Comments about ‘Letter: Gun control Down Under’

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Published: Monday, Jan. 21 2013 12:00 a.m. MST

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Screwdriver
Casa Grande, AZ

Yes but everything is backwards there so we need even more guns here to make it safer. The NRA has lots of research to say it's so. Anyway, were going to buy the guns anyway.

Beverly
Eden, UT

Reasonable gun control measures work. The United States has 30,000 gun deaths every year. It is a national tragedy and a national disgrace. As the President said, "We can do better." No one's guns should be taken away - we need to support the 2nd Amendment, but we need to prevent gun deaths. The President's recommendations need support. The Deseret News has been completely silent on this issue. Supporting the President would show leadership. The cry for leadership during the presidential election was loud and the Deseret News reported regarding the need for leadership. What about leadership now? 30,000 people will die and the Deseret News is silent??? No position?? I question the leadership of the Deseret News at this time in America when we need leadership on the gun issue.

Mike in Cedar City
Cedar City, Utah

So there Deseret News! The only real wseakness in the Presidents postion is the lack of a buy-back program. Want to rethink your not well thought out position on an Assault wseapons ban in view of some facts and not IRA Republican party conjecture?

higv
Dietrich, ID

Can anyone back that up. Most guns used in crimes in the US are already obtained illegally and it is already illegal to kill. Gun laws who do they bring back murdered? Besides more gun laws don't curb gun deaths.

Mountanman
Hayden, ID

You gun control advocates should move to Chicago, where guns are banned. You will be safe there, right?

micawber
Centerville, UT

@higv:
The letter writer did back up her position. She says that in Australia, they tightened gun controls, and gun deaths decreased. Now, you might not believe there are raasons Australia's experience has been different than ours has been. But she at least provided some evidence. You did not.

Emajor
Ogden, UT

While assault weapons bans and gun buyback programs may have worked well for Australia, I have to wonder if there are enough cultural and demographic differences between the US and Australia that would prevent a similar benefit here. Americans love to kill each other with guns. Hand guns, assault rifles, you name it, we worship it & we'll kill each other with it.

Mountanman & higv,
For the one billionth time, selective use of statistics does not a strong argument make.

Mountanman
Hayden, ID

@Emajor. For the one billionth time, if you can come up with any gun control law that guarantees bad people will not get their hands on guns, I will support it! After all, we both know that laws prevent criminal behavior don't we? That's why no one murders or steals or drives drunk because its against the law, right? Your naivety is exhausting!

Noodlekaboodle
Poplar Grove, UT

@Mountanman
That's an absurd argument. Name me one law that prevents the illegal action 100% of the time. I mean, we can't guarantee someone won't drive drunk. So clearly there shouldn't be a law against it. We can't guarantee a woman won't be raped, so we don't need a law for that either. We can't guarantee any laws will be followed 100% of the time. So using your logic we should just eliminate all laws and be anarchists?

Mountanman
Hayden, ID

@ Noodlekaboodle. Here is what you don't get! Since some people will never obey laws, including all and any gun laws, a gun in my hand is better than a cop (with a gun) on the phone! The ONLY way to stop bad guys with guns is more good guys with guns! Get it? The alternative is victimhood, and I refuse to be a victim! If you choose not to protect yourself, that's your business. I challenge you to put up a sign in your yard, "Gun free family" and practice what you preach!

Mike Richards
South Jordan, Utah

Instead of telling us that another nation has lower "gun deaths", shouldn't we first ask what freedoms are guaranteed to that nation by their Constitution? Does Australia have the same guaranteed right to keep and bear arms that we have? Is that part of their Supreme Law of the Land?

America is a land of liberty where the people are expected to conduct themselves properly. The freedoms that we enjoy are unalienable rights bestowed on us by our Creator, not by government. We cherish freedom because we know from whom it came. Agency is the supreme "gift" from God. Giving away our agency is returning to the plan that was submitted by Lucifer and rejected by every one of us. We chose to be free. We chose to be responsible. We chose to control ourselves with minimal interference from government.

Too many people want someone else to be responsible for their actions. Its time that we thought seriously about what it means to be free Americans and contrast that with being baby-sat by Washington with its "parental control" of our lives.

pragmatistferlife
salt lake city, utah

First of all mountainman guns are not banned in chicago. They have strict ownership requirements, and don't allow concealed carry permits, but guns are not banned. Secondly gun deaths in chicago are mostly amongst the criminals themselves and the innocent who are caught in the violence (mostly children..270 last year). So for the most part gun deaths in chicago are perputrated by illegal guns on others who posess illegal guns or on those who wouldn't be permitted to own a gun anyway.

The problem for chicago is it doesn't exsist in a vacuum. Chicago has an imense crime problem. Chicago has an imense poverty problem, and therefore chicago has an imense violence problem armed by a country awash in legal guns sold illegally to chicago criminals. Chicago stands as an island and your circular logic of..because criminals can get legal guns illegally we should just have more legal guns is just that, silly circular logic. NO, the question is how to stop the illegal sale of guns to chicago criminals?

liberal larry
salt lake City, utah

I think Mountainman makes a good point. We can't just ban guns in cities like Chicago, we need to restrict firearms nationally!

micawber
Centerville, UT

@Mike Richards

The number of gun deaths is certainly relevant to this discussion. You might believe the freedom to carry any kind of weapon you choose outweighs the toll of gun violence. But others might disagree, and the scope of violence is important when making that balance.

I don't believe that keeping certain kinds of guns and ammunition out of the marketplace constitutes a meaningful erosion of freedom. I think that being a free American includes being more free from the risk of so many guns and so much ammunition circulating in this country.

LDS Liberal
Farmington, UT

Mountanman
Hayden, ID
@ Noodlekaboodle. Here is what you don't get! Since some people will never obey laws, including all and any gun laws,

===========

So, what you are saying is;
since criminals don't obey laws anyway, why pass laws?

Great.
So prosecuters have nothing to prosecute.
Law enforcement has no laws to enforce.
No one can go to jail becuase criminals are just going to commit crime anyway?

Pass the laws, and when these laws get broken, prosecute them.

Do restrict assault guns, because criminals will just ignore them anyway?!

Conservative logic is so illogical.

Where there is no law given, there is no sin.

Mike Richards
South Jordan, Utah

Change the argument to the right to speak without restraint. How much government control are you willing to have on censoring speech BEFORE you speak? How much "thought policing" are you willing to abide by because having "dangerous thoughts" and "dangerous speech" impedes society? How much "book burning" would you tolerate before you realized that you had not authorized the government to censor your thoughts, your speech or your writing?

How many governments have restricted speech and censored all writing so that the people would not be exposed to "far right" ideas about freedom, about liberty, about agency?

How many of you would like to live in China where Internet access is limited, where speech is controlled, where writing is censored?

Speech is a guaranteed liberty with prosecution reserved for violations after speech was used. Keeping and bearing arms is a guaranteed liberty that forbids governmental interference.

Those who argue for governmental control argue for the dissolution of the Constitution. They encourage Obama to breech his oath of office. He took an oath to uphold the Constitution. The Constitution forbids him from interfering with our right to keep and bear arms.

We can limit ourselves without the government's help.

one vote
Salt Lake City, UT

Gun deaths are a consequence of profit for Rambo like high capacity killing machines for the patriots in camouflage.

The Real Maverick
Orem, UT

Who cares what the right wing thinks? When have they been right in the past decade?

SS needs to be privatized! (The market later crashes and had SS been privatized many more Americans would be lost right now)
We need to invade Iraq because they have WMDs! (No WMDs have been found)
We need to give tax cuts to the rich because they'll create jobs! (The past decade has been horrible for job creation)

I could list about 20 more examples, but ya kinda get the point already, don't you?

Copy Cat
Murray, UT

The Real Maverick
Orem, UT

"Who cares what the right wing thinks?"

And the liberals think they are the ones with an open mind??

Not!!!

9MM
Murray, UT

I don't understand why death by gun is so unacceptable and yet death by any other form is acceptable. Death by automobile and medical accident far surpass death by any other form, yet there is no outcry for bans, or restrictions, so those deaths must be acceptable. When a bus rolls off the road killing and wounding dozens, that must be acceptable, no one blames all bus drivers or restricts the manufacture of buses. All behavior in our society carries risk, and what we label as acceptable and unacceptable risk is greatly swayed by your political persuasion.
As for Australia, apparently there is no death by any other form other than by gun in the great down under. So their homicide rates must have dropped to zero after they passed restrictive gun laws. Oh, I am sorry, it didn't, their murder rate has been following the same declining curve for the past 80 years, with no statistical change post the gun ban.

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