Wally West:[I'll agree w/ MR to a certain extent... Like the old
knight from the 3rd Indiana Jones admonishes, We should "Choose
Wisely!"]Now there is a fantastic violence/gor series. Flesh
melting in Indiana Jones 1, ripping out beating hearts in Indiana Jones 2, and
all creative ways people die in the Temple of the Grail, including decapitation
and rapid aging and desiccation.Indiana Jones was a personal
favorite of mine as a kid. Jewish/Christian/Hindu Mythology, violence, Nazis,
cults, and a hero with a bullwhip, gun, and a PhD.Too bad the 4th
movie was such garbage... no quality gore and violence either.
Why do we target QT? He is a lightning rod as casual observer (9:16 a.m. Jan.
15) states. My guess he speaks out at times like these to get an ego stroke. Its
probably the same reason he "creates" the "art" he does.re: Mike Richards 9:36 a.m. Jan. 15*Who can tell what
"triggers" violence?* Choosing fight over flight perhaps?
"Because so few people seem to understand that putting violence
into our minds means that it is there for future reference.We are free to
choose. We should choose wisely."Just because its there does not
mean we should, need to, or will. Resisting those impulses is separates from the
animals, a Tarantino film, etc...I'll agree w/ MR to a certain
extent... Like the old knight from the 3rd Indiana Jones admonishes, We should
@airnautComparing Bugs Bunny to an interactive graphic video game like
Grand Theft Auto is like comparing an apple to the moon. Although since the moon
is made of cheese (I too grew up on Bugs Bunny) I guess you can say
they’re both round food.@Craig ClarkAn eloquent
comment…@ Twin LightsInsightful as always…
A Hollywood reeling from the charge that popular culture is the culprit hides
behind its chorus line calling for stricter gun laws.An NRA anxious
to shift the focus away from gun availability washes its hands like Pilate and
points in the direction of video games.The fray is joined by an new
strain of ‘truthers’ pouring into Newtown to find proof that the
Sandy Hook massacre is a hoax manufactured by Federal and state authorities.The plot thickens.Tell me this is all a bad dream.
It’s a struggle to keep from getting too cynical when we see madness
giving way to lunacy.
I watched violence on Bugs Bunny for over 50 years.Guess what, I neve once even felt a twinge like dropping an anvil on anyone.Let alone shooting anyone ala, Elmer J. Fudd.This is beyond
ridiculous.Lock-em up in a gun case where they belong, or ban
them all together...anything less than that is just silly nonsense.
If we agree that we don't know what triggers violence, can we also agree
that "violence" is defined differently by different people?Can a threat be considered violent? Can threatening to fire someone, flunk
someone or take his car or house be considered a violent act? Is physical force
necessary?What is the difference between non-physical violence and
just being "mean"? What I'm getting at is that some
people would tell us "no harm, no foul" while others would pile penalty
upon penalty if they thought that someone was intimidated because of his sex,
his race or his nation of origin. Would "All in the Family"
be a violent TV show? Do we have to see blood and guts before the show is
violent? Would a show telling kids to disrespect the parents be violent?It's not nearly as abstract as some would assume if thoughts really
do precede the action. If a child is taught by a movie to sass his parents and
the parents place sanctions on that child and the child breaks things to show
his parents that he is displeased, and the parents . . . Which seed
will bloom into violence?
Twin Lights and Tyler -- two very good comments. Thanks.
So, the 'heroin' in 'kill bill' goes to a foreign oriental
country where guns are banned, and with a sword and years of martial arts
training is able to destroy a ruthless gang of 88 crazy assassins who defend
themselves with swords but are slashed to pieces in much the same fashion as
does Ammon with his sword in defending the kings flocks from robbers in the Book
of Mormon. There is a lot of bloodshed in that book by the way.So,
she comes back to the good old USA to some town in SW United States and meets
her match when she attempts to invade a home with intent to murder it's
homeowner and is met at the door with a double shotgun blast that lands her on
her back 20 feet from the front porch.... a lovely example for the need and the
right to bear firearms
The D-News needs to get its bi-polar editorial act togethers. Two articls saying
that gun violence defies any easy solution. Two articles saying its Quintin
@Mike Richards"Who can tell what "triggers" violence? "Value question, though when it comes down to it someone can do a lot
more damage with a handgun than they can a DVD case.
Perhaps if this was a hot issue 40 or 50 years ago when the partisan wing nuts
were on the fringes, I wouldn’t be so pessimistic. But in today’s
environment we have one side that will fight tooth and nail against any
perceived constraints on their 1st amendment rights to produce (and critically
praise in Tarantino’s case) any garbage they can sell. On the
other side is a large and well financed constituency that will fight any
perceived infringement of their 2nd amendment rights. Why this side
doesn’t take their arguments to their logical conclusions and call for
individual ownership of tanks and fighter jets (since the 2nd amendment was
designed to overthrow a tyrannical government which should imply citizens having
the ability to actually do so) is beyond me, but I guess common sense and
societal outrage still hold some sway.
Violence in the media cannot be the entire discussion. That would be incredibly
short sighted. There are several competing factors all of which need to be
dealt with harmoniously. But believe that violence in the media is of no effect
is foolish.The following is not an argument for or against firearms.
But think about America 40 or 50 years ago. A higher percentage of homes had
firearms and few of them were locked up. But there were few instances (that I
can recall at any rate) of these types of mass shootings. Why? What has
changed in America since the 1960s and 70s?When we know the answer
to that question, we will be on the path to solving this.Reference
firearms, entertainment, and mental health. Probably none of these can remain
precisely as they are now.
Tarentino's "kill bill 2" builds up the lethal value of swords as
the most dangerous of all weapons and builds on that theme all throughout the
first movie and then at the end of the 2nd movie we find that the quintessence
of home protection is embodied in a double barreled shotgun.By these
2 'kill bill' films, Tarentino has with cinematic display, done more
for the advancement of the American citizens right to bear arms as guaranteed in
the US Constitution than anyone else I know.
What I find interesting is that there are such large numbers of parents who
believe (even though it is not based on any factual evidence) that viewing
violent media causes violence, yet is seems that they are not doing anything to
stop it. If you truly felt that way, get rid of your video games, get rid of
your tv's, and stop going to the movies. Parents are such hypocrites.
Stop complaining and do something about it if you feel that it is a problem.
Instead, they allow these things into their homes, and allow their children to
view these things because it is easier than trying to stop it.
because he is making the paper a lot of money, not hard to spot the hypocrisy
Who can tell what "triggers" violence? Who can tell whether seeing and
hearing and reading about violence can trigger violence? Who can tell us that
we are not what we experience?Didn't someone who is greater
than us all tell us to guard our thoughts? Didn't he warn us that "as
a man thinketh, so is he"?We have agency to make choices. If we
choose to let violence be part of our lives, then we have allowed violent scenes
and violent thoughts to be rooted somewhere in our minds. Who is to say that
when the right circumstances occur that we will not dig out those violent
memories and act on them?Before guns, there were knives and swords.
Before knives and swords, there were sticks and stones. Violent people use
whatever weapon that they have available to facilitate their violent desires.Because so few people seem to understand that putting violence into our
minds means that it is there for future reference, it helps to have constant
reminders that we don't need to participate with Hollywood.We
are free to choose. We should choose wisely.
[A recent survey of 1,050 parents, conducted by Common Sense Media and the
Center for American Progress, shows that 77 percent believe that, "Media
violence, such as content in TV, movies, and video games, contributes to
America's culture of violence." Sadly, 75 percent of those same parents
indicated that it is difficult to shield their children from violence.Additionally, a poll of Deseretnews.com readers indicates that more than 85
percent agree or strongly agree that "violent entertainment contributes to a
culture of violence?" Furthermore, around 85 percent also believe the amount
of violence in America is "getting worse" and that the news industry
doesn't take "entertainment violence seriously enough."]This isn't evidence or proof of anything, except that the majority of
Deseret News readers and people willing to take surveys from right wing groups
are afraid of everything.Who cares what these people think? Its just
proof of white, middle-class, religious fear.Especially when REAL
statistics proves that "the amount of violence in America" is getting
BETTER.[our violence-drenched society]Nope. Our society
isn't violence drenched. Everything is consistently getting better, people
aren't getting "more wicked", and the "end-times" are
nowhere in sight.
I’m no fan of Tarantino and I’ve criticized him on these boards in
recent days. When something horrific happens, we look for the scapegoat on which
to fix blame while knowing that none of us are in a position to cast the first
stone. Both the First Amendment and the Second Amendment are taking their share
of lumps since the Newtown atrocities. The fury will subside in time and it will
seem that nothing is going to change.Let Quentin Tarantino keep
finding new projects to indulge his interminably pubescent mentality. The best
thing for me to do is see to it that I don’t help make it monetarily
profitable for him.
I find it ironic that this paper takes such a stand against violent media, yet
their sister company and shared news room (KSL) is one of the purveyors of this
violent media that the Deseret News hates so much. It seems like a bit of
cognitive dissonance to me.
Tarentino is a lightning rod for the violent genre of films. He glorifies
gratuitous, stylized violence. His work is similar to a drug dealer who
facilitates and profits from an illness.
Obviously, anyone entering a movie theater or purchasing a video game should
have to undergo a background check and a 7 day waiting (cooling down) period.
Targeting Tarantino seems a bit opportunistic and disingenuous to me. Don't
get me wrong, I don't watch his stuff, but blaming Tarantino, or indeed
hollywood in general, is totally missing the point. This level of violence has
been around in entertainment, and totally ignored by DN, among others, for
years. Ever watched what your kids are doing on Halo, or Call of Duty? Have you
watched High Plains Drifter, or texas chainsaw, or any one of thousands of
others? How did this body of work go unnoticed while you crusaded on and on
about porn? Yet there it was, and it is as much a symptom as it is a cause. We
want this stuff, and pay for it. Often it involves gratuitous use of guns, and
there's no way we can speak against that around here. Yeah, all this
violence is bad. But don't try to convince me it's new, or
Tell me Beverly, Have you ever asked yourself why people want these guns? It is
not the gun itself but why people buy them, why people want to use them. If all
political leaders, news reports and people who think outlawing something stops
something else, they will be lost in the mud of the wrong debate. It's
naive to believe that if you show violence it will not bread violence.
Commercials are built on showing makes us want. Its naive to believe that the
more the government try's to control it wont lead to more rebelling by
those who don't wish to be controlled. Beverly please don't fall into
the simple quick "fixes" because they don't fix anything, they just
The government (that means us, the people) have been in a constant state of war
for over ten years and you think it is the media that is causing the culture of
A consoling factor for people who treasure their right to own firearms for
protection was brought out in the 'Kill Bill' movie when a homeowner
can sit relaxing in their rocking chair inside their homes and still have the
ability to blow an assaulting housebreaker off their threshold and 20 feet out
onto the front lawn with a shotgun blast even if the assailant has been highly
skilled and trained in martial arts and is wielding the best sword the world has
I simply don't watch network TV except when it's time for news
(it's PBS only for me).Last night, just before 10, I turned my
set to Channel 5 a couple of minutes early and what did I find?A
couple of extremely violent and raunchy scenes previewing the next episode of
whatever had been in the trash can beside the pig trough for the previous
hour.The problem of garbage as entertainment goes far beyond Quentin
Tarentino.But who is responsible for that? Could it be viewers who
mindlessly watch it thinking they are being entertained? Could it be those who
are disgusted but say nothing?No amount of legislation will cure
this problem. But I'll bet a few hundred thousand letters to sponsor from
people who are fed up with it would have a very fast and positive result.Have you written any?
It is the "One Month Anniversary" of 20 little children being shot to
death, and the Deseret News has no stories about it, and continues to deflect
attention away for the primary cause (GUNS) to movies and other issues. Today,
the President of the United States, will receive recommendations from the Vice
President of the United States on what should be done about gun violence in
America. Isn't the release of this information a historic newsworthy
moment? I will support the President's efforts to prevent or
reduce gun violence in America. All of the political leaders, in Utah, remain
silent. Intimidated by the gun lobby. The Deseret News should be asking what
their position is on this critical issue and what they support or recommend to
reduce gun violence in the United States. All political leaders in Utah are
tap dancing around this issue. Collectively, they could write a book entitled,
"Six Ways To Cheat At Tap Dancing," By the Utah members of Congress.
Tarantino is a disgrace but so are we, for falling for "sophisticated and
witty" plots and dialogs as an excuse for paying for violence as
entertainment. Just how far would we be willing to go for "witty" in any
kind of form of entertainment? Is there really that much difference between the
minds of Tarantino and Holmes or Lanza? Just like the NRA and gun
control, we seem to want no curbs on our "freedoms".