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Comments about ‘Utah Utes football: Utes close 'up and down' season on a good note’

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Published: Saturday, Nov. 24 2012 9:08 p.m. MST

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Uteanymous
Salt Lake City, Utah

Spokane Ute

"getting invited to a bowl with one of the lowest pay outs, while going 7-5, just doesn't say much."

It's funny how Utah fans are suddenly disparaging all of the bowls the Utes played in while they were compiling that "amazing" nine-bowl game winning streak that many Utah fans used to beat their chests about incessantly until Boise State ended that streak by embarrassing the Utes in the "lowly" Las Vegas Bowl.

Here's a clue

lower paying bowl > not qualifying for a bowl

regardless of how you spin it.

--------

I don't troll Utah articles; I'm a Utah grad who simply doesn't agree with all of the misguided hyperbole Utah fans like to throw out there to convince themselves that a couple of perfect storm seasons in 2004 and 2008 suddenly transformed Utah into a great football program. The Utes hit their peak in 2008 and have been in steady decline since; and that's only partially due to playing "better" competition.

Spokane Ute
Spokane, WA

Utenymous,

I find it difficult to believe that any Utah grad would belittle the program like you do. Amazingly bitter. Disparaging all the bowls? Atleast get your facts straigh when being critical of your so called alma matter. Ever hear of the Sugar, Sun or Fiesta bowls? Here's a clue Guy: $20+ million in TV rights. Last year's bowl pay out: Sun ($2 mill) vs. Poinsettia ($.5 mil). Would you like to compare bowl payouts over the last 10 years? What a loyal fan you are; one bad season and the program is horrible. Thanks for your loyalty...not!

Spokane Ute
Spokane, WA

Utenonoymous

I'm looking at the top 25 BCS and USA Today rankings, yet I don't see BYU. We are talkings about "National Rankings" right?. Oh I get it, go to the Sagarin or RPI rankings where they list all 200+ teams. What ever fits your agenda I guess.

scott
Alpine, UT

Sorry, Spokane Ute, I don't see any belittling in Utenonoymous's comments. He's simply disagreeing with you and not drinking the red koolaid.

We all know BYU isn't currently ranked in the Top 25, but we also know that BYU has finished in the Top 25 following five of the eight seasons during the Bronco/Kyle era, whereas, the Utes have only managed to finish in the Top 25 three times during the same time period.

To put that in perspective, BYU has finished in the Top 25 almost as many times during the Bronco era (five) as the Utes have in their entire football history (seven).

Since neither BYU nor Utah are ranked in the current Top 25, we have to go to a second ranking system, which incidentally is used in the super-secret "bcs" formula, to get an idea of where teams not ranked in the Top 25 stand in comparison to each other.

One of the most widely respected of those secondary rankings is Sagarin, where we discover:

#25 Utah State
#37 BYU
#50 Utah

You can choose to dismiss the ranking because it doesn't fit your agenda, but that won't change the ranking.

skywalker
Palo Alto, CA

Spokane Ute

Bowl payouts are a meaningless basis for comparison because they have absolutely NOTHING to do with on field performance.

Look no further than 2008, when 9th ranked, undefeated Boise State(12-0) was matched up against 11th ranked TCU(10-2) in the Poinsettia Bowl, while 12th ranked Cincinnati(11-2) played 21st ranked Virginia Tech(9-4) in the Orange Bowl.

The ONLY thing bowl committees care about is how many fans each team will bring and how many televisions will be tuned in to watch their game; the bowls couldn't care less how accomplished each team was during the season.

Given a choice, the Fiesta Bowl would pick an 8-4 unranked Wisconsin team over an undefeated 12-0 5th ranked San Diego State team in a heart beat, regardless of how many Top 25 teams SDSU beat during the regular season.

scenic view
Baltimore, MD

Spokane Ute

So are we to assume that 6 of the 9 wins in Utah's now defunct 9-game bowl winning streak were meaningless because they occurred in the Poinsettia, Kraft Fight Hunger, Armed Forces, and Las Vegas Bowls, which Utah fans now talk about with such disdain?

What is your criteria for determining whether a bowl is meaningful, or not?

Does the opponent matter at all, or is it simply how much $$$ the bowl pays?

What is the minimum payout in determining whether a bowl is meaningful or not?

And, if $$$ is the overriding factor in determining how meaningful a bowl is, why even play the game?

Inquiring minds want to know...

sammyg
Springville, UT

Spokane Ute :>{

There's not a Ute on the planet that wouldn't die to see his Utes play one more game, even the New Mexico Bowl this year. The same bowl game you and every other Ute fan disparaged BYU for playing in and let's not forget the Helicopter Bowl, Kraft Fight Hunger, and Las Vegas Bowls while we are at it.

Utes would die for the chance to play any bowl.

So BYU's bowling, that's all any of us care for our team, a post season, any post season and you and other Ute fans are personifying so well the old adage of...

... sour grapes.

cont'd

sammyg
Springville, UT

cont'd

Yep, Utes beat BYU again, nobody cares except the locals, but on a national stage its BYU in spotlight again, post season, yet a dim one, late hours, maybe not as many fans to watch it, but its there, the insignificant Poinsettia Bowl, in its glory for BYU fans to gloat about it, much like you guys like to gloat about the wonder years, your PAC12 membership (9th place), except this is current events.

And you can bet that whoever announces this game they will mention that BYU almost beat ND, BSU, and Utah. A better team than their record shows in spite of the QB problems, coaching etc.

I wonder if they will say anything about Utah?

Spokane Ute
Spokane, WA

Look at all the Helpers. Where to start. First off, Scott. I went back and looked at the final BCS standings over the last 10 years, including this season, and found Utah ranked in the top 25, 5 times starting in 2003. During that same time, BYU was ranked in the top 25, 4 times. I can list the years if you would like? I also noticed BYU didn't play in a BCS bowl during that time frame, yet played in the same conference as Utah. Pretty fair comparison of the two teams.

Now, does bowl payout make a bowl meaningless or not? Of couse not, never said it did. Of couse opponent matters, like playing an 11-1 SEC team. However, the more prestigous bowls are played later in the season, and pay out more money. Obviously the Fiesta and Sugar Bowl pay out more money, and are more sought after, than the Poinsettia bowl. Do you honestly think that BYU would accept a Poinsettia bowl bid over the Fiesta, Sun or Sugar Bowl?

Class is in session.

Spokane Ute
Spokane, WA

@skywalker

Can you please let me know what year San Diego state went 12-0 and didn't get a BCS bid? Do you understand how the BCS bowl system works? If a team like SDSU goes 12-0, they would be ranked in the top 12, and receive a BCS auto bid. You realize that Kent State is on the verge of doing that this year; with a top 16 bid. I realize a BCS bowl is foreign to BYU, but you may want to research how the sytem works. Go undefeated, achieve a high enough ranking, and you will get a BCS bowl. Some teams capitalize on this opportunity: TCU, Boise State and Utah. Some don't: Hawaii. I hope you have a better understanding of the BCS now.

TroyTown
Anaheim, CA

Spokane Ute

"I went back and looked at the final BCS standings over the last 10 years, including this season, and found Utah ranked in the top 25, 5 times starting in 2003."

Nice try, but the final BCS standings are not the final Top 25 rankings, but I guess we couldn't expect U to know that.

As skywalker clearly explained, bowl payout or prestige often has little to do with actual on field accomplishment. Just because a major conference negotiates tie-ins with several "more prestigious" bowls, doesn't mean the conference teams that end up filling those slots are anymore accomplished or deserving than teams like TCU or Boise State in 2008, or BYU in 1984 and 1996.

SDSU has never finished 12-0 and been left out of a BCS bowl, that was quite obviously a hypothetical example. sheesh!

Two For Flinching
Salt Lake City, UT

Phoenix

All of that is great. How many of those accomplishments have happened in the current (aka BCS) era of college football?

The fact is lately Utah has had more success in bowl games, and against "name" teams than BYU. It's not a slam on BYU, just a testament to Utah's growth as a program. There is no need to get defensive about it.

sammyg
Springville, UT

Spokane Ute

BYU does not need the $. Each year you kids on the hill bring up this silly bowl payout schedule as something of significance. Who cares? I guess the teams that still work out of trailers... ok, you got a real need there.

So how about payouts for this year... Some simple math for you.

BYU makes a buck and the Utes... not one red cent. LOL

TroyTown
Anaheim, CA

2fer

"All of that is great. How many of those accomplishments have happened in the current (aka BCS) era of college football?"

How many of those accomplishments have happened in Utah football history EVER?

It's true, Utah has had a couple of great seasons, but NOTHING before or after. Even with your two bcs busting teams you still weren't good enough to string two Top 15 teams together, let alone, two Top 10 teams.

Maybe Utah will eventually become competitive in the PAC 12 and prove the naysayers wrong, but at this point, the "growth" in Utah's football program looks more like a couple of brief flashes in the pan.

Spokane Ute
Spokane, WA

@ SammyG

You do realize that the PAC 12 is scheduled to make approximately $44 million in bowl revenue don't you? Two BCS teams. You also realize that the money is distributed through out the conference, right? I'm sure you are also aware that Utah get's a 50% split of a full PAC 12 TV share this year? That number is approximately $10 mill. Now that's pretty simple math. $10 mll + PAC 12 Bowl Share > $500K. You can't beat us on the field, or at the bank; but nice try.

Also, did I mention that the trailers are temporary while we build our state of the art $30 million football facility?

I hope this helps you with your understanding of Utah's Athletic Budget. I know it's a tough concept to grasp when you don't belong to a major BCS conference.

Spokane Ute
Spokane, WA

@ Troy

What rankings determine BCS bowl slots? What rankings determine the National Champion? BCS of course. Nice try, but everyone in college football know's, this is the ranking that counts. Do you even understand how the BCS rankings work? Apparently not, then again if you haven't been to a BCS bowl it's probably a new concept.

Saying SDSU goes undefeated in the BCS era is worse than saying BYU did, or will. Never happened, never will. Shesh!

cedarcityute
cedar city, UT

It's nice to see some actual Ute fans in this article forum :) Secondly, forget about all the BYU kids in here, we have bigger fish to fry folks! The PAC-12 needs to show the SEC where it's at! I think our conference can keep up with the best of them, but the Media, ahem, especially ESPN give the SEC too much love and make it sound as if the PAC-12 is weak, which it is not. This season did not live up to the expectations of many fans, myself included, but that is part of growing pains! Let's stick with our team and support them and our coaches!

LonestarRunner
Salt Lake City, UT

Spokane Ute

"What rankings determine BCS bowl slots? What rankings determine the National Champion? BCS of course."

Sadly, you're only partially correct.

The BCS rankings are ONLY used to qualify teams for the BCS championship and BCS bowl games.

The final BCS rankings come out at the end of the regular season.

The final Top 25 rankings that determine the national champion are the AP and Coaches Polls, which come out AFTER the bowls.

The BCS has adopted the Coaches Poll as their "official" BCS poll and the BCS REQUIRES that all Coaches vote for the BCS championship game winner as #1 in the poll.

The AP Poll is completely separate from the BCS. AP voters can choose ANY team as #1, even a team like Ohio State that is ineligible for post season play.

Interesting, Utah fans ALWAYS cite their AP rankings from 2004 and 2008 (#4 and #2), even though the "official" BCS poll is the Coaches Poll, in which the Utes finished #5 and #4.

AP and/or Coaches Top 25 Rankings during the BCS era

BYU (SIX) - 2001, 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2011
Utah (FIVE) - 2003, 2004, 2008, 2009, 2010

Swoop
Salt Lake City, UT

cedarcityute

"Secondly, forget about all the BYU kids in here, we have bigger fish to fry folks!"

Like planning which dip to go with your couch potato chips during bowl week???

"The PAC-12 needs to show the SEC where it's at!"

The SEC has won 6 straight BCS championships and will be playing in the BCS championship game again this year. The PAC 12 has NEVER won a BCS championship and won't be playing in the BCS championship game this season.

Yeah, that's really showing the SEC "where it's at!"

Utah fans need to step out of that crimson bubble on the hill once in awhile to see that your fantasies don't even come close to reality.

sammyg
Springville, UT

Spokane Ute

It's never about the money for BYU.

All the money in the PAC12 that will be Utah's future windfall will do very little for a program that will always be miles behind the behemoths of the original conference.

Hang on to those coattails.

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