Stand Your Ground means that one does not have the obligation to retreat if
threatened. When you are lying on your back and someone is on your chest and
pounding on you, retreat is not a physical option. That is why the GZ defense
team did not use SYG. They claimed self-defense.
@frugalfly:I share your questions. If either one of them would have
taken a step back and avoided the confrontation that led to this death, we
wouldn't have heard a word about it. As it was, Zimmerman could have
backed off as advised by the 911 operator. Martin could have gone on his way
without attacking Zimmerman. Either choice would have avoided the
confrontation. I hear so many people jumping to conclusions about
who was at fault and why, but I wasn't there. I did not attend the trial
either. I don't know what the truth is about all this. From what I have
heard and read, this situation escalated because of the actions of two people.
Martin may have been only 17, but so was the kid who killed a soccer
ref in Utah a few months ago with only one punch to the head. 17 is old enough
to join the military with parents' permission. 17 is old enough to kill.
The trial is over. Accept the outcome and work to improve the world by teaching
your own kids how to behave. This is not the case to rally around
for a cause.
When LIES are spewed forth to the ignorant masses, chaos is inevitable. When the
lies come from the President, the chaos is even worse. He uses his "life
experience" to hypothesize scenarios from his "unique" perspective.
He talks about the woman in the elevator "clutching" her purse. Truth be
known, that lady in the elevator opened her purse and gave him a "fair
share" of her money. From my unique perspective, this
"event" gave license to ALL of the hate mongers to do their hate
This is mass hysteria! The angels have recorded all that which was done that
unfortunate day. Let God, who knows and sees all things, be the judge.
Not sure if any of you keep in close touch with your pal, "Zim".Should you give Zimmer a call, right now, you can be sure that he wishes he
never got out of his vehicle to follow Trayvon Martin."Zim" joins
the many infamous who know they made a gargantuan mistake. The life this killer
will now live, well....not exactly what "Zim" had in mind.We'll see the entire sad story in writing soon enough from "Zim"
and his family.
If Zimmerman is a White Hispanic then Obama is a White Black.
This is no surprising. These people have an awful lot of time on their
hands.Meanwhile, the rest of us go back to work.
Of course Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson are rabble rousing, but the real problem
is the news media. Every time some misguided soul waves a sign or shouts a
slogan the media shows up to take pictures and formulate stories no mater how
outlandish the mob might be. As a matter of fact, the more bazaar the crowd the
more attention they get. Come on news media, do some work, find a real story
instead of riding your office chair waiting for the story to come to you.
@10CC:"... the law in Florida is so lenient toward self defense that
it's not difficult to murder somebody and get away with it, if you know how
to set up a confrontation, then when it escalates, you kill them and claim self
defense."If you kill someone regardless of what law you use for
an excuse, you'd better show some signs that you had to defend yourself...
or a jury will likely see that you spend much of the rest of your life locked up
in jail.@Zenawp:"If I was a neighborhood watch person, I
would notice that Trayvon fit the profile..."Don't say
'profile' lest guys like Sharpton and Jackson will take it that you
mean 'racial profiling.'"Why are they dividing a
nation over racial profiling when none exists?"There are some
black folks who make a living out of fostering anti-race relations."Why did he feel compelled to attack this man he must have believed to be
unarmed?"There is no earthly reason why Trayvon needed to
attack. All he needed do is proceed directly to his home.
@Ted:"So people are fired up and marching for Trayvon but why are they
not marching for the other 5-10 kids his age gunned down each day."Because they are mostly black on Black kids. Black protesters don't care
much about protesting where Blacks kill Blacks.@OHBU:"Had
that law not been in place, they might have reached a different
verdict..."Likely not. Zim had the right to defend himself.
How that differs from 'stand your ground' is unclear."We don't know who started the fight."We do know who
get beat up with a bloody nose and scalp. There is no reason for Zim to start a
fight. All he wanted/needed to know was, does Martin live here or is
burglarizing houses?"But we do know that Zimmerman instigated
the whole situation."He did no such thing. Zim was on
neighborhood watch. He had the right to know who Martin was and what he was up
to. He had the right and responsibility to keep Martin in sight to inform the
police when they arrived.
I try to contemplate what the result would have been if Zimmerman would have
backed off as advised by police? I wonder what the result would have been if
Travon Martin would have reacted to Zimmerman with no physical resistance or
retaliation or racial slurs? Both contributed to the end result. Both are
guilty to some degree of being violent. It would have only taken one of these
persons to be mellow and nonescalating and we wouldn't be talking about
this. It wasn't like the Rodney King video which the man layed on the
ground and got the crud kicked out of him. That video makes me sick! I still
can't understand how they got away with that....
I can't judge if justice was served. Unlike the jury, I did not listen to
every word of testimony and examine every piece of evidence that was presented
at the trial.
What is expected? What is accepted? What is unacceptable? Give it a rest.
Nobody is mentioning the fact that the neighborhood was being burglarized by
some young, black men. If I was a neighborhood watch person, I would notice that
Trayvon fit the profile of who had been robbing the locals. Walking in your
neighborhood following someone is not illegal. Beating someone and breaking
their nose is illegal and may get you killed. But who is at fault here? Gone is
the time when we can beat someone and hope they have nothing to protect
themselves. Would this be an issue if the neighborhood watch person were a woman
of any race? I think not. Why are they dividing a nation over racial profiling
when none exists? I'm very sad for the loss of Trayvon and for his family.
But destroying Mr. Zimmerman's life even further, will not bring back their
son. Did they teach their son to beat people that were walking behind him? Why
did he feel compelled to attack this man he must have believed to be unarmed?
What is justice? Is it to persecute a person who was found innocent in a legal
and fair trial? Should Zimmerman say that though he is innocent in order for
things to be just, he should confess to doing something he didn't do? The
more the protesters protest, the less respect I have for them.
Senator John McCain, who is in the mold of Al Sharpton.Say anything do
anything to stay in power. Orin Hatch knows where the power is also, slide to
the Left and gain Washington power.
Nan,Think about it for just a minute...To be able to have the
right to speak up without fear of reprisal, is a major reason our forefathers
came to this country.
SLars:To the extent the self-defense laws (including "stand your
ground") can be used to murder people under the pretense of self defense,
then, yes, you're right, many in this nation would like to see at least a
vigorous review of these laws, including Senator John McCain, who is hardly in
the mold of Al Sharpton.A Utah policeman I know told me the law in
Florida is so lenient toward self defense that it's not difficult to murder
somebody and get away with it, if you know how to set up a confrontation, then
when it escalates, you kill them and claim self defense. I really
doubt this was Zimmerman's intention, but under the law, this is entirely
possible... and extremely difficult to prosecute.
idablue: ""Stand your ground" wasn't even part of the
defense" While you're technically correct that the defense
did not present Stand your ground, if you listened to juror interviews since the
verdict, they very clearly used it when they came to their "not guilty"
verdict. Had that law not been in place, they might have reached a different
verdict, because it is only with laws like that where you can instigate a
situation, if perhaps not the actual fists being thrown, and still claim self
defense. We don't know who started the fight. Zimmerman claims it was
Trayvon, but of course he does--I'm sure Trayvon would say the opposite.
But we do know that Zimmerman instigated the whole situation. In the absence of
stand your ground (and the jurors learned about this from the supposedly
left-wing media before sequestration) Zimmerman likely wouldn't have been
Worf: Michael J doesn't know. He is just spouting the PC dogma without
trying to educate himself. Sometimes I wonder what ever happened to a
"real" education, not the current PC education we are getting with out
@Michael J:How is it harder being a black in Florida than white in
Utah?. What's the difference?
It is easy to criticize the protestors but I do agree that it is much harder to
be a black teenage teen in Florida than a white teenage teen in utah. The
verdict was right under the law and evidence but that doesn't mean there
isn't a injustice when it comes to perceptions to black male teenagers. I
am sympathetic to what the ultimate message.
Justice was already served.
This is all so ridiculous that one wonders just what in the world all the
protestors really want. They don't want justice or equality, they want some
abstract objective that no one can provide. You just can't have everything
work for the welfare of every person when we are all humans. What a waste of
effort and media space.
"nation's self-defense laws"Zimmerman waived his right
to be tried under the "stand your ground" laws. There argument is
irrelevant. It looks to me like the far-left is trying to take away
our rights to defend ourselves.
If Obama was a city, he would look like Detroit.
These so-called "leaders" of the black community have all made very good
livings from race-baiting. The truth is none of these protestors really know the
evidence or what went on in the court room. "Stand your ground"
wasn't even part of the defense, yet Holder conveniently ignores this just
as the white-guilt ridden liberals and black leaders ignore the fact that it was
not even a white-on-black incident.Based on the evidence the jury
made a correct decision. I don't believe Zimmerman is completely guiltless
in this tragic incident, but I am disgusted in how many have used this for
political purposes and to promote racial division.Instead of wasting
their time on this garbage a true leader of the black community would be
addressing the enormous problem of black on black crime and preponderance of
single mothers and welfare dependents in the black community.
Racism is ugly. Just because Obama, the Martins, Jackson, Sharpton and obvious
are black does not excuse them for their blatant actions I am so opposed to
racism whether done by whites, chinese, hispanics, muslims or blacks.
Hmmmm. I lock my car doors every time I get out of it. I live in a
neighborhood that is all white. Does locking my car door mean I am racist
towards whites?I was in a store today and a clerk approached me,
asked if I needed any help. I told him "no, thank you". He lingered
nearby. Does his lingering mean he suspected me as a risk for theft or crime?
I am white. How is my experience different than Obama's experience of
being followed in a store.While living in Richmond, Virginia, I was
robbed on the street by a black man. I don't feel that he represents the
black community at all. Just because he was black does not mean all blacks are
thieves. I don't feel suspicious of my black friends now.Is
Sharpton, Jackson, Obama, and others using this "crisis" to get
something, just as Emanuel said "never let a crisis go to waste"? If Treyvon had been white would Zimmerman have acted any differently?
If Martin had been white, and was killed, would the black community be out in
the streets marching against injustice?
So people are fired up and marching for Trayvon but why are they not marching
for the other 5-10 kids his age gunned down each day. 17 yr olds are killed
each day in some big city (and other places too) around this nation. Who's
marching for them? Should somebody be marching against these Trayvon supports
for the injustice they have against these other young kids? Something is
twisted upside down regarding these marches. Who's instigating them and
I'm quite confused as to what people want in the name of Justice. Mr.
Zimmerman was "not guilty" and that was very clear from the evidence and
the trial. He spent a year in prison already and was "not guilty".
So.....do people want someone else to pay a price in the name of justice? What
is needed to make these people feel that justice was served. Bottom
line....don't punch a "strange man" in the nose and then mount him
and begin to hit his head on the sidewalk.....he may feel a need to defend
himself and may have a lethal weapon. This was not "stand your
ground".....it was "stay alive".