Thank you DN for confirming what I have learned listening to rush, watching fox
and reading drudge...
All of you that so love obamacare, have you registered yet? Please tell us about
your experience and how much less you are going to have to pay for it.BTW,
the roll out to obamacare was outsourced to a French Canadian Co. Couldn't
even do this with an American Company. No wonder it is such a mess.
So when I did actual research on why Businesses got a delay but individuals did
not, I found: 1) Businesses will need to provide documentation on their
employees benefits and how much the business to covering. 2) The reporting
requirements for businesses were not made as clear as they could have been
3) Businesses were told by Republicans that the ACA would be repealed and to not
worry about it. None of these things effect and individual, who only
needs to get healthcare (from their employer or through a market place), and
they're done.I'm not really sure why there is so much
confusion about this.
Does it occur to anyone that the ACA Site problems may be caused by Hackers
hired by the Obstruction/Sabotage Party? Additionally over the past 30 years,
the people they serve have stolen enough money, if they are able to force/cause
the Default it will all come crashing down and they will be able to buy
Hi Vanceone, if your still out there! Bambi here! Good to see you're still
fighting the good fight!
As if Boeing, Microsoft and Apple NEVER have hiccups introducing new
It seems to me that that 'disastrous' is pretty much hyperbole. Here
we are two weeks into the process and already the web site is far more useful
than it was Oct 1. A couple of days ago I was able to go in and register without
any wait screens or errors, and view my options.The fact is no large
web site goes up without glitches. Doesn't anyone remember the growing
pains Amazon and EBay experienced? Or Medicare Part D?No, really the
only disaster we are experiencing is the government shutdown and palpitations
regarding the debt limit. Already the credit rating of the US of A has taken
another hit. And our trading partners are calling for a de-Americanization of
world trade. This is serious business folks. Losing the status of World Reserve
Currency would be a huge blow to the US and it's economic future.Make no mistake about it, what is happening in Washington now is a disaster
that could affect America for the foreseeable future. The Healthcare.gov website
rollout? That's a few weeks of inconvenience and a soon forgotten political
Well, let's see... what could be worse than a shaky rollout of a government
program with kinks to be ironed out? Could it be obstinate duty of staying the
road of shutting down the entire country? Like the old saying: "We can do
without philosophers, we can do without books, but civilized man cannot do
without cooks." After the GOP lays off all the cooks, hunger pangs follow.
People should be reminded that it is only October 15th and open enrollment goes
on until December 15th (and actually people can sign up until the end of March)
I am a previous health insurance worker and I can tell you it's only the
beginning of open enrollment. It's obvious that some want to say this is a
disaster before it's even begun. There is a significant reduction in costs
if a person actually signs up for a plan when figuring in an income with it.
And if someone wants to keep their current plan, it's just fine...THEY
DON'T HAVE TO CHANGE. Also, if a person needs help or they can't get
on, call the number listed on the website and they will also mail out some
information by November.As for me, I have been without insurance for seven
years and I'm looking forward to the reduced cost I'm getting.
Not that anyone will answer hear my voice. What if I don't want health
care? Social Security? United States Postal Service? Abortion planning
clinics? The Department of Education? IRS? Is my voice something that you can
just stamp on and say 'too bad' for you. I thought all you Democrats
were supposed to be caring, charitable people? I thought Democrats went out of
their way to understand and help the poor, the indigent, and especially those
without a voice? Am I a voice that you can throw in the dumpster like an
aborted fetus and say 'too bad'? Do I count? I know the answer! No!
That's just the way it is, isn't it? My way or the highway? huh?
This sounds oddly familiar! I thought America was supposed to represent the
voice of all, not just the rich, the poor, and those who had a voice. My voice
hasn't been heard for many, many years. Which Democrat out there has the
courage to listen to my voice and help me find a patron, just like every other
voice out there. Who?
Pres. Obama started debating for the presidency in April of 2007, giving us his
ideas of a good future. Nearly 7 years later and 2 election wins later, it is
time to get the Affordable Care Act up and running, and enrollment lasts 6
months, let us wait and see. No delay needed. Our economy is growing. And
thanks to the president, we exited the recession in summer of 2009. The future
Dear UtahBlueDevil,I'm sorry but your argument is off point.
You purport that badly run companies proves that my supposition is incorrect.
There will always be badly run companies. There are also very good government
programs. My point is that the government should NEVER be in the business of
acting like a business. I never said that the government is full of idiots. I
said that the government has never been able to run an entitlement program with
efficiency, effectiveness, and in an economically sound manner. NEVER.
Entrusting 1/6 of our economy to the federal government, which is what health
care in this country costs, is economic suicide. This morning Herman Caine made
my argument: the government is not in the business of being in business. He
spoke about how the man at the top, the President, should never have tolerated
the bungled roll out of healthcare.gov. He went on to say that a CEO of a top
company (not a bad company) would never tolerate such a thing. He or she would
be the one to say, "We are not rolling out until we get it right".
Glitches were too many people going to websites too quickly, happens every time
a new product comes out, go to Apple when they bring out a new product, or even
try to go to a new restaurant or store that opens up, what happens? Oh, and
personal liberty doesn't give you the ability to crash into me in a vehicle
or to go to the emergency room and raise my rates without insurance.
Truthseeker nailed it on the head. There are innumerable opportunities for
people of all economic levels to provide charity to those who really need it,
but we see enormous numbers of uninsured overwhelm emergency rooms. Our tax
levels are quite a bit lower than Canada's, but many, many people go
without healthcare, or lose their homes to healthcare debt.Why
don't we see lesser taxed, wealthier people lined up at the ER entrance
ready to assist monetarily? I would guess a lot of people feel those at the ER
deserve their plight, ie, bad habits.In my experience, the most
generous people are the poor themselves. They know intimately the struggles of
others, and their hearts are softened, they help willingly, and selflessly.What does the Bible say about how easy a rich man will get into heaven?
Jesus said it's easier for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle.
Wealth shields the wealthy from having to see the problems of
others. It's much easier to bake some cupcakes for a neighbor in minor
distress than go to Pioneer Park and really help where it's needed.
I for one am sure that Jesus totally meant harsh governmental penalties, massive
bureaucracy, confiscatory taxation, and elite politicians making rules for the
peasants to live by that they avoid--and if you don't like it, you hate
Jesus! If the government doesn't do it, you are a bigot! You
push grandma over a cliff if you don't like 20,000 a year deductibles and
10,000 a year premiums for less healthcare than last year! Why, even attempting
to criticize the wonders of a socialized economy means you hate children, man!
Critical Thinking.... let me just propose the following..... the US auto
industry... the US airlines..... US energy companies like Enron... or retailers
like JC Penny, Sears, kMart.... Kodak....Verox... AIG..... do we even need to
mention the US banking system that needed billions of loans to float their
boats, and even then we still had spectacular bank collapses, or People like
Bernie Madoff... the leadership of Tycp....We could go on and on
with endless list of private corporations that perform poorly. Are you really
trying to tell me you get great customer service from your cell phone company,
or cable company? Have you ever tried to dispute a billing or statement with
your health insurance company.Lets be real here. Pretending that
the government is a bunch on blundering idiots, and corporate america is
significantly better just doesn't measure up under objective scrutiny. I
know bash the government is a popular mantra... but the FAA does a great job of
keeping our airways safe, our national parks are the life blood of many
communities, our military does a spectacular job. The US postal service
delivers a letter across country in a couple of days for under 50 cents.
"The government will take from the 'haves' and give to the
'have nots.' Both have lost their freedom. Those who 'have'
lost their freedom to give voluntarily of their own free will and in the way
they desire. Those who 'have not' lost their freedom because they did
not earn what they received. They got 'something for nothing,' and
they will neither appreciate the gift nor the giver of the gift." Howard W.
Hunter, "The Law of the Harvest"Thanks Critical Thinker. I almost
didn't read the comments because I knew what was coming from our community.
Dear Linguist,I have a simple philosophy about our government
attempting to do the business of of a free market economy: it never has and
never will work. The federal government has never been better than private
business at managing money, creating opportunity, building wealth, and creating
jobs. You don't have to be a Democrat or Republican to prove it.
Let's look at your concern about the "glitches" with the
healthcare.gov sight. Incompetence would not be tolerated by any
business executive who is concerned about good customer service, and delivering
a good product. He/she knows that someone else in the free market will outdo
their business, if they don't stay on top of quality. The federal
government has no such incentive to deliver quality, or to do so economically:
there is no competition. The federal government has never run like a business.
That's why a debt we can't pay is tolerated, and no entitlement
program in the history of this nation has ever or will ever deliver on its
promise. The same will be said of Obama Care. Mark my words. Insurance
reform? Yes. Government in the insurance business? No.
Name ONE rollout that went as smoothly as desired. Just ONE please. Then hold
the criticism until the rollout irons out the kinks. The problem with critics is
that the critics expect perfection while the critics are far from perfect
When "glitches" are not really website glitches...I am thinking about
Come on. The software was a bit glitchy. Look at the states who set up their
own exchanges. The program works fine--the website will get fixed.
I am not surprised about the number of references to Christian beliefs.
However, although this new law offers Christian relief to those who for one
reason or another do not have health care the comment about Lenin and his take
on health care is right on the mark. Its important to remember that very little
coming out of government has anything to do with anything positive about
Christianity... or Mormon... but LOTS to do with politics and government power.
The latter part of that is very important. One must decide just how much
personal freedom he/she is willing to give up to the government. You may be
without health insurance but you still need to think, "Do I really want
government to control my health?" Do you want government to make life calls
for you and your family? Remember, not all of the government believes in God.
I prefer to make life decisions myself and to reserve that decision making to me
and my God while leaving government out of the equation.
Dear Church Member,You are correct that Jesus said we should help
the poor. Never the less, his directive was toward individuals, not a
government entity. Furthermore, the Christian is not to be compelled to give,
as in a government mandate, but from a good conscience and a willing heart. The
are many of us who willing practice this ethic, such as myself. I give of my
time and I tithe my finances. The framers of our constitution deliberately
limited the powers of the federal government so that it would not infringe on
personal liberty. Personal liberty includes the freedom to be charitable. It
is not the job of the government to tell me or you how to give from the heart.
Nor is it the job of the government to take care of us. We don't answer
to an entity. We are each responsible to God. Moreover, the Bible also says
that if one doesn't take care of his own, i.e. family, he is considered
worse than a reprobate. We must work to eat.
Re:AVoiceofReason"Remember Jesus' attempts to help the poor were
done through invitation not legislation. "What was the govt
structure during Jesus' mission on earth? Was it a democracy?Did leaders collect taxes, and if so, what were they used for? Do
you imagine Jesus would condemn our democratic system today in which taxpayers
contribute to help the needy, disabled, elderly and children? Would he condem
those of us who support such programs because it wasn't purely
"voluntary"? While the Catholic Church recognizes the
important role the govt plays in helping others, other denominations remain
silent--unless it involves same-sex marriage, abortion or contraception. There is nothing stopping you from voluntarily helping people now.
I'm sure you could contact local agencies and find those who need help
paying medical bills, rent etc. or those who need rides to Drs. appts. or any
other variety of help. What are you waiting for?
To Voice of Reason:DO you think American citizens should be forced
to buy car insurance?? Why??
With respect, it just seems that people on the Right are all too eager for
affordable health insurance for all to fail. Why not help make it work
instead?There were obvious problems with the healthcare.gov site.
That's a shame. There also remain 6 months for people to sign up, and
already the site is working out the glitches.My advice: let them
fix the glitches, and if more time is needed in March, extend the enrollment
period a bit then.Why do it now? There's really only one
motivation that I can see, and that's to give the opposition more time to
try to convince people they shouldn't sign up for insurance. I find that
extremely disingenuous, especially considering that the marketplace idea was
touted for a long time by the very conservatives now opposing it.
@ Church memberTo your first point, I'm not against helping
people get health insurance (or health care). I'm against the government
doing it. Like a referee they should create a level playing field, not a tie
game. I personally support organizations, groups, drives, etc. that seek to help
individuals who are currently unable to be self-sufficient to become so -
managing health care costs included. I feel there is a personal responsibility
to help those in need, not a government-mandated responsibility. Remember
Jesus' attempts to help the poor were done through invitation not
legislation. When the rich young man went away sorrowful after Jesus invited him
to sell everything and give to the poor Jesus didn't try to sue him or
create a law forcing him to give his riches to the poor. It's a question of
agency.To your second point, that is a horrible comparison. Millions
of people try to get Apple products because they want them, and they are willing
to pay the price. Millions are trying to access Obamacare because the government
is forcing them. They will be taxed if they don't. BIG difference for
@Roland KeyserThe problem is so much bigger than glitches on a
website. The real problem is that there's no demand for the product. The
website got millions of hits because visitors were reloading pages over and over
again trying to get the site to work. The true way to measure demand is to ask
how many people actually made a purchase. It's a question the Obama
administration won't answer. The answer is too embarrassing.Obamacare is built on the backs of young people, and it's predicated on
forcing them to buy products they don't want, at prices they can't
afford. If no one signs up on the exchanges, the whole thing collapses. There is
no question about this: the scheme will fail. Not because of sabotage by the
opposition, but because it's based on the assumption that people will do
things that people don't do.
Everything is overshadowed by tea party hysteria.
In spite of your wishing it so, it isn't nearly the disaster you were
hoping for. Maybe if we stopped trying to tear everything down and showed some
christian charity, things would be better.
Didn't the GOP already get a delay when the ACA was first passed? Here we
are, 3 years later, and they're asking for another delay?I
think it's painfully obvious what the GOP is trying to do. They pushed for
a delay hoping to have the White House by now. They failed. Now, they hope to
push for another delay.Like an immature child who comes up with
excuse after excuse to procrastinate doing their homework, the GOP needs to grow
up and let the ACA work. Time to move on and work on other things
The rollout is going great for all those states who chose to set up the
exchanges themselves. Those silly states like Utah who said no and left it for
the federal gov't are in this giant overwhelmed server system... why did
you leave that to the federal gov't anyway? I thought states knew better?
Now the Military Vet's is in line for not getting paid and SSi nd food
stamp cards are coming up to be hit. Obama is seeing a lot of money to pay for
his health car plan. I"m can't see why Obama isn't impeached.
Didn't Jesus teach about helping the poor, sick, disabled, and the lowly
among us?I don't understand how religious people
(conservatives) can be so against helping poor and middle class people from
getting health insurance.Also, when Apple comes out with a new
product and millions of people try to get it, isn't it a success?? Millions
of people are trying to sign up for Obamacare (ACA). It will work.
The rollout has been fine here in CA, and in the other states which developed
their own exchanges.How goes it in UT? Got any stories to report
there?Q: Why no postponement for the individual,mandate?A:
People have waited long enough for the chance to have medical insurance and
receive the treatment they need and deserve.
What pragmatistferlife said was exactly right.People have until
March 31, 2014 to acquire health insurance. That is plenty of time to get the
glitches worked out.The ACA is based upon a great compromise with
private inusrnace companies--insurance companies will now grant insurance to the
folks who couldn't pass underwriting, but only if the government has a
"mandate" that gently encourages everybody to sign up. Delaying the
mandate is a betrayal of the insurance companies who are doing their part by
extending coverage to the otherwise uninsurable.Delaying the
individual mandate could drive insurance companies out of the market. Is
destroying the private health insurance industry the Repubicans' objective,
or would that be an unintended consequence?
Obamacare is the keystone to single payer healthcare aka government or national
healthcare. The Russian communist Vladimir Lenin, too, understood
the role of medicine when he opined, “Medical care is the keystone in the
arch of socialism.”"One of the first acts of the new
Bolshevik government was to nationalize health care – again, not out of
altruistic concern for the masses of Russian peasants, but to centralize control
over the population and over physicians, who tended to be free thinkers and well
respected by the citizens".
Great explanation BlueDevil. Let me just add one simple explanation to the
question of why you can delay the employer mandate and not the individual
mandate. Every system has core principles from which all other policies and
actions are derived. The core principle of the ACA is everyone should be
covered and everyone should pay (one way or another). You can delay
the employer mandate because it's simply one way to achieve the overall
principle of everyone covered everyone pays. You delay the individual mandate
and you've killed the ACA, so don't think this is just some benign
helpful suggestion. It's a wolf in sheep's clothing.
Just a thought.The person or persons who wrote this article
obviously have good insurance for both themselves and their family.The attitude "I have mine and I do not care if others do not have it"
is not very Christian like in my opinion.
Lets be clear here..... the roll out is simply the beginning of a 6 month open
enrollment period. Second, the problems being experienced are not the result
of a government agency putting out shoddy work, it is the result of Experian,
the contractor who built the system, who didn't do their job right. Yes,
the same people you entrust your credit score to... that built the system that
got over loaded. No one is being denied medical treatment. No one
is being denied insurance because of structural problems with Obamacare itself.
It is a contractor underestimated the load that would be put on the system, and
didn't do enough testing, that is the problem. Hardly an indication of if
Obamacare is a failure. No more so than when you can't log into your
online banking account a sign that the US banking system is a failure.Deep Sea Horizon was an avoidable failure that cost lives, and billions of
dollars. And yet you don't see people saying the US carbon supply system
is a failure.
If Congress can't figure out how to balance a budget, then why do we expect
them to be able to figure out solutions to other more complex things such as
solutions to poverty and education and medical pricing and....Budgets are not that hard to figure out. Spend less than you take it. Save
10%. Have an emergency fund. They should hire Dave Ramsey.
The rollout of Bush's Medicare Part D program also had plenty of glitches.
One big difference between the two, of course, is that Republicans have been
doing everything in their power to make sure that the ACA fails. Democrats
didn't like Medicare Part D, and voted against if for the most part. But
once it was the law of the land, Democrats let it go forward without trying to
wreck it.Also, a big part of the problem with the ACA rollout is
that so many millions of Americans have been trying to sign up, that it has
overwhelmed the system. The insurance doesn't go into effect until 1/1/14,
so everyone still has plenty of time to sign up.