The real story behind Utah County dad's viral short-shorts photo


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  • Roundtrip Thomasville, GA
    Dec. 31, 2013 6:51 a.m.

    I hope the girl appreciates how much her father loves her. My father just died and I'd give anything to have him back to laugh with and build funny memories with. When the girl in the story grows up, she and her dad will hopefully use this incident from the past to bond with.

  • ebur Charlotte, NC
    Oct. 31, 2013 2:59 p.m.


  • kargirl Sacramento, CA
    Sept. 14, 2013 6:53 p.m.

    In case he is LDS, here's this: recall that the Jewish law was to do no work on the Sabbath. What was Christ's lesson regarding the man whose donkey (okay, that wasn't the word used) was stuck in the mud and needed to be rescued or would die? He said it was okay to pull out the animal for this man on the Sabbath, even though it was work, because the circumstance was an emergency and couldn't wait for the next day. I would put what happened here in a similar light--after trying every othr way to teach this lesson with love and kindness, this dad did the only thing left to him: he thought out of the box and brought a new idea forward. Whether or not it will be successful long term is not really our business, and I personally feel it's up to daughter to tell us if she chooses. I do hope she paid attention--people tend to listen to what you have to say much better when they aren't distracted on the skimpiness of your outfit.

  • Dante Salt Lake City, UT
    Sept. 14, 2013 11:56 a.m.

    The comment from "Really???" cracks me up. No, the article does not state that Mr. Mackintosh is LDS. But take time to consider the clues: 1. He resides in Utah County, 90% LDS. I know, still a 10% chance he's non-Mormon. 2. He and his wife have seven children. I know, still a 5% chance he could be non-Mormon Catholic. 3. Mackintosh is a Scottish name, not an Irish-, Italian-, or Polish-Catholic name. Still a 2.5% chance he is non-Mormon. 4. He said, "In an effort to try to spend time with just the family, we reserve our Monday evenings for just that." Okay, he may be a Scotch-Catholic software engineer transferred to Utah County by his employer, and who, despite being non-Mormon, practices family home evening and cares deeply about his daughter's modesty. But the odds are 99.2% to .8%.

  • 3boyzmom chattanooga, tn
    Sept. 13, 2013 2:43 p.m.

    From the facebook picture of the daughter, it looks like she has had more than enough "agency", with all of her piercings, lack of modest clothing, etc. My kids will someday enjoy their free agency...when they are no longer living under my roof. I fear this dad's lesson to this daughter is coming too late. I hope it works!

  • sprdthewrd NORMAN, OK
    Sept. 12, 2013 9:57 p.m.

    How wonderful. A dad who loves his daughter. Now days it is out of the ordinary that the daughter even knows her dads name. What a wonderful family example. You children your parents love you and are teaching you how to be good parents in a wicked world.

  • JSB Sugar City, ID
    Sept. 12, 2013 9:49 p.m.

    Re. Christopher B.

    You're straining at gnats.

  • Bob K porland, OR
    Sept. 12, 2013 7:14 p.m.

    No tank tops on boys or girls (except when playing sports) in Utah, a desert?

    Appropriateness, rather than forced prudery fits the 21st Century better

  • Vernal Mom Vernal, UT
    Sept. 12, 2013 3:37 p.m.

    Totally agree with steph-uk.

    Why does the daughter own a lot of immodest clothing?? (I'm assuming she bought them herself). The short shorts, tank tops, and sun dresses, etc., start at a very young age in my opinion. If modesty is important to you, please don't buy the clothes for your little girl that you don't want them wearing as a pre-teen and teen. It starts with mom and was taught in our home to our daughters. Then you are NOT giving boxes of clothing to the DI, and purchasing a new wardrobe when you get married in the temple. You have already been dressing modestly.

  • Kirk R Graves West Jordan, UT
    Sept. 12, 2013 2:50 p.m.

    Here is the straight up answer.
    If the problem is serious enough, and I truly felt (after prayer) that smoking or drinking or taking drugs would solve it (can't imagine how, but you asked) then yes, the salvation of my children trumps everything. I imagine the vast majority of LDS would agree.

    The fact that you have kept beating this to death tells me that your understanding of the LDS faith is kind of shallow. One of the core tenants of the faith is the right each person has to receive direct revelation from God concerning our stewardships in the this life. Our children being the most important of all.

  • WillK South Jordan/Salt Lake, UT
    Sept. 12, 2013 2:50 p.m.

    People made a similar pharisaical point some time ago.

    Mark 3

    1 And he entered again into the synagogue; and there was a man there which had a withered hand.

    2 And they watched him, whether he would heal him on the sabbath day; that they might accuse him.

    3 And he saith unto the man which had the withered hand, Stand forth.

    4 And he saith unto them, Is it lawful to do good on the sabbath days, or to do evil? to save life, or to kill? But they held their peace.

    5 And when he had looked round about on them with anger, being grieved for the hardness of their hearts, he saith unto the man, Stretch forth thine hand. And he stretched it out: and his hand was restored whole as the other.

    6 And the Pharisees went forth, and straightway took counsel with the Herodians against him, how they might destroy him.

  • jeanie orem, UT
    Sept. 12, 2013 2:43 p.m.

    In education we call what this dad did a "counter example". It's a well-known method for making the correct way much more clear to the learner by demonstrating the wrong way. Hopefully his daughter learned. :)

  • greatbam22 andrews afb, MD
    Sept. 12, 2013 2:04 p.m.

    @ Chris B

    Tell us more about our hypocrisy because we "liked" how this guy dressed imodestly to teach his daughter a lesson.

  • zoar63 Mesa, AZ
    Sept. 12, 2013 12:58 p.m.


    "Where in this story does it mention this man and his family are LDS? Sure, there are clues that could lead you to believe that they are, but we could all be wrong. I say this because LDS people aren't the only people who get concerned about modest dress."

    The Monday evening family night was a dead give away. I vote for LDS

  • Christine B. Hedgefog Salt Lake City, UT
    Sept. 12, 2013 11:31 a.m.

    From page 1 "Maybe I just don't understand"

    That's the first time in the thousands upon thousands upon thousands of anti-Mormon and anti-BYU comments that this lady has made on the Des News over multiple years where she actually said something sensible!

    Good on her. I'm glad she is starting to get it. Hopefully the message comes through even louder and clearer next Friday!

  • george of the jungle goshen, UT
    Sept. 12, 2013 10:19 a.m.

    Good story. I told my wife the story and showed her the picture, and she just said; was she wearing hers to, so he could wear his together. She liked the story to, Her words was; it's cute.

  • Hey It's Me Salt Lake City, UT
    Sept. 12, 2013 8:51 a.m.

    Let's get this straight. . .we are not all perfect. The dad used his agency to prove a point. It didn't hurt him or anyone else. It's not for me to question his agency. The article never stated that he'd been through the Temple so Christopher B from Ogden, the article I read only said their family does things together on Monday nights. v. . I didn't see it say Temple anywhere in the article. I think he made a great parenting choice. If his daughter didn't learn the message behind it many others will.

  • Chris B Salt Lake City, UT
    Sept. 12, 2013 8:40 a.m.


    My comment has been addressed, but not necessarily answered. Big difference.

    I still don't think anyone has said what the difference is between smoking to prove a point about not smoking and dressing like this to prove a point about not dressing like this.

    And again, I'm done enough research to know that both smoking and modesty-related questions are asked to get a temple recommend.


  • Chris B Salt Lake City, UT
    Sept. 12, 2013 8:36 a.m.

    @SayNoto BO,

    Did the Savior ever break a rule/commandment in order to teach one?

    Didn't think so.

    Sept. 12, 2013 7:43 a.m.

    So after all of this, did anything change?

  • jeanie orem, UT
    Sept. 12, 2013 7:20 a.m.

    Chris B.

    I think your question has been adequately answered by many posts.

    If you really want to understand the LDS faith, focus on the doctrine and learn for yourself. Stop looking for hypocrisy among its members and justifying it as learning. Maybe then you get why this dad's actions aren't seen as wrong by many.

  • t702 Las Vegas, NV
    Sept. 12, 2013 6:03 a.m.

    Great story! Too bad Chris B uses it to take a shot at this man's faith. Thing is God has laws, God also has this thing call agency- our freedom to choose. While God wants all his children to keep all his commandments 100 percent of the time, we are still free to choose. Whether or not the man's funny action is against God's standard is entirely between him and his God

  • Really??? Kearns, UT
    Sept. 11, 2013 10:05 p.m.

    Where in this story does it mention this man and his family are LDS? Sure, there are clues that could lead you to believe that they are, but we could all be wrong. I say this because LDS people aren't the only people who get concerned about modest dress.

  • Twin Sister LINDON, UT
    Sept. 11, 2013 7:12 p.m.

    Christopher B. To try to answer your question directly about drinking and smoking to prove a point--not all of the requirements/rules are weighted equally. In my experience and in my opinion, as a temple attending Mormon, it would not be okay to take drugs or drink alcohol in order to prove a point--no. This would be considered a weighter matter. As far as the modesty issue goes--modesty is important and it is stressed. As someone else already expressed, it is permissible to dress in swimsuits, for instance, when at the beach or to wear athletic uniforms or attire in order to particpate in sports that may not be considered as modest as being fully clothed. My personal opinion about what this Dad did to teach his daughter a lesson was not violating any modesty issues. I believe that he did what he felt was the "more weighter" matter in teaching his daughter a lesson on modesty and that he did not violate any rules to any great degree. I hope this explanation helps and it is my opinion.

  • arand Huntsville, u
    Sept. 11, 2013 5:00 p.m.

    Good Job Dad, it doesn't matter if you are Mormon, Catholic, Protestant, Jewish, Atheist, etc. The point is, you made the point. Even though your daughter doesn't see it now, she will when she has children of her own. I'm sure she will thank you at some point in her life.

    Again, congratulations. We need more dads like you.

  • JohnInSLC Cottonwood Heights, UT
    Sept. 11, 2013 4:23 p.m.

    "Is it ok to start smoking/drinking to prove a point about smoking/drinking?"

    Chris B:

    My dad sure thought so.

    When I was 16 he told me he knew I'd probably get invited by some of my friends to try alcohol. He said, "I worry about the situations you might be in when that happens, which could jeopardize your safety and that of your friends [he was referring to driving, etc]. So, I want you to promise me that when you feel the need to experiment with alcohol, you'll tell me. I'll go buy it for you--whatever you want, clear out the family, and stay here with you while you try it."

    I promised. And that took all the perceived fun out out of it.

    As one very prominent leader of the LDS Church once told me: "You've got to know the rules before you can feel inspired to break them."

  • Christopher B Ogden, UT
    Sept. 11, 2013 3:55 p.m.

    I guess the part I have a hard time with is when Mormons stress something so strongly and then have no issue not doing it.

    If modesty is so important(and living in Utah I've heard Mormons talk about it countless times). And if Mormons have to be even more strict in "clothing requirements" after going through temple, this man makes it seem like those things really aren't that important.

    So is modesty and doing what is promised in your temples very important or not really important?

    And if its very important, why do people seem to support this guy not doing what is so important?

  • Christopher B Ogden, UT
    Sept. 11, 2013 3:53 p.m.

    Jeanie and ordinaryindivdiual,

    Although I appreciate the reply, it doesn't seem like either of you answered the question.


    So it would be ok to take drugs/smoke to teach a lesson?

    And by ok, I mean would the LDS church frown upon it and take action(loss of temple privileges)


    Someone teaching another person to shoot free throws doesn't have to demonstrate it in the incorrect way in order for the person to learn the incorrect way.

    I have done enough research on Mormonism and have enough Mormon acquaintances that I know part of the Mormons temple worthiness is whether they "dress appropriately" at all times. I would spell it out further but I think the Des News moderators would use it as an excuse to block my comment, if they wont already. I think you all know what I'm referring to.

    I ask again,

    Is the LDS church ok with people breaking rules to teach rules?

  • UtahBlueDevil Durham, NC
    Sept. 11, 2013 3:52 p.m.

    Christopher B - ummmm, yep. We even break these standards when we go to the beach.... play some sports.... Modest is the symbol of a covenant we have taken, not the covenant itself. Therefor there are times, sometimes to make a point, sometimes in the exercise of out jobs, sometimes for recreational purposes, we dress appropriate to task.

    Some of are even known to speed when late to work, not be fully honest when asked our opinions about how others look, and even keep some secrets from our kids about the holidays. Shocking.... I know.

    Boy, talk about missing the point article.

  • O'really Idaho Falls, ID
    Sept. 11, 2013 2:07 p.m.

    Christopher. Relax. It was just a simple object lesson. No need to make it more complicated than it was.

    Very brave dad and a terrific lesson.

  • ordinaryindividual Springville, UT
    Sept. 11, 2013 1:46 p.m.

    @Christopher B

    That's a fair question. Here's my view on it.

    If I take you to a basketball court and show you the exact perfect form on a free throw, and I even make 10 in a row to prove it works, and then leave, will you make every free throw for the rest of your life? No. But does your inability to make every free throw make the form any less perfect? No. The fact that you (or I) can't replicate the perfect form every time doesn't invalidate the perfection of the form.

    Similarly, the standards of the church and the gospel of Christ as a whole attempt to show us that perfect form for lasting happiness. Neither you, nor I, nor Mr. Mackintosh can replicate that perfect form every time, despite our best efforts. Doesn't make the principles of the gospel any less perfect, though.

    The key to happiness is focusing on perfecting OUR form. When we get caught up watching the other free throw shooters, we aren't even attempting any shots. Our job is to cheer for the good form we see in others and refine and perfect our own.

  • JSB Sugar City, ID
    Sept. 11, 2013 1:36 p.m.

    I have six children and now 16 grandchildren and I know how difficult it is to get children through the teenage years. They have lots of brains but no good sense. I don't know if I would have done the same thing but I could have. I certainly don't judge the father for trying. I hope his daughter has enough brains and maturity to recognize how much his father loves her.

  • Just an Observer Salt Lake City, UT
    Sept. 11, 2013 1:30 p.m.

    Just in case we see comments here from those who want to poke, prod, belittle, and cajole those with whom they have issues, we should realize that they likely have had experiences that cloud their judgment--say, in the workplace, among their acquaintances, or even in marital relationships. What we often don't realize is that we actually do them a disservice in responding to them, because it provides them with the unhealthy stimulus they are seeking. If we don't respond, they will eventually tire of that lack of stimulus, and look to instead lift themselves out of the morass in which they find themselves. For the love of our fellowmen, let's help them by remaining silent when they post.

  • jeanie orem, UT
    Sept. 11, 2013 1:22 p.m.

    Pretty amazing dad! Sometimes when all else fails shock is an option.

    Chris B.
    Sometimes creativity in parenting is necessary to get a kid to really think. When my mom was a teen she was told by her mom if she ever wanted to try alcohol or smoking my grandma would buy it for her and she could have a try at home. (This was in the generation before drugs) She didn't need to sneak around to experiment. My mom never took her up on the offer, but I have no doubt my grandma would have followed through had my mom asked. My wise grandma took away the mystery and the excitement of sneaking around. This dad put back in the face of his daughter that her choices affect others in an unforgettable way. I doubt he'll be disfellowshipped or loose his temple recommend.

  • Say No to BO Mapleton, UT
    Sept. 11, 2013 1:02 p.m.

    @ Christopher B
    The Savior did some rather radical things in his ministry.
    The woman taken in adultery, clearing the merchants from the temple by force, turning away hungry followers because they were looking for a handout rather than Living Water...
    The Pharisees had trouble with his teaching methods.
    They also followed Him around asking questions calculated to entrap Him.

  • UtahBruin Saratoga Springs, UT
    Sept. 11, 2013 11:52 a.m.

    This guy is "DAD OF THE YEAR" for sure. What a great way to drive the point home.

  • Christopher B Ogden, UT
    Sept. 11, 2013 11:48 a.m.


    I just want to understand.

    So its ok to break standards of dress to prove a point about standards of dress?

    What other things does this apply to?

    Is it ok to start smoking/drinking to prove a point about smoking/drinking?

    What is your opinion?

  • steph-uk Birmingham, West M
    Sept. 11, 2013 11:48 a.m.

    Great story and great dad. My only question is why does she even own immodest clothing? I know, I know...agency. Or perhaps she has her own money and buys her own clothes, but if I had ever brought home clothes that I'd bought that were inappropriate, my parents wouldn't have allowed me to keep them let alone wear them! I had expectations and I knew if I were to fall short of them it wouldn't be tolerated. That said, I understood why modesty is so important and never felt a desire to wear immodest or inappropriate clothing.

  • KeithB Riverton, UT
    Sept. 11, 2013 11:37 a.m.

    @ChristopherB, Mormons do have standards of dress. I believe this Dad was utilizing a unique way of driving the point home with his daughter.

    @wwookie, couldn't agree more.

  • 9MM Murray, UT
    Sept. 11, 2013 11:31 a.m.

    I love it! The question all parents should ask is how far will you go to teach your children correct principles? It is especially difficult when cultural standards are pulling farther away, or should I say pulling more off, from the principles of modesty and decency.
    Making yourself an object lesson I think is an incredible teaching tool.

  • wwookie Payson, UT
    Sept. 11, 2013 11:17 a.m.

    Great story. I wouldn't have the kahunas to do something like that.

    Hope the daughter knows it is just as embarrassing for dad as it was for her.

    Lets just not make this a common occurrence.

  • Christopher B Ogden, UT
    Sept. 11, 2013 11:04 a.m.

    I don't think his bishop would approve of this would he?

    I thought there were rules with how Mormons should dress, especially those who have gone through the temple.

    Am I wrong?

    Maybe I just don't understand?