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Storm pumping up Utah's snowpack; January coldest month since 1949

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  • RedShirt USS Enterprise, UT
    Feb. 12, 2013 8:29 a.m.

    To "atl134" that is a nice distraction. You still did not address the question.

    Since the NOAA stated that if no warming occured for 15 years or more then the models were wrong and met the 95% Confidence Interval. So, eventhough the NOAA has proof that the models are wrong, you still hold to the lie that the models that the climate change alarmists have good models.

    According to Phil Jones, leading climate scientist, there had been no statistically significant warming since 1995. Do you know more than the NOAA or Phil Jones?

    Again, why do you trust models that are proven wrong?

  • the truth Holladay, UT
    Feb. 11, 2013 5:06 p.m.

    Man-made climate change IS a hoax.

    The proof?

    It has been hotter before.

    And it has colder before, in this case, 1949. What is the left's explanation for that?

    Even science can not say that man has made any more than a few tenths of one degree difference.

    Which means nature is the only major factor and only significant factor.

    If the left had not interjected themselves into the free market decades ago, we probably would all using nuclear power mad driving hydrogen powered cars by now, and be pollution free,

    and complaints about fossil fuels would just be the stuff of story books.

    The problem is NOT conservatives or energy/oil companies, or even cars, it is the left interfering in the natural development of technologies out of irrational fears.

    And progressives are using climate change solely for the gain of power and money.

  • worf Mcallen, TX
    Feb. 11, 2013 4:47 p.m.

    Say it enough times, and people will believe anything---Bill Clinton USA newspaper 1994

    Storms have been occurring for thousands of years. It's nothing new, but some will believe we're causing it with our cars, and factories. This is laughable, and crazy.

  • NedGrimley Brigham City, UT
    Feb. 11, 2013 4:19 p.m.

    "The storm chased away an inversion that had been hanging over the Wasatch Front..."

    Wait, isn't anyone going to give the Repugs a pass since they obviously arranged for a clean up of the pollution that everyone has been complaining about?

  • Badger55 Nibley, Ut
    Feb. 11, 2013 3:21 p.m.

    All climate change is not a hoax, just the man made variety.

  • atl134 Salt Lake City, UT
    Feb. 11, 2013 2:55 p.m.

    @lost in DC
    ["The earth is full... there is enough and to spare" tells me the planet will be OK. ]

    That was given long before the earth reached 7 billion people. And now if all of the 7 billion lived like Americans... no we wouldn't have the resources for that. Especially in some parts of the world where they can barely scrape by as it is (particularly when it comes to water resources).

    @Redshirt
    "The NOAA stated the conditions that prove the models you are using are wrong. Those conditions have been met. Why do you still trust models that are PROVEN wrong?"

    Because the 2000s were the warmest decade on record, 2012 was the warmest La Nina year on record, and January 2013 was the warmest January on record in the UAH dataset. I'm not particularly surprised that a 15-year trend is near 0 for a period where year 1 is the strongest El Nino in over half a century and years 11-15 had La Ninas 4 of the 5 years. The models obviously aren't perfect; for instance they severely underestimated Arctic sea ice melt too.

  • worf Mcallen, TX
    Feb. 11, 2013 2:18 p.m.

    Al Gore failed science in high school, and got a "D" in college.

    Hmm? Harsh winters two hundred years ago must have been caused by steam engines.

    There's a better chance of ants stopping earthquakes, then people changing the weather/climate.

    Just a hint--energy from the sun varies.

  • derecha Central, UT
    Feb. 11, 2013 2:12 p.m.

    How can you tap the Yellowstone or Missouri when everybody cries foul about tapping the Colorado River, which we have rights to divert and it runs through our backyard?

  • Brave Sir Robin San Diego, CA
    Feb. 11, 2013 12:41 p.m.

    @jsf

    Where did I say anything about CO2? I said pollution...you know, that nasty brown stuff that smells bad and turns your lungs black. It comes from engine exhaust and burning stuff (like coal).

    So again, if we are supposed to be wise stewards of the earth, do you think that polluting the air is part of being a wise steward? This is a yes or no question.

  • RedShirt USS Enterprise, UT
    Feb. 11, 2013 12:35 p.m.

    According to the NOAA, "Near-zero and even negative trends are common for intervals of a decade or less in the simulations, due to the model’s internal climate variability. The simulations rule out (at the 95% level) zero trends for intervals of 15 yr or more, suggesting that an observed absence of warming of this duration is needed to create a discrepancy with the expected present-day warming rate." See "STATE OF THE CLIMATE IN 2008" at the NOAA website.

    Now, we have reports from the UK Met Office stating that the climate warming stopped at least 15 years ago. see "Global Climate Warming Stopped 15 Years Ago, UK Met Office Admits" in New American.

    So, we have a study that states if warming is stalled by 15 years or more it meets teh 95% CI to prove that the models used for warming are wrong.

    Ok alarmists, here is the question. The NOAA stated the conditions that prove the models you are using are wrong. Those conditions have been met. Why do you still trust models that are PROVEN wrong?

  • jsf Centerville, UT
    Feb. 11, 2013 11:38 a.m.

    **'Study says coal burning in Utah kills 202 a year' - AP - Published by DSNews - 10/19/10

    **'EPA inventory shows Utah's sources of greenhouse gas' - By Amy Joi O'Donoghue - 02/05/13 - Published by the Deseret News

    'WASHINGTON — The nation's power plants continue to be the single largest stationary source of greenhouse gas emissions, according to new information released Tuesday by the Environmental Protection Agency.'

    Now with the Kennecott smelter switching to natural gas, where is any other coal fired plant on the wasatch front? Oh my gosh they aren't the single largest source of greenhouse gas emissions on the Wasatch Front. Must be the 202 dead each year are over in Colorado and places beyond. And additionally even though CO2 is listed as a greenhouse gas, at ten times the level it is now, it will not hurt you.

  • LDS Liberal Farmington, UT
    Feb. 11, 2013 11:29 a.m.

    lost in DC
    West Jordan, UT

    "The earth is full... there is enough and to spare" tells me the planet will be OK.
    ---

    I grow ever so tired of this false doctrine.

    God ALWAYS has stipulations to his promises.
    It is Obedience.

    We will ONLY have "enough and to spare" if we use it wisely, treat it the very best we can, and do everything in our OWN power to preserve and protect her.

    If not, the Lord is also on record, and made it perfectly clear he will destroy us.

    =============

    jsf
    Centerville, UT

    Do youself a favor.
    Turn off the radio, and Google or Wiki the atmospheric compostition of our sister planet Venus.

    BTW - CO2 is not a pollutant, it is a greehouse gas.

  • jsf Centerville, UT
    Feb. 11, 2013 11:10 a.m.

    But, Brave Sir Robin, CO2 is not pollution. Horticulturists tell us the CO2 levels should be double what they are. So in all actuality I should not be on the side of AGW scientists that tell me CO2 is a pollution. Because it is a lie. Now back to real pollution.

  • Brave Sir Robin San Diego, CA
    Feb. 11, 2013 10:34 a.m.

    @lost in DC

    "The earth is here for our use, but not for our abuse."

    So let's ignore global warming for a minute and focus only on pollution. Would you say that pollution is use or abuse of the earth? To me, that's abuse. So since you're "clinging to the scriptures", shouldn't you be on the side of the global warming scientists, even if for a different reason?

  • Maudine SLC, UT
    Feb. 11, 2013 10:30 a.m.

    @ lost in DC: Can you honestly tell me that current conditions don't constitute abuse of the earth? Can you honestly say you believe God approves of wasting resources and not looking for more environmentally friendly alternatives? In spite of the words of the Bible, do you honestly believe God is going to save us from our own poor choices to abuse his gift of the world?

    Yes, God gave us dominion and made us stewards and promised as long as we are faithful and do our job there will be enough and to spare. Can you honestly look at the world around you and claim that we are doing our part? Do you think anything about the current state of our environment is going to make God say, "Oh yeah, that's just what I intended."?

    (Hint: Church leaders are urging conservation and increased protection of natural resources.)

  • lost in DC West Jordan, UT
    Feb. 11, 2013 8:47 a.m.

    climate change is just the mantra al gore wanted to use to corner the market on carbon credits and line his own pocket, and for foreign despots to raid the US treasury since we have abused the earth for so long at their expense so they are now due some sort of recommpense.

    If the libs are so concerned about all the CO2, they can stop exhaling and adding to the CO2.

    FT,
    I'd rather cling to the scriptures than to man's ever-changing theories and philosophies regardless of how much you chose, in your typical liberal "tolerance", to denigrate us.

    "The earth is full... there is enough and to spare" tells me the planet will be OK. When God gave Adam dominion over the earth and all things on the face thereof, He also gave him responibility to take care of. The earth is here for our use, but not for our abuse.

  • FT salt lake city, UT
    Feb. 11, 2013 7:29 a.m.

    The more the climate change deniers speak the worse they sound. Facts are facts but you can continue to cling to your bibles and radio talk show hosts ignorant babble. The "deniers" are our generations human sacraficers or flat earth believers.

  • Tekakaromatagi Dammam, Saudi Arabia
    Feb. 11, 2013 7:25 a.m.

    Hello Mountainman: I think that global warming is real. Putting all the CO2 up in the atmosphere is going to have an effect. (Between you and I, I would be incredibly happy if Al Gore was shown to be wrong. I guess that I believe in global warming, not because of Al Gore, but in spite of Al Gore.)

  • Pagan Salt Lake City, UT
    Feb. 10, 2013 8:29 p.m.

    Since the beginning of time the world and its climate have and continue to change, to think man is responsible is an asinine hoax. - Smokey Lonesome

    **'Lung Association slams Utah areas for bad air' - By Amy Joi O'Donoghue - DSNews - 04/30/09

    **'Study says coal burning in Utah kills 202 a year' - AP - Published by DSNews - 10/19/10

    **'EPA inventory shows Utah's sources of greenhouse gas' - By Amy Joi O'Donoghue - 02/05/13 - Published by the Deseret News

    'WASHINGTON — The nation's power plants continue to be the single largest stationary source of greenhouse gas emissions, according to new information released Tuesday by the Environmental Protection Agency.'

  • Smokey Lonesome WEST VALLEY CITY, UT
    Feb. 10, 2013 7:29 p.m.

    JoeBlow-

    Since the beginning of time the world and its climate have and continue to change, to think man is responsible is an asinine hoax.

  • xscribe Colorado Springs, CO
    Feb. 10, 2013 6:14 p.m.

    Now climate change is a hoax? Wow! You will not find one scientist on Earth who says climate change is a hoax. Manmade? Maybe. But climate change? Have you never heard of the ice age?

  • atl134 Salt Lake City, UT
    Feb. 10, 2013 4:27 p.m.

    @Mountanman
    "should we try to make the weather the warmer to avoid these record cold temps "

    We did not set a single record low at SLC International January 2013 nor were we even within 6 degrees of a record low. It was the coldest January since 1949 primarily due to the extended inversion events. It should be noted that January 1949 was actually a full 5F colder than January 2013.

  • atl134 Salt Lake City, UT
    Feb. 10, 2013 4:25 p.m.

    @Mountanman
    "Seems global warming really is a hoax doesn't it?"

    You want to say that after Utah just pulled its warmest year on record in 2012 and the lower 48 set its warmest year on record by a full 1.0F in 2012?

    But let's forget a regional matter and look at the globe since well... we're talking about global warming. How did the globe do this past month?

    For January 2013, Roy Spencer's (an anthropogenic climate change skeptic) UAH satellite dataset showed a +.51C temperature anomaly globally in January 2013, the warmest January globally in the UAH satellite record (1979 onward). So it is clear that while yes, Utah was cold this past month, the world as a whole was warmer than average. So why should I believe that global warming is a hoax again?

  • Tom in CA Vallejo, CA
    Feb. 10, 2013 3:50 p.m.

    Climate change is a hoax.

  • Thinkin\' Man Rexburg, ID
    Feb. 10, 2013 3:23 p.m.

    GLOBAL COOLING!

    Well, the fanatics shout about warming every time we have a warm month -- turn-about is fair play.

  • HaHaHaHa Othello, WA
    Feb. 10, 2013 1:37 p.m.

    And again Mountain Man, your right on as usual....Its tooooo easy. They don't have an answer to your question, but I can give you their answer for them, its too easy. You see, there is really no precise answer. The answer is always going to directly correlated to the following principles. Whatever your driving now, living in now or wearing now, is to much, you need to downsize, give-up or sacrifice. Whatever you paying for taxes, fees, licensing or other government confiscations, its not enough! You need to do more! No matter how big government gets, or its bureaucracies, and unfunded mandates are, its not enough. We need to suffer more. Just make sure you ignore ALL evidence that contradicts the theories of man-made global warming, and take most or all of your personal liberties and throw them in the trash. Of course we need to always have special exemptions for special, elite, liberals, because they are...special. There is your answer!

  • pragmatistferlife salt lake city, utah
    Feb. 10, 2013 12:09 p.m.

    Thanks Mountainman..Joe looks like a genius...it's just actually tooooooo easy.

  • Richard Larson Galt, CA
    Feb. 10, 2013 11:29 a.m.

    Oh, you poor utahns......

  • Midwest Mom Soldiers Grove, WI
    Feb. 10, 2013 10:21 a.m.

    Thanks, Joe Blow. Your timing was an impeccable.

  • BYU Track Star Los Angeles, CA
    Feb. 10, 2013 7:30 a.m.

    Despite the recent snow and cold. Utah's snowpack doesn't look so good as a water supply come spring. Not to sound like a broken record but Utah water agencies need to start looking at the economics of tapping the the Yellowstone or Missouri rivers. Otherwise the regions water supplies can not support the Utah population and future growth. Tick-tock tick-tock !!

  • Mountanman Hayden, ID
    Feb. 10, 2013 7:15 a.m.

    "January the coldest month since 1949." Wow! Seems global warming really is a hoax doesn't it? Even if we could change the weather, should we try to make the weather the warmer to avoid these record cold temps or should we try to make the climate colder? Record warm weather or record cold weather, do we get a choice? What is the optimum temperature of the Earth?

  • JoeBlow Far East USA, SC
    Feb. 10, 2013 5:56 a.m.

    And to follow, will be all those who confuse climate with weather and will cite this article as absolute proof that climate change is a hoax.