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Comments about ‘Utah Scout council urges BSA to delay vote on admitting gay Scouts and leaders’

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Published: Thursday, Jan. 31 2013 7:15 p.m. MST

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kargirl
Sacramento, CA

Just thinking here, some folks on this board are discussing yesterday's virtues v. today's, and giving examples. Well, things have changed, and there are comparisons aplenty to the "olden days", especially, I noted, a couple to Biblical times. So, how about--wives and concubines, for many kings and rulers; slaves, including some being taken as wives and concubines after victory; marriages through trickery; arranged marriages; marriages to cement agreements between royalty; how's that for examples? And polygamy...back to the wives and concubines, but many of the OT marriages were multiple ones. Now, those were obviously all right, from a divine perspective at the time, just as it was here in the early Church. So who's to say, since we do not know all that will be revealed yet--check the ninth article of Faith--that there is not something more about some of these things left to learn of? I am unwilling to say, since the word of the Lord is dynamic, and not my dynamic, but His, that there may be more to hear on this when we are ready to listen.

kargirl
Sacramento, CA

To clarify about Sandusky's kind of crime: His crime has nothing to do with his sexual preference. He's no doubt as straight as he can possibly be. It's a crime of power and of violence, pure and simple. He is a bigger person, being powerful enough to exhort a smaller, younger, less powerful person to do something he didn't want to do, to use trickery, bribery, threats, and brute force, to get the power he wanted. He did that because he could. He used sex. He could have pulled out their hair or done other things, made them clean the showers with a toothbrush. But that wasn't his choice. Only he knows why, him and God. But it has nothing to do with what you would think.

George
Bronx, NY

@grandpa Dave

The answer to your question is really very simple not everyone agrees what your self serving definition of what it means to be morally straight no matter how loud you yell it.

worf
Mcallen, TX

As I learned, having been in the Boy Scouts. Stand tall and do what's right. Integrity is important.

NWCL INDP
Murray, UT

I am an active LDS male who has been involved in Scouting most of my life, achieved the Rank of Eagle, and helped dozens of others do the same. I've seen gay boys in scouting and it hasn't made any difference. In fact, the biggest difference it has made is in the lives of the gay boys. Just like straight boys, they get the opportunity to learn things about their city, country, environment, family, others, and selves. And, they learn to do, becoming men and leaders.

I not only see nothing wrong with it, but see it as a great thing in all of these boys lives. I encourage it and encourage those afraid or hateful of gay people to reach out and learn how similar gay people are to you.

worf
Mcallen, TX

NWCL INDP,

I agree with you, except I don't want a gay leader camping with the boys.

jbs49
Spanish Fork, UT

I just wondering was so many people are get gays? Shouldn't everyone have a chance to excel? Why so much prestige against something you really don't understand? I believe that young men should be able to participate in Scouting no matter of race, greed, color, religion or sexual orientation. This also includes BSA leaders, so long as the Scout or their leaders are not pushing the issue of sexual orientation or miss using their power to molest the Scouts. I wouldn't stop my sons from becoming a Scout just because the leader is gay. Gay men and women are HUMANS we should treat everyone equally.

The Deuce
Livermore, CA

I would have to say that if you have stock in BSA, it is time to sell. The conflicts that this entire issue brings up will more than drive this organization into the ground.

chanchoboy
Birmingham, MI

I feel sorry for the BSA they are between a rock and a hard place, pressure from the gay community via economic support from corporation donation, and pressure from the very organizations that support the BSA, ie the religious community. Its a no win situation. The BSA is trying to extend an olive branch to both sides. The problem is that large support could be loss and the organization left to cities,schools,and private organizations. I don't see the gay community, that has pushed for this, stepping forward to make sure that the organization continues if the religious community leaves the organization. The percentage of Gay and Lesbians who would join and lead is probably very small. Sad, there is a lot that scouting teaches our youth and society needs these teaching no matter who you are. Our prayers should certianly be with those charged with this decision that it can me made to garantee the longivity of this inspired organization...

TA1
Alexandria, VA

Sort of to paraphrase Brigham Young "This is the place" now just get on with the change and stop complaining. As the LDS Church was willing to change so the local council should be as well. Period.

Noonhigh
Bountiful, UT

Consequences of this passing:
-LDS Church doesn't withdraw from BSA because doing so would be to contrary to the latest statements about homosexuals.
-The LDS Church will put out a official statement and many Church members will accept it right way, others will not.
-Local councils will lose millions of dollars in Friends of Scouting programs but will also gain millions of dollars in support. I think the net will still be loss but they will work through it.
-Most BSA troops will eventually buy one man tents. To help every one be equal since gay youth will always be sleeping alone. Scouting would never allow two people who by definition of sexual orientation that are attracted to each other to sleep in the same tent, unless they are adult couples or parents and child(ren).
-Many parents will not allow their children to attend National and Council Scout camps. Though they allow them to attend public schools? More parents will also be at scout camp.

Light was not meant to be hid and through pain comes joy. Scouting is one the most wonderful organization to ever exist. Follow the truth for he leads the way.

patriot
Cedar Hills, UT

"time to consider the consequences"

Yes - consequences such as the LDS and Catholic churches DROPPING all involvement with BSA?? If I am a professional scouter this means I probably lose my job pretty soon!!

Joan Watson
TWIN FALLS, ID

To NT-somewhere in Ut
Im glad you had a laugh. But the fact remains - If a parent has a gay son or daughter isn't it possible that gays themselves have a mother and a father and who is also a member of a family consisting of brothers sisters aunts and uncles? Your suggestion that I should have, included your quote that "a dog is not a cat" serves only that you muddied the waters. If you do not have a familiy member who is gay - then it seems it is you that has had a "very limited experience" and not the many who have.

athought
Salt Lake City, UT

I haven't even gone though all the comments on here, just 4 pages of them. What's the big deal, and why do they need to change? I've had kids in scouting, and no where do I recall having to fill out anything asking if they were homosexual or not. Or, do they go on their camps, and when assigned to a tent, come out with "I'm homosexual" or do they ask the homosexual scouts to stand in one line and hetersexual's to stand in another? My 12 year old grandson is in scouts, and I don't know that he would know the difference, and at his age, I'm not going to explain it until he asks, or it comes up. Why do we have to put this in these boy's heads and have them question if their friend in scouting or their leader is homosexual? Isn't it enought to be aware as parents what our kids are involved in and give them our support, no matter their orientation, and just let them have fun and learn in the scouting program? What am I missing?

Eliyahu
Pleasant Grove, UT

@Andrew Zaelit: You feel they should first poll the membership before proceeding? Would you have made the same argument decades ago when organizations like the Boy Scouts had to desegregate and eliminate racially segregated troops? How would that have worked out? Answer is, we would still have "separate but equal" units in scouting in parts of the country where the majority at that time were dead set against it because of personal prejudices and belief in the scriptures they used to use to justify it. The issue here isn't whether banning gays is popular or not. Rather, the question is, is it right and fair to do so?

What about the young scouts whose sexual orientation hasn't really emerged yet? Do they get to stay in scouts until they realize they're more attracted to male than to female, and then they have to drop out, or do they just stay silent and pretend to like girls so they can finish the program?

GDance
Independence, MO

This really isn't about gay's in the scouting program.

This is really about an organization known for teaching young men character deciding to change its fundamental character for the sake of money. How can an organization tell a young man to stand up to peer pressure about drugs and then bow to peer pressure and sell its very own soul.

Forget "how could they ever have enough separate toilets at camps", forget "how do we assign campers to tents", forget "how do we redefine the youth protection program to allow any sexual orientation when there are individuals who prefer man-boy relationships too" .

This is really comes down to an organization caving on its character for money and if it does that it will never, ever be the same. It may still exist, but it will no longer be what it always has been.

torton
Utah, UT

Concretebo, I, like you, am also not “anti-gay.” I also feel strongly about allowing all human beings access to the same basic rights as everyone else. I am also someone who feels that the media’s and love affair with gay rights is a little over the top. I also realize, however, is that some change IS necessary if gays are going to be granted full rights such as civil unions. Turning a blind eye does not bring change. Just like with the civil rights movement in the 60’s, open, frank communication to what was happening was the catalyst for change in America. I understand your concern about over-publicizing the Boy Scouts of America’s debate regarding the inclusion of gay members, but this debate might just be what brings about the change for homosexuals that you favor.

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