I am fine with repealing it. They just need to let us all know what the
alternative is? Are we scapping pre-existing conditions legislation? Are we
going beck to de-insuring those over 18? What are we talking about.There has been no one who has put out a descriptive plan of - if not obama
care - than what.Just repealing is the lazy mans way out. It is a
step backward, that doesn't addressing the spiraling upward medical cost
that were happening before there was even the first words of obamacare in
Obama's eye. Conservatives have got to go beyond just being against
things..... they need to promote solutions.To this point -
crickets.... nothing. Just rhetoric.
We trust the government to protect our city with police officers and fire
fighters, but we turn to insurance companies to protect our health.
Fortunately, most of us will never need the police or fire department, but
unfortunately most of us will need health care. Hopefully, the Health Care Act
will be the first step in getting rid of insurance companies. There concern is
not our health, it is the almighty dollar. Just count the dollars the insurance
companies have spent on lobbying our elected officials. Do you think they
should spend that money on their customers who need health care support?
First and foremost, Dan needs to lose his lifetime health coverage provided by
the State taxpayers from when he was in the legislature.After he loses his
social healthcare coverage, then we can talk.
@Mike Richards"That plan is to do as Mitt Romney did and let the STATE
or the PEOPLE handle their health care needs. "Obamacare allows
states to opt out and develop their own plans as long as it covers at least as
many people and is no more expensive than Obamacare. So far only Vermont has
gone this option. @Mountanman"Can you name one monopoly
that has ever reduced costs, provided incentive for technology advancements or
cared about quality?"Healthcare. There's a difference
between a corporate monopoly (which is for profit) and a gov't monopoly
(which is not for profit). The US healthcare system is the most expensive in the
world in terms of % GDP spent on it. All of the European healthcare systems are
cheaper and at least most of them are much more gov't involved than the US
If there's a part of it that doesn't work why not just fix that part?
Heck a lot of Democrats would like to get rid of the employer mandate. Why not
just pass a bill that gets rid of that part of it if most in Congress think
it'd improve the bill? Or do Republicans just hope Americans
end up suffering so that they can benefit politically?
Wait a minute. I thought all life was sacred. Or is it only sacred if it's
unborn and/or you don't have to help pay for it?
That little girl who needed the transplant is a living, breathing human being
who needed help from an administration that had no intention of treating her.
The doctors had no qualms about helping her, but the "secretary" had
"qualms" about the cost. She didn't think that that the family of
little girl should expect to use the "people's money" for something
that insignificant. Of course no one heard her say that. Of course Obama was
never heard giving directions on who could be treated or who could be rejected,
but without the public outcry, that little girl would have died. There's a pattern. Read what Obama said about blotched late term
abortions. What did he say about little boys and little girls who had survived
an abortion attempt? Do you really want Obamacare? Do you really
trust anything about that has been done by this administration? Can you count on
public outrage when you need medical care, care that you've already paid
for, care that is owed to you? Are you willing to gamble - your life?
Mike Richards, 12:47 PMI assume the little girl you're talking
about is the one who recently received the double lung transplant. The reason
she was initially refused that transplant was because they usually aren't
given to children that young. It had nothing to do with Obamacare.I
know you're bound and determined to hate the man no matter what and
that's your right, but at least tell the whole story first.
Mike Richards "I said "Major Medical", not sniffle insurance. You
can find many very good policies that will cover everything above $10,000 for
much less than $2,400 a year. " File this under "if I had some ham
I'd make you a sandwich." For the vast majority that $10,000 is an
astronomical sum - just die and shut up - right?
tesuji,How about if we start at the beginning? Where did the people
give Congress authority to tax them for healthcare? Would you state which
clause in Article 1, Section 8 authorizes the federal government to tax us for
insurance? Please don't try to wiggle your way out of that question by
claiming the "forgoing powers" clause. You and I both know that the
"forgoing powers" refers ONLY to the enumerated duties listed in Section
8, otherwise Section 8 would not have been necessary. (Military and Defense are
listed at least 6 times in that section even though defense is clearly mentioned
elsewhere, but "elsewhere" does not give Congress authority to tax us -
only section 8 does.)It is not the responsibility of the federal
government to wipe our noses. We are independent people, free from the heavy
boot of the government. We earned the right to pay our own way through life.
Except for the few items enumerated in Section 8, we have told the federal
government to leave us alone. In other words, if you want health insurance,
talk to your insurance agent and don't expect anyone else to pay for your
The problem with the "repeal and start over" idea is that Republicans
will never allow a new bill to pass. They seem to be satisfied with the status
quo: an expensive, inefficient health care system that is costing more and more
every year. Even people who have health insurance are getting pushed into
minimal plans and/or high deductible plans because of rising costs. 50 million Americans don't have any health care, and are forced to wait
until they are very sick and use the emergency room - the most expensive
solution there is. Obamacare is surely not perfect, but I say
let's see how it works, and reform it as needed. The status quo isn't
@patriot "It is sad to see America sinking in the mud like this with no way
to save itself."Don't be discouraged. We are witnessing the
high water mark of liberalism in America. Big Government is being discredited by
its own self. Obamacare will serve as an object lesson and a warning for future
generations. It's a fiasco -- a highly visible failure, impossible to
ignore.Observe the efforts in this space today to blame the
impending train wreck on the opposite party. But we all know who's
responsible for it.In the Senate, 58 Democrats, 2 Independents, and
0 Republicans voted in favor.In the House, 219 Democrats and 0 Republicans
voted in favor.And everyone knows who signed it -- the guy whose
trademark is blaming other people. He won't be able shift the blame this
" I believe the best course of action would be to repeal Obamacare and start
over on health care reform." But the medical industrial complex will
dictate a similar outcome.
Are we living in anarchy or under the rule of a monarch? Because based on what I
learned in Civics class the legislative branch passes laws and the executive
branch is tasked with enforcing those laws. So since when is the President
allowed to pick and choose which laws or parts of laws the executive branch
enforces? I am allowed now to pick and choose which laws I follow? This
notion that employers should provide health insurance is ridiculous.
Wouldn't our economy benefit if businesses focused on doing what they do
instead of running HR departments? If a company does choose to provide health
insurance then the employee should pay taxes on that as income. How is that not
Henderson,I said "Major Medical", not sniffle insurance.
You can find many very good policies that will cover everything above $10,000
for much less than $2,400 a year. Many employers buy that kind of insurance for
their employees and then fund the difference, relying on the statistics that
show that very few people need major medical coverage more than a few times in
their lifetime. Other employers offer health savings accounts where you pay
from your health savings account for all non-major medical, then your policy
pays for the large expenses.If you can't afford to pay for your
own medical, then why do you have the cell phones, the computers, the TVs and
all the other extras? Obama wants 18% of all income that goes to
doctors and hospitals. He has already let his "secretary" deny coverage
to a 10-year-old girl for lifesaving health-care. Were it not for public
pressure, that little girl would have died. His plan does not reduce that 18%.
It increases it.Americans used to be known as people with a
back-bone. Now too many need their "nanny government" to wipe their
I know that Nancy Pelosi, Harry Reid and Barack Obama had good motives in doing
this. Their hearts were in the right place. But motives are only good in
theology. They can argue for leniency on the judgment day because they really,
truly in their heart oif hearts did intend to help the working poor.What matters in government is that they should have gotten it right
irrespective of what their intentions were.So, I conclude, that they
are right wing, robber baron capitalists who want to stick it to working class
people. Like the Koch brothers. Right wing Democrats (Reid, Pelosi and Obama
not the Koch Brothers). Where are those bleeding heart liberal Republicans who
were against Obamacare? Bachmann? Perry? Gingrich? (Geez, Pelosi, Reid and
Obama, this is embarrassing, you are further right than those wackos!)
"We fought a war to be free from the political tyranny of
"Europe"."You might need to take a history lesson. Of
course, that would involve actually going to college rather than constantly
bashing it. We didn't fight a war to be free from the political tyranny of
"Europe." "There are still "King Men", who want
a King"I agree. They come in the form of insurance. What do they
know about health care? What do they know about my needs? All they know how to
do is make money. So they slash hospital staff, add red tape, and cut my
insurance because of pre-conditions. How many hospitals work with bad equipment
and dirty tools to save costs? How many hospitals rely on fewer beds because of
cuts?Like you said, they desire to be kings."We have
excellent health care in America. "If you can afford it. "For $2,400 a year, they could buy major medical insurance."You're showing how out of touch you are. Without employer provided
health insurance, a family will often pay $2,000 dollars PER MONTH not PER YEAR
(as you suggested) to be covered. That's not affordable. Sorry!
The Republican plan is to let the free market decide. That sounds good until the
market starts doing what it naturally does, price-fixing, colluding,
monopolizing, profiteering, etc. My father-in-law was against Medicare until he
had a heart attack with a $68,000 bill attached. All of a sudden he was in
favor. The clear answer is to provide Medicare to everyone and drive out of
business the entire health-insurance system that exists only to gouge us and
"The goal of health care reform should not be to insure everyone. It should
be to ensure that everyone has access to affordable services. Contrary to
politicians' statements, the former prevents the latter."I
could not find a better argument for a single-payer system than this quote.
Thank you. Lets provide quality affordable health care to all. Lets
stop making wall street fat cats rich off of our health. Get rid of insurance.
Force these folks to actually get productive jobs. Lets start treating humans as
human beings not as commodities.
We are not Europe. We fought a war to be free from the political tyranny of
"Europe". We rejected government mandating every part of our lives.
There are still "King Men", who want a King. They refuse to cherish
their liberties. They refuse to take responsibility for their choices. They
want a "safety net". They want to do whatever please them without
paying the consequences. Children want the same thing. They want. They want.
They want. Mostly, they want "Daddy" to pay for it.We have
excellent health care in America. We also have cell phones. We have
automobiles. We have air conditioning. We have TV. We have every comfort
imaginable. If we want to see a doctor, we can choose from hundreds of doctors.
BUT, we have to pay for the doctor just like we pay for our cell phones. Many
people pay $100 month for their cell phones and another $100 for their cable.
For $2,400 a year, they could buy major medical insurance. But,
they don't want to. They want somebody else to pay for the necessities
while they spend their money on their "wants".
It is sad to see America sinking in the mud like this with no way to save
itself. Yes we can and should blame corrupt and inept leaders like Obama but
Barack didn't elect himself to office. The people of this country - as a
majority - have fallen off the wagon. As a majority now America has become a
lazy, ignorant, entitlement bound, uninformed society not deserving of freedom
or prosperity. The remaining 40% who are patriotic and smart don't have the
political power anymore to overcome the ignorant and stupid majority along with
their corrupt media. It feels like we are being drug under by a giant boat
anchor tied around our necks. Obamacare is nothing more than an ugly by-product
of the state of the union.
This long history of complaining about the ACA from the right reminds me of
Laman and Lemuel from the Book of Mormon. When Nephi's bow broke, what did
they do? Did they help him fix it? Did they offer solutions? Nope. All they did
was murmur. Same thing here. When will the GOP stop
imitating Laman and Lemuel and help solve some of our nation's problems?
Those complaining there are no alternatives to the ACA simply reveal they
aren't paying attention. There are dozens of alternative plans and polcy
proposals out there. They also reveal a terrible penchant for
blindly following the "we have to do something!" argument - without
knowing whether that "something" is better or worse than what we already
have.The goal of health care reform should not be to insure
everyone. It should be to ensure that everyone has access to affordable
services. Contrary to politicians' statements, the former prevents the
It should be repealed. And replaced with a single payer health care system.
Which has been proven time and again in nation after nation to provide a better
outcome for a lower per capita cost than our mess of a system.
Iron Rod,Too much MSNBC for you! The repubs HAVE offered solutions, MSNBC
and the DNC just won’t let you know about them. Please stop repeating the
lie that repubs offered no solutions.But when you pull a knife out
of someone’s back, do you replace it with something, or just try to heal
the wound. Doing NOTHING would have been better than Obamacare. FreedomFighter41,See comment above. Question, why are you fighting
against freedom as your name and comments suggest?Steven Warren,See comment for Iron Rod.
The House has repealed it. Over and over and over again. Complete waste of
time.Fine, you want to get rid of it, propose something better. The
status quo is completely unacceptable. I'm not a huge fan of the ACA
either, but a single-payer plan proved politically untenable. So we went with a
conservative, Republican plan, the Mitt Romney plan. And Republicans still
whine about it.
"The alternative plan is the only plan that is Constitutionally legal. That
plan is to do as Mitt Romney did and let the STATE or the PEOPLE handle their
health care needs."So why hasn't Utah done that?
Massachusetts did. Why not Utah? Under the ACA Utah is permitted to
opt out and create its own state operated health care system like Romneycare for
Mass. So why hasn't Utah's legislature gotten off their rears to do
it? Do we lack the proactitvity and accountability to do it? Do we fear funding
it just like how we fear funding education?Repubs have not a single
leg to stand on. Don't like Obamacare? Fine. But offer a
solution. Want a state centered solution? Fine. Then Utah, get off your rear and
create and fund it. Don't want to do anything? Fine. Then stop
Liljenquist's column is a microcosm of the national Republican Party--just
say no but offer no solutions. Today's Tribune cartoon ("Republicans
vow to repeal and replace Obamacare with . . . Eleph-icare") accurately
depicts what the GOP has to offer.
@ Chymist. There are about 40-50 million uninsured Americans (many by choice).
That's more than the entire population of every country in Europe and with
their near zero population growth and very little immigration,can you tell me
how we are going to pay the healthcare bills for 40-50 million people? Single
payer will not help, all that does is eliminate competition and creates a
healthcare monopoly. Can you name one monopoly that has ever reduced costs,
provided incentive for technology advancements or cared about quality?
@MountainmanEvery European country that offers a universal
healthcare plan provides health care coverage for ALL of their citizens at about
half the cost of healthcare in the US. It is not noticeably worse healthcare
coverage, either. There an a GREAT many inefficiencies in the US system, and
most would be remedied by expanding Medicare to cover everyone.
Freedom fighter. The Republicans have proposed several alternative plans; tort
reform, healthcare savings accounts and allowing insurance companies to compete
across state lines. One can argue about the effectiveness of these proposals but
the most important ingredient is CHOICE! Obamacare is forced upon us and no one
has any choices!
The alternative plan is the only plan that is Constitutionally legal. That plan
is to do as Mitt Romney did and let the STATE or the PEOPLE handle their health
care needs. If a State's Constitution allows that State to mandate health
insurance, then that State has been authorized by its citizens to perform that
duty. If a State's Constitution does not allow the State to mandate health
insurance, then that duty falls to the people to furnish their own health
insurance.The United States Constitution DOES NOT authorize Congress
to tax us for health care nor does it allow Congress to mandate health care for
American citizens. The Court ruled only that Obamacare was a tax. Because that
tax had not been implemented, no harm could be proven; therefore, the Court
could not rule on the TAX. The Court did not approve Obamacare. The Duties of the Federal Government are enumerated. Those duties cannot be
added to or subtracted from without an amendment. The 10th Amendment handles all
duties not enumerated and strictly forbids the Federal Government from
appointing itself to perform those duties. They are to be left to the States or
to the People.
Until repubs offer an alternative plan, I'll just consider their
complaining about the ACA as merely sour grapes for a Democrat passing a
Republican health care plan. They must be really angry that Bush
never got around to doing anything about health care despite having 8 years to
do it. The party of no solutions and do-nothing is becoming less and
less relevant with each passing day.
The whole point and purpose of the ACA was to bring about a single payer system.
It may happen sooner than expected...
All the time, man hours and money wasted on this. I can only imagine how many
hospital's and Doctor's we could of built.
Everyone that demands Cadillac quality healthcare for Yugo or Pinto prices is
fooling themselves! You get what you pay for! Obamacare is just another attempt
by the government to short circuit economic realities and get something for
nothing! Like every other price manipulation scam, it will fail! In fact, it
already has failed! There is only one way to get cheaper healthcare; settle for
less quality healthcare and even the great Obama can not change that! Obamacare
offers neither cheap healthcare nor quality healthcare.
"...as in medicine", as a practicing physician I am thoroughly sick of
trying to treat uninsured people. These persons often cannot afford medicines
required for their conditions, and they certainly cannot afford home IV therapy,
not to mention hospital bills. No one plans on becoming sick or injured, but
this happens every day. Most of these uninsured patients have smartphones and
they drive automobiles, so it's easy to ask questions about their
priorities. (Their automobiles must be insured, by law.) The saying
about how your freedom ends where my rights begin applies here. The general
public has the right to avoid paying for medical care of the uninsured. Mr.
Lilenquist and the other ACA naysayers should offer solutions to these problems
rather than just saying "no". For now the concepts of individual
insurance exchanges, employer coverage, and expansion of Medicaid are all we
have. Let's get going.
"Where, as in the case of sickness and accident, neither the desire to avoid
such calamities nor the efforts to overcome their consequences are as a rule
weakened by the provision of assistance – where, in short, we deal with
genuinely insurable risks – the case for the state’s helping to
organize a comprehensive system of social insurance is very strong."-- Hayek
We waited a very long time for Congress to do anything regarding health care,
and then, when Obamacare was finally adopted, it was essentially a Republican
plan. The individual mandate was first proposed by the Heritage Foundation in
1989 and subsequently was offered as part of the Republican response to
President Clinton's health reform plan in 1993. Finally, a version of
Obamacare became the signature accomplishment of Governor Mitt Romney in
Massachusetts. I agree it is a hodgepodge, and we can do better. But if we
repeal it in its entirety and then try to put together a new plan, we will be
waiting forever to get something new in place. I suspect that Mr. Liljenquist
would be one of those, who if in office, would be actively preventing
replacement legislation from being enacted.There are better
alternatives - specifically, a single-payer system. Why not expand Medicare to
cover everyone? It has very low administrative costs compared to private
insurance, and it works well. We could allow individuals to purchase
supplemental insurance from companies of their choice, just as Medicare
participants do. Problem solved.
OK if the Affordable Health Care Act is repealed, what is planned to replace it
with? Or are we happy with the current insurance situation?