Comments about ‘Red roundup: Could Utah, Michigan football series be in the works?’

Return to article »

Published: Wednesday, June 13 2012 10:17 a.m. MDT

Comments
  • Oldest first
  • Newest first
  • Most recommended
Jenny83
OGDEN, UT

I think most BYU fans would agree that they would have much rather won their game against the Utes than getting totally humiliated on their home turf.

Jenny83
OGDEN, UT

BYu played mostly WAC teams the last half of the season....and the worst team in the big sky.....and your beating your chests because you won 10 games.....so would of most any other teams with a schedule like that....

phoenix
Gilbert, AZ

Utah played 6 teams with LOSING records, including one of the worst teams in the country...and U lost to two of them...any decent team would have easily won 10 games with Utah's schedule...

You're just jealous that the Utes can't even beat their chests about not losing to any bad teams.

Two For Flinching
Salt Lake City, UT

Phoenix

The playing teams with a losing record argument is a poor one because those losses came to other PAC-12 teams. A team might have a losing record in the PAC but that same team would probably be a contender in the WAC or Sun Belt. Look to strength of schedule rankings if you want a barometer for the overall quality of teams played in a season.

sammyg
Springville, UT

Two for Flinching

Look to the Coaches Poll and AP if you want a barometer for the overall quality of your team.

jenny

6th to 8th place in your conference and this makes you happy or is it the pictures again?

Snack PAC
Olympus Cove, Utah

twofer

Your SOS argument is meaningless when you consider how awful #107 Colorado(3-10) was and how lousy ASU was playing the last half of the season - and you lost to both of them, AT HOME.

I look to the individual team rankings and EVERY single Utah opponent after mid-September was ranked below BYU and below Tulsa, the team that BYU beat in the Armed Forces Bowl.

hedgehog
Ann Arbor, MI

"Look to the Coaches Poll and AP if you want a barometer for the overall quality of your team."
Sammy g

Ole Miss didn't win a SEC game last year and fired their coach. They finished the season ranked 76 in the nation.

Ole Miss was head and shoulders the worst SEC to run onto the fieled last year.

And Yet the only lost to bYu by one point. on a freak play.

The question to be asked is if bYu played the Ole Miss Schedule would they still win 10 games? would they even win 3 games?

Snack PAC
Olympus Cove, Utah

hedgy

Your analysis is like a blind man touching an elephant's tail and forming his opinion of elephants based on one elephant's tail.

Objective fans evaluate seasons based on the entire season, not on one or two games.

A week after Ole Miss, BYU played at #17 Texas(8-5), and only lost 16-17. In late October, BYU played at #20 TCU(11-2), and only lost 28-38. And in their bowl game, #34 BYU beat #35 Tulsa(8-5) 24-21.

All three of BYU's losses were to Top 40 teams.

Four of Utah's five losses were to teams not even ranked in the Top 40.

btw, Texas beat California 21-10. Utah lost to California 10-34. Based on BYU's narrow 1-point loss to Texas, BYU would have easily handled the Bears, a team that dominated the Utes.

Bottom-line:

As confirmed by the polls, overall, BYU was a better team than Utah in 2011.

BYU #25/#26
Utah unranked

Truth Machine
Salt Lake City, UT

hedgehog

Based on beating #34 BYU, Utah would have won 10 or 11 games playing BYU's schedule.

Based on losing to #107 Colorado, Utah would have lost 8 or 9 games playing BYU's schedule.

That's the problem with using individual games to judge or predict an entire season. Teams change and different conditions apply week to week.

BYU was a much better team by the end of the season than they were when they played Utah.

Utah was a much worse team by the end of the season than they were when they played BYU.

Despite the jealous spin from our friends on the hill, those changes had little to do with improved or weaker competition.

JohnInSLC
Cottonwood Heights, UT

Sports"Fan" and TruelyBlue hilariously attempt to contort facts in a failed effort to claim the y is the better program over the past decade ("flukes" and "Quests" notwithstanding). Here are the real facts:

Since January 2002:

Utah: 8-1 bowl record
[BYU: 5-2]
Utah: 2 undefeated seasons (incl. ‘05 Fiesta and ‘09 Sugar Bowl victories)
[BYU: 0]
Utah: 2 final Top 5 rankings
[BYU: 0]
Utah: 2008 AFCA Coach of the Year award
[BYU: 0]
Utah: the 2005 No. 1 NFL draft pick
[BYU: 0]
Utah: 1 consensus All-American (at two positions): Louie Sakoda
[BYU: 0]
Utah: Overall record 92-33
[BYU 80-45]
Head-to-Head: Utah 7 (avg. margin of victory 16.7 pts)
[BYU 3 (avg. margin of victory 4 pts.)]

Spin it however they want with their Idaho State/USC assisted top 26 ranking last year, Utah is clearly the premier program of the two over the last 10 seasons.

Truth Machine
Salt Lake City, UT

JohnInSLC

There's no question that Utah had two great seasons and its best decade ever in the 2000's, but the overall results don't lie:

Top 25 Finishes
BYU 5
Utah 4

National Individual Award Winners
BYU 1 (Luke Staley - Doak Walker Award for Nation's Best Runningback)
Utah 0 (Louie Sakoda was a great player, but he didn't win a single national award)

Head-to-head
5-5

Conference Championships
BYU 4
Utah 4

Spin it however helps you sleep at night, but a Top 25 finish is a Top 25 finish

You're just jealous that Bronco has almost as many Top 25 finishes in 7 years as the Utes have in their entire history

Two For Flinching
Salt Lake City, UT

Snack Pac

using your logic: Utah beat BYU by 44 at home, which means Utah would have easily handled Texas and TCU. Which means Utah would have been undefeated (again).

The fact is rankings are very subjective and are based on a small sample due to the fact that most teams only play 10-11 of the 120 FBS teams. This obviously creates flaws. Just because a team is ranked higher does not necessarily mean they are better than every single team ranked below them.

JohnInSLC
Cottonwood Heights, UT

Sorry, the "Truth" part of the Machine is broken.

Luke Staley played 11 years ago, outside the past decade that Sports"Fan" examined.

5-5 head to head? Is that in women's soccer, or were you hiding with ducky in Tulsa the last couple of years and just watched the wrong BYUtv football replays?

I'll admit, byu has more suspect Top 25 rankings in history than Utah.

LonestarRunner
Salt Lake City, UT

twofer

Sorry, but you need a course in "logic", because the entire point of Snack PAC's post was you can't use "individual games to judge or predict an entire season".

The fact is a national panel of poll voters is much more objective than the jealous kids on the hill who only whine about the rankings when they favor BYU.

Single head-to-head matchups aren't even the final determination of which team is better, otherwise, how do you explain:

Alabama 6
LSU 9

Alabama 21
LSU 0

We don't see it as much in college football, because teams usually only play each other once, but in basketball it happens all the time, where a team that lost by 20 points in the first meeting, wins by 20 points in the second meeting.

We've even seen teams that lost twice, sometime soundly, to the same team during the regular season, beat their opponent, sometimes soundly, in the third meeting.

One game does not a season make, even though Utah fans want to pretend that it does.

LonestarRunner
Salt Lake City, UT

JohnInSLC

The past "decade" is 2000 to 2009, it isn't some arbitrary 10-year period.

Granted, Utah was the premier program in the state from 2003 to 2008, but your program is fading, and during the current coaching era (Bronco and Kyle), BYU is back on track and Utah's best years are behind them.

Top 25 Finishes
Bronco 5
Kyle 3

Top 15 Finishes
Bronco 3
Kyle 1

Conference Championship Seasons
Bronco 2
Kyle 1

10+ Win Seasons
Bronco 5
Kyle 3

Overall Record
Bronco 66-24
Kyle 65-25

Head-to-head
Bronco 3
Kyle 4

but, let's not forget, Bronco held a 3-2 advantage just two years ago, and Bronco and Kyle were tied at 3 apiece just a year ago.

Kyle does hold a big advantage in one category, however.

Losses to 10-loss teams
Bronco ZERO
Kyle TWO

Kyle had a great year in 2008, but overall, Bronco has out-performed Kyle.

Two For Flinching
Salt Lake City, UT

Lonestar

Of course a panel of voters is more objective than a single team's fanbase. The system is still very subjective and flawed.

I also agree that one game doesn't make a season. However, it's silly to pretend that a great season is defined by losing to every decent team you while beating a bunch of mediocre to bad teams. The BYU fans here often tout their #25/26 finish but at some level the accomplishment must ring hallow based on the body of work.

JohnInSLC
Cottonwood Heights, UT

"The past "decade" is 2000 to 2009, it isn't some arbitrary 10-year period."

LoneStar:

You are both wrong and all over the road.

First, the most-used definition of decade at the most popular online dictionary is:
"1. a period of ten years: the three decades from 1776 to 1806."

Second, unlike your rambling on about '00 to '09, then '03 to '08, then Kyle-Bronco era, I stuck to the last decade as described by Sports"Fan".

Finally, in your effort to look pump up Bronco over Kyle, did you compare victories over ranked teams? I didn't think so. Kyle 5-4, Bronco 3-4.

Now if you're comparing empty slogan-eering Bronco wins, hands down!

LonestarRunner
Salt Lake City, UT

JohnInSLC

In your effort to pump up Kyle over Bronco, did you compare LOSSES to conference bottom-dwellers and 10-loss teams.

Bronco is undefeated against NM, CSU, Wyo, and UNLV.

Kyle lost to all of them.

It's not just about who you beat, but also who you don't lose to.

Bronco has never lost to a 10-loss team.

Kyle has lost to 10-loss teams TWICE, including just two games ago.

BEING a Top 25 team is a greater accomplishment than beating a Top 25 team.

One is a single game accomplishment.

One is a season long accomplishment.

Marked it Down
Park City, UT

Sorry twofer, but only a jealous Utah fan would try to trivialize a Top 25 finish.

BYU fans were very pleased with finishing in the Top 25 for the 5th time in the last 6th years, especially after getting off to such a rocky start.

It is interesting, however, that Utah fans are trying so hard to discredit BYU's Top 25 finish, when it was BYU's final Top 25 ranking that gave the Utes their ONLY notable win in 2011.

54-10
Salt Lake City, UT

Look at all these bitter "Cougar fans." Oh the pain of the 54-10.

Love it.

to comment

DeseretNews.com encourages a civil dialogue among its readers. We welcome your thoughtful comments.
About comments