Comments about ‘Calif. bill aimed at Scouts' gay ban passes hurdle’

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Published: Wednesday, April 10 2013 12:00 a.m. MDT

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G L W8

JimmyJackJohnJones: if you don't know that scouting is a religious organization, you need to check out why Lord Baden Powell founded it in the first place, and why "Duty to God" is the first point of the Scout Oath. It's not just Utahns that know this; many of the chartered organizations are religions outside the LDS Church that sponsor scout troops. Scouting from the beginning has been designed to be a support to organizations with similar ideals as the scout oath and law, which are ethical if not religious in nature.


Mr. Bohey's comment previously couldn't be farther from the truth on this matter. This type of law sets a precedent that the government can be preferential towards any non-profit based on its definition of morality. When this is applied to any church that discriminates towards gays in any way you've suddenly created a situation in which the the first amendment is violated. You can't treat one religion different than another based on their morality.

Salt Lake City, UT

As some others have pointed out, the liberalism is completely non-liberal when it comes to any ideals that clash with its own. In this case, the ideal of freedom of assembly and association as explicitly outlined in the 1st Amendment.

Folks, the warfare over freedom has never and will never be over. There always have been and always will be forces attempting to abridge or abolish each and every freedom that has been fought for and, so far, maintained in our country. But, are no guarantees. If you want them, you've got to fight for them. Just like it's always been.

Charlottesville, VA

Bad idea. If the BSA admits gays, they will do so because they feel like they have made the decision on their own. Trying to strongarm them into doing what the California legislature wants will more likely backfire. Nobody likes to be coerced.

Twin Lights
Louisville, KY

A Scientist,

Wouldn't that mean every religious organization would be unable to qualify as tax exempt?

Could organizations providing support services to (only) the disabled qualify?

What about low income housing limited to elderly residents?

Many charitable organizations would not qualify under your criteria.

Fred Vader
Oklahoma City, OK

As I have said, If you are a "gay marriage supporter" and you are not against this act of the Cali legislature, then you can no longer use the excuse that "gay marriage" won't be forced on churches. This is exactly why the churches are fighting it.

The "gay marriage" movement is not about "equal" marriage rights, it's about forcing everyone in America to accept their lifestyle, and then to punish those who, like churches, teach that their behavior is sin. Freedom of Religion is a clearly spelled outright in the Constitution.. "Gay marriage" is not.

This so called "tax" legislation is exactly why churches campaigned for Prop 8, and the anti-prop 8 folks called their campaigns "lies".

Who was it that actually wasn't telling the truth, hmmmm?

Farr West, Utah

One more attempt to limit the freedom of those who hold traditional values, while protecting the extremists. The atheists and amoralists are making it harder to follow the religious and moral principles upon which our nation was founded.

Phillip M Hotchkiss
Malta, Mt

@ Jjjj have you ever read to boy scouts oath ?If so how can you say it's not a religious group . Unless it has changed since I was a kid. Don't it say something about duty to God an country. What part of God is not religious? Taxing the boy scouts for standing u p to their beliefs. Is just the beginning. We will all need to stand up to our faith.Stand for something or sit through it all. The chooses we make dictates the lives that we live.

HS Fan
Salt Lake City, UT

BSA continues to lose thousands of members with declines year over year. THAT'S A FACT. Leave them alone, let them be, they're rotting well enough on there own.

Durham, NC

There is a doctrine that laws can not be written to isolate or impact a singular class of people. This same measure to pass constitutionality would need to apply to all like organizations - such as churches as well. All private organizations would not be allowed to limit or discriminate in their membership. Women could sue religions for not ordaining women priest using this a precedent.

While I do believe things like gay marriage will ultimately be granted by the Supreme Court.... there is a lot of precedent that the supreme court holds very carefully the right of religions to operate without interference from the government. While gay marriage may become the law of the land - the courts will not force religions to perform gay marriages.

This will likely be the same precedent here. Boy Scouts is a private religious organization. No group should be discriminated for their beliefs. Jehovah's witnesses have been granted great latitude by the courts. Like wise, scouts should be given the same latitude to follow beliefs.

Cottonwood Heights, UT

Another of many reasons why I choose to live outside of California and why I refuse to even visit it.

Saint George, UT

Scientist: The U.S.S.R. was dissolved years ago. I'm sorry your aspirations for such are somewhat limited here. However, look at it this way. You are allowed to express your opinion here.

Salt Lake City, UT

Californians should still be able to donate to their churches and have them support the BSA. Most United Way branches still support the BSA so Californians can donate to them specifying that their donation support the BSA. United Way donations will be deductable on their state taxes.

Henry Drummond
San Jose, CA

I wouldn't worry about this becoming law folks. The California Legislature is remarkably similar to the Utah Legislature in that they often waste time and money on unconstitutional message bills that have no chance of getting past the most idiotic of federal judges. I think if the politicians on both sides of this issue just back off, the BSA, parents, and the boys themselves will make decisions that will be more inclusive and make more sense than anything pandering politicians come up with.

Jonathan Eddy
Payson, UT

This legislation will pass because it is California and voters there are too ignorant to recognize bad, immoral and unconstitutional law.

The good news is that lawlessness is reaching a crescendo and lines in the sand are being drawn.

The real question is, will the forces of reason and common sense be strong enough to overpower the forces of ridiculousness, ushering in an era of sanity?

The Rock
Federal Way, WA

Strange. It is illegal to discriminate on the basis of religion and sexual orientation. So when a religion follows centuries old tenants that run counter to what the Gay community desires they retaliate by discriminating against the religion.

An illegal act.

As Frederick Bastiat, author of "The Law" stated in the opening paragraph:

"The law perverted! And the police powers of the state per-
verted along with it! The law, I say, not only turned from its
proper purpose but made to follow an entirely contrary purpose!
The law become the weapon of every kind of greed! Instead of
checking crime, the law itself guilty of the evils it is supposed to


My guess is this won't go anywhere since the application can be broadly applied, and i don't know why they wouldn't just wait to see what the BSA decides.

There is no shortage of stupid ideas in state legislatures across the country. Like a bill proposed in TN which would cut aid to families based on their children's grades. Or UT, passing an open carry firearm law.

That said,
Nobody should have to lie or cover-up their identity. Love one another, love our neighbors as ourselves.

Park City, Ut

I think the boy scouts has more to worry about than this. For example, my son just informed my wife that he wishes to no longer attend any boy scout functions or associate with them because "they discriminate against gays and those who choose not to believe in God" - he didn't hear that from us. I think the first one will be an issue sooner than later, most young adults and those in the coming generations will have a hard time with any organization that discriminates in this way. For example, recent polls show that 81% of young adults ages 18–29 years old support the rights of gay couples to marry. The age groups of those who are against gay marriage have the highest mortality rate in the country if that tells you anything. My point is that if the boy scouts wants to retain and attract new members, they had better be willing to "evolve" to some point on this issue, that or face extinction.

Arizona Rocks
Phoenix, AZ

Boy Scouts of America should be allowed to stay the course and remain steadfast to the principals in which this organization was founded. For a state to put restrictions on them and try to force the BSA by removing their non profit tax status is extortion.

Alexandria, VA

Fortunately the 1950s are over and organizations - which declare themselves to be private – (although the Boy Scouts hardly seem like a private organization), will face more and more scrutiny in the public place (as they should). If the LDS Church lets gay people in and allows them to hold callings (with specific conditions) is the Boy Scouts any different - as someone before me once said "what would Lord Baden-Powell think?"
I doubt the movement’s founder would have much sympathy for any non-inclusive policies.

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