Comments about ‘Letter: Too much government?’

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Published: Wednesday, Dec. 19 2012 12:00 a.m. MST

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Roland Kayser
Cottonwood Heights, UT

Total tax rates (federal, state, and local) are lower in the U.S. than in almost all other developed countries.

Mountanman
Hayden, ID

@ Roland Kayser. Then move to where taxes are higher and you win and will be very happy!

Lagomorph
Salt Lake City, UT

The writer complains about having too much government and the costs of maintaining that government, then in the same breath hopes that Hill AFB will not be shut down. The last I checked, Hill was a federal government enterprise maintained by federal tax dollars. Or has it been fully privatized lately? (I'd have thought that would have made the news.) You can't have it both ways. You can't argue for reduced government scope and spending while preserving your pet government program. Either everything is fair game for budget cutting or nothing is.

KJB1
Eugene, OR

Sorry, Mountainman, but this is just as much our country as it yours. Guess we'll have to learn to live together.

airnaut
Everett, 00

I enjoy roads, power, water, sanitation, schools, police and fire protection, ect., ect.

This is America --

You are Free to move somewhere else,
or
You are free to move to your mount retreat cabin in Montana,
live off the land, and not pay a dime in taxes.

Conservatives continully think and associate living "Free" as being some weird montetary issue.
They really have know idea what Freedom is.

Kent C. DeForrest
Provo, UT

Let's face it, we all like big government. Yes, we wish it could be more efficient, but when asked what we are willing to give up, we offer peanuts. Our problem is that we're just cheapskates. We want all that government offers, but we don't want to pay for it. We want our grandkids to pay for it.

All you have to do is look at tax revenue as a percentage of GDP to see that we are far less willing than other developed nations to pay for what we want. Here are the stats:
Austria 42.8%
Belgium 43.2%
Canada 31.1 %
Denmark 48.2%
Finland 43.1%
France 41.9%
Germany 37.0%
Hungary 39.1%
Iceland 41.4%
Italy 43.5%
Japan 28.1%
South Korea 25.6%
New Zealand 31.0%
Norway 41.0%
Poland 34.3%
Portugal 35.2%
Spain 30.7%
Sweden 46.4%
Switzerland 30.2%
United Kingdom 34.3%
United States 24.0%

Only South Korea is in our league. And the GOP is trying to tell us we're taxed too much. Sorry, the argument doesn't hold water.

Mountanman
Hayden, ID

Kent, Kent, Kent. You forgot to add all the OTHER taxes Americans like me pay! Federal income taxes, federal and state capitol gains taxes, federal and state excise taxes, federal and state fuel taxes, state income taxes, sales taxes, property taxes, death taxes, license taxes and lets not forget inheritance taxes! All in all, I pay nearly 50% of my income paying only some of these taxes! Taxes is my largest item on my families budget and I see that I must now pay MORE taxes next year? When is it going to stop?
So much for the GOP telling us were are taxed to much because WE ARE! If YOU want to pay more taxes, please feel free to send it in! For the rest of us, we are tying to survive! Suggestion; since the IRS has bankrupted more Americans that healthcare bills, let's have a government program to bailout taxpayers! That will help far more Americans than Obamacare (another tax) ever will!

Eric Samuelsen
Provo, UT

The phrase "too much government" is a strange one, isn't it? Government isn't a commodity that you can have too much of. It's the way the people get things done they want done. We want our children to be educated, so we pay for schools. We want ill-intentioned people to not steal our stuff, so we pay for cops and a justice system. We want poor people to not starve to death, so we pay for food stamps or housing subsidies. Where we run into problems is when we have things we want government to do, but we don't want to pay for it. That's precisely where we are now.

airnaut
Everett, 00

Mountanman
Hayden, ID

=========

You doing SOMETHING wrong mountaman.

Try either using TurboTax,
or hire a Tax Accountant.

Mitt Romney makes WAY more than you do and yet only pays 14%.

FYI -
My families biggest single expense is Medical Insurance.
and it magically keeps right on inflating at 15-20% per year no matter what the economy is doing.

I'm soooo looking forward to Obamacare kicking in!

Kent C. DeForrest
Provo, UT

Mountanman,

I'm not wealthy, but I am comfortably above the mean income in the U.S. Just for kicks, I added up my federal and state income taxes, Social Security and Medicare taxes. The total came to 18 percent of my AGI. And I don't have a mortgage, so no interest deduction. My kids are all over 17, so no child tax credit. In fact, I don't take advantage of any significant tax credits or deductions, other than the customary charitable donation deduction. So my rate is higher than most people's in my income bracket. Yes, I pay sales tax, which might add 2 percent, and my property tax is 1.9 percent. The excise taxes and license fees I pay are negligible. So my total tax burden amounts to about 22 percent of my adjusted gross income.

If you're paying 50 percent, then you're undoubtedly among the 2 percent of the population that President Obama is trying to hit with his minuscule tax rate increase. I can see why you're upset.

Mountanman
Hayden, ID

My property taxes alone are more than 11% of my income. Sales taxes here are 5.5% of almost everything I buy except fuel which has it's own federal and state taxes of about $.55/gal. Then there is my federal and state income taxes, which is about 18% for federal and about 10% for state not counting capitol gains on my business. So, yes, I actually nearly 50% of my income goes for taxes! And now, I am told I must pay more?
What irritates me more than anything is my taxes keep increasing. I could sell my house and my business to avoid such high taxes but I worked all my life to establish both and it is not fair that I am punished for working hard and playing by the rules. Its very discouraging!

Lagomorph
Salt Lake City, UT

Mountanman:

I agree with airnaut. You aren't doing something right. I'm in a two income home with some rental income, solidly middle class, the usual deductions. We paid an effective rate of about 13% federal income tax (less than Mitt!). Throw in about 5% Utah state income tax and 6% sales tax, and about $4000 in property taxes on two houses (about 5% of income) and we're still well under 30% total taxes. You should find a better accountant.

RedShirt
USS Enterprise, UT

We do have too much government. Read the article "‘Welfare Nation’: The Sad Truth" at The Blaze. When you have 1.25 private sector workers for every person that either gets welfare assistance or works for government, we are getting into a scary situation.

How can we have a nation running where you have so many people dependant on those working in the private sector to support them?

To "Lagomorph" what about your SS taxes, Medicare, Medicaid, and your other payroll deductions. Just including your SS taxes would take you over 30% to what you state, then adding in the Medicare and Medicaid taxes will take you close to 40%.

airnaut
Everett, 00

RedShirt
USS Enterprise, UT

"Just including your SS taxes would take you over 30% to what you state, then adding in the Medicare and Medicaid taxes will take you close to 40%.

12:41 p.m. Dec. 19, 2012

============

Impossible Mr. RedShirt.

Social Security is a set rate of 4.6% and is CAPPED at $110,100

So it is infinity impossilbe to hit a 30% factoring in 4.6% SS tax,
and that percetnage only goes DOWN the more you make.

BTW -
Mitt Romney paid the same amount on his $25 Million as I did on my $115,000.
The difference is he made 217 TIMES mores than I did.

How is that possibly fair and equalitable?

ECR
Burke, VA

Redshirt - If you want to learn the truth stop reading The Blaze. Like everything Glen Beck does, The Blaze is all about putting money in his pocket. He will say any outrageous thing he can to provoke his listeners and exploit their loyalty just so he and his media empire can enjoy more profit. If you think the "liberal press" is in it for the money, just check the balance sheet of almost every major newspaper in America. Telling the truth often doesn't equate to financial success. Ah, but it usually equates to a good night's sleep.

Jory
payson, utah

Lagomorph and Airnaut

MountainMan could lower some of his taxes. Depends how he has his business classified. Then if he goes and do the things that will lower his taxes you will call him a tax cheat so their is no way he can win. Guess what, he could make a lot more money than you two to make that much in state income taxes.

I don't know why you two are arguing with him. Taxes are so fact dependent that you can't tell what he is paying is right or not. Besides his business is probably categorized different than yours (passive or not passive) that some deductions you get with your passive income (rental income) won't work with his. Learn the tax code before you comment on taxes.

Kent C. DeForrest
Provo, UT

Mountanman,

Sorry about your tax situation. If what you write is correct, either you own way too much property for your income, or your income is way too low for the amount of property you own. Same thing, of course. But if you're counting property tax that you pay for your business, that is a business expense and would reduce your income tax. I agree with Lagomorph. Get a new accountant.

Also, thanks for mentioning the gasoline tax. I forgot that one. But for me that adds up to less than $300 per year, so again, negligible. My total taxes are 23 percent of AGI, at most. And I would have to more than quadruple my salary to be affected at all by Obama's proposed tax increases.

procuradorfiscal
Tooele, UT

Re: "Let's face it, we all like big government."

No, we don't.

Only liberals want big government. But, unfortunately, too many rubes out there go along with them, since they don't care one way or the other, and are easily manipulated by disingenuous liberal promises of "free" stuff.

One good thing about the Obama regime -- it will soon force the rubes to the undeniable truth -- there's no such thing as "free" stuff, and there's no sugar daddy out there to tax for it but us.

RedShirt
USS Enterprise, UT

To "ECR" you may not like The Blaze, but the information that was gathered for that article is public information, and is true. Just because you don't like the source of the truth does not change the fact that for every 1.25 privatly employed person there is 1 person on government assistance or working for the government.

The wicked take the truth to be hard was quite a prophetic statement in light of today's liberals that can't refute truth when presented.

To "airnaut" do the math. Lagomorph claims that with the things he listed he pays 29% of his income in taxes. Now, add Medicare 2.9% tax, and SS of 4.9%. That puts Lagomorph at 36.8% (since we don't know his income we have to assume 4.9%). Now, if you include taxes paid on utilities like phone, gas, electricity, and local government fees, that can add in more. The total amount paid in taxes, even by Lagomorph is approaching 40%.

Mountanman
Hayden, ID

@ Kent. You suggested that I have too much house for my income. It may interest you to know that my property taxes have gone up every year I have lived here(over 20 years) because of levies that people here pass to increase property taxes, many of whom are not property owners themselves. So, what we have here are people finding yet another way to force others to pay for their schools, police, fire, library and local college without they themselves paying for any of it. Another round of entitlements?
In regards to fuel taxes, I fill my vehicle usually 3 times each week and it takes about 20 gals each time. The fuel taxes, both federal and state are about $.55/ gal. 60 gals times 52 times a year times $.55/gal=$1716.00 That is more than my family budget for clothing each year. Not insignificant to me!
Yes, I am TAXED TOO MUCH!

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