U.S. & World

'Don't know' if Missouri teen shot with hands up


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  • Nan BW ELder, CO
    Aug. 21, 2014 3:48 p.m.

    Then there is also the fact that the "forensics authority" hired by the Brown family, isn't even qualified to do this kind of work. I think I'll go get a job as a physics professor. (I am not remotely qualified.)

  • worf Mcallen, TX
    Aug. 20, 2014 2:33 p.m.

    Is it possible the police officer was defending himself after being hit in the eye, and attacked?

    People are so so gullible, and jump to conclusions.

    Is Al Sharpton, Obama, and Holder as concerned with the American reporter who was just executed by ISIS? An act of war? Or our American Marine in Mexico?

  • TheProudDuck Newport Beach, CA
    Aug. 20, 2014 1:53 p.m.

    "Unless the incidence of criminality by "Blacks" is five times higher than it is for "Whites" this would indicate a propensity for "White" police officers to shoot "Blacks" and not shoot "Whites", and if that is the case then it should be looked into to determine the cause."

    It's actually about *eight* times higher (at least for serious crimes like homicide and rape). So police are shooting black people *less* than should be expected, when you account for different criminal offending rates.

  • TheProudDuck Newport Beach, CA
    Aug. 20, 2014 1:43 p.m.

    "How many shots did Michael Brown fire at the officer?"

    Why does it matter?

    More people were killed last year with hands and fists than with rifles.

    "CSI" makes people expect too much from autopsies, as far as what they can prove or disprove. The fact is that the bullet placement can tell us very little about where the guy's hands were. Since most police firearms training (all firearms training, actually) is to aim for the center of the target's mass, the most likely scenario is that the arms were near center-mass -- that is, somewhere near Brown's chest. Not up.

  • Loconic Alpine, UT
    Aug. 19, 2014 1:31 p.m.

    Oops. Wrong city used in my previous comment. It was meant to read Ferguson instead of Gunderson, Missouri in the last paragraph. My bad.

  • Loconic Alpine, UT
    Aug. 19, 2014 1:25 p.m.

    @ The Universal Curmudgeon...

    The incidence of criminality by Blacks is indeed multiple times greater per capita as it is for Whites or any other race. There are debatable reasons for that, but it's nevertheless a fact. Blacks also kill other Blacks at much higher rates than any other segment of American society.

    That wasn't the case before President Johnson introduced his great social reforms back in the 1960's that included all kinds of entitlements which ultimately made Blacks feel that they needed government help and assistance to survive. Negative Black personal and family statistics have been growing ever since. Even though Blacks make up just 13% of the American population, over 40% of all convicted felons are Black. 73% of Black babies are now born out of wedlock . Those stats have been correlated to the breakdown of the family unit and the positive support that individuals should be receiving from families, but often don't.

    BTW: There has never been a single incident of a White police officer ever shooting a Black person in the entire history of Gunderson, Missouri. Yet the rioters make it seem like it's a big, ongoing issue. False!

  • boneheaded, but not a smidgen SLC, UT
    Aug. 19, 2014 12:52 p.m.

    another barry distraction from the scandals that plague this administration.

  • davidroy Flagstaff, AZ
    Aug. 19, 2014 11:02 a.m.

    I can't help but wonder what happens when a black cop shoots and kills a white teenage male under the same circumstances as this incident? Should whites go out and loot stores? Overturn cars? Burn down buildings? Will the president and AG Holder get involved? There is a black minister that has spoken out about this type of activity from the black community and so called black leaders.

  • Sven Morgan, UT
    Aug. 19, 2014 10:42 a.m.


    "Never looks good when a cop shoots a teenager. Looks even worse if the teenager was unarmed."


    It also never looks good when the media tries to portray a strong-arm robbing thug as an innocent, college bound child, while at the same time, smearing an officer with a stellar career with no history of racism. The media did the exact same thing with Trayvon Martin and George Zimmerman.

    The fact is, if white cops killing black men were an epidemic as the Black Community, Al Sharpton and the Liberal media want to portray, it would not be the circus atmosphere that it currently is. The fact is, Black on Black crime is staggering, while white on black crime, and white police violence against blacks is monumentally low. But once again, facts do not matter. The Democrats need a good distraction and voter turnout issue.

    BTW, did you hear…the Democrats are setting up voter registration booths right near where Michael Brown was killed? The Democrats never let a crisis go to waste. The facts do not matter.

  • The Universal Curmudgeon Canada, 00
    Aug. 19, 2014 10:39 a.m.

    Statistics (from the FBI) show that "Blacks" are shot by "White" police officers at a rate five times higher than the rate that "Whites" are shot by "White" police officers.

    Unless the incidence of criminality by "Blacks" is five times higher than it is for "Whites" this would indicate a propensity for "White" police officers to shoot "Blacks" and not shoot "Whites", and if that is the case then it should be looked into to determine the cause.

    IF the incidence of criminality by "Blacks" is five times higher than it is for "Whites" then that is a completely different matter which also should be looked into to determine the cause.

  • worf Mcallen, TX
    Aug. 19, 2014 10:34 a.m.

    This incident, is an excuse for building tension, and our leaders are fueling it.

    Gives them more power, and control over over a divided society.

  • Sven Morgan, UT
    Aug. 19, 2014 10:25 a.m.

    It appears the accounts of the two "witnesses" to Brown's killing, Dorian Johnson (Brown's accomplice to the robbery at the convenience store) and Tiffany Mitchell (a neighbor), are not squaring with the autopsy report. The two autopsy reports both concluded that the 6 shots all hit Michael Brown in the FRONT of his body: 4 shots to his right arm, and two to his head.

    In particular, Tiffany Mitchell indicated that when Brown broke free from his struggle with officer Wilson through the window of the cruiser, he began running away from Officer Wilson. She indicated that Officer Wilson pursued Brown, firing shots at him. She said Brown's body jerked like he'd been shot. Okay, if we're to believe Ms. Mitchell, Brown should've received wounds to his back. Once again, there were no bullet wounds to his back…only to the front of his body.

    Facts a stubborn things.

  • Tators Logan, UT
    Aug. 19, 2014 9:20 a.m.


    Latest autopsy reports indicate Brown's hands were NOT up when shot. There was nothing to indicate anything like an execution style shooting like one story that keeps circulating and as told by Brown's friend. They also found marijuana in his system as well. In fact, a newly released (to the media) You-Tube video that was being made by a couple of Black guys has them commenting about the incident as it was happening.

    In that video, they describe the scuffle taking place in the police vehicle where a shot was fired, and then afterward outside of the vehicle. Michael Brown at first started running away. The officer got up and told them (Brown and his friend) to stop. They did. Then Brown started saying something to the officer just before charging him. The video guys said they thought the officer was missing him since he kept coming. He finally dropped when shot in the head just before reaching the officer. This all collaborates the official police report.

    And if true, as it now appears to be, all the looting and rioting are based on a false premise and narrative.

  • well informed Salt Lake, UT
    Aug. 18, 2014 10:24 p.m.

    How many shots did Michael Brown fire at the officer?

    Aug. 18, 2014 10:21 p.m.

    Never looks good when a cop shoots a teenager. Looks even worse if the teenager was unarmed.

  • patriot Cedar Hills, UT
    Aug. 18, 2014 4:38 p.m.

    most police do wait until you hold your hands up and plead for your life before they blast you in the head....right? Geez-I am so sick of the hear-say about this tragedy. Let's just keep quiet until the investigation is complete and that includes the president. It may be that both the boy and the police were at fault here but police don't shoot people unless they are fearing for their life. The kid was a criminal robbing a store and then threatening the store attendent and now we know he fought with the police. The police still may have had the opportunity to wound him but instead paniced and killed him in which case the police will have to pay the price. Let's just wait and see and not make things worse by guessing.

  • patriot Cedar Hills, UT
    Aug. 18, 2014 4:29 p.m.

    well the main stream media already said his hands were up and he was down on his knees pleading with the officer not to shoot ....so it must be true...right?? Never mind the fact that the investigation is still on-going....that doesn't stop Barack and the Reverend Al and MSNBC and CNN however...

  • FDRfan Sugar City, ID
    Aug. 18, 2014 4:22 p.m.

    Objectivity, rationality, truth are not a part of this protest. Looting under a pretense of an excuse is what this is about.

  • t702 Las Vegas, NV
    Aug. 18, 2014 4:13 p.m.

    I'm glad they released the video of the kid stealing which shed some light on who this kid really was. The family and media only want to focus on the shooting and want us to forget about any wrongs the kid did leading up to the shooting.

  • Brio Alpine, UT
    Aug. 18, 2014 3:44 p.m.

    @ george of the jungle:

    Two wrongs never make a right.
    Like so many others, you are jumping to conclusions while an investigation is still underway.

    There is conclusive video evidence of only one wrong being done... the store robbery and assault on the store owner and completely caught on surveillance video.
    The other "wrong" you are alluding to is still under intense investigation and may prove to not be a wrong at all. Only time and complete investigative evidence will tell. Hold off on your two-wrongs saying until then.

  • Objectified Richfield, UT
    Aug. 18, 2014 3:30 p.m.

    The officer involved in this incident had no previous racial incidents or any other kind of negative report on his record. As such, it's highly unlikely he would've just pulled over 2 Black guys and shot one for no good reason. That would make no sense whatsoever and go completely against his proven character.

    Since the Black 18 year old (an adult) had previously just committed felony assault and robbery, he would've been very leery of any policemen when this officer approached him. As such, the law agency's account makes total sense about this guy pushing the officer back into his car when he tried to get out and him trying to take the officer's gun away from him.

    When anyone is fighting over a gun, someone is bound to get shot. And if a policeman is involved, it's usually the perpetrator.
    Also notable is that police are trained to shoot to kill, not just wound suspects. A wounded person can be even more dangerous than before he got wounded. Therefore, it also makes sense that the officer would've shot this much bigger (6'4" 245 lb) guy multiple times in order to completely stop him.

  • george of the jungle goshen, UT
    Aug. 18, 2014 3:25 p.m.

    Since when does 2 wrongs make a right.

  • RichardB Murray, UT
    Aug. 18, 2014 2:51 p.m.

    If the 6'4" adult pushed him into his car, and tried to wrestle the gun from him, he was probably shot in the arm several times. Right handed, right arm. It would also explain the shot that hit in the top of the head, being below someone, and firing, causes the aim to be a little high. I have great skepticism over his lawyer and their own autopsy.

    Just as great as the loss of life, is the inability for Black leaders to calm the masses, and organize the voters to oust the people they don't like, instead of robbing and looting.

    I reserve judgment until the facts are released. It's to bad others do not see it that was. This is like the Traynor Martin shooting before the 2012 election. The media used pictures of him when he was 13 years old.

  • FDRfan Sugar City, ID
    Aug. 18, 2014 2:21 p.m.

    Does the family attorney think we will believe that the policeman drove by and pulled this man into the car so he could shoot him in the face?

  • Crimen delSiglo sandy, UT
    Aug. 18, 2014 1:56 p.m.

    hands up, hands down

    it does not matter in so far as weeks (all in capital letters and not yelling) of violence

    the local police replaced

    state police replaced

    national guard is called in

    will the president call in the federal military

    again the word "executed" is spoken as if killed is not sufficient

    family doesn't trust the local coroner so they call in a private one

    grief expressed in an irrational way is not acceptable

    gone on too long and too far

    quiet, quiet, peace, be still

  • Hoosier87 American Fork, UT
    Aug. 18, 2014 1:33 p.m.


    The "teen" was shot because he thought he was getting busted for the assault he committed a few minutes earlier - when the police officer had no idea he even committed the crime. The teen was reacting that way to get away, so he wouldn't be caught for the assault.

    I wanna know when I can go looting (I mean peaceful protesting)...