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Comments about ‘BYU and the Big 12: Some people just don't like BYU’

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Published: Thursday, Feb. 21 2013 4:00 p.m. MST

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Warmslope
Chicago, IL

@atl134

"I wanted BYU to be taken instead of Colorado (though opening the Denver market and the PAC-12 insistance on tier 1 research universities made that unrealistic)."

Thanks for your comment. I also was of this same sentiment, for the Pac to take BYU and Utah although the business case for Colorado is understandable even for me. I liked the idea of geographical symmetry in the conference, i.e. 2 Washington teams, 2 N. Cal, 2 S. Cal, etc. As well as the idea of a truer western states conference. Look at what the Big-10 is becoming, really a shame. That's why I'm glad the Okla and Tex schools didn't break off and go to the Pac. The growth in size of conferences will come to be seen somewhat negatively I suspect. The last 2 Pac conf championship games were a joke. UCLA didn't have a resume deserving of playing against the north champ either time, certainly not in '11, and not either in '12. It devalues the regular season which is too bad.

vinnyb3
Provo, UT

It's funny to me that many Ute fans cite their reason for disdain towards BYU as being: "They think they're better than us". But then they will turn around and rub in BYU's face that Utah is in the "better conference". Then there is the attitude that Mormons at BYU are the self-righteous ones and the true Mormons are the never-self-righteous Utah fans.

It happens on both sides. Let's get over it and quit making it personal.

MyPerspective
Salt Lake City, UT

I've read the article in this series and I've read the comments. My conclusion: byu is always the victim and they play the card well. Why does byu's station in life have to be the fault of someone else? I suppose it's human nature to blame someone else when we don't get what we want. Personally, I find it sad that the term "bigot" is used in such a casual manner.

I have to ask myself if these articles and corresponding comment threads would even exist if Utah was not in the Pac-12. We'll never know. The State of Utah has a school included in an elite conference and partnered with some of the best schools in the nation if not the world. What a great blessing for the state of Utah of which byu is a part. Why can't everyone be happy for the UofU and know their accomplishments benefit us all.

Uteology
East Salt Lake City, Utah

"Clearly, BYU isn’t a little, religious school that will meekly do whatever it’s told. That’s TCU’s job."

Wow!! What weak smack. And then he goes on to call out "bigotry" as the reason BYU is hated. PRICELESS!!

MUSSing with U
Baltimore, MD

MyPerspective

LOL at your delusional spin.

The kids on the hill suffer from such an insecurity complex that they're not willing to see reality.

ppbrittain
Hillsboro, MO

The author certainly is arrogant in some of his assumptions. Dog TCU all you want but remember their victory over Wisconsin in the Rose Bowl and their traditional rivalries against former SWC teams like Baylor (another religious institution that I suppose the author reckons the rest of the XII orders around), Tech and UT.

talkinsports
Gilbert, AZ

Your perspective is flawed, but thanks for playing.

NightOwlAmerica
SALEM, OR

Whether BYU ends up somewhere or not, I don't like where D1 college football is going aside from a new playoff system.
One day we will see corporate sponsors of conferences. Watch, it will happen. In other words another layer of decision making by power brokers. And when that happens I will take more interest in FCS or other small division football.

hubbardesquire
Alabaster, Alabama

Skip past the Big 12, grab the Air Force Academy, and come on over to the SEC! We will be happy to pull up a couple of extra chairs!

Ronald Uharriet
SWun City, Ca.

Thanks for the honesty.

Naval Vet
Philadelphia, PA

Snack WAC:

"Go back and review the teams U beat in most of those 'undefeated' seasons - it's laughable that you'd be beating your chest about any of them except 2008."

And YOU can go back and review the teams the Y beat in their ONLY undefeated season, and see just how laughable THAT was as well. Only 3 teams in the entire country played a weaker SOS than you.

P.S.: The 2004 Utes thoroughly DOMINATED every one of our opponents, and actually beat a ranked team. In fact, we blew them out.

Truth Machine
Salt Lake City, UT

Naval Vet

Laugh all you want about BYU's 1984 schedule, but the best teams BYU played in 1984 were better than the best teams Utah played in 2004.

If you really want to know how BYU won the NC with their 1984 schedule, all you need to do is look back a year to see that 1984 was merely a continuation from what BYU started the 2nd game of 1983, a 24-game winning streak that included road wins against two Top 15 teams (UCLA and Air Force), and back-to-back Top 7 finishes.

If the Utes had actually done something of note in 2003 or 2007, they might have received some serious consideration for a national championship in 2004 or 2008.

Pittsburgh 2004 was BARELY ranked in ONE poll, after spending almost the entire season UNRANKED. Beating the Big Least QUAD-champion simply wasn't very impressive.

Fans, coaches and sportswriters were much more impressed with BYU's defeat of a traditional power like Michigan, who was ranked in the Top 10 and who were themselves considered national championship contenders earlier in the season, until injuries sidetracked the Wolverines. Despite their records, Michigan 1984 was much better than Pittsburgh 2004.

Naval Vet
Philadelphia, PA

Frantic&Emotional Spin Machine:

"...the best teams BYU played in 1984 were better than the best teams Utah played in 2004."

The best teams the cougars played in '84 were unranked WAC teams -- 8-4 Air Force and 7-4 Hawai'i.

the best teams your big brother played in '04 was Big East Champion/25th-ranked 8-4 Pittsburgh, and the 7-5 Big 12/Cotton Bowl Aggies of Texas A&M.

So you're going to attempt some frantic and emotional claim that an unranked 8-4 WAC also-ran (Air Force) > a 25th-ranked 8-4 Big East Champion (Pittsburgh)? Or a 7-5 WAC also-ran (AFA) > the Big 12's #3 team (A&M)? Fail.

"Fans, coaches and sportswriters were much more impressed with BYU's defeat of a traditional power like Michigan."

NOBODY was impressed that you need a late 4th Qtr rally in order to beat a 6-6 Michigan team down to playing their 4th-string QB.

'04 Pitt > '84 Mich

truecoug1
Provo, UT

@NavalVet "NOBODY was impressed that you need a late 4th Qtr rally in order to beat a 6-6 Michigan team down to playing their 4th-string QB."

Yes, of course, which is why NOBODY ranked BYU #1 to finish the season and why NOBODY thinks they won the National Championship in '84...oh wait, that actually happened.

I guess the only people who weren't impressed by that were U, Chris B., and Bryant Gumbel...wait, you're right. That is NOBODY.

By the way, I like how U say Utah is BYU's big brother. Yet 5 of the most commented articles are about BYU and 2 are about Utah. I would say that that's a pretty good ratio for the interest that people have regarding each of those schools.

And since U and Chris B. probably have close to a quarter of those total comments, I would say that your interest in your "little brother" is strangely greater than your interest in BYU's "big brother".

Life is just full of irony.

Go Cougars!

phoenix
Gilbert, AZ

Naval Vet

Instead of arrogantly looking only at labels, you should try digging a little deeper and comparing actual teams.

It's laughable that you dismiss Air Force, because they were ONLY in the WAC, but then completely ignore the fact that Michigan was from the mighty BIG TEN. And the you pretend that Pittsburgh, which finished in a FOUR WAY TIE for first in the BIG LEAST, was something special.

Air Force(8-4) beat Notre Dame(7-5) 21-7 in South Bend and POUNDED Va Tech(8-4) 23-7 in the Independence Bowl.

And lets not forget, in 1984, the rankings only included the Top 20. It's very possible that Air Force would have been ranked if the rankings had included the Top 25.

Beating Hawaii(7-4) in Hawaii was always very tough. During Hawaii's WAC years, the Utes were only 7-10 versus Hawaii, 2-6 in Honolulu.

Who did Pittsburgh beat in 2004, Notre Dame(6-6), a team that lost to the BYU(5-6) team that finally got Gary Crowton fired?

Bottom line:

The exact same AP/Coaches voting organizations who voted BYU #1/#1 in 1984, voted Utah #4/#5.

BigDog32
Tooele, UT

Only 2 things keep BYU out of the Big 12.

#1--TV Revenue. The Big 12 would expect BYU to share TV revenue.

#2--Location. Why would Big 12 Schools in Texas, Oklahoma, Kansas, and Iowa want to travel to Utah to play? That would be as crazy as Boise State and San Diego joining the Big East. Only a dying conference and desperate team would engage in those talks. Bringing West Virginia in was a desperate act for the Big 12 but the conference seems to have stabilized.

It did not make sense for the Big 12 schools to join the Pac 12 schools. BYU's best fit is in the PAC 12. The question is how do they get in? They would join schools in Utah, Arizona, Colorado, California, Oregon, and Washington. Their act of desperation by leaving the Mountain West when Utah joined the Pac 12 was only seen as a move of desperation. They should have stayed put. Now they have their programs in unproductive situations where they are much worse off than they were.

Unless the Big 12 becomes desperate again, I do not ever see BYU getting an invite there. Get back in the Mountain West and the invite will come.

talkinsports
Gilbert, AZ

naval vet

Take off the crimson-colored glasses long enough and you'll see that, regardless of records, 1984 Air Force and Michigan were both better than anybody Utah played in 2004.

Naval Vet
Philadelphia, PA

truecoug1:

"I like how U say Utah is BYU's big brother. Yet 5 of the most commented articles are about BYU and 2 are about Utah."

Utah is the big brother because we beat you 3 in a row, 8 of the last 11, and own a generation gap in the all-time series. Only in WACistan is the "top dog" the one with the most comments. Everywhere else, it goes to the team with the most wins.

phoenix:

"Air Force(8-4) beat Notre Dame(7-5) 21-7 in South Bend and POUNDED Va Tech(8-4) 23-7 in the Independence Bowl."

AFA was the #3 team in the WAC back in '84. Only in the bubble is the 3rd best team in the WAC (1984) > THE best team in the Big East (2004).

"Beating Hawaii(7-4) in Hawaii was always very tough."

Maybe for WAC teams, but looking at their 5 year history from '82 to '86, the Warriors posted a .537 Home winning average, and beat only 4 teams with a winning record. And they were AFA, UNLV, Utah, and Fresno St. The only "name" team they beat was 3-9 Wisconsin.

Naval Vet
Philadelphia, PA

takinsports:

Take of the blue-goggles long and enough and you'll see that, regardless of frantic and emotional spin, 2004 Pittsburgh and Texas A&M were both better than anybody the cougars played in 19843

truecoug1
Provo, UT

@NavalVet "Utah is the big brother because we beat you 3 in a row, 8 of the last 11, and own a generation gap in the all-time series."

Dude, I've said this before, but the mere fact that U come onto BYU boards citing the Utes' head-to-head record and trying to claim relevance/superiority over BYU because of it just shows how little-brotherish U are.

From 2003-2009, Boston College won all six games they played against Notre Dame. Would I, or anybody else, think that Boston College was Notre Dame's "big brother" during that time, or at any time?

I don't care that U have won 3 in a row over BYU (two of those in completely fluke fashion). Before that, BYU had taken 3 of 4 from Utah. I didn't care about that either. I cared more about the final rankings and two conference championships than beating Utah.

See, I don't HAVE to care. BYU has already established itself as a legacy program, with a national following and national relevance. U currently run your football facilities out of a trailer park.

That's about as "little-brotherish" as it gets.

Go Cougars!

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