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Comments about ‘Letters: IRS unpaid furloughs will 'severely impact' taxpayers, employees’

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Published: Saturday, May 18 2013 12:21 a.m. MDT

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Kent Buckner
West Valley City, UT

How sad! Five days without work. Boo-hoo. I can feel the impact on my life already, as I'm sure others throughout the State are. Try being out of work 3 YEARS then tell me how tough being off 5 DAYS is. Go cry somewhere else.

ugottabkidn
Sandy, UT

Austerity saves nothing. It just shifts the costs from one place to another. That's one of the reason we have the greatest prison populations in the world, about the only place we are number 1. Check out the costs to that little tidbit. Think you're saving by being frugal on education and paying minimum wages? Think again.

Ultra Bob
Cottonwood Heights, UT

As a staunch supporter of our national government and the rights, freedoms and the services it provides, I am appalled at the thought the there are 5000 IRS employees needed to handle the IRS services in Utah.

As for hurting businesses, the only way we will get tax reform is by hurting those people who have made such a mess of our tax systems.

Utah Soldier
Bountiful, UT

Be glad it is only 5 days. Other federal employees are facing 11 days of unpaid leave.

Res Novae
Ashburn, VA

@Utah Soldier,

I'm just happy it's down to 11 from 22. It could have been worse. On the other hand, we'll see what the next fiscal year brings.

Spoc
Ogden, UT

Bob, I appreciate your willingness to pay taxes. It is a common misconception that because there is an office in Utah that it's sole function is to serve just Utah.

Although I do not work for the IRS, I believe your individual tax return is not processed here but in Fresno, CA. Ogden is a District office which appears to be a Q&A office for anyone needing help within the Rocky Mountain District of Utah, Idaho, Wyoming, Montana, and Colorado. Ogden also processes business withholding payments and business tax returns for 26 states and all international payments and returns. A significant number of IRS people are seasonal. I do not know if they will be included in the furloughs. I am sure there are other functions I am not aware of but it is sufficient to say that the numbers are not related to Utah's population, just like the dollars spent in Utah by the Feds is more than the taxes taken in because of the national defense and land management issues.

I can tell you that the total number of employees is down IRS wide by about 30 percent because of electronic filing of returns.

Wastintime
Los Angeles, CA

Re:UltraBob

The IRS office in UT is a REGIONAL U.S. office meaning it processes returns from several states.

We're it not for our IRS workers, we wouldn't have the many benefits we enjoy as U.S. citizens.

Mark l
SALT LAKE CITY, UT

Oh brother! Another public worker complaining about a furlough day. A day off without pay. Not a pay cut. It's the only thing the union would allow. There is no real pay cuts here, like in the private sector, where businesses must be productive and provide a profit.

Mountanman
Hayden, ID

@ Wasting time. About 47% of Americans benefit from the IRS, the rest of us do not benefit at all. In fact, the IRS has bankrupted more Americans than medical bills. Now Obamacare will be enforced by the IRS! Imagine that, the IRS in charge of our healthcare!

Ultra Bob
Cottonwood Heights, UT

Spoc & Wastintime, I feel much better now.
The proposal for a flat tax on every sort of income without exception and without deduction in the best way to make support for the government fair and honest. And easy to collect.
Every penny of outgoing money from a business is income to somebody. If the business was required to pay an amount equal to the flat rate on every outgoing payment, then everyone is paying, the owner, the supplier, the employee, and even the foreign worker and owner no matter where they are.
No more individual tax returns.
No more tax year. The tax is paid to the government at the same time as paid to the receiver.
No more taxes on business income retained. Only the outgoing money is taxed.

wrz
Pheonix, AZ

Ultra Bob:
"...I am appalled at the thought the there are 5000 IRS employees needed to handle the IRS services in Utah.

You need to tell that to your Senator and Congressman. They are the people that make/pass the tax laws. Of course, the IRS has to develop the forms and procedures to implement the laws. That also adds layers of complication.

Take IRA's for example. It started off fairly simple... Put away some money in a retirement account and pay taxes on it later. Then along came Mr. Roth who complicated the process with his ROTH IRA. But that wasn't enough complication to satisfy Congress so, in addition to the traditional and ROTH IRA they made the SEP and the Simple IRA with provisions to roll over, convert and borrow. Now it's so complicated even trained IRS employees have difficulty with it.

cpafred
SALT LAKE CITY, UT

@Ultra Bob

"If the business was required to pay an amount equal to the flat rate on every outgoing payment, then everyone is paying, the owner, the supplier, the employee, and even the foreign worker and owner no matter where they are."

This is a horrible idea. What if I am a wealthy commodity trader (with no employees) making millions each year trading tens of billions of dollars in options and futures... how is my income taxed?

What if I am an individual inventor who sells my invention to a Cayman company who does no business in the USA. How is the millions I earn from selling my invention taxed? Hint, the US gov't can't compel a Cayman company to collect and remit tax to the USA. Without the filing of some form by me, how will the US gov't even know about the transaction?

When there is an amount paid to the US government, how will they know the amount paid is correct (or what it is even for) without filing some sort of declaration (under penalty of perjury)? How often must these payments to the government be paid and forms filed (daily, monthly)?

cpafred
SALT LAKE CITY, UT

@Mountanman
"About 47% of Americans benefit from the IRS, the rest of us do not benefit at all."

I assume you have a federal highway or two in Idaho? If so, and you drive on them, then the IRS has benefited you.

What about the military, safe food, safe water...I could go on and on...

Without the IRS, our country would have no revenue (because few would pay their full liability) and none of the above would exist.

Ultra Bob
Cottonwood Heights, UT

Cpafred.
I am not an accountant, tax expert or genius. My hope is that someone more intelligent than me might be able to see the merit of my idea and prove it out.

Trading in commodities is the same as any other business, having employees is irrelevant. Buying and selling options, futures, investments, stocks, bonds etc. is no different than buying and selling toothpaste. The transactions are defined in money. Fairness can only be obtained if income of every sort is income.

When you sell something and receive money there is no tax to be collected. Doesn’t matter if the buyer is domestic or foreign. If your item becomes a commodity in foreign markets there is no tax. But if the item becomes a commodity in American markets the business operation in the USA would be required to pay the tax.

Lots of questions unanswered, but the savings of time, money, government employees plus enabling us to keep our capitalistic economic system make it worth while to check out.

cpafred
SALT LAKE CITY, UT

@Ultra Bob

"I am not an accountant, tax expert or genius. My hope is that someone more intelligent than me might be able to see the merit of my idea and prove it out."

I am two of those three things and I can say hundreds of tax policy papers are written each year and discussed along with hundreds (if not thousands of ideas) each year in many forums and publications. Ideas are floated, evaluated and discussed by the Administration, Treasury, the ABA,the AICPA, TEI, academia, many tax publications, etc. These ideas that you frequently throw out have been discussed and abandoned because they have major flaws. As I pointed out, some of the richest people in our country would go totally untaxed under your latest proposal (and it could be planned around all day long).

You seem to have a real interest in tax policy, so I invite you to perhaps take a tax course or two online (to get up to speed) and subscribe to some tax policy publications such as you can find on the websites of the AICPA.

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