Why don't you guys just join the prestigious PAC 12 or big 12? Then you
would be fighting for a prestigious conference championship and prestigious bowl
game every year. I don't get why you guys would rather just fight for WAC
championships. Can a cougar explain please?
Am I the only one that's sick and tired of the TV revenue rhetoric? I
thought BYU was all about exposure, not money. I guess that was just a joke.
BYU being independent is a disservice to its players and fans...nobody seems to
care about that. As soon as BYU's first inevitable loss occurs, the season
is over. That sucks. Being in the MWC at least gives you something to play for
after that first loss. I hate BYU being independent. It's just like Riley
Nelson. Selfish and self-centered. Forget about the team.
Chris,Pretty easy to explain. The WCC has no Sunday play, has higher
academic standards then the majority of PAC-12 schools and provides a faith
based education. Even a Ute fan should understand that.
chrissy"Why don't you guys just join the prestigious PAC 12
or big 12? Then you would be fighting for a prestigious conference championship
and prestigious bowl game every year."Yes, we've all seen
how all of that "fighting for a prestigious... whatever" is working out
for the Utes.Tell ya what; why don't U call us the first time
the Utes beat a conference opponent with a winning record?
@ Just the FAXSo, according to you, BYU isn't going to join a
great conference because Utah has struggled in it's first two years?
Hasn't BYU beaten a couple PAC 12 opponents with winning records the last 2
The Cougars have come just as close to winning the Pac-12 championship as the
Utes have in basketball and football. I know I shouldn't feed the troll,
but I just can't help it.
Ahh the pleasures of independence. Why, let me tell you about how wonderful it
is....it's....well, it's just,,,,,,well, we love it! True, it's
not for everybody, but it provides so much---er---umm---it really free's us
up to....umm, well uh....
I think it is great, I haven't missed a game and most of them are in high
definition. I also like our chances in the three bid WCC. All of the sports have
improved and we can get the best programing available. INDEPENDENCE ROCKS. ESPN3
and game day replay rocks. GO COUGARS.
Chris B wonders "Why don't you guys just join the prestigious PAC 12 or
big 12?"One does not simply "just join" a BCS
Conference. It is invitation only.
If BYU enters into any new conference agreement I hope it's for football
only. The WCC fit is ideal for the university. It's true the
basketball team plays in smaller venues, but competition is with faith based
institutions that are respectful of the Y's no Sunday policy, and the level
of hoops play is very good. In my opinion, the WCC is a perfect home for the
Cougars. They should stay put and help advance the stature of the WCC.
@Fuzz - a loss in the PAC12 dooms their NC hopes, too. Utah has no realistic
hope of an NC just because they're in the PAC12. Rather the opposite.The only teams not named Alabama with a realistic expectation of an NC
game in the current idiocy are three teams in the SEC and maybe one in the
Big12. Ohio State with Urban Meyer and his criminals will get a shot next year.
Oregon or Stanford might get a shot.So what does Utah or Oregon
State play for? Wins. A bowl game. Pride. Ranking.What does BYU play
for? Wins. A bowl game. Pride. Ranking.And BYU gets every game on
TV. And plays cool teams all over the country. SEC plays Bo Diddley Tech out of
conference.OTOH, Utah, Washington, WSU, Alabama have all backed out
of games with BYU. Afraid to play BYU? Frankly, yes. Only on thing may be the
impetus driving BYU back to a conference: scheduling.
@BlueHusky"Ohio State with Urban Meyer and his criminals will
get a shot next year."Judge not lest ye ... ah forget it, you
and your fellow cougs will continue throwing stones from your glass houses
regardless.By the way, scared to play BYU? Yeah, that's why we
scheduled a stronger team in Michigan instead. I'll tell you what, I'd
love some of whatever it is you're having.
The best part of being independent is the exposure. I can watch just about every
BYU basketball and football game. It's awesome. What other university can
The bottom line is that BYU simply doesn't work and play well with
others.Oh, and let's be clear... Utah brought more money to the
MWC with two BCS games than BYU ever did.
Chris B: You can't just join a conference. You have to be invited. So who
wants BYU? Not the PAC-12 they have the Utah market wrapped up. Not the Big-12
as they are looking east. Not the Big-10, ACC or SEC (too far and too big for
BYU). If there was an interest in BYU, then they would already be a member.
Any of those conferences would give you more exposure than independence. The
Mountain West would be good for BYU, but their ego won't let them look at
real life. The Mt West is now the best of the rest and with the new play off
system, should see a lot of money and exposure. Instead BYU wants to stay in
fantasyland. Good luck with that.
Howard S.The bottom line is that Utah was so desperate to be
considered "one of the big boys" that they were willing to become a
perennial conference doormat just to be associated with the big boys.btw, how much money is Utah bringing to the PAC 12?UNLV would have
added more value to the conference than they've gotten from Utah - at least
the Rebels have a basketball team.
When? and if? Utah starts winning Pac12 games then we can say it was a good
decision to join. In the meantime, they are getting beat up on the field, in
the press, and by fans. I guess being the doormat is not that fun.Realistically, when do they expect to start beating Oregon, Cal, Standford,
USC, UCLA, and the Arizona teams? What new event will trigger that advance in
winning?Will their coach get better? No.Will their
recruting get better related to the big boys in the PAC? No.Will
their players get a big swaggering winning attitude in the meantime? No.I'd say the team up North should start praying.
Having SDSU and BYU return to the MWC would be awkward to say the least. First,
there's that poison pen letter San Diego State wrote about the Cougars that
wasn't supposed to become public. Then there's the never ending
"We Wuz Wobbed!" rhetoric from the last game the Aztecs played in
Provo.If you get past that, then you have to face Air Force who not
only humiliated BYU the last time they met on the gridiron, but played "Hit
the Road Jack" on the loudspeakers after the game.Then
there's Nevada and Fresno State who assured BYU they would stick with the
WAC through thick and thin unless of course they didn't feel like it.Let's not forget about Utah State who still is smarting over BYU
insisting on 2 for 1 contracts for football after they went out on a limb for
them. Its a sad state of affairs when the most friendly faces BYU
could look forward if they return to the MWC are the Wyoming Cowboy fans in
Laramie. I say BYU stands pat.
Fuzz, you jumped to a lot of unsubstantiated conclusions. Do columnists and
sportscasters set school policy? Nope.I think independence has been
GREAT! I see the team more now than ever. Exposure on TV, Radio, and News is
greatly increased. The team is playing in more locations than ever. Better
than the same old tired places. This is exposure and it is great.Sure, I wish they would win every game. They don't. Few do. Most never
have. Yet somehow they teams show up to play every year. Imagine that. And
even after they lose a game or 10 they keep playing. Wow.Lighten
up. Independence has been good. Things are far, far better than it every was
in the MWC in my opinion.
Henry Drummond,Interesting you bring up AFA. BYU is 24-7 lifetime
against AFA and had beat them 6 times in a row before their loss in 2010. You
are making a big deal out of nothing. BYU and AFA have had a good series
together and will play again in the future.
Byu would dominate every conference so there only being fair by independence.
anti BCSAnaheim, CAHow much has Utah brought to the PAC?
Actually about $2 million from last years Sun Bowl.Which is more than BYU
has earned from 2 Poinsettia Bowls.Oh and in the lifetime of the MWC
Utah brought about $30 million just from the Fiesta and Sugar bowls. BYU
brought less than $10 million from their series of 3rd tier bowl games.Utah Desperate to be one of the big boys? Better than being rejected by every
major conference in the county.As for UNLV... let's just say
they have a better chance of an PAC invite than BYU.
I love independence. I have absolutely no desire for BYU to join any conference.
Just because utah must have other, greater schools to prop it up and lend it
some small modicum of credibility, BYU does not need that. They are able to
stand on their own. I really like it.
Dear Fuzz, just because a sports writers says it is about money does not make it
true. I have never heard BYU or anyone in authority say they are
doing this because of the money. Quit reading between the lines and stick to
the facts. Yes, they are making more money, but BYU has consistenly stated they
are doing this to get more exposure for the University and for the Church. That
is the bottom line. Before we, maybe, got into the homes of several million, now
they are in the homes of up to 60 million through ESPN and BYUTV. I hope this
is simple enough to understand. Don't forget FUZZ, it does take
money to run a sports program. Everyone does not simply volunteer their time
and the airlines do not give them free flights, nor do the athletic companies
donate their equipment. The refs are not free. It does cost maintenance for
the field and the lights. So, I simply do not understand why you are having a
problem with them wanting to make money.
How exactly is Utah scheduling up when they replaced BYU with Fresno State, not
Michigan. Utah straight out said they didn't want BYU on 2014-15 because
they didn't want to risk losing 2 non-conference games. On the other hand
BYU scheduled Michigan in 2015 in addition to their games at Nebraska, at
Southern Miss, and home against Boise State and Cincinnati.
Independence is much better!The good:1. In spite of what
CKS007 says there is less exposure in the MWC than being independent. At least
that is true for BYU! Only six football teams last year had more TV exposure
than BYU which also helps with recruiting.2. BYU gets to play an overall
tougher schedule in Football which will help BYU get better and helps with
recruiting. In Basketball it is kind of a wash as the MWC is really good this
year.3. More ability to play all over the country which helps with
exposure and recruiting!4. BYU would have to abide by what the MWC says
which is kind of like being in an HOA (Home Owners Association) and having
others make rules for you.5. More money - joining the MWC, even with
BSU's deal, would result in less money for BYU. Probably one of the least
important reasons but it does help with facilities, training and helps support
other sports. This also helps with recruiting.6. ESPN helps schedule some
football games.The bad:1. Football games are more difficult to
schedule.2. Game times are not as convenient for the local fans.
@Duckhunter"I have absolutely no desire for BYU to join any
conference."Which is really quite convenient because no
conference in the country wants BYU.Kind of like a young guy who
thinks dating is a "waste of time"... because no one will date him.
@ Duckhunter"They are able to stand on their own. I really like
it."I assume by "they" you are including Idaho and New
Mexico State... Over 30 teams have been classified as a D-1 independent since
1978, including Colgate, Eastern Carolina, Indiana State, Richmond, Temple,
Tulane, and Utah St.. Going independent is not some badge of honor; pretty much
anybody can do it.
RE: motorbikeCottonwood Heights, UT"By the way, scared to play
BYU? Yeah, that's why we scheduled a stronger team in Michigan instead.
I'll tell you what, I'd love some of whatever it is you're
having." It is funny Utah fans keep bring this up BYU also scheduled
Michigan and was still willing to play Utah. Utah inseted Scheduled Fresno
State. That is the team you got insted of BYU I hope you will like that game.
You have such a history with them. No more we scheduled Michigan insted of BYU
because it is Frensno State you replaced BYU with. RE: Henry
DrummondSan Jose, CADon't worry BYU is not going to take a step
backward and join the MWC.RE:CKS007Clearfield, UTYou do
know Chris B. is a Utah fan and is being sarcasticRE:FuzzSpringville, UTWhen BYU beats Utah there only Pac-12 team they play they
still will not beat a Pac-12 team with a winning record.
the MWC would take BYU back in a second
Howard S."Actually about $2 million from last years Sun
Bowl."Sorry to burst your delusional crimson bubble, but it was
the PAC 12's bowl contract with the Sun Bowl that brought in whatever the
Sun Bowl pays - as far as the PAC 12 is concerned, it really doesn't matter
whether it was a mediocre Utah last year or a mediocre USC this year.Utah provides a warm body so that PAC 12 can play a conference championship
game, nothing more.
@2ferOnly a few could do it successfully, and there is the
difference. But I didn't claim being independent as a "badge of
honor", I claim BYU's ability to do it successfully as a badge of
honor. None of those teams could get an ESPN contract, none of them could work
out individual deals with bowl games, none of them could arrange the schedules
BYU is arranging. You see there are those, like utah, that can only
leech onto greater schools than themselves to try and gain some relevence. utah
"fans" apparently know this on a sub concious level based on how all
they talk about is the pac 12 and almost never about utah itself. For BYU fans all that matters is BYU. That is the difference in
being a school that can stand on your own and a school that lacks anything of
its own and must cling to the accomplishemnts of others in a desperate bid to
claim it matters.
As long as Notre Dame is independent and ESPN continues its contract with BYU,
the Cougs will stay independent. Holmoe told us that scheduling would be tough
the first two years, and it was. But look at the schedule for 2013. The
schedule seems to be manageable going forward, and is a lot better than a MWC
schedule.BYU has gotten the exposure from the media they wanted.
Now BYU just needs a signature season to get "exposure" from the non-BYU
football fans to recognize the Cougs as a powerhouse program. We missed a huge
opportunity this year. With a decent QB, I think we could've finished the
season 11-1 and possibly been selected ahead of N. Illinois for a BCS at-large
bowl. Is it just me, or does anybody else see a simiarity in how
Taysom Hill plays and how Colin Kaepernik plays? Taysom has a long way to go to
get to that level, but their games look a lot alike.
Loyalty is an admirable trait, in most circumstances. With the MWC, loyalty was
not a two way street. BYU is fine as an independent unless something substantial
changes. A teams first responsibility is to themselves - BSU and SDSU need to do
what is best for themselves as does BYU. Conferences serve the needs of their
members, not the reverse. Win-win situations are fine but BYU doesn't need
to lie down for a conference that has proven itself unreliable, Big East or MWC.
@Chrissy"Why don't you guys just join the prestigious PAC 12 or
big 12? Then you would be fighting for a prestigious conference championship and
prestigious bowl game every year. I don't get why you guys would rather
just fight for WAC championships. Can a cougar explain please?"Happy to right after you explain to Cougar fans why Utah is never fighting for
a presitigious conference championship and a prestigious bowl game and instead
is fighting to stay out of the cellar. The only fighting Utah did this year was
to stay out of last place.
@CKS007"If there was an interest in BYU, then they would already be a
member."Interest goes both ways. Conferences have been
interested in BYU but BYU hasn't been interested in giving up EVERYTHING to
join them. It's no different than negotiating for a new job with a new
company. Higher pay doesn't make the new job ideal. When I interview and
negotiate prospective new employees I find that pay is rarely the problem and
benefits and work schedule is a primary concern.It's no
different for BYU. It will be a moot point of discussion with any conference if
they want BYU to give up the right to re-broadcast their own games and if they
expect BYU to give up No-Sunday-Play.The MWC wasn't good for
BYU before so what has changed that will make it good now? That was something
that both Utah and BYU agreed upon when the Mtn Network was first launched. If a
business partner you trusted knifed you in the back and then years later reached
out to you to go into business together again, would you trust him a 2nd time?
Only a fool would...
Duckhuner "I claim BYU's ability to do it successfully as a
badge of honor."BYU isn't doing it successfully until they
can do it without 2 for 1 schedules with BCS teams.Notre Dame does
independence successfully... no one else does.
@ DuckhunterYeah those pathetic schools like everyone in the SEC,
BIG 12, BIG, and PAC-12 who must cling to each other for relevance. Or could it
possibly be that schools like USC and Texas understand the benefits and
advantages of conference affiliation?"For BYU fans all that
matters is BYU." - and Utah. BYU fans, including yourself, talk about the
Utes quite a bit.Lastly, in two years of independence Utah State
played Nebraska, Iowa, Boise St., Utah, BYU, Southern Florida, Connecticut,
Louisiana Tech, Fresno State, and they got Oregon to come to Logan. Scheduling
isn't hard when you do 2-for-1 and 1-and-done with BCS teams and home-home
2ferEvery conference needs its bottom dwellers so the big boys of
the conference can pad their win totals. Credit the Utes for adjusting to that
role so quickly; Colorado and WSU appreciate the company.
JIM 1027 "When? and if? Utah starts winning Pac12 games then we can say it
was a good decision to join. In the meantime, they are getting beat up on the
field, in the press, and by fans. I guess being the doormat is not that
fun."You mean BYU fans not Utah fans. You can't
get a single ticket to a Utah game. We travel to California and Arizona to see
Utah play. the fans have never been more excited. And the press outside of Utah
finally give Utah respect.I guess being the "PAC12" doormat
is not that fun "for BYU fans."
SwoopSalt Lake City, UT2ferEvery conference needs its
bottom dwellers so the big boys of the conference can pad their win totals.
Credit the Utes for adjusting to that role so quickly; Colorado and WSU
appreciate the company.____________________BYU pads
their schedule with bottom dwellers all the time. And they only managed a 7-5
record this season. LOL! Credit the Cougs for being consistent. Idaho, Idaho St
& New Mexico St. appreciate the company.
Duckhunter"For BYU fans all that matters is BYU." This is
exactly right! and unfortunately, this is why those up north keep trying to
prove to us they are better. All we've ever cared about is BYU, and this
somehow comes across as self-centered and rude to an underdeveloped outsider
perspective. Seriously, how many of us really care what the Utes do? I know I
don't; I can't even tell you which teams they lost to in football or
their overall basketball record is. I'll bet the Ute "fans" have
all that information memorized about BYU. There are only two reasons I even
respond to their rantings:primarily because I get tired of constantly being
attacked, even though arguing back is like arguing with a democrat, and
honestly, sometimes it's entertaining to encourage them a bit. Other than
that, I simply don't care. All that matters is BYU. You're spot on.
BYU ia just another mediocre team in the land of alot of mediocre teams outside
the SEC Conference. Don't worry BYU, you're along way from being one
of the elite whether you're in the MWC or play as an Independent. Lots of
big egos and wishfull thinking over there in Provo...