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Comments about ‘LDS Church says disciplinary claim is 'patently false'’

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Published: Friday, Sept. 21 2012 8:29 p.m. MDT

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Shelama
SALT LAKE CITY, UT

The Mormon church, like every church, has every right to make and enforce whatever rules they want. And members are free to take it or leave it. But it's difficult to see much if any association with Jesus of Nazareth in any of it.

Economist
Salt Lake City, UT

OKay, this makes no sense. The title of the article is, "LDS Church says disciplinary claim is patnently false", but yet the article discusses the fact that there is a pending disciplinary hearing on the 30th of Sept and that excommunication is just one of the many options afforded to the council.

So which is it?!? Either this guy is going to be disciplined or not? The double speak in this one is strong Obi-Won

shaedow
Salt Lake City, UT

I notice that the paper chooses to offer a very one-sided story here, favoring the Mormon faith. This can be seen by noticing there is no name given for the blog, but FAIR is prominently featured along with its address. Seems getting our own information, or understanding both sides is not encouraged here...

shaedow
Salt Lake City, UT

I found the blog on the Tribune. He is the managing editor of Mormonthink which you can find by adding the standard COMmercial ending to the above. ;) Shae

Sandee Spencer
Longwood, FL

There is a big difference between being disciplined by the church for being anti-Mitt Romney or for being discplined for speaking publicly and clearly against the church itself.

It always puzzles me why folks that are hostile to the church and speak openly and publicly against the church are so dismayed if the church desires to release them from their membership and baptismal covenants. All are welcome to attend worship services and activities. But those that choose to work, speak and write against the church are invited to leave their official status as believing, practicing members.

Say No to BO
Mapleton, UT

The Church got dragged into another story during the political "silly season." Even though it is not about Romney, certain media outlets are hyping it as such.
In the end it is an issue between the Church and a member. There is no political connection here.

skeptic
Phoenix, AZ

Anything and everything in one way or another is political within the church organization. Name one thing that is not.

A voice of Reason
Salt Lake City, UT

Shelama,

"The Mormon church, like every church, has every right to make and enforce whatever rules they want. And members are free to take it or leave it. But it's difficult to see much if any association with Jesus of Nazareth in any of it."

Perhaps you find it difficult to associate Jesus with the Holy bible also?

Mathew 21:11-13

"And the multitude said, This is Jesus the prophet of Nazareth of Galilee.

And Jesus went into the temple of God, and cast out all them that sold and bought in the temple, and overthrew the tables of the moneychangers, and the seats of them that sold doves,

And said unto them, It is written, My house shall be called the house of prayer; but ye have made it a den of thieves."

Dixie Dan
Saint George, UT

I wonder how many faithful LDS members have been disciplined for their comments on Harry Reid, who is a faithful member of this church?

Claudio
Springville, Ut

Sandee,

That's is NOT the purpose of Church discipline at all. They are not at any time "invited to leave their official status" as members. That would be 100% counter to the mission of Jesus Christ. Church discipline is a complicated process, very rarely discussed in the open (thus the reason why many including yourself misspeak as to its purpose), that is geared completely towards repentance. The Church does not excommunicate people and effectively say, "good luck with whatever." Excommunication is a step towards full repentance, necessary in only the most severe cases. It is the intention of those administering the discipline that the individual will continue to work with Church leaders to return to full fellowship.

lloydlewisjr
Montrose, CO

To Economist: The Church said this individual was not being disciplined for anti -Romney writings. That was the denial subject.
shaedow: it's an LDS publication.
Funny how they can leave the church, but they can't leave the church alone.
If one is going to stir the sewage and put a spin on everything for their own satisfaction, perhaps it is better to have them released from membership and baptismal covenants. If you don't believe it, leave it, but leave it alone because obviously if one is not doctrinally sound, they have no business spouting off about it.
Just my take on it.

The Watcher
BATTLE MOUNTAIN, NV

Hay: Dixie Dan, If Harry Reid was a faithful member of the LDS church, he wouldn't behave the way he does.

Nanook of the North
Camarillo, CA

OK, Watcher, are you Sen. Reid's bishop or stake president? Otherwise, what qualifies you to decide Brother Reid's faithfulness or lack thereof? What specific behaviour are you referring to? Or are you one of those Mormons who is convinced that the Republican Party is the only true party on the earth? (A claim which I and many other more-left-wing Mormons would dispute vociferously.) Seriously ... name specific behaviours that you think make Br. Reid an unfaithful Saint?

2close2call
Los Angeles, CA

While I agree that the LDS church can excommunicate any of its LDS members they wish, I think it is a bad idea to excommunicate those that doubt the authenticity of the church and post things that make the church look bad, especially if those things he is posting are true. It only makes the church look like they are hiding something. Additionally, if what he is posting is not true, a better approach would be to explain in general conference or elswhere what is false about what he is saying instead of excomunicating him and trying to sweep it under the rug and effectively censoring him which many Americans believe is vile .

I believe, If this man is excommunicated for saying things bad about the church that are in fact true, but make the church look bad, It will end up increasing the number of LDS apostates who actually believe truth is important. If he is posting lies that make the church look bad and he is excommunicated with no explanation of what the lies were, the same result will occur as the lies are left unrefuted and many will still believe he was telling the truth.

Joan Watson
TWIN FALLS, ID

1. It will not matter in the long run - but because the church disciplinary councils are strictly confidential, the other side can say anything publicaly to justify themselves and put the church in a bad light - and they usualy do.

2. It doesn't matter who you are or what you are - anyone of us who accuses someone based on hearsay or rumor and then we broadcast, with no proof, that what we heard is true - becomes a tale bearer and a false witness.

Hawkeye76
Saint George, 00

The LDS Church spokesman said: Church discipline becomes necessary only in those rare occasions when an individual’s actions cannot be ignored while they claim to be in good standing with the church.
Since Mr. Mitt Romney's factual misrepresentations about our President are so publically visible and so oft repeated why has he not bee disciplined? Is there some misunderstanding about the clarity of the Articles of Faith's doctrinal stance on ethics and honesty. Mr. Romney is the face of the Church right now, like it or not, and it would seem advisable for the Church to rebuke him in some form for his dishonesty. I am not speaking of the political bending of the facts that is unfortunately common place in politics today; but of known and deliberate and repeated factual misrepresentations.

Rikitikitavi
Cardston, Alberta

Utter lunacy to expect to retain Church membership in the face of all the anti-LDS garbage on his blog. We don't need "cultural" members in the Church.

fkratz
Portland, OR

One of the interesting aspects of MormonThink is that much like Richard Packham's Homepage, no one has really challenged the information contained withing. It seems that folks should appreciate sources of information which offer something other than what is put out by LDS. (org). We are indeed fortunate to be living in the internet/information age where we no longer have to rely on "pamphlets" or word of mouth to obtain information, especially that which is critical. Thanks Mr. Twede!

nschulzke
Pleasant Grove, UT

He's not excommunicated yet, and we don't know whether he will be. So commenters: stop talking about it as if he has been already.

The vast majority of MormonThink isn't about Romney, it's about the Church and its teachings. And it's all intended to draw members away. When a person who associates with such a group claims to be a Mormon for the purpose of increasing the credibility of the group, it is more than natural for them to be singled out for counselling and possible disciplinary action.

@fkratz:
The church has a long-standing policy of not directly addressing sources of anti-Mormon literature. Mormon scholarly groups, however, actively address and, yes, challenge such "information". In fact, FAIR itself has an entire section of their webpage devoted to MormonThink specifically, not to mention a vast analysis of critics comments in general. So to say that the content of MormonThink goes unchallenged is ridiculous.

A voice of Reason
Salt Lake City, UT

All claims about Twede vs Romney which favor twede are ludicrous, without substance, and are most certainly false. I spent a few minutes on his blog to see if there is anything directly opposing the church. I found that there most certainly was.

Consider the following claims:

"Romney is imperfect"
"Romney has lied"
"Romney has sinned"

All these COULD be true. Let's assume for a moment that they are. Now consider the following:

"We are all as imperfect with sin"

Does the church excommunicate those who sin? No. Does it excommunicate members who turn to apostasy and try to lead other members away from the church? Yes. Has Romney tried leading members away? No. Are there fine disputes about doctrine that Jesus Christ commanded us not to engage in? Yes! Claims against Romney's political philosophies have gone directly against what we have been commanded. Are we being commanded to follow Romney? No. To not dispute? Yes.

Lastly, Twede's publications argue quite the opposite, and do nothing to substantiate the church as the true church of God. Rather, they only cast doubt and do the opposite. The truth is very plainly testified by the spirit.

Continued...

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