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Comments about ‘Religious freedom and same-sex marriage: How a wedding cake in Colorado became a cause’

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Published: Saturday, April 5 2014 12:00 a.m. MDT

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Chris B
Salt Lake City, UT

I liked the approach one commentor suggested.

When a BLT person comes in and wants a cake for their "marriage" the owner should tell them what they think of gay "marriage" and what the bible says about homosexuality.

The owner can then explain that they will bake them a cake and that the proceeds will be donated to a pro-traditional marriage orgazniation.

Then, bake their cake. When the person comes to pick up the cake, remind them again what the bible teaches us about this and thank them for donating to a pro-traditional marriage group!

I applaud this man!

Snapdragon
Midlothian, VA

The SSM debate needs to stop comparing itself to civil rights, and start comparing itself to the abortion issue.

SSM is against moral and religious values. Would you go ask the cake man to go perform an abortion for you? How would you feel when he said no to that? The issues are morally comparable.

The Scientist
Provo, UT

Bigotry is so ingrained and automatic, we shouldn't be surprised they cannot see it in themselves.

Henry Drummond
San Jose, CA

This Associated Press article puts a human face on both sides of this issue - something that is sadly missing from most of the stories I read. I suspect both sides have become unwitting and unwilling pawns in a sometimes deadly game. It would seem that helping people understand each other would be the highest calling of anyone in public life. Sadly, its easier to get attention and political power by appealing to peoples' fears than helping them see other points of view.

VA Saint
Chester, VA

Very good article. It is good to see a non-biased article that discusses both sides with respect.

waikiki_dave
Honolulu, HI

People who operate a business and choose to deny services to gay people are bigots and should be subject to prosecution.

Bob K
portland, OR

When you go with your loved one and your Mom to pick out a cake for your wedding....

You don't know the history of the baker.
You don't know the religion of the baker.
You don't know that he may have been a sinner and found God.
You don't know he does not make Halloween cakes or batchelor party cakes.

You just know that you are left out, unwanted, disapproved of, that your money has been refused, and you were told you do not qualify.

Perhaps you ought to have noticed the cakes with the crosses,etc, but you consider yourself a Christian, and they did not bother you.

Preparing for the most important occasion of your life -- something so good you could not have dreamed of it years ago, but that everyone else in your family can have -- you have been told you are not eligible.

There was no sign in the window saying "No Gay Weddings".
You are in a State where it is illegal to discriminate against Gays

But you are not good enough to buy a cake there, it seems.

How do you feel?

gmlewis
Houston, TX

Civil rights legislation was written in broad terms that do not limit the scope to what is reasonable. Therefore, it is easily subject to abusive use in private social situations. Is refusal to treat someone with respect the same thing as a physical assault? In the eyes of the law, there is no legal basis for recognizing the obvious difference. Is refusing to rent to a gay couple the same thing as suggesting they take their one-time wedding cake request to another bakery, while offering to provide pastries that celebrate any other family or personal event? The law can't see the difference.

As legal precedents are established over trivial disputes, our laws have been corrupted. We will mourn that these days have come.

U-tar
Woodland Hills, UT

This is a free county, the baker has the right to do what he wants, leave the guy alone. I am sure there are gay bakers out there. If not, then the grocery store has Betty Crocker.

phatness
SALT LAKE CITY, UT

Well done on this article that encourages the reader to empathize with individuals on both sides of the debate. If all articles represented both sides of the story so well, I think it would eventually change the nature of voters, and therefore the nature of politics.

Sampson
Hurricane, UT

The real issue is that this should not be a civil rights issue. The baker has the right to turn away customers. The free market system would be the real leverage. Forcing the cake maker to serve the customer takes away his right as a business owner. If another cake maker advertised that he would make cakes for any marriage, then he would corner the market. The first baker would lose a portion of the market. This is not the same as separate bathrooms and drinking fountains. The baker has his constitutional right to uphold his beliefs. Would we force a store owner to sell alcohol or tobacco if he felt those were products he didn't want to sell?

Forcing the baker to make a cake against his will is not the way to handle it. The court ruling is wrong.

samhill
Salt Lake City, UT

"The affair has made them realize, Mullins said, that 'as a minority, you don't have the option to opt out of the culture wars.'"
========================

Every last one of us is a minority of one. When our most deeply held beliefs are disallowed by a society that can't find room for compromise, then our freedoms of thought and expression are denied.

So, what happens when one minority has views that are contradictory with another? In a case like this, where one person feels constrained from participating in something the person believes is a violation of their structure of ethics is then compelled to participate regardless, it seems to be a obvious violation of their freedom of thought and expression. For surely, such a freedom includes NOT expressing and/or NOT thinking in some way.

Yet, as shown by the judges ruling and a few comments here, some people feel completely justified , obligated in fact, in punishing others for simply NOT thinking and/or NOT expressing themselves in a way the judges deem "proper."

How will the freedom of thought and expression survive? The same way it always has, by fighting for them!

SigmaBlue
Centerville, UT

Why couldn't this gay couple just find another bakery that would bake their wedding cake rather than seek to take away the Phillp's Bakery's freedom of religion? It seems that the Gay Community wants others to be tolerate of their lifestyle, but won't extend the same coutesy to those with differing beliefs. This isn't about diversity or equality, it's about conformity and power. If the straight and Christian side of society won't conform to the Gay agenda, then they'll try to destroy your way of life. What's next, Christian's will be forced to accept Pedophile's who want to marry a child, or people into bestiality who want to marry their dog? We, as a nation, need to realize that there will be times when people's belief's will collide with one another, and that's when moral courage needs to take a stand for what is right.

cjb
Bountiful, UT

The United States having violated the golden rule in times past overtly through its discrimination is not now free to discriminate with impunity. A business owner may feel it is their right to discriminate against a certain class of people because those other people are not acting in accordance with the business owners religion.

Given this nations history that is not reason enough. The business owner still can however choose to sell their business and go into another line of work. When a people abuse freedom they lose parts of their freedom . This is a part of our our inheritance which consists of both good and bad.

cjb
Bountiful, UT

Re sigma blue

For the same reason if stores or resturants discriminated against you for what ever reason, you wouldn't put up with it either.

Besides where in the Bible does it justify not selling to gay people? Are you aware that the Bible teaches that women who are divorced are not supposed to remarry? I doubt this cake place refuses to serve women who have been divorced. And if not it really isn't about following religion anyway.

Shaun
Sandy, UT

@SigmaBlue. Gays our trying to destroy your way of life? You mean like preventing people who are in love from getting married.

I think Christians need to stop thinking they are victims when they are the ones trying to force their way of life on everybody. Especially in Utah.

The Rock
Federal Way, WA

@waikiki_dave

"People who operate a business and choose to deny services to gay people are bigots and should be subject to prosecution."

So we are going to fight discrimination with discrimination?

Denying services to the gay couple may have hurt their feelings but it caused no harm.
This is about revenge. They want to hurt anyone who disagrees with them. This will lead to persecution of all people who take their Christian religion seriously.

Two For Flinching
Salt Lake City, UT

Baking a cake has nothing to do with the bakers religious beliefs. Would it be appropriate for a Mormon waiter to refuse to serve a customer who ordered a beer? Do your job and stop trying to force the rest of the world to live by your definition of morality.

@ SigmaBlue

Comparing same-sex couples to pedophilia and beastiality is very offensive, nor is it accurate. Children and animals can't legally sign a marriage license, so there is no need to worry about that becoming a reality. Not only that, but both of those thing constitute a significant amount of harm. Prove that same-sex marriage is detrimental to society, causes harm to straight couples, or disadvantages children and you will make a lot of money in the legal world. But so far, everybody who has tried to do so has failed.

Horse Sence
Pocatello, ID

I agree with Sampson! Why does tolerance seem to be a one way road with this issue? If you choose to live a LGTB life style, that's your choice. But don't FORCE me as a traditional-marriage-believer to agree with it or ACCEPT it!

Schwa
South Jordan, UT

I wonder what the authors would think if suddenly the majority of stores no longer accepted Christian customers. Would you feel ok if grocery stores, gas stations, and banks refused to do business with Christians? Why do you (if you do) think discrimination is ok?

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