Salsero--who receives the data from "universal background checks"? You
seem to place your trust with them.
@SalseroHow do we know you are not the founder of a white supremacy hate
group?Your attempt at passive/aggressively taint anyone who
disagrees with you as a "supremacist" (or mentally ill, etc) is quite
I want our Utah Congressional Delegation to know, that my neighbors and I, are
going to work hard to get them defeated in the next election. As a life-long
Republican, I am fed up with their weak, nonsensical, positions on guns and
their collective fear of the NRA.
The loss to Obamaites was not to the NRA it was to the people of the United
States who love their freedom. The legal jargon proposed by Obama and his crowd
does nothing toward slowing down the use of guns by violent people and the
Congress knows it.
The writer failed to mention that only 4% of Americans consider gun control a
pressing issue, according to a recent Gallup poll. My group of friends and I
have very little faith in President Obama's ability to solve any problem,
and especially the crime problem. We've seen him try to solve other
problems by implementing previously failed "solutions" that only liberal
ideologues support. Look at how he "solved" the problem of high health
care costs. He pushed for mandatory health insurance that covers so many things
that now the average family will spend up to 80 percent MORE on health care.
Obama is so focused on fundamentally changing our nation that he can't see
the forest for the trees. He wants to transform America from a nation founded
on principles of individual freedom, individual rights and limited government to
a socialistic country that places governmental power over the individual. He
sees increased federal control as a solution to almost any imaginable problem.
Reduce crime by focusing on guns? Give me a break. How about keeping armed
robbers and attempted murderers in jail for life? How about locking up mentally
ill sociopaths and Islamofascists who preach the killing of infidels?
Anyone opposed to reasonable gun control measures is just fooling himself if he
does it in the name of protecting the 2nd. Automatic weapons are illegal to
possess, whereas semi-automatic weapons are allowed. Why isn't anyone
shouting about an assault on freedom because automatic weapons are banned?
Proposed bans on large-capacity magazines and some types of semi-automatic
weapons is just a small thing compared to the restrictions we already accept
@ Mad Hatter"We're talking about background checks in the
Machin-Toomey legislation. Nothing about restricting someone's right to buy
a gun. Nothing about establishing a gun registry. And nothing about requiring
background checks for selling/giving guns to family members or close friends the
seller knows."Read the bill, and understand the implementation
process and the present laws and you will see that your understanding of the
Manchin-Toomey bill is just wrong, although it accurately states what the media
has (deliberately?) mislead you to believe the bill would do.The
checks themselves were relatively innocuous, but the machinery to perform them
created a de facto registry of guns and gun owners. The prohibitions on
maintaining such a registry were flimsy at best and could be easily ignored.
Especially by Obama and Eric Holder's disregard for existing laws.Background checks will not disarm criminals or crazies who get mot (80%) of
their guns by theft, other illegal sources, or having straw purchasers who can
pass a check buy them.Gun control is not about reducing crime, but
disarming law abiding citizens.It's not the guns, it's the
criminals and crazies!
This wasn't a loss against the NRA. It was a loss against the legislative
branch, which is, in effect, the arm of the American people. You give too much
credit to the NRA, powerful as they may be.
Background checks hurt no one - unless you are already a convicted felon, drug
user, or mentally ill. Why block this reasonable step to prevent some gun
violence? I won't stop all gun violence, but it is step in the right
direction. The paranoid statements in these comments should be a concern. Just
think through this past week. Two guys with several bombs killed three people-
including an 8 year old boy. The lone Sandy Hook School shooter killed 20
children under 6 years old and four teachers. Any bomb is against the law, but
a nutcake can buy an assault rifle on line without a background check. Why
would you be afraid of blocking a nut from getting an assault rifle?
The reason the NRA is so powerful is because a lot of voting U.S. citizens back
it. I am tired if them acting like the NRA is some powerful entity going outside
the interests of the public. They are part of the public.
"gun control advocates are scrambling to regroup after losing soundly to the
(NRA)"I did not know the NRA voted in the senate.just shows the mentality of the BO misadministration, they don't get
their way and they have to find a boogeyman to blame it on.Mad
HAtter,more background checks will not stop criminals, they just lead to
registries of honest gun owners that will lead to confiscation.And
if you think the NRA celebrates mass killings, you would not meet the sanity
requirements to purchase a gun. Lay off the MSNBC and DNC propgranda.Old Man,nothing to add but hate-speech? typical of the
Worf Great point. Mass. was at a standstill and I would bet most folks in that
area were praying for a gun. The anti second amendment, anti gun, anti freedom,
anti libery folks have another Boogey Man (to go along with oh no the dreaded
assualt rifles) the insidious NRA. The NRA is citizens who treasure their second
amendment rights. I guess if that makes me a Boogey Man I am proud to be one.
A single death is a tragedy; a million deaths is a statistic. 20 Children die
in Newtown and it's a tragedy, and 435 gun deaths in Chicago is a
statistic. Chicago has some on the nation's most restrictive gun laws and
it has had a small effect on deaths. In 2010 ~80,000 people were unable to
purchase gun because they failed a background check, which is a felony because
they lied on the application; however, only 44 were prosecuted.The
current law is preventing people from buying guns; however, we're not
inforcing the laws on the books. Let's inforce the laws on the books first
and address the other issues, anti-depression drugs and violent video games; a
common element between Newtown and Colorado.
@SalseroThis is America not Iraq--You can belong to any group you
want--even hateful ones.This is America not Afghanistan--Mental capability
isn't required for many things--Look at Congress :)This is America
not Russia--You are assumed to be alright until you PROVE you are not.This
is America not Pakistan--We don't need to know EVERYTHING about our
neighbors just because they own guns.This is America not Iran-- Our lives
are NOT open books to you, the government, or anybody else.This is America
not North Korea--You don't HAVE to believe ANYBODY, and personally I
wouldn't.If a person IS CRAZY, he will find a way to hurt
you.In the meantime we are AMERICANS, and have the right to our privacy
and the right to protect ourselves from the same crazies you fear.
I don't get it. I respect the 2nd Amendment and I am an avid firearm owner,
I shoot targets and occasionally hunt once in a blue moon, and have them for
protection for family. What I don't get is the headline for this article
"Gun control forces seek new path after big loss against NRA". I
didn't realize this Gun control stuff is against the NRA I just assumed
that it was against the 2nd Amendment. The NRA is just a lobby group, albeit a
powerful one. But why blame them for what is going on, they don't get money
for guns being sold, they don't sell guns, they don't manufacture
them, they are just a lobby. I guess the NRA are to blame when a person that has
a mental illness kills someone, or when a Gang banger shoots up a park full of
kids. It's like let's blame pressure cookers for bombings now.Oh by the way, I am not a member of the NRA was once long ago never will
be again, for personal reasons. I do appreciate that they stick up for the 2nd
I am a supporter of the US Constitution. I am not a member of the NRA. I write
my Congressional Delegation when I deem it important. Upholding the
Constitution is always important. It is not just the NRA that made a lot of
noise on this last go around on 2nd Amendment rights, there were a lot like me
contacted their Senators.Why is the 2nd Amendment important?
"Commentaries on the Constitution" written by Joseph Story, makes this
points better than I can. He writes:"The right of the citizens
to keep, and bear arms has justly been considered as the palladium of the
liberties of a republic; since it offers a strong moral check against the
usurpation and arbitrary power of rulers; and will generally, even if these are
successful in the first instance, enable the people to resist, and triumph over
them. There is certainly no small danger, that indifference many
lead to disgust, and disgust to contempt; and thus gradually undermine all the
protection intended by this clause of our national bill of rights."
A week ago Harry Reid accidentally referred to this as taking guns away from
people, and background checks are already happening.Do some
homework. How many times have our political leaders told untruths, and when
will you start looking beyond their words?If politicians were true
to they're political campaign speeches, -we would not have the problems we
@Hutterite"A way must be found to protect us, and our
legislative process, from the NRA." This is the reason nothing
gets done. You are looking for a scapegoat and in this case, the scapegoat
happens to have MILLIONS of members who disagree with your stance. The left is
responsible for nothing getting done on this because they CANNOT resist the urge
to control things. The NRA is, by and large, a group of honest, hardworking
American people who are some of the most responsible citizens. Not some demonic
specter that haunts America. And yet, the left keeps pushing an agenda instead
of an honest solution.
@DN Subscriber 2 SLC, UT@Longfellow Holladay, UT@MoJules Florissant, MO@cjb Bountiful, UT@worf
Mcallen, TX@Chase Saint George, UT@Flashback Kearns,
UT@HS Fan Salt Lake City, UT@red state pride
Cottonwood Heights, UT@Fitness Freak Salt Lake City, UTI have no idea how well you can handle a gun under pressure. I don't
know anything about your shooting skill and your training in handling a gun. I
know nothing about your mental stability. I don't know if you belong to a
white supremacy hate group. I don't know if you are an anti-govenment gun
nut waiting for the "revolution". I don't know if you belong to a
domestic terrorist organization.I know nothing about you. I'm
not sure I could trust you in this. You talk about everything except the issue
of universal background checks. Maybe you'd fail a background check. I
don't know. So, why should I believe you?
mad hatter-"The NRA loves mass killings. It sells more guns. That is their
business: selling more guns. They are no longer focused on gun safety. Their
business if enhanced through fear." Did you think about this before
you typed it? You believe that? I'm an NRA member and I've never seen
the NRA celebrate a mass killing. I have however seen the NRA celebrate the
countless incidents where a law abiding citizen uses a gun to prevent a robbery,
rape, home invasion and possibly murder- unlike the MSM which hardly ever
reports those news events because they don't fit the narrative. The
NRA is focused on preserving the individual's constitutional right to bear
arms- not selling guns. Law abiding Americans often buy guns when they feel
their right to bear arms is under attack - which is why your man Barack Obama
has been gun salesman of the year for the past 5 years. He's caused more
guns to be sold than any salesman for Ruger, Smith and Wesson, Sig Sauer,
H&K ever has combined.
Hey People, We're talking about background checks in the
Machin-Toomey legislation. Nothing about restricting someone's right to
buy a gun. Nothing about establishing a gun registry. And nothing about
requiring background checks for selling/giving guns to family members or close
friends the seller knows. Just background checks which the NRA supported as
recently as 1999.Now, give your argument based on the topic of
background checks only. Why are you opposed to having universal background
checks? And if you are opposed to universal background checks as a matter of
principle, then it must follow that you are opposed to background checks
required of purchasers at gun shops.Don't confuse the issue by
references to the Constitution. That doesn't work. You are either in
favor of people we don't want to have guns to get them however they can buy
them or you want to have a system that stops them from going to legitimate
dealers, gun trafficers, and straw purchasers.The NRA loves mass
killings. It sells more guns. That is their business: selling more guns. They
are no longer focused on gun safety. Their business if enhanced through fear.
A few questions for all those allegedly well intentioned people so hot for more
gun control: Why is the President so concerned about "doing something"
after white children were killed in Newtown, CT but doesn't want to do
anything about the black babies who were killed by Kermit Gosnell in Pa?
Why hasn't Major Hassan been punished yet for his attack (with a
handgun)that killed 13 US Soldiers at Fort Hood over two years ago? Why
do you keep talking about a "gun show loophole" when there is no such
thing as a gun show loophole? How would the new laws you proposed have
helped to prevent the attacks at Newtown and Aurora?
In an area of more then a million,--people were terrified of one man. So much
that 10,000 policemen were called in to capture him.Still!
Politicians are thinking of restricting guns of innocent citizens. Wow! But
weapons were given to Egypt, and Mexican cartels. I don't
understand it. Are we to be defenseless, and dependent on government for
protection? The ones who put us seventeen trillion dollars in debt?
Gallup: 4% care about gun control. Yet Politicians push it. It's an agenda.
I imagine it will be shoved down our throat like the highly
successful Obamacare. Politicians' leashes have become much too
long. Anyone pay attention to STOCK act being repealed...?Didn't think so....It's a purely corrupt institution -
on both sides of the isle. All of you folks propagating and
puppeting and parroting the politicians' agenda are not standing with the
constitution. You either stand with the constitution, or burn it. Choose
ye this day whom ye will serve. Many of you already have.
The associated press USED to be a good unbiased source.With this
article (among others)they've lost their credibility.I wonder -
do they accept funds from the democratic national committee to keep afloat?The Senate gun control bill was doomed from the start. Harry Reid was
even reluctant to waste time on it. The "boss" insisted on wasting time
on it, so they did.The bill wasn't defeated because of the NRA,
it was defeated because the Senate still puts some value on the 2nd amendment.
To quote John Belushi "Was it over when the Germans bombed Pearl
Harbor"? Gun Control advocates are providing the NRA with some good
chuckles, but that's about it.
Hutterite, I guess if we need to be protected from the NRA so badly, then we
need to be protected from Labor Unions, Trial Lawyers, the AMA, Dentists, MLM
companies, GE, Lockheed, Detroit, GM, Ford, George Soros, the Kohn brothers,
Warren Buffett, the State of California, Planned Parenthood, the SDS, the Black
Panthers, the FOP, and anyone else that lobbies the Congress. Labor Unions and
the Trial Lawyers are responsible for far more legislation that damages our
freedoms than the NRA ever hoped to do.There is this little thing
called the First Amendment which allows all of these entities to lobby congress.
The NRA has as much right to throw their weight around as Labor Unions do. YOu
ban the NRA you have no choice but to ban your precious progressive/liberal
outfits also.By the way, the Constitution and your freedoms
guaranteed therein won out in this mess. The NRA was just the catalyst. I
guess you don't like your Constitutional freedoms, eh? The right to bear
arms protects all the others.
Let me share with the gun opponents why gun laws are being vigorously
opposed.Pro gun people believe the goal is to get rid of guns.
Either by banning them we're by making them so difficult to legally keep
the people give them up. It's a case of if you keep giving them an inch in
an inch and an inch, the other side will eventually get their mile.Pro gun people do not believe that the primary purpose of the opposing sides
gun laws r to keep people safe. if so why would they even have invented gun free
zones. isn't it obvious criminals would ignore them, and these only serve
to harass legitament gun owners.If the goal was to keep people safe
why is there opposition to training and arming teachers?This latest
proposal for universal background check would have required people to keep
records of gun sales for the rest of their life under penalty of law, what would
have happened had the Wreckers been lost? a big fine? the right to have a gun in
How about car control, alcohol control, knife control, bat control and lastly
pressure cooker control?
How can you tell when a writer has an agenda on gun control?When
they use a dishonest and misleading term like: "After Congress approved the
10-year ban on 19 types of military-style assault weapons..."The
banned weapons were semi-automatic rifles, a technology that is almost 100 years
old. The term "military-style assault weapon" is phrased to conjure up
an image of a fully automatic military assault rifle. Anyone who uses the term
"military-style assault weapon" to describe a semi-automatic rifle that
is only cosmetically different from a modern semi-automatic hunting rifle is
First, remember that this is advocacy propaganda from the Associated Press, not
impartial reporting of facts by real journalists.They lead off the
article celebrating passage of the 1995 "Assault Weapons Ban" but fail
to note that scientific studies confirmed it was a total failure and made no
difference in criminals killing people. It was "feel good" legislation
at best, or a thinly disguised attempt to curtail private gun ownership one type
of gun at a time."Gun control" is not about making the
country safe for law abiding citizens, it is the cynical goal of statists to
remove any potential impediment to government tyranny (as feared by the
Founders- leading the the Second Amendment), or a misguided attempt to prevent
legal self defense, ironically making it safer for criminals.The
Cruz-Grassley substitute provided workable options for common sense "gun
safety" measures, but the leftists shot it down.Freedom loving
Americans will continue to oppose all forms of "gun control" that are
ineffective, and infringe on our rights.
A way must be found to protect us, and our legislative process, from the NRA.
Because, although they are particularly good at it, the NRA isn't the only
dog in this hunt. Pharmaceutical companies, oil companies, and any number of
other outfits are out there, each and every one of them seeking to have their
agenda moved forward, almost always to the detriment somehow of the citizens of
the nation. The outcome of the political process should be the will of the
people and the rule of law (which this bill did not contravene) and not the NRA
agenda. We all lost today.