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Comments about ‘BYU, Utah, USU football teams more profitable than Utah Jazz’

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Published: Tuesday, Jan. 8 2013 4:50 p.m. MST

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Just the FAX
Olympus Cove, Utah

ute4ever

"BYU does NOT have a wider fanbase than Utah."

- dozens of marketing studies during the last 50 years directly refute that claim.

"An average LDS person will say they are a BYU fan, even if they've never watched them play."

- do you even one shred of imperical evidence to support your own personally biased opinion?

"If BYU has a national presense (outside of Mormons), then explain why the Poinsettia bowl had the lowest viewership ratings since 2006?

- no explanation needed; the viewership for one bowl game doesn't prove anything

Mormon doesn't equal BYU fan, but that doesn't negate the fact that over 2/3's of BYU's students come from outside the state of Utah and tens of thousands of BYU alumni live all over the country and throughout the world. And that doesn't even include the tens of thousands of Mormons who are BYU fans, even though they've never attended school at BYU.

manutd
San Diego, CA

I am amazed at the time ute fans have to come up with detailed statistics and reports they pull from who knows where just to prove a silly point.

Do you guys have jobs?

Just the FAX
Olympus Cove, Utah

Spokane Ute

"Exactly what poll was BYU ranked in?"

2011
BYU(10-3) - #25 Coaches, #26 AP, #34 Sagarin
Utah(8-5) - unranked, #39 Sagarin

2012
BYU(8-5) - unranked, but bowl winner
Utah(5-7) - unranked, and no bowl

Overall since BYU's Independence/Utah's move to PAC 12 basement

BYU(18-8) - one Top 25 finish, two bowl wins
Utah(13-12) - no Top 25 finishes, one bowl win

Spokane Ute
Spokane, WA

It's so funny how BYU fans act as if this last season define's Utah's past, and coming 20 football seasons. The ironic thing is, that as bas as Utah was; they still beat the little guys from down south. No wonder there's so much anger and hate. Even when your rival has it's worst season, you still can't beat them. So then you quickly use the old "one game doesn't define a season" gag. I guess that, and not being in a BCS conference (being on the outside looking in) generates a lot of hate and animosity. It sure is shinning through on these threads. I love it!

DaveKnowsWhatsUp
Bloomington, IN

Navalvet- your 8:13 and 8:39 posts plus your response to me are all combative in nature (combative is synonymous with fighting). You're trying to spin anything you can to prove that Utah is somehow superior. Did BYU really make more money? I don't know, nor do I really care...some reports say they did, some say they didn't, depends on how you want to twist it. However, this is the entire point of my sarcasm that appears to have been lost. Does it really matter what one website says compared to another? Data can be turned in so many different ways, and it all comes back to the original point I was trying to make...Ute fans hate BYU because of the perceived arrogance. When Ute fans express their displeasure (sometimes in the extreme), BYU fans often respond in a way that justifies the Ute hatred, and the cycle continues. No matter how you spin the story of who's better, prettier, or richer, it all comes back to drumming up the same ageless argument. Trust me, I'm not "frantic and emotional", but it is entertaining to watch some so desperately defend their honor while attacking the other.

DaveKnowsWhatsUp
Bloomington, IN

justthefax- empirical evidence is a big concept and difficult for some to understand the importance of it...

ute4ever- this is just my experience, but I've lived all over the country and have easily found more people who pay attention to, or at least know something about the sports program at BYU. Given, many of these are church members, but many are coworkers, neighbors, and just general friends who are sports fans in general. The only people I've ever met that follow the U are direct graduates, or people who have moved from SLC that intentionally hate BYU and follow Utah by default (fortunately these are in the minority). I know this isn't cold-hard fact, just my experience, but it's just as meaningful as spouting that BYU doesn't have a larger fanbase without at least having experience to back it up.

Bluto
Sandy, UT

@navallint

You continue to lose arguments, quit before you fall further behind.

BYU has a "profitable" Athletic Program from top to bottom.
Utah does not.

(Looks like BYU's superior MBA program has paid off).

BYU consistently has 8-10 Top 25 athletic programs, year after year.
Utah does not.

BYU cranks out All-Americans in just about every single sport, year after year.
Utah does not.

BYU far outpaces Utah with Academic All-Americans as well.

BYU is Top 25 in Football and Basketball attendance, year after year.
Utah is not.

BYU outdraws Utah in every Olympic Sport, save gymnastics.

BYU is a Tier One University Academically, Utah is not.
Latest USNWR rankings BYU #68 Utah #127 (10th in the Pac)

Every BYU game is seen Nationally and Internationally.
Utah's are not.

The problem with Utah is that even with their new (unearned) revenue, they are now and will continue to be dead last in athletic budgets and facilities in the Pac.

Utah fans still think their competition is with BYU.
It is not.
It's with their Pac 12 brethren from now on.

Cal, UCLA, Washington, ASU, Arizona all have major facility upgrades underway.
Utah simply can't keep up.

yesterday
Salt Lake City, UT

you get players for free. that's why.

MESOUTE
Albany, NY

Many others have made the obvious comment of how the Utes are running away from the Cougs in revenue and profitability even in years when they are not receiving a full share of conference $$$. This is nice. But the real story here is how in the world the Jazz can manage to lose 16.4 million!! WOW! Greg Miller is really running the organization into the ground.

scenic view
Baltimore, MD

Spokane Ute

"It's so funny how BYU fans act as if this last season define's Utah's past, and coming 20 football seasons."

What's so funny about it - the last two years are Utah's only two years in the PAC 12? Why shouldn't they define Utah's potential for the next 20 seasons? See Arizona post 1978.

Here's a little history lesson:

1964 - after dominating their previous conference, Utah won its 1st WAC championship, cracked the Top 20 for the first time, won a bowl game, and beat BYU, again.

Utah wouldn't play in another bowl game for 28 years.

1965 - BYU won its 1st conference championship and beat Utah for only the 4th time in history.

By the time Utah played in its next bowl game in 1992, BYU had won a National Championship, a Heisman Trophy, finished in the Top 25 TEN times, won over a dozen conference championships, and had beaten Utah 18 out of 20 years from 1972 to 1991.

Things can change quickly.

Thinkman
Provo, UT

Had BYU not gone independent and stayed in the Mtn West, they would be operating at either a loss or a very modest profit according to these stats.

They were wise to go independent for not just exposure, but financially wise too.

GD
Syracuse, UT

shots and dunks. There could be so much more but it will never happen. Anyway I don't really care anymore.
Gary

Whatsnu
Sandy, UT

Spokane Ute

"I guess... not being in a BCS conference (being on the outside looking in) generates a lot of hate and animosity. It sure is shinning through on these threads."

Being on the outside looking in at what, a perennial conference bottom dweller?

Get real. NOBODY envies conference bottom feeders, regardless of which conference they're in.

As you may have noticed, BYU fans are hardly angst-filled because the Utes have won a couple of recent head-to-head games. 5 of the last 7 games during the Bronco/Kyle era have been decided by a touchdown or less in the closing minutes of the game or in overtime.

Hardly the type of "domination" that Utah fan humerously continue to spout.

The fact that BYU has finished in the Top 25 FIVE of those seven seasons, versus only THREE Top 25 finishes for the Utes, shows which program has really been more successfu, overall.

btw, how was the attendance at the couch potato chip bowl?

Dutchman
Murray, UT

ToosmartforU,

You brought this topic up so I will respond. I know you and some other people in this state do not like the "attitude" of the U so you don't want one penny of tax money going there no matter how small a percentage. Well, I am very active LDS and have been all my life and I have never complained that a lot of my tithing money goes to support BYU including the J. Rueben Clark Law School that puts out a lot of ACLU attorneys. In fact, at least two of the past Executive Directors of the ACLU for Utah are BYU law school graduates including the one who fought the Church and Salt Lake City over the Main Street Plaza issue. Not everything that happens at BYU with my tithing support makes me happy but I am not complaining. You brought it up.

Phantomblade,

The fact is every state sponsored higher education institution in Utah receives a bigger percentage of support from the state than the U does. UVU inparticular is very high. It is a matter of public record. Yet, the U benefits this state by being an economic power house.

ute4ever
West Jordan, UT

@ toosmartforyou

You ask why TCU vs. Loiusianna Tech viewership is relevant? The statistics from that game were taken from the 2011 Poinsettia Bowl. BYU vs. San Diego had many, many less viewers than the previous year, which would (from a BYU fan's perspective) feature two much less "nationally prominent" teams like TCU and Louisianna Tech. 29% less viewers than the previous year's game. And 38% less viewers than the 2010 game.

Go ahead and chalk this up to "just one bowl game", but either BYU doesn't have the national draw you fans think they do, or you are all just bandwagon fans and jump off at the first sign of trouble....which I guess would have been the loss to Utah this year.

All the studies out there on this go ask people "are you a BYU fan". Do you think a Mormon in Florida would say "no" to that question? No, even if he hasn't seen a game ever. The church affiliation is what drives these inflated study results.

Spokane Ute
Spokane, WA

Yeppers, two years defines the future of Utah's existence in the PAC 12. Just like it did when Arizona and Arizona State joined the conference. I wonder how many screen names the Utah Haters post under? The rant is always the same. Let's compare top 10 finishes and BCS bowl victories over the past 10 years, shall we? Of course not, let's spin it. Say top 25. Say we go back 30 years. It's always the same old song and dance. Utah has won 8 out of the last 11. Let's spin it, the games were won by a total of x amount of points. If a Utah fan says the sky is blue and the grass is green, the Utah Hater will say, not when it's over cast and not in Kentucky. It's really quite amussing. Especially when they get all bent out of shape. Case in Point!

Mike Johnson
Stafford, VA

USU reported $5,881,831 in revenues and $5,881,832 in expenses for the same period 2011-2012 for which the Utah and BYU figures are reported. (Although BYU has a different financial year--2 January to 1 January instead of 1 July to 30 June for the state schools, but they cover the same football season).

PAC man
Anaheim, CA

Spokane Ute

Spin it however helps you sleep at night:

AP/Coaches Top 25 Finishes
BYU 18
Utah 7

AP/Coaches Top 15 Finishes
BYU 10
Utah 3

AP/Coaches Top 10 Finishes
BYU 4
Utah 3

AP/Coaches #1 Finishes
BYU 1
Utah 0

1964 Utah UR/14
1977 BYU 20/16
1979 BYU 13/12
1980 BYU 12/12
1981 BYU 13/11
1983 BYU 7/7
1984 BYU 1/1 National Champions
1985 BYU 16/17
1989 BYU 22/18
1990 BYU 22/17
1991 BYU 23/23
1994 BYU 18/10, Utah 10/8
1996 BYU 5/5
2001 BYU 25/24
2003 Utah 21/21
2004 Utah 4/5
2006 BYU 16/15
2007 BYU 14/15
2008 BYU 25/21, Utah 2/4
2009 BYU 12/12, Utah 18/18
2010 Utah UR/23
2011 BYU UR/25

Uteology
East Salt Lake City, Utah

@Just the FAX
"Overall since BYU's Independence/Utah's move to PAC 12" ...

Is irrelevant since the SOS is vastly different between the teams. For example:

2011
Utah SOS #49 ... 8-5
BYU SOS #90 ... 10-3
TCU SOS #86 ... 11-2

2012
Utah SOS #41 ... 5-7
BYU SOS #63 ... 8-5
TCU SOS #16 ... 7-6

Are you telling us if Utah and TCU, the same two teams that own BYU, played BYU's schedule that they would have a worst record?

Dutchman
Murray, UT

Phantomblade,

I don't know where you got the $415 million state appropriation figure. I reviewed my numbers and actually the U has a $2.5 billion annual operating budget and gets an annual $211 million appropriation from the State depending on the mood of the legislature. That is 8% of the U's operating budget. The legislature will always appropriate some money to the U to keep their foot in the door because they want a flag ship university and they get this for a bargain. That $211 million appropriation is returned to Utah's economy in terms of tax revenues and jobs many times over. The U is now tied with MIT in creating private companies that are a result of research and development done at the U. The State of Utah would literally go into an economic depression if the U was closed down. Yes, bemoan that $211 million dollar expense all you want but it is the best return on investment that the State of Utah has.

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