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Comments about ‘Religious groups weigh in on Supreme Court's Obamacare ruling’

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Published: Thursday, June 28 2012 8:46 p.m. MDT

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Aussie Teacher
WESTON, VT

Once again the US is shoing how hypocritical they are. You must be the only people on earth who claim to love God and yet are quite happy to see people go bankrupt because they need helth care. The only place where a person is scared to go to hospital because they can't afford the costs.
How lucky am I that if I or my wife become ill then we can go to hospital (or a doctor) and get treated and not have to lose my house in doing so.
How people are so facinated by the US totally escapes me!
Flash on the surface, but sick and dangerous underneath.
All gloss and nothing else.

God Bless Amerika? I don't think so, He/She has better things to do than 'bless' a country that cares nothing for its own.

Hutterite
American Fork, UT

Here again, we need to keep religion out of politics.

Mark B
Eureka, CA

I don't know if God judges whole societies, but if He does, then one measure that must surely enter into this judgment would be how the weakest, least self-reliant, most dependent citizens are treated. If there is condemnation, surely it would be greater if that society is a rich one.

Gandalf
Salt Lake City, UT

Mark B, you are dead on.

RG
Buena Vista, VA

How society treats people is not only a function of government. God wants us to care for the poor, but he never said it had to be done by a tax and spend and waste big government program (that also provides free abortions just for the convenience of the mother). Obamacare was not the only way to accomplish noble goals; in fact, it has and will continue to have many unintended consequences, and logically, would not be able to succeed in its goals without bankrupting the country. So just because someone doesn't support Obamacare does not mean they are heartless. In fact, it might mean they think other options will actually work much, much better. The GOP did provide a number of good ideas, which were all ignored by Obama, even though he said he'd take good ideas from anyone.

Mark B
Eureka, CA

Fair enough, RG. What's the BEST unused idea that the GOP offered to reforming health care? And if the whole idea of reform by government is so bad, then what should we do? Go back to coverage only for the well-employed? Go back to the 50's, when it didn't matter much? I'm for that as long as PRICES get taken back to what they were then.

Hellooo
Salt Lake City, UT

And as the affordable health care act continues to cause raising prices for all people, some applaud the access not realizing the limit it will place on services rendered and quality of the care given. As the health care system gradually reduces the services that it provides, maybe we can all be like Aussie happy to get care even if it substandard and 50 years behind the times.

RedShirt
USS Enterprise, UT

To "Aussie Teacher" going through personal financial problems is much better than what happens under systems that have universal care. For example in England doctors admit that every year 130,000 people are euthanized intentionally through policies that prevent caring for the elderly.

To "Mark B" we know that God judges individuals, and not whole societies. Go and read the Bible.

Some of the best ideas that the GOP offered were to cut regulations on health insurance companies. This was to be done by allowing insurance providers to sell across state lines. You also have the idea of tort reform which would make suing doctors harder, which brings down malpractice insurance rates and is known to get more specialists into areas where tort reform has been in effect.

George
Bronx, NY

@redshirt
" in England doctors admit that every year 130,000 people are euthanized intentionally through policies that prevent caring for the elderly"

rally? please provide us a reliable source for his claim, because as usual you claim to have "facts" that seem to have escaped everyone else.

zoar63
Mesa, AZ

It just a simple principle of economics, supply vs demand. Once Obama care is fully implemented the demand for people to get health care will exceed the supply of health care providers which will result in long waiting periods before you are seen by a doctor. Rationing of health care will be inevitable.

Moderate
Salt Lake City, UT

"implemented the demand for people to get health care will exceed the supply of health care providers "
Rationing would only occur if there is a limit on adding new doctors. I am not aware of a law or social taboo about more people becoming doctors. Historically, enterprising people rise up to fill the demand created by the shortage. More people will go to medical school and become doctors. Why? Because a job is guaranteed. Foreign doctors will also be drawn to the United States to fill the shortages.

Are you concerned at the future rise in employment?

Wally West
SLC, UT

per RedShirt at 12:27 p.m. June 29, 2012

*To "Mark B" we know that God judges individuals, and not whole societies. Go and read the Bible.*

Like Sodom & Gomorrah?

There may be an example or two in the BoM.

mark
Salt Lake City, UT

" maybe we can all be like Aussie happy to get care even if it substandard and 50 years behind the times." So says Hellooo 

Among the seven nations studied—Australia, Canada, Germany, the Netherlands, New Zealand, the United Kingdom, and the United States—the U.S. ranks last overall, as it did in the 2007, 2006, and 2004 editions of Mirror, Mirror. Most troubling, the U.S. fails to achieve better health outcomes than the other countries, and as shown in the earlier editions, the U.S. is last on dimensions of access, patient safety, coordination, efficiency, and equity. The Netherlands ranks first, followed closely by the U.K. and Australia.-Mirror, Mirror on the Wall: How the Performance of the U.S. Health Care System Compares Internationally, June 23, 2010, Authors: Karen Davis, Ph.D., Cathy Schoen, M.S., and Kristof Stremikis, M.P.P.

I have many other studies that show the US healthcare system is inferior to the Aussie system if you need them Hellooo

mark
Salt Lake City, UT

". . .going through personal financial problems is much better than what happens under systems that have universal care. For example in England doctors admit that every year 130,000 people are euthanized intentionally through policies that prevent caring for the elderly."

No, Redshirt "doctors" do not admit that. One doctor, Professor Patrick Pullicino, made a claim:

"He claimed there was often a lack of clear evidence for initiating the Liverpool Care Pathway, a method of looking after terminally ill patients that is used in hospitals across the country.

"There are around 450,000 deaths in Britain each year of people who are in hospital or under NHS care. Around 29 per cent – 130,000 – are of patients who were on the LCP.

"Professor Pullicino claimed that far too often elderly patients who could live longer are placed on the LCP and it had now become an ‘assisted death pathway rather than a care pathway’."-Top doctor's chilling claim: The NHS kills off 130,000 elderly patients every year, The Daily Mail, Steve Doughty, June 19, 2012

The sensationalist headline not withstanding, Professor Pullicino is not admitting that 130,000 patients are being euthanized.

JSB
Sugar City, ID

I appreciate this well written and balanced article. But, I still have some questions. Now that Obamacare is the law of the land, does it mean that insurance companies or the federal government will be paying for: Abortions? Birth control pills? Treatment for tobacco, alcohol and drug abuse related illnesses? Treatment for STDs? Treatment for obesity? In other words, will people who strive to live a healthy, moral lifestyle be forced to pay for the irresponsible behavior of others?

Good-Heavens
Salt Lake City, Utah

To JSB: Yes, it will pay for all health care problems. We don't apply a litmus test to what your lifestyle was like before giving care. Or would you have it that we just care for folks that live by your definition of a healthy, moral lifestyle?

UtahBlueDevil
Durham, NC

Patriot..... God doesn't judge societies? Really? We never see where a group of people was "punished" for their inequity as a group rather than as individuals? If that is the case, I have whole sections in my scriptures you don't.


" God wants us to care for the poor, but he never said it had to be done by a tax and spend and waste big government program (that also provides free abortions just for the convenience of the mother)"

I sort of beg to differ. God didn't prescribe how we do a lot of things. But as a society, "WE" formed a government to deal with our common needs. Defense. Highways. Educate our kids. Provide safety serves like police and fire departments. The list goes on with things that at an individual level, we could not afford to do. But as a society, through our elected representation, we fund things so that we can have reliable and predictable services that at an individual level we could not provide. And we did so in a way that doesn't discriminate against any individual. We don't pick and choose who gets access to fire protection, police, schools.

Mountanman
Hayden, ID

There is no way Obamacare will succeed. Everything we were told about it, what it would accomplish and what it won’t do is a lie! 44 million Americans ( you can probably double that in less than 5 years) will now supposedly get free healthcare. What that really means is 44 million Americans will become even more dependent on other people and locked into poverty, an even more permanent poverty! Is compassion measured by dependency? How will the taxpayers ever pick up the tab for ever more and more dependency? Deficits and the national debt will explode! Yes we need to help the poor but that help must not create ever more dependency! It will cost us millions of jobs because businesses cannot absorb the costs, thus those paying taxes will continue to decrease and those needed every kind of welfare will explode! Obamcare will only increase the number of Americans that are dependant on the government and dramatically harm every part of our economy.

Springvillepoet
Springville, UT

@RG: "Obamacare was not the only way to accomplish noble goals"

What exactly were those ideas offered by the GOP? What is your plan to help? I ask, because you are saying the government shouldn't be involved (in spite of the "general Welfare" clause of the preamble to our Constitution) but I don't see enough private help being offered. In fact, the little help I do see, mostly from religious organizations, comes with a lot of conditions and strings attached to that help.

Jesus din't tell people to help the poor only if they are of a certain faith or political perspective. He said help. He said love. He said do unto others as you would have them do unto you.

And if you believe our current administration is leading our nation in the wrong direction, wouldn't one way to counteract that be to act more Christ-like with say, a nationalized healthcare system for those who can't afford health care? Because no part of Obama Care, even in its original form, says people can't keep paying for private, premium insurance policies. It's sole purpose is to help those who cannot help themselves.

twinkleberry67
Layton, UT

Keeping religion out of politics? When the state dictates to a religious organization who provides nonprofit healthcare what they can and can’t do regardless of the fact that contraception and elective abortions to promote said contraception are a major violation of the religious organization’s tenants, these religions have the constitutional right to defend their beliefs. I hear people right and left practically salivating about how they will never pay another doctor bill again and would rather tie up an emergency room for a free Tylenol or a band aid and are expecting to get all the free plastic surgery they want for life. If there is one truth that has been throughout the ages it is this: he who has the gold makes the rules. If people think healthcare is a right, they will be sadly disappointed to find the state will arbitrarily decide who gets what and when. Then what are you guys going to do? Anyone think of that?

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