@Rifleman, glad to hear you'll be voting for Scott Howell and Peter Cooke,
two staunch opponents of abortion.
Re: SG in SLC Salt Lake City, UT"We respect diverse views about
reproductive issues."Yes, that is exactly why 'one old
man' is incorrect when he suggests that the Democrat's position on
abortion is in line with that of the LDS Church. Conservatives, and the LDS
Church, believe that abortions are appropriate where the life of the mother is
at risk, and in cases of rape and incest.When Democrats start
showing as much concern for the life of viable unborn infants as they do for
condemned killers on death row then, and only then, will we consider supporting
them and their candidates.
RE: SG in SLCRegarding abortion: If you are
"pro-choice" then you MUST BE "pro-abortion".That is
the choice.If you support the choice then you must also support the
act. they go hand in hand.It is very simple math.Regarding Democrat party far shift to the left.It is a fact.Obama is a communist. and he is the defacto leader of the party. How
much farther left can go you when you are embracing communism, marxism and
socialism to the fullest?The repubs have shifted to center left,
when the establishment is lead by big government, big spenders like, mccain,
bush, lindsay graham, and liberal democrat hobnobber hatch.sorry if
you do not like it being wrenched back to center right by tea partiers.Your characterizations are wildly wrong or intentionally deceptive.The people will always move en mass to where they feel the representation is
most like them. Here in Utah is is the republican party not the democrats.The "wooing" will always be frustrated by the true nature of the
Re: the Republican shift to the right versus the (alleged) Democratic shift to
the left, and litmus tests --FDR, Truman, JFK, Carter, and Bill
Clinton would fit in just fine in today's Democratic party; I'm pretty
sure you can't honestly say the same for Teddy Roosevelt, Eisenhower,
Reagan, and Bush I & II (or "41" and "43") in today's
Republican party. I don't think that any of them could get the Republican
nomination today, and Roosevelt would be absolutely pilloried (George Will said
as much in an op-ed piece a few days ago). I'm not sure that even Barry
Goldwater or William F. Buckley, Jr. would be relevant in the GOP today, and
most people would agree that, taken as a whole, these Republicans are further
right of center than the aforementioned Democrats are left of center.And really, isn't it much more common for someone to be labeled a RINO
for not being "conservative enough" than for someone to be labeled a
DINO for not being "liberal enough"? That has certainly been my
Rifleman,I can guarantee that you won't find the words
"abortion on demand" in the national, Utah, or Salt Lake County
Democratic Party platforms; what you WILL find is language like "a
woman's right to choose"(which is often mischaracterized by
conservatives as pro-abortion), "a comprehensive approach that protects
reproductive freedom while fostering personal responsibility and education for
thoughtful and moral decisions", and "We respect diverse views about
reproductive issues. Decisions about reproduction are best made on an individual
basis in accordance with one’s own personal or religious values." My
faith teaches that free agency and personal accountability for one's
choices are eternal principles, and I believe that the aforementioned party
platform language regarding reproductive rights squares pretty well with those
principles.Honestly, I think a lot of people would be surprised at
how many Democrats there are who generally oppose on moral grounds elective
Re: "That's why I gave up on the Utah Democratic Party . . . and joined
the Socialist Party - USA.Yeah -- that's the problem with us
Utah Democrats -- we're just go too lite on socialism.You gotta
hand it to marxist, though. He got tired of all the spin and prevarication,
finally admitting that Democrats are expected to be marxists -- even if we are a
little too reactionary for his taste.
one old man,I don't see the LDS church requiring practicing members
of ANY faith to pay for contraceptives and morning after pills for their
employees. I have NEVER heard that preached over ANY LDS pulpit.Why
do you spread such untruths?
Re: one old man Ogden, UT"Don't they know that the Democratic
position on abortion is almost word-for-word identical to that of the LDS
Church?"It is condescending to suggest that someone who
doesn't believe as you do must therefore be less knowledgeable. There is a
world of difference between the position of the LDS Church and the support for
abortion on demand by your everyday, common, garden variety, Democrat.In other words, Republicans aren't fooled by a wolf in sheep's
clothing trying to masquerade as holding the same position on abortions as we do
Interesting that several posters here are objecting to what they call Democratic
support of "abortion on demand."Don't they know that
the Democratic position on abortion is almost word-for-word identical to that of
the LDS Church?
Why do we always hear about the "right" and the "tea-party"
hijacking the Republican party, but never hear about the "left" or
"socialist/Marxist" hijacking the Democratic party. We have this same
story every two years and it gets old and is tired. I have always said that as
soon as the National Democratic party supports my views and interest, than I
will vote for them. But for now, the Republican more accurately reflects my
views so I will continue to vote for them. A few years ago, the Utah
Democratic party put up Dave Thomas as the Congressman for the 1st District
against Rob Bishop. I know Dave Thomas personally and he is a great man. At
the time he was serving as a Bishop, he and has family hunted, and he was a very
successful businessman who started a business after being a teacher. He was the
"perfect" Republican candidate, but was running as a Democrat. I
struggled internally for days with my decision. I finally had to vote for Rob
Bishop because the party he represented was more in-line with my beliefs
Nationally than the Democrats. Like it or not, parties matter.
“The site even includes a GOP elephant painted blue and orange”Imitation is the most sincere form of flattery."We just
want to create a tent in the Democratic Party in Utah and nationally that LDS
people can feel comfortable in."Does that mean abandoning the
party’s support for abortion on demand, gay marriage, and dependency on
the state?SG in SLC,You speak of litmus tests, the DNC has
them. Unwavering support for abortion, gay marriage, and state dependency, to
name but a few.
Re: SG in SLC Salt Lake City, UT"Your posts are cases in point for the
main thesis of the article. "When it comes to the core values of
the majority of Utahns they find that Republicans most closely share similar
beliefs. It is not the Republicans who have shifted their beliefs on same sex
marriages, but we have noted that the Democrats have now added that plank to
their platform.And no, Republicans have not shifted so far to the
right. When measured against the principles we believed in 20 or 30 years ago
there has been a drastic shift to the left.
DN Subscriber & Rifleman,Your posts are cases in point for the
main thesis of the article. The Republican party has shifted so far to the
right, and has become so monolithic, so driven by ideological purity and
"litmus tests" (increasingly to the exclusion of problem-solving and
actual governance), and so fundamentalist in its views that there is no longer
any room in it for moderates (ask Bob Bennett how moderates are treated by the
GOP).I was once a Republican, but I felt marginalized and
disenfranchised as it became apparent that the party simply dismisses
contrasting points of view (my views on the environment and economic policy vary
from the mainstream Republican party line). I also observed a growing hubris
and sense of entitlement in the party, particularly at the state level. On the
other hand, while my views on 2nd Amendment rights and abortion also vary from
the mainstream Democratic party line, a greater diversity of opinions seems to
be welcomed and valued in that party.I think many Utah moderates and
independents have had similar experiences to mine, and would make the leap away
from the Republicans if they knew they were not alone.
Why vote for a democrat that takes their marching orders from barack, nancy,
harry? Look at corroon, becker, matheson, and how they have operated in this
state. They take their orders from barack and do everything that is asked of
them by the democrat party.Do you think any of these democrats
listen to the will of the people? Unless you want welfare, they don't
mention you unless they want your money.This whole idea that we can
tax our way to prosperity is ridiculous.
In the 40's, 50's and 60's, Utah was heavily Democratic. It was
lopsided Democratic, and Utahns voted for LBJ in a landslide. People forget
that.But then, the National Democratic Party was hijacked by the
extreme left-wing types, and it has never recovered. 1972 was a watershed year
with the Democratic National Convention, embracing abortion "rights,"
ERA, gun control, and other platform items which horrified most Utahns. Utahns
left the Democrats in droves, and it has only gotten worse. If
Utahns elect Democrats to go to Washington, they instantly find themselves in
isolation and are a quaint curiosity for the left-wing Democratic machine.
Conservative Democrats are ridiculed, marginalized, and then run out of town.
(Ask Zell Miller).Too bad things aren't more balanced, but if
the National Democratic Party had more balanced (not a euphamism for tax
increase) membership, they might have more of a chance in Utah.Hope
springs eternal, right?
When the Democrats adopt the principles and values that are important to Utah
voters they can expect to see some converts. In the last election Gov. Gary
Herbert beat Peter Corroon 64.2% to 31.8%. May I suggest that Democrats that
don't believe in abortion and same sex marriage consider joining those of
us with a like mind.
"Republicans, beware?" Did his article appear on the Editorial page?
Perhaps DN thinks its readership will actually swallow this as a news story. Oh
well, Yellow Journalism lives!
The Utah Democratic effort is pathetic. Do they really think they can elect
anybody by being the Republicans Lite? People need a real alternative.
That's why I gave up on the Utah Democratic Party (and their clones in
other mountain west states) and joined the Socialist Party - USA.
Likely I've seen a few more politicians than some readers over the years,
obviously not others, but I have to say that the State of Utah was very well
served by Governor Rampton and Governor Matheson, both Democrats. We were also
well served by Governor Clyde, a Republican. I'm sorry that I can't
say as much for more recent governors as they seemed to have an aura of being
full of themselves and looking for national attention, rather than taking care
of Utah first and foremost. Just my opinion........I have always
voted for the "person" and not the "party" when it comes to
elections and have never voted a straight-party ticket in my life.
You think the Democrats are going to lure Republicans this year? Really? The
DesNews runs this story every two years. Funny thing is, they never write a
story regarding how Republican candidates might be more attractive to Democrats
than their Democrat counterparts. With the economy in the toilet
(far and away the most important issue), record debt--and all three branches of
government working to strap us with even more debt and put our economy into
greater peril, America's leadership in the world bowing to China, wars
being fought without purpose, our borders not being enforced, etc.--and all of
this under the leadership of the Democrats, how could anyone with any level of
loyalty and devotion to this country consider continuing down this path
we're on by voting with that party?If anything, expect the
Republicans to do well this election.
Utah Democrats are of the same party as Barack Obama, Harry Reid, Nancy Pelosi,
Barney Frank, and Rahm Emmanuel.I reject all of the policies and
goals of those Democrats, and therefore must reject the Utahns who choose to
associate themselves with those listed above.Our neighbors may be
good and decent people, with different ideas, but you must judge a person by the
company they choose to keep, and in this case, it is unacceptable. Under ANY
circumstances.I don't care if they skip the Democrat
convention, or run from sharing the stage with Obama (as Jimmy Matheson has
already done) to try to fool us by claiming they are different. They are
not.If all Democrats were like Utah Democrats, then maybe I would
consider voting for them.