@Say Non to BOI've never heard of the Church being selective about
disobeying the laws of the land that are "bad," either. And you
didn't hear me propose disobedience. I propose that we as a nation change
our policies to allow more LEGAL immigration before God holds our nation
accountable for disobeying HIS laws. It's not illegal to allow more visas.
And it won't be illegal if the law is changed to allow for amnesty. I,
too, believe in the rule of law--both man's and God's laws.
@John C. C.I've never heard of the church being selective about
disobeying the laws of the land that are "bad."In fact, Elder Oaks
would take issue with you. As he explained in a talk a few years ago, the only
exceptions might be something like mandatory abortion. The immigration laws
clearly do not rise to that level.You would do well to review the handbook
of instructions which clearly states that people should migrate legally.
It's what we do when they disobey the law that troubles me.
Say No to BO sadly misunderstands the position of the Church of Jesus Christ of
Latter-day Saints. They respect the laws of God, too. Our nation "by the
people" made bad law and will be held accountable for ignoring God's
will that we welcome the stranger and love our neighbors as ourselves.To anti-liar, it is clearly immoral, unfair, and wrong for us to keep those
millions around the world who actually do love America waiting respectfully in
line. SLars rightfully pointed out that those who follow our laws are
penalized. Reward them by letting them come in. They will be even more
law-abiding than the ones who are already here."There is no way
American citizens can compete with guest workers." So we punish them? Yes, SLars, the gap between the rich and the rest of us is growing still
greater. If we had more legal workers, the business tycoons would no longer be
able to exploit so many undocumented workers.To prelax and all
others who worry about jobs I repeat, immigrant workers create more jobs than
If we are to believe the reports, then one inevitably must conclude that the
Latino culture in America, at large, does not respect the rule of law. What Republicans need to understand is that the pro-illegal
immigration/anti-enforcement "Latino vote" indicates a fault NOT with
the Republican Party, but rather the value system of the Latino culture in
America -- again, if we are to believe the reports. Rewarding, with
legalization, persons who disdain this nation, its sovereignty, its borders and
its laws, who show such disrespect for its citizens, while millions around the
world -- who actually DO love America -- continue to wait respectfully in line,
CLEARLY is immoral, unfair, and wrong. And everyone knows it!What is needed in this country, instead of essentially surrendering the
sovereignty of the United States to Mexico in order to win the "Latino
vote," is a smidgen of INTEGRITY on the part of our politicians -- which
means obeying, honoring, sustaining, and enforcing the law, for a change. Shamefully, the value-systems of illegal aliens, the unscrupulous
businessmen who hire them, and the corrupt politicians who are paid off by the
businessmen, are marked by covetousness, greed, and corruption, respectively.
I have fought this battle since 2006. In the process I have lost faith in the
church as well as the politicians. The law itself means less to me than before
I walked down this road of pointing out to our "leaders" that something
is very wrong when they extoll the virtues of those who are unlawfully
present.I no longer shake my head when those elected and those of my faith
stand in the way of deserved deportation. The LDS Church once stood firmly in
the camp of defending the law of the land. That standard now has conditions
attached. I never thought I'd see the Presiding Bishop stand with the
politicians and make comments at a photo op. How far we've come.2013
may very well be the year when we sell out the rule of law to trespassers from
the third world. And like the 1986 amnesty, this one will fail to stem the tide
because we lack the political will to enforce the laws legitimately enacted.Last one out, bring the flag.
Of the many comments I have seen about illegal immigration, one of the best
comes from Vernon Briggs, a Cornell University labor economics professor: "The toleration of illegal immigration undermines all of our labor; it
rips at the social fabric. It's a race to the bottom. The one who plays by
the rules is penalized... a guest worker program guarantees wages will never go
up, and there is no way American citizens can compete with guest workers."
We have seen seven amnesties since 1986. They add up to 6 million
illegal workers given citizenship. It doesn't stop the problem, it keeps it
going. Americans must demand enforcement against most before amnesty is given to
the few. We must be convinced our leaders will enforce our laws. There is a reason our wages have dropped over the past 40 years, and the gap
between rich and poor has widened. Between illegal immigration, and legal
immigration giving our record numbers, we will be guaranteeing depressed wages
to our children and grandchildren. The open border folks backed by
big business has seen that our laws are not enforced. It has to stop, it has
hurt to many people.
Over a million legal residents (green cards) are allowed here each year. I think
that is more than enough, especially when we already have 12 million people
already here on green cards from other years, that have never applied for
citizenship. They just want the jobs. Last year Obama gave out 3.3
million work visas. Many to people illegally here in the country. With this
economy, I think that's to many. Add in Obama's student visas and his
first of the year waiver for relatives and we have flooded our labor market. There is a reason for this, many business owners have said they would
reduce all workers to 28 hours, except a few top management people. In order to
do this, they need more cheap labor. It's not compassion, as
families have already been united by the waivers already. This is war between
business and labor. Is it any wonder the newly created jobs have went to low
wage earners, and the middle class has seen the most loses.
What's missing from these proposals is a big increase in the number of
foreign born allowed to move here. Not just temporary workers. Real
immigrants. They give us strength, just like our own ancestors gave our country
strength when they moved here. Our visa restrictions are much too
narrow. Let's have faith in the laws of supply and demand. Forget your
prejudices. A new surge of immigrants would give our economy just the boost it
needs. Contrary to common belief, new immigrant workers create more
jobs for the natives than they take.
NO to citizenship for illegals. NO NO NO NO!!!!!!
If the states or the federal government mandated e-verify along with draconian
penalties for non-compliance, they could solve 75-80% of the illegal immigrant
trespassing problem overnite.They don't REALLY want to fix
immigration. They want to pander to businesses and tax individual Americans for
the services that illegal immigrant trespassers steal on a daily basis.BOTH political parties think that by pandering by illegal trespassers they can
convince LEGAL hispanic Americans to vote for them.There's
NOTHING AT ALL wrong with the present immigration law; except it isn't
enforced.They won't enforce a new one either.
The real problem I have with changing the immigration laws is that since 1986
they have not been fully enforced by the Federal Gov't. That creates 2
issues for me:1. How do you determine what parts require changes when you
have no data to determine whether or not they work when fully enforced.2.
If the Federal Gov't has never fully enforced the current laws, what proof
do we the people have that they would enforce any new changes?What
faith would we have in the State if they said "There will be a $500 fine for
speeding. But we will only write a ticket to every 100th person that each
officer catches each month".Most likely we would have a lot more
speeders due to the low odds that they will be caught.
The proposal includes "ways for more temporary workers to be admitted into
the country."With unemployment still very high, I question the
wisdom of it. I know many will claim that I am proposing
"protectionism", but given that temporary workers frequently come on
visas that are owned by the employer and are therefore not fully subject to the
free market, it really isn't protectionism to be against more temporary
worker programs that admit hundreds of thousands of workers. For
example, given the H-1B visa used widely in the technology industry, free market
champion and Noble Prize economist Milton Friedman called the H-1B visa a
government "subsidy given to employers" to bypass the free market in
their hiring. As such, nearly 40% of all US IT workers are with this visa. Many
of the temporary workers programs Obama proposes are similar.Americans should be cautious about Obama's proposals for immigration
reform. Many working Americans would be hurt economically by it by making it
even more difficult to find and keep good employment, being that American
workers would have to compete against these temporary immigrant worker programs
that are essentially government subsidies given to employers.
Immigration isn't only with people from Mexico. Texas is also having
problems with immigration. Many are coming here from Californis, and New York.
Some questions:* why can't these people live with the leaders
they voted in?* why bring their liberal ideas to Texas?They
made their beds, now sleep in it.