Quantcast
Opinion

Letters: The Obamacare tax

Comments

Return To Article
  • RedShirt USS Enterprise, UT
    Sept. 26, 2013 8:13 a.m.

    To "UT Brit" the NHS may be popular, and it may work for many, but that doesn't change the fact that they have policies that leave people in pain, refuse to treat people, or push people into selling all of their property to get better care through private providers.

    I have lived in another country, and I watched people die at the hand of socialized medicine.

    You say that you would never want to live under a system like the US has, yet in England, the private insurance business is growing. If the NHS was so great, why would the number of people getting private insurance doulbe between 2007 and 2010? It seems that many people are not satisfied with the NHS.

  • UT Brit London, England
    Sept. 26, 2013 2:47 a.m.

    "The NHS isn't even handling the necessary care for the people in England."

    I live here Redshirt, I am having a debate with someone who has zero experience or knowledge of a health care system while trying to pretend that they do. I guess you would argue with Buzz Aldrin about what it feels like being launced to the moon.

    The NHS is very popular. My family and extended family and friends have had good experiences. Apparently thats all wrong though according to you. Should I go by my own experiences and that of my family or go from someone who probably has never lived in another country?

    I have lived in the States Redshirt and seen the terrible health care system you have. I will say again, I would never want to live under a similar system again. Speak to people with experience and not rely on newspapers trying to make headlines.

  • Redshirt1701 Deep Space 9, Ut
    Sept. 24, 2013 10:08 a.m.

    To "UT Brit" the problem is that most of what I have listed are not problems with specific hospitals or doctors. Most of those articles point out Policies of the NHS that are killing people. Your system is what is killing people, not individual policies.

    I can avoid individual hospitals and doctors that abuse patients. I can't avoid national systems that encompass all public healthcare providers. The only way to avoid the disasterous NHS policies is to go to private doctors, so why not establish a system based on private care and insurance in the first place?

    The NHS isn't even handling the necessary care for the people in England. They are refusing to pay for medications that prevent long term pay.

    Why would I want a national system that will use cost cutting measures to save the system money at the expense of the healt of its citizens?

  • UT Brit London, England
    Sept. 24, 2013 9:16 a.m.

    @Redshirt1701

    Oh I can do a headline dump for horror stories from the US, I can assure you I would win by a healthy margin. Which country is clamouring for healthcare reforms again?

    Can the NHS handle every single eventuality, no. Are you saying that you never have problems in America with your health care? That no one dies waiting for care? That people are not put into taxi cabs and dropped off down the street? That insurance companies dont have lifetime caps, have thousands of employees whos sole purpose it is to not pay for care?

    The NHS is not perfect but having lived in the States I can confidently say it stands head and shoulders above what I experienced in the US.

    The titanic survivor would have been able to go to a public nursing home, she chose to pay for a private one and could not pay the bills, sounds like you need to do more research.

    Come to England and ask a thousand people on the streets whether they like the NHS and whether they would like to scrap it for a US style healthcare system. I am extremely confident in what the response would be.

  • Redshirt1701 Deep Space 9, Ut
    Sept. 24, 2013 8:32 a.m.

    To "UT Brit" I have looked into your system quite extensively.

    Here are some headlines from newspapers other than the Daily Mail:

    "100,000 terminally ill 'do not get proper palliative care'" Telegraph

    "Cataracts, hips, knees and tonsils: NHS begins rationing operations" The Independent

    "'Cruel and neglectful' care of one million NHS patients exposed" Telegraph

    "Patients 'denied intensive care'" BBC

    " The real lessons of this NHS disaster" The Independent

    "Lung cancer victims denied lifesaving scans" The Telegraph

    "Patients forced to live in agony after NHS refuses to pay for painkilling injections" Telegraph

    "Sentenced to death on the NHS: Patients with terminal illnesses are being made to die prematurely under an NHS scheme to help end their lives, leading doctors have warned." Telegraph

    "The Ugly Realities Of Socialized Medicine Are Not Going Away" Forbes

    "Two patients died after waiting in ambulance outside 'full' Oldham hospital unit " Manchester Evening News.

    "Last 'Titanic' survivor sells mementoes to pay for care" AFP I thought people didn't have to go bankrupt under Universal care?

    Apparently ever other news source in England has found massive problems with the NHS, why haven't you ever seen those reports?

  • UT Brit London, England
    Sept. 24, 2013 3:08 a.m.

    @Redshirt1701

    "for the most part they put politicians in charge of who lives and dies at the hands of the government employees"

    Please cite which countries you have researched that have that system. I have been in my doctors office many times and have never seen a politician in there telling the doctor whether to treat me or not.

    I have private insurance through my work and I have never used it. I am perfectly happy with the treatment my family and I have received from the NHS.

    I suggest you stop reading Daily Mail headlines and actually talk to people in the countries you have been "researching". The Titanic survivor was living in a private nursing home and she was unable to pay the bills. No treatment was denied her, I suppose in America the private nursing home would have waived her bills and continued to support her right.............

    As regarding the influx of patients, I have never waited so long in an ER than when I was in a hospital in the US. When people depend on the ER for simple treatments instead of going to a doctors surgery the waiting time seems to increase you see.

  • Redshirt1701 Deep Space 9, Ut
    Sept. 23, 2013 1:53 p.m.

    To "Alfred" actually, you are wrong about the US government overhead costs. While just the Medicare department has a 3% overhead, the complete government has a 25% to 30% overhead rate. Saying that Medicare has a 3% overhead rate is like saying that your company's billing department has a 3% overhead cost. While it may be true, it doesn't tell us the whole story.

    To "UT Brit" I have done research on other countries' systems, and for the most part they put politicians in charge of who lives and dies at the hands of the government employees. They often end up with 2 tiered systems where the commoners get second rate care and the wealthy pay private doctors. Take England as an example. They pulled the plug on funding care for a survivor of the Titanic. The government hospitals in large cities often can't handle the influx of patients, and so forth.

  • ugottabkidn Sandy, UT
    Sept. 23, 2013 10:42 a.m.

    Alfred, UT Brit has real experience, listen and learn. To add to your so called premise a fairly recent poll done in Canada 90% of Canadians would not scrape their system for ours. This shoots the myth that Canadians flock south. If you have ever truly experienced the before and after of the ACA then you would prefer the later, even with all it's flaws. Denial of healthcare for profit is not healthcare it's vulturous.

  • UT Brit London, England
    Sept. 23, 2013 5:26 a.m.

    @Alfred

    "Right now, if someone in a country with government healthcare (like England) needs care and don't want to wait in line, they comes to the US. Where will they (and US citizens) go under Obamacare?"

    Errr they just go to a private doctors in the UK. You do know we have public and private hospitals right.....well obviously not.

    I do not know a single person who has been to the US for treatment. Please do research on other countries health care systems before commenting on them.

  • gmlewis Houston, TX
    Sept. 22, 2013 3:50 p.m.

    After hearing all the voices for or against ObamaCare, I concluded that a Single Payer system was better than the alternatives. ObamaCare was well intentioned, but far too complex to succeed. There are too many special interest groups (Democrats, Republicans, Unions, Doctors, Hospitals, Health Insurance companies, young folks, old folks, and even states) for everything to click together. Murphy's Law has yet to be repealed, but neither should ObamaCare. However, it does require some major changes, and that will only happen if we have bipartison support.

  • Alfred Pheonix, AZ
    Sept. 22, 2013 3:36 p.m.

    @ugottabkidn:
    "Afred from AZ, We are already spending enough money on healthcare to pay for a single payer healthcare system."

    So, why not keep what we have?

    "Medicare administration costs 5% your for profit healthcare system is paying close to 35%."

    The Correct overhead numbers are 3% (Medicare) and 12% (private insurance.) And the reason for the difference is, Medicare serves the elderly who incur much, much more healthcare costs resulting in a significantly lower overhead percentage.

    "As a nation we are paying the highest percentage of our GNP for healthcare of any industrialized nation and yet the results are at the bottom."

    That's because of Americans' lifestyle of low physical activities and overeating. This will all change under Obamacare as the government will tell you what and how much you can eat and what kind of exercises you must engage in... something like the life inmates experience in jails.

    "It will, I mean will without a doubt, come back to haunt you."

    Obamacare is already haunting millions of seniors who will be instructed to 'just go home and take a painkiller.' Obama's own words.

  • ugottabkidn Sandy, UT
    Sept. 22, 2013 11:20 a.m.

    Afred from AZ, We are already spending enough money on healthcare to pay for a single payer healthcare system. Medicare administration costs 5% your for profit healthcare system is paying close to 35%. As a nation we are paying the highest percentage of our GNP for healthcare of any industrialized nation and yet the results are at the bottom. We have the means we just don't have the will. It will, I mean will without a doubt, come back to haunt you.

  • wrz Pheonix, AZ
    Sept. 22, 2013 12:16 a.m.

    @high school fan:
    "Healthcare for all? Right. 30,000,000 people will still not be covered"

    Probably true. Many young people will pay the penalty (oops) tax rather than buy insurance. And, since 'preexisting condition' is out the door, many will not buy until they are sick and need it. Which means insurance companies will either go bust or have to significantly jack the premiums up.

  • high school fan Huntington, UT
    Sept. 21, 2013 7:44 p.m.

    Healthcare for all? Right. 30,000,000 people will still not be covered

  • one old man Ogden, UT
    Sept. 21, 2013 6:39 p.m.

    This letter is a prime example of what happens when a person overdoses on hate radio.

  • Mr. Bean Pheonix, AZ
    Sept. 21, 2013 5:59 p.m.

    @Curmedgeon:
    "Patients on Medicare get the same services from the same providers (hospitals, doctors, etc) as Patients on Blue Cross or any other insurance company."

    Obama allocated big chucks of Medicare to Obama care. With less resources, services will, of necessity, be cut back. Even now, some Doctors will not take new Medicare patients. What will it be like with Medicare funding redirected to Obamacare?

  • Curmedgeon Bountiful, UT
    Sept. 21, 2013 5:13 p.m.

    "Next year, Medicare patients will receive sub prime care."

    HUH? While I am not a fan of ObamaCare, I cannot wrap my mind around the above comment. Patients on Medicare get the same services from the same providers (hospitals, doctors, etc) as Patients on Blue Cross or any other insurance company. The only difference is where that Medicare is paying the bill rather than another company.

  • Alfred Pheonix, AZ
    Sept. 21, 2013 3:46 p.m.

    Hutterite
    "But, if we'd get over ourselves, we'd figure out there's a way to make it work."

    It won't work because...

    There's not enough money in the entire world to provide all the healthcare that every US citizen wants or can use. Thus, someone has to go without. With the healthcare industry as it's currently constituted those who go without are the poor and/or can't get insurance for some reason. With government provided single payer healthcare the poor will get their care... but someone else has to go without. And that someone is the elderly. When people get old and need serious healthcare they will have to go without. The government will decide that because there is limited resources and someone has to go without. It's called (by Sarah Palin) 'death panels.' Obama told us early on how it works... 'if you're old and need extensive healthcare, just go home and take a painkiller.'

    Right now, if someone in a country with government healthcare (like England) needs care and don't want to wait in line, they comes to the US. Where will they (and US citizens) go under Obamacare?

  • Ultra Bob Cottonwood Heights, UT
    Sept. 21, 2013 3:46 p.m.

    I agree Obamacare should be repealed. However, ONLY if it is replaced by the health care system needed, wanted and possible for America called Single Payer U. S. government Health care.

    Without any reservation, the government of the United States of America will pay for any and all needed and proper medical care for every American citizen and every person within the area of control of the United States of America.

    This amendment to the Constitution as created and voted into being by the people of the United States of America to be effective as of NOW.

  • ugottabkidn Sandy, UT
    Sept. 21, 2013 12:36 p.m.

    This letter is one of the most misinformed letters I have seen in a very long time. Medicare is in the shape it is in because your Utah representatives along with their republican cronies voted to force Medicare to pay retail for drugs with NO authority to negotiate prices like the VA or any other nation. These "brilliant" economists also

  • LDS Liberal Farmington, UT
    Sept. 21, 2013 11:57 a.m.

    These letters are getting more and more ridiculous....

    Jay Leno makes jokes about Obama, Obamacare, Republicans, Democrats, religion, Science, Muslims, Catholics, Mormons, Jews, Mexicans, ...it doesn't matter.
    He is a comedian!
    That is his JOB for crying out loud!

    Besides,
    Jay Leno announced his RETIREMENT [again, for a 2nd time] months ago.
    He is not getting "fired" for making jokes about Obamacare.

    As I said - ridiculous.

  • ray vaughn Ogden, UT
    Sept. 21, 2013 10:57 a.m.

    I was opposed to the Iraq was of 2003 but was not exempt from my tax money going to that war. If you are a citizen of this country sometimes your money goes to pay for things you do not support.

  • Mike Richards South Jordan, Utah
    Sept. 21, 2013 10:44 a.m.

    Does anyone still think that ObamaCare will provide health CARE for everyone? Haven't they read the articles in the Deseret News? Haven't they read about those who will not be covered? Haven't they read about those who will received less than adequate care? Haven't they read about the hundreds of thousands of workers whose hours have been reduced because of ObamaCare? Haven't they read about the soaring insurance premiums that cost $2,500 MORE per family per year, not $2,500 LESS, as Obama promised?

    When people believe a politician and ignore the facts, they're will be duped. "Duped" is related to "duplicity". "Duplicity" means "deceitful". Obama has been deceitful when he's campaigned for ObamaCare. That program is not at all related to the ObamaCare that you and I will have to pay for if the Democrats continue to reject the will of the people. Even Obama doesn't want his program to be implemented - until after the next election. If it were such a marvelous program, wouldn't he want it in place BEFORE the election. Wouldn't he want the people to know what his program has done?

  • Shaun Sandy, UT
    Sept. 21, 2013 7:50 a.m.

    Wow. These letters to the editor get more ridiculous everyday. I'm sure Jay Leno is stepping down because he got in trouble for making jokes about obamacare.

  • JoeBlow Far East USA, SC
    Sept. 21, 2013 7:43 a.m.

    Ann,

    Couple points

    Obamacare is not inferior to someone who currently has no healthcare.

    If you have insurance today, you will not go on Obamacare. Just like our congressmen.

    I think that Obamacare could be much better and wish our congressmen would come to the table in earnest to make improvements, but alas, that is not the case. Can you name any GOP proposed legislation that has attempted to make improvements? Or any piece of GOP proposed legislation that has attempted to Replace Obamacare?

    It is reasonable to have discussions about Obamacare. It is reasonable to dislike Obamacare. There are lots of problems with Obamacare.

    How about we discuss those instead of writing factually challenged letters to the editor.

  • Midvaliean MIDVALE, UT
    Sept. 21, 2013 7:08 a.m.

    Ann, we are now to the point were people need to start offering alternative solutions, not just criticism.
    The law can be amended. We now have something in place. Lets work with it and structure it to work for us.
    I daresay NO law about universal health care will make everyone happy, mistakes will be made. How we deal with them is how the system will be judged.

  • Hutterite American Fork, UT
    Sept. 21, 2013 1:09 a.m.

    Sadly, we're missing our chance to provide everyone health care. A single payer health care system. And people will have access to your health information in this system. They're delivering your health care, why shouldn't they? Not the IRS, mind you, but the health care system. Of course it won't happen; there's a nose to be shot of to spite our metaphorical face. But, if we'd get over ourselves, we'd figure out there's a way to make it work. We just won't have it if someone else might benefit, too.