@ Blue Devil I did not say that Simpson was a lefty. I meant that he is not a
Conservative ( a moderate at best)and you thinking that he is must mean you are
As for politics, of course the Pres. is playing politics, of course Boehner is
playing politics, of course Krauthammer is playing politics. It's a
political system and process. It's the DEFINITION of politics, for
Pete's sake. What matters is that the people don't get screwed.
Which is almost certainly going to happen, but we've asked for it so
we'll just have to take our lumps and learn from it.
MikeRichards notes that the Constitution calls for the House to write budget
items. It's also important to note that the reason for this is precisely
because they are elected EVERY two years by local constituents, making them more
responsive to the will of the individuals in their districts. After all, money
policy is EVERYTHING in government. And recall, the people of the nation
(again) put Republicans in that position this past election. They have not just
A seat at the table, but THE seat at the table. But the Constitution also
allows the President to veto, giving him a seat at the table also. That is part
of the reason why it has become common for the president to propose a budget to
"I cannot undertake to lay my finger on that article of the Constitution
which granted a right to Congress of expending, on the objects of benevolence,
the money of their constituents." So said James Madison, the father of the
Constitution. Words have meaning. However, to most Democrats and Republicans,
and many unfortunate Americans, the constitution is in the way for the
progressive model of government, which is loss of liberty. We have now arrived
at model of society that is more associated with Egyptian slavery, then American
liberty. We can indeed ask our leaders what the great Russian writer
Dostoeevsky asked, "You, the would be future savior of mankind, do you
despise man or do you respect him?" I think it is quite obvious that our
political leaders despise mankind. They view most Americans as helpless.
Indeed, they are! If America is to survive, we must find like minded people who
believe again, like Thomas Paine, that "...Americans have within our power
to begin the world again."
The House should do its consitutional duty and pass a budget and sent it to the
Senate. Let the Senate decide if they will send it to the President. No more
negoitating with the president before hand. The president can't demand
anything from congress Republican or Democrate. Let's either live by the
consitution or start over again and let the people of this country decide what
type of government they want and are willing to fund.Also how is a
lawfully passed tax exemption in the tax code is a loophole? Deductions and Tax
credits have 2 purposes, to encourage a behavior or discourage behavior. The
term loophole is used by those who don't like what some one is doing.
Congress passed the deductions that oil companies are legally using because when
they were passed we wanted to encourage oil drilling. Currently companies that
have their sustainable energy projects on line by the end of the year are able
to take a tax credit in the current year for the investment. Isn't that a
loophole for the alternative energy companies or is it acceptable because
it's for green energy and not oil?
I have no doubt that if we go over the "Fiscal Cliff" that it will be
the GOP's "fault". Why? Because they made unresonable demands?
Because they were unwilling to work with the other side? No. Simply because with
the help of their friends in the media, the Democrats will be able to pin the
blame on them no matter what.As the last four years have proven,
nothing bad can be attributed to failed Obama policies. The abysmal economy was
all "Bush's fault". The high unemployment rate, the spiralling
debt, and every other negative economic number can be pinned on the GOP. The
buck never stops anymore at the oval office. Obama will still be blaming Bush in
2016.As the last election has proven. That is the new reality in
America. We might as well get used to it. We already went over the cliff on
We are letting these Lying politicians on both sides ruin America right before
our eyes.Obama clearly doesn't care about Freedom and
Capitalism.Republicans should not give an inch on his plan to
destroy America and plunge us further into debt.Hold the line. Let
Obama reveal who he really is to his blind democratic party.And
those of you who are not blind are the real problem. You see clearly that you
are destroying America. Please stop while there is still time.
"Deseret News were to cave into your personal wishes, simply because you do
not like those columnists, that would NOT be freedom of the press."No, what you describe would be freedom of the free market and Freedom of
Speach. Showing displeasure in what a commercial entity does is not restriction
of expression. Freedom of the press refers to government intervention,
regulation, and control by governmental entities. Publically disagreeing in how
a business runs itself is not Restraint of Press.The
"Church", not only because of federal regulations about non-profits and
politcal speach, but also because it represents a diversity of people who
believe in the same tenants of faith, has been most vocal about
non-partisanship. As an agent of the church, the Deseret News should follow the
admonishions of its owner.I beleive the Church should stay away from
and not affiliate itself with the dirty world of partisan politics - advocating
for issues instead. Telling the DN so in no way constrains DeseretNew's
abiltiy to publish whatsoever it likes. And yes, I think members
of the Church have the right to speak out when they disagree with a position
taken. That is called Freedom of Speach.
@The Taxman:"As you pointed out, if the Constitution is working
properly, isn't it the job of the House of Representatives, working with
the Senate, to craft legislation..."Excellent point, Taxman.
All money/funding bills are to originate in the House. Boehner should get on
with it, pass a bill and send it to the Senate. Then, if the Senate disagrees,
work it out with them. The president should stay out of it. Oh, wait. The
Senate is controlled by the president's party. Well, there goes our
'checks & balances' system.
@Blue:"Let me get this straight...Republicans, contrary to the wishes
of 70% of Americans, are threatening to tank the economy if their millionaire
friends don't get a tax cut..."Those 'millionaire
friends' are the ones who create jobs. What Republicans are trying to do
is to save the country from another recession.@There You Go
Again:"When Republicans announced they were going to wipe President
Obama off the face of the earth, it was nothing more than a power play."Not so. What it was, was a try to oust a socialist from controlling our
government. Didn't work... which seems to say that Americans want
@JoeBlow:"Thank you Charles, for pointing out the unconscionable power
grab by President Obama. Where would he get such an idea?"It's in his DNA.@1aggie:"Is Chuck living in
Washington State now because (he is clearly on something)?"If he
is, he is merely following the example of our president who tells us he was on
something in college with his friends."The fact is, or should I
say the reality is, if we go over the cliff, Republicans in the house will be
blamed."Republicans will get the blame because the media will
see to it.The truth is, if you are looking for the truth, the House
is supposed to decide what funds the president will get. It's called
'checks & balance.' If the president decides what the government
should spend the checks and balances of the Constitution go out the window...
becoming a figment of someone's imagination."It's is
time for the DN to drop Charles Krauthammer..."Typical Democrat
response... if you disagree with someone just eliminate them. Put a gag in
@mohokat - make that two of us laughing. You considering Alan Simpson a
"leftie", well that says plenty.... either you have no idea who Alan
Simpson is and his body of work, or you live on the very far extreme of
"conservative". In either case, if you categorize me and Mr. Simpson
as lefties, I welcome your derision with pride. I take that as a compliment and
validation.Mr. Richards, you once again contradict yourself. In one
post, the lack of a budget is Obama's fault, then here today, you claim
Obama is acting extra-constitutionally by engaging in this budget process. You
need to decide one way or another. Moutainman - if we could have as
many words as Charles has, it would no challenge to refute his opinions with
facts. Alas 200 words limit doesn't provide much opportunity for real
data. For example, Charles debt to GDP ratio numbers are way off, the problem
is actually way worse - and has been for over a decade. US debt to GDP has been
above 60 for a long time, and toped 102 percent.... much worse than most
european nations. His numbers are just wrong.But lets go back to
calling people "lefties".
@Mountainman - you also forgot the ultimate argument ender liberals use: calling
you a racist. That ends every argument. You're a conservative and or a
Republican therefore you are a racist and your opinion has no merit. So
anyway, President Obama wants to raise tax rates on Paul Millsap and Al
Jefferson and Kobe Bryant etc etc. How does that help anyone's life? Is
that really somehow going to make my life or your life any better? We're
still going to have a massive deficit and huge unfunded liabilities but
we'll all feel better because those evil rich like Paul, Al, and Kobe will
have lighter wallets.
"Is the House even in session right now? If so, what are they doing that is
more important than solving this (fiscal cliff) problem?"What is
more important? Apparently sowing fear and voting against the
disabled is what's more important.
@ VST. Its as predicable as the sun rising each day. Whenever Dr. Krauthammer
writes his opinion, the liberals who can not refute his position, always attack
him and call him names and demand that DN stop publishing his articles. If a
conservative don't like want someone in the media says, they just
don't read it or they change the channel or read something else. Not
liberals, they DEMAND that opposing voice be silenced, shouted down or banned!
If a liberal disagrees with a conservative, liberals call it free speech but if
a conservative disagrees with a liberal, liberals call it "hate speech".
Mike,"Why then is he demanding that the House pass his
legislation?"I haven't heard the President make such a
demand. Please direct me to a (legitimate) source where I can read the
quote.But since you raise the above question, I think it fair to ask
why so many Republicans (and the talking heads who represent them) are demanding
a plan from the White House? As you pointed out, if the Constitution is working
properly, isn't it the job of the House of Representatives, working with
the Senate, to craft legislation that will pass both bodies and be signed into
law by the President? Why is Congress not doing its job, and who is Congress is
holding up the show? Is the House even in session right now? If so, what are
they doing that is more important than solving this (fiscal cliff) problem?
@UtahBlueDevil I am still laughing. You say there are quite a few conservative
writers you enjoy.Then you mention Bennett and Simpson. That tells me how much
of a leftie you are to call those two conservative.
The GOP already has Faux News carrying its water, misinforming the weak-minded,
and thereby influencing them to vote against their self-interests. It does not
need the DN to do the same through its poor choice of editorial pieces.
UtahBlueDevil hit the nail on the head when he/she said "the DN, as owned
and published by the LDS church, should rise above such poorly though out
partisan "stuff"." The Church owns the DN and as long as it does
(and as long as I am a member) I will hold the DN to a higher standard than
other newspapers.The distinct lean to the right (as VST admits above) and
steady diet of opinion pieces from such reality-challenged authors like Charles
Krauthammer and George Will does not, IMO, serve the interests of the worldwide
church that owns it.I must add here that the continued censorship
practiced by the DN moderators (which, in many cases, extends far beyond their
stated policy and into refusing to publish comments they disagree with) also is
of great concern to me.
The Republican House was elected to represent the people of the United State.
The House originates all budget bills, unless Obama has already destroyed the
Constitution. The President has sworn an oath to defend the Constitution. Why
then is he demanding that the House pass his legislation? The President has no
authority to legislate.Obama's true colors have come out. He
is walking down the same road as every "would be" dictator has walked.
He thinks that his tantrums have merit. All that he has proven is that he can
lie on the floor and kick his legs in anger. We tolerate such behavior in a
two-year old, but we expect just a little more maturity from the President of
The United States.
When Republicans announced they were going to wipe President Obama off the face
of the earth, it was nothing more than a power play.
Can we get something straight here in this "national conversation"? If
tax rates go up from current levels on any income bracket it's called a tax
hike. If rates are allowed to remain at current levels it's not a "tax
cut". It's simply allowing rates to stay at current levels. I
don't understand how so many people are allowed to get away with saying
that allowing rates to stay the same is a "tax cut". It's not. I don't personally care if tax rates go up on "the rich" since
"the rich" voted overwhelmingly for Obama but let's call it what it
is: mob rule. When individual rights to equal protection are sacrificed to the
whims of the mob then it's called mob rule and it's what our Founders
were most afraid of. But I say let rates go up on the rich. It won't
help the economy and it may not necessarily increase revenue to the Federal
Government (not that Obama really cares about that crucial point) but it will
make a lot of unhappy people feel better about themselves
UtahBlueDevil has hit the nail on the head: The DN, as owned and published by
the LDS church, should rise above such poorly thought out partisan
"stuff". I would have stopped reading the DN long ago but I am a member
of the LDS Church and feel I have a badly-behaving relative who needs
correcting. If the Church divests itself of the DN I will stop
reading/commenting. But our Church is a worldwide church (and this is a
worldwide website), so until the DN lays off the hard-right-wing partisan
opinion pieces (frequently not based in reality) that I feel will only drive
away reasonably intelligent investigators, I will comment.
VST - so my opinion on this opinion piece... you felt compelled to comment on my
comment? Do you not see the irony of that. I respectfully pass your own advice
right back to you.You see, I see the DN, as owned and published by
the LDS church, should rise above such poorly though out partisan
"stuff". There are many conservative writers I quit enjoy. They most
often try to make a coherent argument worth debate. I usually enjoy
Bennett's contributions, and Alan Simpson is one of my favorites.You see, some actually like political debate - find it a great method of
coming to reasonable solutions. But stuff like this "opinion" which
elevates itself just barely above "i know you are, what I am".... I
think the DN could do much better.But there you go VST, my
opinion.... feel free to when ever you see my post to skip right on over them,
as you so kindly advised. Or comment about it... that is what this is all
Power grab?The hypocrisy in this article is mind boggling.Let me get this straight...Republicans, contrary to the wishes of 70% of
Americans, are threatening to tank the economy if their millionaire friends
don't get a tax cut... and _they're_ talking about a "power
grab?"Lets remember how we got here in the first place:Tax cuts, which reduced federal revenues by hundreds of billions of dollars
each year, but which produced zero economic stimulation,Plus,Two unfunded foreign wars, the costs for which are thousands of dead
Americans, tens of thousands of seriously wounded Americans AND about two
trillion dollars.Will conservatives _ever_ admit that the deficits
they like to thump their chests about today were created by policies they
enthusiastically embraced ten years ago? Are our memories really
Charlie is kind of a negative nellie.
Is Chuck living in Washington State now because (he is clearly on something)?
His statement "If Obama remains intransigent, let him be the one to take us
over the cliff. And then let the new House, which is sworn in weeks before the
president, immediately introduce and pass a full across-the-board restoration of
the Bush tax cuts" shows such a disconnect from reality that I'm
reminded of election night when Mitt didn't bother to write a concession
speech even though statisticians like Nate Silver (who predicted the electoral
count accurately) had been saying for weeks that Obama would win.The fact
is, or should I say the reality is, if we go over the cliff, Republicans in the
house will be blamed. It is time for the DN to drop Charles Krauthammer because
he, like other talking heads like George Will, have lost touch with the real
world and are only serving as enablers for many Utahns to remain outside
Chuck continues to amaze me with his bad articles that couldn't be further
from the truth. Dnews, you could do so much better. You're truly doing your
readers a disservice by continuing to publish this guy.
As many astute Americans have always known about Obama, it all about power and
control with him. He is a controller and he wants as many people as possible to
be dependent upon the state aristocracy. To be dependent on something or someone
takes away that person's power and control over their own lives, it just
another kind of slavery to the state aristocracy. This same kind of state
aristocracy exists in Cuba, N. Korea, in the former USSR and E. Germany.
That's why Obama never met a tax he doesn't love, it gives him control
of the wealth in America. Control the wealth and you can control everything!
That's why we have Obamacare, it give the state control of your health.
This is the "fundamental change" Obama promised to bring to America and
he is making great progress.
Boehner and McConnell aren't playing politics and trying to grab power for
the Republicans? Really? I still wonder why partisan drivel like
this makes it into print. This is nothing more that political cheerleading.
Charles would serve us all better if he used his powerful intellect presenting
ideas, and supporting them, than this ongoing school yard bashing of the other
side. With Mitch McConnell's now failed threat to make Obama a
one term president a foot note in history, perhaps the loyal opposition can
spend more time trying not engineer the failure of the president, and more on
providing leadership that demonstrates they are the party that deserves Americas
trust next election cycle.
Well said Dr. and the truth in every way. We are dealing with a would be
"and then demanded that Congress turn over to the president all power over
the debt ceiling."Thank you Charles, for pointing out the
unconscionable power grab by President Obama. Where would he get such an
idea?Well, maybe he got it from a bill introduced by Mitch McConnell
in 2011 doing just that.Mr Krauthammer conveniently left that part out.And then, Mr McConnell filibusters his own bill which would force a vote
on it.This would be a great comedy skit, except that it is true. And
that these are the leaders of our country.This proves once again
that the best way to get Republicans to be against their own ideas is for Obama
to take up the cause.