So students are going to change their minds. It's OK to do so. BYU
seems to be getting ragged upon by certain writers for the mere fact that they
actually stand for something. Something good, something righteous, something
moral etc. The University of Utah is a great school with proud traditions. They
can't stand for things that are righteous or moral because they are a state
run institution. It is too bad because there are many good moral people who go
there. On the other hand at BYU there are also great traditions and good moral
people. The fact that they talk about being moral and standing for something is
a credit to them but yet all I see on this board is others trying to drag them
into the pit. I predict that BYU will beat Utah in football this next
fall. Once they do this, the series should be cancelled for ever. I am sick and
tired of the bickering between the institutions. We should celebrate the good
and play down the bad in both organizations. Go Cougars!
back @ Duckhunter 2:00 p.m. Oct. 30, 2012Interesting. Especially
when you consider there is minimal (but closer to negligible) demographic
difference between fans, students, & staff between the 2 institutions. p.s It did not dawn on me until now... byu is a "dry" university
and renowned for their accounting program... let the party begin or not!
What I'm finding hard to understand is that if Coaches Howell and
Mendenhall are so "concerned" for Davion that he'll just party and
lose focus at Utah, why would they want a kid like that to come to BYU so bad in
the first place?
Gary Kinney, I agree with you, he seems to be trying to make the choices that
will positively impact his future the most, and still could very well jump for a
better offer, and I wouldn't hold it against him (as many cougs fans
already are), but I also think from what I've read from him that he's
very comfortable with his commitment to Utah. He has publicly said that although
UCLA and USC, his dream school, have been looking at him a lot lately, he's
got a chip on his shoulder that they never recruited him before, while Utah has
been since high school, and is motivated to compete against them, not for them.
So that's what I know from him, but obviously you know him personally while
I don't, so I'll note your word. He seems like a good kid, and a
focused, hard working athlete, so I'm excited about his possible future at
Duckhunter said1st of all it is spelled "sell" not sale. Bronco
wasn't trying to "sale" anything. 2nd of all BYU has had more
success on the field these last several years than utah has by almost all
measurable quantifiers.--------Does head to head record count as a
measurable quantifier?LOLSpin it Ducky, Spin it!LOL
JmThms:Your school lost 3 in a row to their big brother on the Hill,
8 of the last 11, doomed with a generation gap in the all-time series, never
been invited to play in a BCS bowl, have an all-time LOSING record in the
postseason, have a worse record than the Utes in both games vs. ranked
opponents, and games vs. BCS-level opponents, and isn't wanted by any
relevant conference in the country. So I'M asking YOU......How's that inferiority complex been working out for YOU?
CougFaninTX:"If one kid changes their mind from Utah to BYU, we
get accused of unethical activities, illegal recruiting, etc."That's because recruiting a previously-committed player while on his
mission IS unethical/illegal (per NCAA standards; not the DoJ). And in case you
didn't know, Davion is a JUCO CB. Not a current missionary in the field.
Duckhunter:"As a secular government owned school there is no
moral code for that university, anyone can do anything they want there. Sleep
around, drink, whatever, it all goes."Not true. Utah DOES have
a "moral code"; otherwise known as our "Honor Code". Just
because our "Honor Code" does not have specific prohibitions on
adultery/fornication, that doesn't mean Utah has no moral code. It just
means we're an "institution of higher learning"; not a
"daycare/seminary".And as for alcohol at the U...(1) Utah is a "dry" campus.(2) Underage drinking IS
prohibited. And while I'm not saying underage drinking does not occur at
the U, neither am I suggesting that it doesn't occur at the Y either. In
fact, I KNOW that it occurs at the Y. I saw while I was there my Freshman year,
and similarly, as a U student, I saw Y students drinking up in SLC. And while
I'm not aware if those Y students drinking in SLC were underage (I
didn't card them), I do know that the Y's prohibition on alcohol
hasn't stopped them from imbibing.
@BlueCoug: "I do find some inconsistency in active LDS members who are
loyal Utah fans despising BYU for openly supporting an Honor Code that is based
LDS standards."If you would read what has been written instead
of giving things your own self-serving twists, you will see that LDS members who
are loyal Utah fans the despise byU fans who are judgmental and pious, not the
ones who openly support the honor code. You should save your preaching for
those at byU who agree to the honor code, but don't live it.
@JmThms:You live too close to Boyd Stadium. You must know a lot
about inferiority complexes. Thanks for worrying about me, though. No need to
- I am a Ute fan. We are secure in our fandom.Go Utes!! Onward and
DuckhunterTelling a recruit about BYU's strict rules is not the
same thing as encouraging a kid to live by lesser standards. Coach Whitt is a
devout member of the LDS church and encourages and supports his players who
choose to serve missions. It is ridiculous to claim that he would preach against
his own beliefs in recruiting players.The only thing truly pathetic
in this thread is your slandering of anyone associated with the U because you
feel threatened and insecure about a complete stranger criticizing BYU's
@ute4ever1st of all it is spelled "sell" not sale. Bronco
wasn't trying to "sale" anything. 2nd of all BYU has had more
success on the field these last several years than utah has by almost all
measurable quantifiers. More wins, ranked more times, you know the things that
actually matter. Also the most mpathetic thing I've ever read on these
boards is your posts about this. I know whittingham and the other utah coaches
use BYU's honor code and standards as negatives to recruits, they tell them
they will have to live by those "strict rules" can't have fun,
blah, blah, blah. Of course not only is that pretty much the same tactic that
you are criticizing Bronco for using it is far worse because utah is actually
trying to tell a kid that those standards are negatives for them. They are
encouraging them to live by lesser standards in their lives. That is sad, that
is pathetic, and that sums up what the utah program, and utah "fans",
are all about.
@duckhunterI am well aware that negative recruiting exists at all
schools. I'm sure that Utah coaches told Davion that BYU doesn't ever
put DB's in the NFL. That is an example of negative recruiting and it
happens everywhere. Even Bronco's attempt to sale the strength of schedule
to him was ok. I'm perfectly fine using football negative recruiting as a
toolThe "negative" recruiting that IS funny is Bronco saying
he'd party more at the U than at BYU and that he couldn't focus if he
were at the U. I'm not enraged, just amused. I guess when there really
aren't many on the field selling points for your football team, BYU coaches
resort to sorry attempts to sale off the field items. I'm sure it
didn't come as a surprise to Davion that BYU is the reigning champion of
the "stone cold sober" school.....so ANY school outside of Provo will
likely party more. Really, Bronco has to go to the party card?More
than anything, it shows the lack of scucess on the field for BYU. Otherwise,
he'd sell the program. Sad day for BYU.
Having worked directly with Davion I can assure you he never had plans to stay
with his commit to BYU. He expressed as much to me when he told me he had
verbally committed to BYU. He is just like most athletes today who don't
hold their word as their bond.If something better comes around such as USC
or UCLA he will jump ship for them over Utah.I wish him the best at Utah.
VegasUte,And you too: Hows that inferiority complex workin for ya?
Chris B,'Normal' college experience? And why can't he
have a girlfriend? Hows that inferiority workin for ya, Chris B?
Let's not fool ourselves. You can find a party at any University, College
or town any time you want. I have witnessed some of the wildest parties
I've seen right in "Happy Valley", most thrown by BYU students. So
people who think partying and living the Honor Code effect an athletes decision
on where to play it's not near as big of a factor as most might think.
Go UtesI'm a Utah grad. My father, father-in-law, and many of
my aunts, uncles, and cousins are Utah graduates. I've been attending
football and basketball games at RES and the HC for decades, so I'm fully
aware of the how things used to be at the U, and how they are now. I've sat
in the middle of the Utah student section wearing BYU gear, back when you could
do so with only some mild heckling. I was sitting in the middle of the Crimson
Club for Beck to Harline.Most of the time, Utah does have a
"great family atmosphere," but things have changed. To suggest that Utah
has a "great family atmosphere" on game day for any visiting team, but
especially when the Utes are playing the Cougars is patently false. Try wearing
a BYU jersey to a BYU-Utah game at RES sometime and you'll get a clearer
picture what things are really like at the U.I do find some
inconsistency in active LDS members who are loyal Utah fans despising BYU for
openly supporting an Honor Code that is based LDS standards.
Most of these BYU fans is the reason why I hated attending BYU. Yes I am a Ute
fan that attended BYU. If a player wants to see the biggest load of hypocrisy
about the "band of brothers" go to BYU. If you want a competitive
atmosphere in school, in your ward (if LDS) and socially, attend BYU. If you
want no activities and a student organization that hoardes all of its money to
go on their own vacations, attend BYU. I have been to both schools and Utah BY
FAR is the more friendly, family atmosphere than BYU. BYU is a self-righteous,
judging, competitive group of people.
They both seem like great kids who have made the decisions that are best for
Glad the kid made the right choice to join the best program in the state and the
conference of champions!!!
@RockOn"Many hormonally challenged kids with no thought for the
future will always gravitate to places where they can get drunk, laid and mess
with drugs. U of U, by your description, seems a better fit. That's fine
with me. BYU will take those with a greater desire for education and morality
than an extension of being a high school jock."-------------So BYU lost a commit to Utah. Big deal. Your post is one of
self-righteousness and pure arrogance. It is the reason why so many Ute fans
despise the BYU fan base. Not to mention that it makes all Latter-Day Saints,
who many associate BYU with, as stuck-up snobs, which isn't true of course,
but it is hard to defend against the claim. Fortunately, I won't judge all
BYU fans by your remarks, but many will. Sadly, however, over 20 people
"like" your post.
Their is a simple answer for the negative commentors toward BYU. I believe it
is one that they fully understand but choose not to come right out and talk
about. Why? Because is can be a positive or negative thing for their school
also. The honor code at BYU is a very big issue. Same reason that
many people do not join or attend the LDS church and speak negatively about it.
They choose to not live the lifestyle. On the other side of the fence, for
athletes who do not want the liberal college lifestyles or the requirement to
play on Sunday, then BYU becomes a good fit for them regardless of LDS
membership.It would appear that that gap is widening. Utah is
gaining a liberal college reputation and as time goes on it will most likely be
even more apparent. Sunday play will become a bigger issue for many kids
also.Bottom line there will be kids who choose Utah over BYU because
of the lifestyle available there. But the reverse will also apply and those who
choose the LDS lifestyle will more likely end up at BYU.
ModerateBob, thank you for all the time you spend on the Deseret News
"glorified blog". Must be worth your time or you would not be here.
@ute4everLOL! that you think all schools don't bad mouth all
other schools recruiting the exact same kids. And yes I can give you examples of
utah coaches saying far, far, far worse things about BYU than the one you are so
sillily outraged over.LOL!
@VegasUteAny one recruited this year WILL NOT be playing against any
of those teams except perhaps Hawaii which has traditionally been a competitive
team. Having one down year does NOT mean they won't be decent in the
hypocritical Ute fans stop persecuting BYU and their fans.
@ IdahoCoogDisappointing comment you made judging these two young men that
you have probably never met. Neither of the two has made a promise to anyone
until a LOI is signed and even then minds can be changed. That is always a
right they have and not knowing the cirumstances we have no ground to pass
@ Broomhockeychamp"Performance on the field"? Utah has
beaten BYU three years in a row, and 8 of the last 11. Utah has 3 times the
amount of current NFL players then BYU. Try again.
Better schedule at BYU? The latest Sagarin ratings lists the four worst FBS
schools in order: Massachusetts, Idaho, New Mexico State and Hawaii. I may be
wrong, but, aren't three of those schools on byU's schedule this year?
BTW - cougar blue just might be beyond ecstatic by their home November schedule
this year!!No wonder Davion Chose The Red!!
What I like is that Davion said that Bronco told him that byU has a better
schedule than Utah. Really?? Besides throwing out the "they party"
card, that was particularly humorous. I'm surprised he didn't claim
that byU puts more people in the NFL!!Welcome home Davion!!
Don't kid yourselves people, a kid who wants to party, have girls, do
drugs, etc., will do it regardless of where they go to school or what code they
have agreed to. It happens all the time in Provo, if you think it doesn't,
it's only because of your blue blinders. Don't be so self-righteous
as to condemn a team, a school or a community just because it is outside of Utah
County. There are great people on the Utah team who are solid LDS, including
coaches, and many - MANY great fans who are solid LDS, including ..... The
Prophet! If byU were the only place for LDS players, there would not be high
profile LDS players on other rosters, including Manti Te'o on Notre Dame
and Jake Murphy (the ex - four star byU commit) on Utah.Get off your
high horses. Davion picked the better program for him. He wants to play in the
NFL, enough said!!Nice to have Davion aboard. It has got to be
painful to you southies that Utah got byU's highest rated 2013 recruit (per
Rivals) to date.
@ BlueCoug,People find what they want to find at the school they
choose, depending on the type of person they are. I attended the U and loved
it. You may find it hard to believe, but while at the U, I never drank alcohol
and never engaged in immoral "partying." I did find my wife and was
sealed to her in the temple. The U is a great family atmosphere. Certainly one
who is looking for it can find bad things. NEWS FLASH: so can someone who is
looking for it at BYU. Get off your unbecoming high horse. Glad you enjoyed
BYU; good on you. But know that there are thousands of Mormons and other good
people who have a great experience at the U and live fulfilling lives even
though they were deprived of the apparent and purported celestial bliss that is
BYU. Your attitude represents one of the main reasons I declined my
acceptance to BYU and chose to join with other great Mormons and other good
folks at the U. Glad to see that that attitude is still alive and well after
all these years. Keep it up BlueCoug.
Are we comparing again?
I'm quite comfortable with this transaction. BYU seems to be getting the
better defensive players, anyway, as evdidenced by the performance on the field.
What I found interesting was the final recruiting pitch made to Davion by the
BYU coaches, which said (from Davion's mouth) he would "have a better
schedule at BYU and it would it would be better for me - that there would be a
lot of partying at Utah and it wouldn't be good for me because I need to be
focused". The BYU coaches also said they would continue to recruit him to
get him back.I find it pathetic that BYU coaches have to go to the
"Utah is a party school and will ruin you" card in recruiting. Why
couldn't they just sell the good things about BYU's football program?
I'm not sure why ANY recruit would choose BYU over Utah if they are looking
at the quality of the CB position. Just look at the recent NFL success of Utah
CB's and it's easy to pick the better path as far as football goes.
Utah is a fine place to be. There's no honor code, but in no way does that
mean everyone is partying it up. Sad, sad method of recruiting in my book.
Congrats to both young men for the opportunity to get an education and play Div
I football.Get that degree!
No need for either fan base to get all excited. A verbal comitment doesn't
mean squat. Kids change their minds; no big deal. I hope the kid signs for Utah
and wish him all the best.GO UTES>--->
Welcome to BYU Trent. Cougar Nation is proud to have you on the team.
Brandon Gurney, the Iraqi Information Minister of BYU Sports (or is that Greg
Wrubell…. I think it is debatable). I think it is funny that the Deseret
News has basically become a glorified blog.Anyhoo, kudos to Mr.
Gurney for understanding that his fan base needs to be handled with care and
that he needs to follow up bad news with some good news, even though the good
news happened nearly a month ago.When will we Mormons get over our
@RockOn"Many hormonally challenged kids with no thought for the future
will always gravitate to places where they can get drunk, laid and mess with
drugs."As someone who doesn't drink, get laid, or mess with
drugs, I think I like being a Ute more than a Cougar for many reasons (for one
the U is the only one of the two with my major) but one of them is so that I
could avoid the self-righteous air of superiority enough BYU students have. @Duckhunter"As a secular government owned school there is no
moral code for that university, anyone can do anything they want there. Sleep
around, drink, whatever, it all goes."Drinking is not allowed on
campus. Regardless, I'm sorry that my school doesn't maintain the
Christian-based Sharia law standard your preferred school has.
If one kid changes their mind from Utah to BYU, we get accused of unethical
activities, illegal recruiting, etc.But when on kid changes their
mind from BYU to Utah, it's because of Utah's superiority, PAC,
etc.BYU's not for everyone. Utah's not for everyone.
Good luck Davion.As long as BYU can continue to recruit DBs like
Johnson, Hadley, Sampson, Sorensen and Bills we'll be fine. These are not
the DB's of five or ten years ago. I'll take BYU defense this year
over Utah's any day.
If you are going for football then the U is hands down the best opportunity.
Playing in the PAC 12 pretty much says it all. The Y has a nice campus
experience no question for freshmen recruits but now that will change
dramatically with the 18 year old missionary change. 18 year old freshmen young
men at the Y is going to be a thing of the past going forward. BYU football is
going to change ... for the worse I'm afraid if they continue to recruit
heavily LDS young men. These high school grads are going to go on missions now
which means your first look at them is going to at age 21 most likely after they
have returned from their mission and then most likely red shirted a year after
that. Tough situation. BYU would be better served to recruit more non lds kids
like they used to during the Edwards years. You get the kid for 4 straight years
right out of HS. Some of these kids convert to the church which is another plus.
Why not? Academics are a gimme and there are no personal conduct standards. He
will fit in well with the utes.
@anne26And I've found the majority of utah "fans"
really aren't fans at all. I notice you come around every time you think
the morality of the university of utah is questioned, I'm not sure why. As
a secular government owned school there is no moral code for that university,
anyone can do anything they want there. Sleep around, drink, whatever, it all
goes. No need to stick up for something that doesn't exist don't you
adelmanLOL at your "morally challenged" whining. Just
because a BYU recruit and his parents are impressed with the very real
difference between the BYU culture and the culture they see at most other
colleges and universities, doesn't mean you have to feel
@Rockon: Please tell me you are joking. If not, please know your opinions do
not represent most of the fans/students who root for or attend BYU. Funny
thing, I have found the most arrogant BYU fans are usually those who never
actually attended the school.
LOL at BYU taking the "we're morally superior" route. Again. And I
think the phrase "hormonally challenged" actually was used. Seriously?
Just because a (NON-LDS) kid doesn't want to go to BYU, all of the sudden
there is something physically wrong with this kid? He has worked hard and wants
to experience college in a certain way, and he deserves to.
I hate byu and yes they haven't recruited the best at db, BUT they have one
of the best defenses this yearthat I've ever seen in the State of Utah
Chris B when will you wake up and realize that you are tooting the horn of
something that in well less than 1000 days won't mean jack squat! In
fact... It is now officially less than 800. The BCS corrupt system is dying an
ignominious death and a look at the track record of its fabled poll this season
proves just how dysfunctional of an elitist ball of rubbish it is. Oregon keeps
getting jumped! Yes, you are in the BCS which officially dies in 2014. But even
the BCS thinks VERY LITTLE about the little skunks of the Whacky 12. You lost 4
games in a row in that very conference. A win over a sub mediocre California
squad is no reason to pound your chest... First beat Colorado and then ... Well,
the Utes still haven't accomplished jack!
I usually only check the comments for the Ute trolls.As usual, not
Chris B. finally emerges after weeks of silence. I predict another long period
of silence starting in two weeks.
Too funny of an article. I don't think I've ever seen such a long
article about an unoffice "commit" who still has a chance to decommit.
When will the DN Sports Staff start the Heisman Trophy talk for this guy! Looks
like a bye-week article for sure. Too funny.
motorbike"interesting that so many parents that come with their
kids on recruiting visits to Utah walk away saying what a good, clean
environment Utah presents and what a great family atmosphere it is."Obviously those parents haven't sat in the middle of the MUSS on
game day or been to a Utah frat party.-------chris b"How many times do we see kids commit to Utah and then change their
minds to BYU?Harvey Unga and Josh Sharp, to name just a couple.BYU is unique and isn't for everybody, but, then again, neither is
Utah.BYU and Utah only go head-to-head for small number of recruits
each year, so the real challenge for U is convincing recruits that Utah is a
better place for them than USC, UCLA, Oregon, etc.
Davion switched to play with his cousin. I would do the same if I were in his
shoes.Utah will always have the upper hand in corner talent. Any
honest BYU fan can admit that. The fact is though BYU has done a better job
recruiting the right jc corners that are athletic. The 2012 BYU defense
doesn't look like say the 2007 or 2008. Team speed is much better.
Trammel looks to be a great fit in continuing what we have this year. He and
Johnson will keep the corners locked down. Now the real question is will BYU
allow taysom to throw the ball next year. Cause if they put up points, broncos
D will do its part and manage points.
RockOn, "Many hormonally challenged kids with no thought for
the future will always gravitate to places where they can get drunk, laid and
mess with drugs. U of U, by your description, seems a better fit."Come on Man! You're view from the bubble is seriously warped.As a Utah fan, living in Provo, its cool that this kid from CA decided to make
his own opinions, unlike some of my fellow fans, so good get from you guys. As
far as Utah stealing a recruit from TDS, Meh, who cares I'd rather steal
from our competitors.
Chris B ...You won't see Trammel changing his commitment to
Utah. Utah quit recruiting him before his commitment to BYU. Why that is I
don't know. Before every BYU homer jumps on that comment I'll be the
first to say it may have been because they knew he was leaning to the Y ...
again, I don't know. But it does seem clear that Utah no longer has any
interest.RockOn ... Interesting take. Also interesting
that so many parents that come with their kids on recruiting visits to Utah walk
away saying what a good, clean environment Utah presents and what a great family
atmosphere it is.But that's okay, say what you want ... we all know
your venom comes from jealousy.
Josh Sharp, Craig Cusick don't agree with you. And, it is to be
expected that if one school has tighter, tougher standards it will attract fewer
people. Many hormonally challenged kids with no thought for the future will
always gravitate to places where they can get drunk, laid and mess with drugs. U
of U, by your description, seems a better fit. That's fine with me. BYU
will take those with a greater desire for education and morality than an
extension of being a high school jock.
Question for byu fans:How many times do we see kids commit to Utah
and then change their minds to byu?Very very rarely.How
many times do we see kids originally big fans of Utah switch to byu?same answer.We've seen with examples like Chace Hansen, Zach
Lindsay, Vaha Vainuku switching allegience from blue to red that the future of
football in Utah,is Utah.
"byu has a tough time recruiting top defensive back talent"Why?Interesting. I've said the same thing many times and byu
fans try to dismiss this and pretend its not true. Good choice by
Davion. As soon as somoene clues Trent into what Provo life is truly
like(no parties, girlfriends, no normal college experience) he'll be using
that talented speed he has to run north 30 miles to Utah.I wonder if
Davion's decision had something to do with Utah's inclusion in a real
conference?Or the fact that every single graduating class of the
last 8 years has won a BCS game?I guess winning BCS games was more
enticing than winning WAC championships.Go figure.