Letters: Congress' hypocrisy


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  • Truthseeker SLO, CA
    June 10, 2013 9:13 p.m.


    The issue is tax exempt status, not freedom of speech.
    Organizations aren't required to apply to be a 501(c)(4). They can, in fact, form a 501(c)(4) without IRS pre-approval. But IF the IRS audits them and they have inappropriately invested more than 49% of the funds in politics they can be liable for penalties/back taxes/revocation.

    As for Shulman's visit to the White House:
    1. There is no Bush Administration public-records data about who went to the White House.

    2. The "White House" records actually include the White House visitors' records cover the entire White House complex ie. the Eisenhower Executive Office Building and the New Executive Office Building.

    3. The records report who is cleared for entrance that day, (Shulman 157x's--40 x's for the director of the Office of Health Reform, and 80 x's for the biweekly health reform deputies meetings.

    4. Shulman signed in twice in 2009, five times in 2010, twice in 2011, and twice in 2012.

    5. 40 times to meet with Obama's director of the Office of Health Reform, and a further 80 times for the biweekly health reform deputies meetings.

  • There You Go Again Saint George, UT
    June 10, 2013 7:01 p.m.

    It was actually 751 times...

    I saw it on Drudge.

  • Grover Salt Lake City, UT
    June 10, 2013 6:43 p.m.

    Congress HAS paid into social security since 1984 says snopes that would be 29 years now . Congresspersons do NOT get their salary for life after one term says Politifact. Why are these lies allowed to be printed time after time when there is abundant evidence that their origin in unfathomable and completely unsubstantiated but nonetheless deeply political?

  • the truth Holladay, UT
    June 10, 2013 6:24 p.m.

    They are all silent on The 501(c)4 law because they all know it is unconstitutional.

    (Congess can not make law abridging speech, plain and simple)

    NOT a single organization has been taken to court under this law.


    It is unconstitutional. And they all know it.

    But they left like these laws because it is a method to attack and silence opposing voices.

    A tactic the left requires for them to operate.

  • Open Minded Mormon Everett, 00
    June 10, 2013 5:06 p.m.

    2 bits
    Cottonwood Heights, UT
    If you think this is "hypocrisy" from Congress...
    How about them designing a minimalistic healthcare…
    Members of Congress don't pay any Social Security Tax…
    Members of Congress will draw their full salary for life…
    If Social Security is so great... why don't Congressmen pay into it…
    •4:31 p.m. June 10, 2013

    Um, let's see...

    Cottonwood Heights, Utah – 3rd District.
    So then, Please address your complaints to Rep. Jason Chafftez.

    And Speaking of Hypocrisy…
    I’ll bet my bottom dollar you’ve voted for him – not once, not twice, but mostly 3 times now.

  • Mike Richards South Jordan, Utah
    June 10, 2013 4:52 p.m.


    Please remember that you are addressing a citizen of the United States who has the God given right to express his opinion. You may disagree, but the Deseret New forbids personal attacks.

    Shulman, instead of refuting the claim, told us: "The Easter Egg roll with my kids ... questions about the administratibility of tax policy ... our budget, us helping the Department of Education streamline application processes for financial aid,"

    Obama is very good at changing history. He tried to change the Benghazi history, but he got caught. Shulman. the person who "logged in 157 times" contradicts this "after the fact" change of historical facts. Of all the people on earth, he should know when he "logged in".

  • 2 bits Cottonwood Heights, UT
    June 10, 2013 4:31 p.m.

    If you think this is "hypocrisy" from Congress...

    How about them designing a minimalistic healthcare system for you and me... which they will never have to live under (because they already have better healthcare than you and I, and they pay NADA out of each paycheck for it throughout their working life and NADA during retirement... for LIFE). And they lecture us that we aren't paying enough.

    Members of Congress don't pay any Social Security Tax... but they lecture us about our not paying enough.

    Members of Congress will draw their full salary for life (after serving one term). And when they die... their wife will continue to draw their full salary till they die. Do you and I get that? No.. pensions are too good for common people.

    If Social Security is so great... why don't Congressmen pay into it, and have their benefits always on the chopping block with yours and mine?

    Or here's one... While America is in unimaginable debt, America is suffering a recession, many Americans are unemployed, and they threaten to cut unemployment benefits and give themselves a raise?

  • RedShirt USS Enterprise, UT
    June 10, 2013 12:44 p.m.

    To "Richard Burt" and anybody who believes him, you are wrong. The 501(c)4 organizations cannot be engaged in politics for a specific canidate. They can be involved in politics if they are working to educate people on an issue. According to the IRS they are "An organization embraced within this section is one which is operated primarily for the purpose of bringing about civic betterments and social improvements." Fighting an over-reaching government is a civic betterment.

    You may not like the law, but that is the law.

  • Mike in Cedar City Cedar City, Utah
    June 10, 2013 10:49 a.m.

    KDave, not even the Supreme Court can change the plain meaning of the Statute establishing a 401 (C) 4. Please cite us that decision if you can.

  • Steve C. Warren WEST VALLEY CITY, UT
    June 10, 2013 10:49 a.m.

    Excellent letter, Richard Burt.

    If your recommendation was followed, the electoral process would be more transparent, and we could elect better people.

  • ugottabkidn Sandy, UT
    June 10, 2013 10:18 a.m.

    Mike Richards your disdain has clouded your judgment. When will you actually show proof that even Darrell Issa can't find with all the resources of the United States Government. Issa is quickly becoming the embarrassment that fits him since no Tea Party group was denied 501c status and the only shady groups that have been denied were of the left variety. Yes Karl Rove runs a shady group and all of these groups are tax evaders which by the way puts the screws in Americans rather than doing charitable work. Political groups hiding behind a charitable loophole is the only scandal here and your outrage is disingenuous.

  • Nate Pleasant Grove, UT
    June 10, 2013 10:16 a.m.

    @Roland Keyser "...the records contradict it."

    If White House records are to be believed, Shulman arrived at eleven visits, but only departed from six of them.

  • george of the jungle goshen, UT
    June 10, 2013 8:47 a.m.

    The integrity of a chain is as good as it's weakest link. You can only go as fast as the slowest person. There are some pretty s l o w people that represent us. Mentally and physically.

  • The Real Maverick Orem, UT
    June 10, 2013 8:47 a.m.

    It's amazing how repubs continue to ignore the effects of the Citizens United ruling.

  • Truthseeker SLO, CA
    June 10, 2013 8:43 a.m.

    It was not the IRS which changed the interpretation-- it was the Treasury Dept. The Treasury Dept oversees the IRS and writes the regulations for how the law is to be applied. The Treasury Dept. interpreted "excusively" to mean "primarily." The IRS then is bound to follow the regs issued by the Treasury Dept. Tax accountants and lawyers refer to the 6 volumes of Treasury Regs when applying the tax laws. The Treasury regs on this area of the tax law were written in1959.

    Clearly, post Citizens United, the regs need to be updated.

  • Mike Richards South Jordan, Utah
    June 10, 2013 8:32 a.m.


    A log is kept of every "visitor" to the White House. That log is required by law. The log, not Fox News, is the source of the information of the visits of the head of the I.R.S. to the White House.

    Nixon was taped. He had someone "fiddle" with the tapes leading to the famous 18 minute "gap".

    The logs are there. I'm sure that someone has been told to "fiddle" with those logs, but the horse has already left the barn. Perjury is still a crime in America. Anyone under oath who "fiddled" with those logs will either tell the truth or spend a substantial amount of time thinking about his testimony while he's locked up.

    Obama and his minions cannot silence everybody in government who were told to "fiddle". There are still patriots who put Country ahead of Obama or anyone else who sits in the Oval Office.

  • Grover Salt Lake City, UT
    June 10, 2013 8:25 a.m.

    The point of the letter is that NO political organizations should be given tax exempt status! Left or Right let them be as political as they want, but let them do it on their own dime!

    PS. Mike R: I suppose Fox didn't report on the IRS denial of tax exempt status to "Emerge America" and "Progress Texas" huh?

  • Mountanman Hayden, ID
    June 10, 2013 8:18 a.m.

    No, no people, its not the out of control federal government and the IRS's fault! Let's not hold THEM accountable, lets blame anyone but them! Its actually the conservative organization's fault! If they had not applied for tax exempt status, there would be no targeting, right? Next up for the IRS, the NAACP, Planned Parenthood, move on, Acorn and unions, etc., etc... right?

  • The Real Maverick Orem, UT
    June 10, 2013 8:09 a.m.

    "The director of the I.R.S. had over 150 meetings at the White House while this was going on."

    How are we supposed to believe in anything you say when you post garbage like this?

    Meeting with the White House would be directly against the laws put into place between the IRS and the White House after Nixon's abominations committed using the IRS. Besides, why would the (Republican) Head of the IRS be meeting with the President? So he could attack conservative/Republican groups? That makes absolutely no sense. Have you seen the polarization of DC over the past 5 years? Why would a repub want to help a Democrat?

  • KDave Moab, UT
    June 10, 2013 8:08 a.m.

    It was the Supreme Court that changed the status of 501s to allow political activity.

  • Roland Kayser Cottonwood Heights, UT
    June 10, 2013 7:44 a.m.

    To Mike Richards: "The director of the I.R.S. had over 150 meetings at the White House while this was going on."--totally fabricated--it did not happen. Yes, someone said it on Fox News, but the records contradict it.

  • Mike Richards South Jordan, Utah
    June 10, 2013 6:37 a.m.

    Don't shift the focus from the abuses perpetrated by the I.R.S. Don't pretend that liberal organizations were denied tax exempt status. Don't pretend that Obama's half-brother's organization did not receive tax exempt status and was back-dated two years (totally illegal). Don't pretend that the famous "questions" were directed at liberals.

    The I.R.S. abused its authority.

    The I.R.S. was directed to focus only on conservatives.

    The director of the I.R.S. had over 150 meetings at the White House while this was going on.

    Liberal "tax exempt" organizations were not, I repeat, were not targeted by the I.R.S.

  • Curmudgeon Salt Lake City, UT
    June 10, 2013 5:51 a.m.

    Hypocrisy indeed. These are the same folks who insist, publicly at least, on strict enforcement of the immigration laws while undermining efforts at immigration reform. Always follow the money.

  • Ranch Here, UT
    June 10, 2013 5:50 a.m.

    Do you expect anything better from Utah's Republican politicians?