Letters: Put God back in schools


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  • RanchHand Huntsville, UT
    Dec. 31, 2012 9:50 a.m.


    Do unto others... Ever heard of Karma? Same concept, not Christian. It's a basic tenet, not necessarily a religious one either.

  • Wonder Provo, UT
    Dec. 31, 2012 12:02 a.m.

    I think the letter writer is correct. All US school children should have to recite the rosary at the beginning of each school day. Oh wait, you're not Catholic? So whose religion is the school supposed to teach?

  • Neanderthal Ogden, UT
    Dec. 30, 2012 9:30 p.m.

    "I am by no means a secularist.... A moral person doesn't need a God to tell them which is right and wrong... 'do unto others' applies to secularist and the faithful."

    The 'do unto others' thing came from a God. The God of the Christian Bible.

    Most religions have good things to say about what is right and wrong, i.e., do unto others and how to get along with fellow humans.

    Some religions' teachings go beyond that and teach the requirements to get to heaven after you die.

  • UtahBlueDevil Durham, NC
    Dec. 30, 2012 11:03 a.m.


    "Secularism teaches the opposite.

    Secularism teaches there is no right and wrong, that morality is relative, asks "which value?",

    that dishonesty, greed, even the murder of school children is neither right nor wrong.

    and 'intrinsically' can never be"

    Are you absolutely kidding me? Have you ever been to any of these so called secular countries? Is your claim supported by any real data that shows we have lower crime rates than these countries? Is you claim supported by any laws that provide for this relativity you speak of. For example, are you aware that in the EU it is illegal for advertisers to make claims in their adds that are not supportable by research? Here in the US, advertisers can make any claim they want... this is the moral superiority our government provides?

    I am by no means a secularist.... but is crazy, unsupported claims like these that make me worried for the "God" fearing movement when just making stuff up to support a point seems to run rampant. A moral person doesn't need a God to tell them which is right and wrong... "do unto others" applies to secularist and the faithful.

    Your claims are absurd.

  • RanchHand Huntsville, UT
    Dec. 30, 2012 9:10 a.m.

    Gildas says: "There is a moral vacuum in the consciousnesses of many of the youngest members of society,..."

    If there is a "moral vacuum" it is the fault of the parents, not the schools.

  • Ultra Bob Cottonwood Heights, UT
    Dec. 30, 2012 8:20 a.m.

    The Truth.

    “More importantly recognizing God, recognizes that our rights come from God NOT men,”

    If that statement is true, why are rights so poorly distributed among people? Some people don’t even get to experience life itself let along all the rest.

  • Howard Beal Provo, UT
    Dec. 30, 2012 12:44 a.m.

    Was God in our schools when we used to segregate by race?

    Was God in our schools when hundreds of women and children were massacred at Wounded Knee? We just had the 122nd anniversary of this tragic event.

    What I am getting at is we have had a long history of not so kind moments in our history before and after Engel v. Vitale. Lots of countries are more "secular" than America and have less violence, even violence in schools...

    And like I said before, all sorts of people bring God and their beliefs into our schools each and every day. Religion nor prayer is outlawed by the government in our schools, only state-sponsored prayer.

  • Mad Hatter Provo, UT
    Dec. 30, 2012 12:32 a.m.

    OK. In Utah everyone knows who's religious views will be taught. That's a no brainer. However, how will the other state's handle this issue when they don't have such a state religion like Utah?

    Remember, it was a Mormon family in Santa Fe, TX, which brought a lawsuit against the local school district that argued that allowing students to lead prayers at home football games violated the First Amendment by creating a religious atmosphere.

  • wrz Ogden, UT
    Dec. 29, 2012 11:18 p.m.

    "Put God back in schools"

    Yes, and give him/her a gun.

  • GK Willington Salt Lake City, UT
    Dec. 29, 2012 9:32 p.m.

    re: mark 7:45 p.m. Dec. 29

    Nietzsche once said, "After coming into contact with a religious man I always feel I must wash my hands."

    In other words, the disingenuous duplicity of the true believer is the rule not the exception.

    p.s Why does God need to return to school... Isn't He omniscient??

  • Kalindra Salt Lake City, Utah
    Dec. 29, 2012 9:24 p.m.

    the posters ont hese threads that claim to be the most religious are the same ones that most often post lies and bare false witness, perhaps they should be the change they wish to see before demanding others fallow their lead.

  • mark Salt Lake City, UT
    Dec. 29, 2012 7:45 p.m.

    The truth, nothing of what you say in this post makes the least bit of sense.

    Especially this: It is only a religious and moral people that have ever been able to temper there own behavior.

    I'm not religious, but I "temper" my behavior very well, thank you. Much better then many religious people.

  • the truth Holladay, UT
    Dec. 29, 2012 6:43 p.m.

    Which God is an irrelevant question.

    It does not matter. it is silly question

    The question just diverts from what is actually relevant.

    The community should control their own schools not the government.

    More importantly recognizing God, recognizes that our rights come from God NOT men, that there is right and wrong, and an absolute morality.

    Which provides the backbone of morals and ethics that is sorely missing.

    Secularism teaches the opposite.

    Secularism teaches there is no right and wrong, that morality is relative, asks "which value?",

    that dishonesty, greed, even the murder of school children is neither right nor wrong.

    and 'intrinsically' can never be,

    no act or behavior can be right or wrong, regardless of what a group of people decide or a leader says.

    If there is no right there is no wrong.

    Secularism is just wontoness controlled by the power of big government.

    And who, other than the left, would want to live under a government powerful enough to control all behavior? Because that is what will be required in a Godless world..

    It is only a religious and moral people that have ever been able to temper there own behavior.

  • UtahBlueDevil Durham, NC
    Dec. 29, 2012 5:45 p.m.

    God is in our schools... maybe not in words, but in deeds and the lives of those who attend them each and every day. It was in the lives of those teachers who sacrificed their lives to try to protect those kids. Living a good Christian, Muslim or Hindu life doesn't mean you run around yammering about your God everywhere you go, but beliefs should be reflected in how you live your life and treat others.

    Teachers can demonstrate whet it is to be a true follower without once having to mention God in their classrooms. Several teachers did just that by making the ultimate sacrifice and demonstration of their faith. Actions - not words.

  • Gildas LOGAN, UT
    Dec. 29, 2012 5:44 p.m.

    I could only find one alleged incident of mass shootings in a public school before prayer was banned, but many afterwards as we all know. I think the writer may have a great point.

    The secularization of society has meant that, in a great many cases, if a child is not made aware of basic shared moral beliefs at school, such as the immorality of crimes against life, liberty and property, he will quite likely not find them anywhere else in his immediate experience. What effect that would tend to is fairly obvious. There is a moral vacuum in the consciousnesses of many of the youngest members of society, actually augmented by the "value free" approach to "social problems".

  • Screwdriver Casa Grande, AZ
    Dec. 29, 2012 5:08 p.m.

    Great idea. Then our "christian" schools will be terrorist targets.

    All you that suggest to "put god back in school" don't really believe your religion at all do you? Not a bit. Nor your political religion.

    You now want to turn religious training over to the guvment'?

    If God is in your children's hearts then he is in schools isn't he? Ye of little faith.

  • Ultra Bob Cottonwood Heights, UT
    Dec. 29, 2012 4:34 p.m.

    Is there a verifiable incident of disaster where God was present that he mitigated or prevented the disaster? Is there any statistics that might show that only non-religious people have accidents, get killed, go crazy?

    As the old minister said, Prey to God about your problems, THEN DO.

  • mark Salt Lake City, UT
    Dec. 29, 2012 2:55 p.m.

    I don't understand how someone that believes in a god would think that he is NOT in schools. Do you really think that, if there is a god, man's government is more powerful then him, or her? Do you really think that government can ban him, or her from anywhere?

    Also, prayer is not banned in schools, nor is religion. Your religion goes with you wherever you go. Or do you think you leave your religion behind when you step out of your chapel? And you can pray to your hearts content in school. Bow your head and say a little prayer. I am sure that their are plenty of students that do just this before finals.

    But what you want is to push your religion on those that do not believe as you believe. I don't think most religious people want this, but a very vocal group does. And they need to knock it off. I, for one, want nothing to do with your religion.

  • atl134 Salt Lake City, UT
    Dec. 29, 2012 12:54 p.m.

    No. Secular Canada, Norway, Sweden, Spain, UK, and Germany all have significant (4x-40x) lower homicide rates (it's a rate so it accounts for population differnece since it's homicides per 100k people) than the US.

  • Howard Beal Provo, UT
    Dec. 29, 2012 12:14 p.m.

    God is at our schools. Every teacher brings in their own ethical based, much of it based on their own personal religious teachings, which effects their actions every day as teachers. I can't help but think of those teachers who laid their lives down to protect their students. Most of our high school students in Utah attend release time Seminary where they are engulfed with religion and God. But we all bring whatever to the classroom and all facets of our life. We also seem to forget history as well. The worst school mass murder happened in 1927, well before the Supreme Court decision Engel v. Vitale that "took prayer out of the classroom." I know many teachers in both private and public schools that pray for their students day and night to inspire them, to teach effective lessons, to help their students in what ever problems are affecting them. God is watching over our schools iMO. A rote prayer over the morning announcements or Bible reading does not bring students closer to God.

  • Emajor Ogden, UT
    Dec. 29, 2012 12:08 p.m.

    You're right, Mr. Tillett. Adam Lanza killed 26 people in his school because he wasn't forced to pray to the Christian God or use the phrase "one nation under God" every day in the classroom. Where on earth are you getting this viewpoint from?

    Here's something to think about: Europe is growing more and more secular and yet has a gun violence rate far far lower than the US. So the solution is actually to remove God not only from schools, but the entire public sphere!

  • The Real Maverick Orem, UT
    Dec. 29, 2012 11:28 a.m.

    This really seems like another lame attempt from the right wing to eliminate Sex Education and Evolution in our schools rather than a serious call for citizens to become more virtuous.

  • Mister J Salt Lake City, UT
    Dec. 29, 2012 11:23 a.m.

    @ UtahBlueDevil 12/29 8:16a

    We REALLY need to worry about the psychologically maladjusted that think God is exclusively on their side.

  • Eric Samuelsen Provo, UT
    Dec. 29, 2012 11:18 a.m.

    Look, if God had wanted to, He could easily have given the shooter a massive heart attack the second he approached the school. What you're suggesting is that God did not intervene, because the kids weren't required to recite some rote, formulaic prayer every morning. That, apparently, so offended God that He decided to let a madman butcher them.
    As it happens, I believe in God, and I pray to Him, and I wonder why He allows this kind of evil to occur. I certainly don't have all the answers, though I feel some peace when I pray. But I absolutely and completely reject the absurd theology that says that 'taking God out of our schools' has anything whatsoever to do with this kind of tragedy.

  • ugottabkidn Sandy, UT
    Dec. 29, 2012 10:52 a.m.

    Lyle, while I'm all for the individual developing a personal relationship and faith in God, that approach hasn't worked in the past when you consider all the molested children in churches and religous organizations, ie Boy Scouts. Lyle, we should assign you to find us an alternative.

  • louie Cottonwood Heights, UT
    Dec. 29, 2012 10:31 a.m.

    In some of the few places that force religion in schools we have sent our military to bring peace and freedom to their country.

  • Hutterite American Fork, UT
    Dec. 29, 2012 10:02 a.m.

    What greater good could be done in a school that could only be done with religion? None.

  • embarrassed Utahn! Salt Lake City, UT
    Dec. 29, 2012 9:36 a.m.

    Good questions dave! I'd like to know how the author of this letter has the audacity to use the following...

    "If you cannot trust in a God who answers prayers of faith, what can you believe in?"

    The parents and loved ones of the victims must take great solace in attitudes like that! Right?

  • Furry1993 Ogden, UT
    Dec. 29, 2012 9:37 a.m.

    Which God? The God of Catholics? Protestants? Evangelicals? Jews? Muslims? Wiccans? Buddhists? Hundus? Hare Krisna? Satanists? [Nme any other maor or minor religion]? And what about agnostics and athiests? Imposing one form of religious teaching on soeone whoe family believe in another way is NOT proper or ethical. We taught our children religion and faith in God at home. That's where the teaching of religion and God belongs (unless, of course, parents choose to send their children to private religious schools).

  • KJB1 Eugene, OR
    Dec. 29, 2012 9:14 a.m.

    In one breath people will rant about getting the government out of their lives and in the other they'll demand that the government dictate the most intimate decisions we make. Which is it, guys?

  • dave Park City, UT
    Dec. 29, 2012 8:56 a.m.

    How does one "put God in school"? What does this mean in reality? How would this stop a person not attending from going in and doing harm?

    This seems to be a bit of an non sequitur: God is not in school so people go to school and harm children.. It does not follow any logic.

    I started school in the mid 60's and we never prayed or studied the bible. Perhaps this God in schools thing was/is regional.

    Maybe someone can logically explain this to me.

  • pragmatistferlife salt lake city, utah
    Dec. 29, 2012 8:40 a.m.

    Yes Lyle secularists would object to putting God in schools because it's the secularists and secularism that prevents the children in Utah from having to pray to Mother Mary before class, and it's the secularists that don't allow half a class to leave math class and go pray to Allah when they feel it's appropriate.

    Believe what you choose Lyle...but it's secularism that allows you that choice without the influence from a more politically or even physically powerful religion telling you you can't.

  • Really??? Kearns, UT
    Dec. 29, 2012 8:22 a.m.

    Teaching about God is best done in the homes. If you want an all-day religious-based education for your children, find the money to pay for a private school that focuses on faith-based teaching.

  • UtahBlueDevil Durham, NC
    Dec. 29, 2012 8:16 a.m.

    While I would love to see faith inserted into all aspects of daily life, I fail to see how having God in School would have prevented any of these incidents. It is a nice thought, but really wont result in anything. Think back to the Amish school that was attacked several years ago where several children were slaughtered - a very God fearing group and school.

    I wish it were that simple. But mentally unstable people don't worry about God too much.

  • embarrassed Utahn! Salt Lake City, UT
    Dec. 29, 2012 7:51 a.m.

    Do you honestly think all of America would agree with your choice of "whose God" we should all be forced to worship? I suggest you get out and see our Nation instead of spouting what I call absolute nonsense. I'm sure all these mass murderers share one commonality....self-righteous delusions.

  • DreamMakerCQ Lake Summerset, IL
    Dec. 29, 2012 3:30 a.m.

    Let's put God back into not only schools but make him a priority in our lives! Let's put Ethics back where it belongs!

  • jp624 dancille, VA
    Dec. 29, 2012 1:20 a.m.

    How would increased religion help at all?