Published: Monday, Dec. 10 2012 12:00 a.m. MST
Sooner or later, whether from the Roberts-Scalia court or another, what we know
for sure is that judicial clarity will eventually clear the way for same-sex
marriage in all 50 states. And that there will be no damage to or diminution of
the traditional family. Gays and same-sex couples and their families will
continue to support, celebrate and honor traditional marriages among family and
friends and society at large.Traditional marriage will always
comprise at least 97-98% of all marriages and always be, by far, the largest
contributor to marriage and the family as the foundation of society. Gay
marriage and their families will contribute proportionately to that same strong
foundation. Their children will be just fine.The children of
traditional marriage will grow up with same-sex couples and their children and
families as friends, neighbors, playmates, schoolmates and even pew-mates. They
will see with their own eyes that they are just folks. There'll
be a brief period of unsettled administrative details and trivial lawsuits. Life
will go on basically unchanged except for same-sex couples and their children
and families celebrating their new found marriages.Time to move on
to something important.
This article is predictably conservative, from predictably conservative SLC.
Recently a man I admire said that one of the problems that the GOP has, is that
it has difficulty understanding another person's position. Here's yet
another case. It is not a human right for two other people to marry. It is
"social policy". And legislating from the bench is just that, not
"guaranteeing a minority of their basic human rights". It is ironic,
considering that the Mormans have been so persecuted throughout their brief
existence, that the people of SLC would seek to persecute those that are
different. I challenge you to think differently. Consider that the
word marriage is a religious word. That the right to marry is established in
churches and before God. So stay the heck out of my schools and
government, thank you very much.
"...the importance of prudence when reviewing democratically enacted social
policy."The rights of minority citizens should have never been
up for "democratically enacted social policy" votes in the first place.
It is wrong to deny others the very rights you partake of yourself.I
am trusting this Supreme Court to determine that in America, Equal Protection
means EQUAL PROTECTION FOR EVERYBODY.
Ranch I thought the same exact thing when I saw the photo "Equal Justice
Under the Law" on the front of the building.
If it were not for the Federal pronouncements against polygamous unions in the
late 19 Century, I would not think that marriaage law is a Federal question.
Regardless, it would not surprise me if the court rules that it is a state
issue, but requiring all states to give "full faith and credit" to the
laws of states that do decide to permit it.From the LDS standpoint
however, this would not be a welcome decision, and not just from a moral
standpoint, it also could also raise the specter of making polygamous unions
legal. Simply put, if same sex mariages are legal, can the law really maintain
the illegalty of any form of mutually agreed to adult unions?
Here's my prediction: The court will rule DOMA unconstitutional. On the
prop. 8 case they will issue a very narrow ruling which will not change the
states' ability to regulate marriage. They may decide on technical grounds
that prop 8 was either proper or improper. The ruling will apply only to
California, since California is the only state that approved gay marriage and
then rescinded the right to marry.
Yes, we wouldn't want the court to be ahead of some of the state's on
social issues. It was terrible that the court didn't let Southern states
work out their civil rights issues on their own without federal intervention.
Mike in Cedar City said: From the LDS standpoint however, this would not be a
welcome decision, and not just from a moral standpoint, it also could also raise
the specter of making polygamous unions legal.I'm not sure I
agree and think it might be a welcome decision.Then the church could
reinstitute polygamy, since it was only abandoned for statehood to begin
with.I know it had nothing to do with statehood just a quinkydink.Besides if all parties marrying are adults and can sign a contract, it
would be freedom of choice.
@Roland Keyser"On the prop. 8 case they will issue a very narrow
ruling which will not change the states' ability to regulate marriage. They
may decide on technical grounds that prop 8 was either proper or improper. The
ruling will apply only to California, since California is the only state that
approved gay marriage and then rescinded the right to marry."That's what I had predicted until someone pointed out to me a detail that
gives me pause... since that is what the appeals court had come up with, why
would the supreme court take up the case just to agree with the lower court
ruling?@Happy Valley Heretic"Then the church could
reinstitute polygamy, since it was only abandoned for statehood to begin
with."The church would never re-institute it if for no other
reason than the fact that re-instituting it would likely result in half the
church membership to leave within 5 years. Plus it would still leave a mess
seeing as its now a global church and many other nations still wouldn't
To "Shelama" unfortunately for you, and so many others like you, the
assumptions you made are wrong.Read "Dutch Decline: Losing
interest in matrimony" in the National Review.It is also harmful
to children. See "Man and wife? That's best for baby" in the
Austrialian National Times.As for seeing a significant upsurge in
marriages between gay couples. In the countries that have gay marraige, that
never materialized. Most gays will remain cohabitating, and little will change,
except marriage rates will continue to fall as people see marriage being
I think DOMA's going down, as it should, since it clearly violates Article
Four Section One of the constitution, the 'full faith and credit'
clause. I think Roberts will craft a narrow 6-3 opinion striking down Prop 8,
but only in California.
@Redshirt"marriage rates will continue to fall as people see marriage
being cheapened."'Gay people can get married? Well
that's it, I'm not going to bother marrying anyone myself.' -
said no straight Dutch person ever.
@redshirtonce again opinion pieces and pieces that use the erroneous
assumptions of the writer are not the same as research redshirt, try reading the
credible research the facts clearly contradict your opinions.
To "Tolstoy" once again, try reading what was posted, and the
researchers that were interviewed about their scientific research.Just because it is a news article about a study published. The article from
Australia is not an opinion piece. It is reporting on a study that was
published. It is no different than the AGW articles that you believe.Just because you reject the truthes contained in the article does not mean
they are invalid. You should try reading articles before you lie about their
content, that way you don't appear to be as ignorant as you do right now.
@atl134 said, "That's what I had predicted until someone pointed out to
me a detail that gives me pause... since that is what the appeals court had come
up with, why would the supreme court take up the case just to agree with the
lower court ruling?"To answer your question I believe the
Supreme Court may taking up this case because it is the 9th Circuit Court
decision that is being challenged (not the actual Proposition 8), which issued
the narrow decision (California only) which supported same-sex marriage. In
this instance, the Supreme Court could abandon the 9th Circuit Court decision,
which then would allow Proposition 8 to become effective banning same-sex
marriages in California. Or they could sustain it fully, which would then
cancel the Constitutional amendments of the other 31 States (including Utah)
that prevents same-sex marriages. Or they could decide on a narrow basis to
sustain the 9th Circuit Court decision so that this decision applies to
California only, leaving the other 31 State amendments to stand for right now.
In that instance, challenges to those other State amendments would have to be
appealed separately from this decision.
Judge Roberts showed his true liberal bias last summer so I suspect gay marriage
will be forced down our throats - like Obamacare - very soon. Every state -
including Utah - will be forced to recognize homosexual marriage regardless of
the what the people of the state say. Socialism doesn't regard states
rights - just the all powerful federal government. Get used to it.
@ RedShirt: Marriage in the Netherlands has been in decline for many years -
the decline started before gay marriage was allowed. And, yes, you can argue
that the decline started as soon as gay couples started to ask for permission to
marry and you may even be able to find support for that position - but, if the
gay marriage debate was handled in the Netherlands the same way it was handled
here, the only people you have to blame for the decline in marriage rates are
those who argued that marriage really isn't that important in all
situations and gays really don't need it since all benefits are available
without marriage. In other words, blame the decline in the desire to get
married on those who oppose same-sex marriage - they are the ones who talked
marriage down and devalued it.The "Man and Wife?" article
you reference is actually in the Sydney Morning Herald, was written by Chris
Meney, the director of the Life, Marriage and Family Centre in the Catholic
Archdiocese of Sydney, and is an editorial - not a fact-based article. All it
proves is the Catholic Church thinks people should be married before having
Let's get gay marriage legal and move on.
@redshirt So the article on the Netherlands at best shows a weak
correlation between the gay marriage debate and the decline in marriage but as
usual fails to provide any evidence of a causal relationship. I can make
erroneous correlations between the number of dead rabbits on the side of the
road and the number of telephone poles per mile but that does not mean their is
any casual relationship. Now if you have some evidence of a causal relationship
lets see it.
@redshirtthe article you quote from the Australian times does not seem to
exist anywhere on the internet, care to tell us exactly what research they make
reference to in support of their claims?
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