To "Wonder" stop your lies. I never said nor implied anything like what
you say. You are just becoming an example of a typical liberal who jumps to
conclusion with absolutely no evidence to support your extreamist point of view.
Well guess what, Redshirt? Liberals don't think "Business bad -
Government good". Take your own advice and stop stereotyping people who
disagree with you.
To "LDS Liberal" again,you show your absolute lack of understanding of
conservatives.Conservatives don't believe "Business Good /
Government Bad".They believe that Businesses, in general, are
more efficient than government. Some businesses are good, and some bad, just
like not everybody is good and not everybody is bad.Conservatives
know that the larger and more power government has, the worse it is. This is a
fact that can be seen in the Communist countries. The counries that gave
government more power are struggling the most, and the communist countries that
are easing up on control are doing better. That is a fact.Your
ultra extream attitudes do not help. It only points out that with liberals it
is their way or no way.
So those fees (also known as a tax) on your bill, they pay Obamaphones. The
government has saddled the phone companies with the task of collecting taxes for
government use, and those taxes cost more per month than basic phone service.
Until just recently the cost of the line $11, taxes and fees (more taxes) over
$13. or in other words 120% tax on phone service. So excessive!So
isn't your government sneaky? They fooled even you, the great truth
seeker!Liberals should learn the truth before they post here.The truth is conservative biased. It takes huge corporate media outlets
to corrupt the truth to make it look liberal biased and sell it to the masses.
Now that you know this are you ready to join us? We will welcome
you. We are completely inclusive. We won't check your race or gender, I
promise. You just have to love the truth and love the USA.
Oh Old Man,You have been fooled. Politifact is one of those biased
outlets feeding you half-truths. Obamaphones, as their recipients
choose to call them, are in fact paid by people who pay for their phone
service.The Free Government Cell Phone website says right on it that
"The government will pay for your free cell phone and service"Washington Examiner:The program is called Lifeline, established in
1984, originally created to subsidize landline phone service for low income
Americans, funded by government-collected telecommunication fees, paid by
consumers.To be continued
"T get sick and tired of your insults and of your representatives imposing
policies which harm my family because those who voted for them want them to.
"I'm sick and tired of your backwards economic policy which
has only hurt middle-class families. I'm sick of the unfair tax
policy which rewards top earners (who then buy off more government officials)
while hurting those who are the real workers and job creators in this
country.I'm sick of your wars. Iraq didn't attack us.
Afghanistan didn't attack us, Osama Bin Laden and his terrorist group
did.I'm sick of you folks drilling only to sale that oil to
foreign countries.I'm sick of your excuses, your party had
control of this country, and ruined it.I'm sick of your reps
not compromising, but running our country off cliffs.Stop trying to
define marriage and take choice away from women. Let people decide and let God
judge.Most of all, I'm sick of your ilk attacking those who
disagree with you.
dwaynerichards 5:49 pm:I could take everything you said and apply it
to conservatives in Utah who voted for Bush twice.Obama won. Romney
lost. Get over it.
I can't understand people who accuse others living the life on the
governments dime. I got laid and I was making 29 a hour plus benefits. On
unemployment I took home 450 a week and it was taxed at fifteen percent. Most sane people would rather make 29 an hour vs $400 a week.
@ Mountanman 8:02 a.m. Dec. 4, 2012"Gaming the system is the
newest and fastest growing occupation in America." You mean like
all the schemers on Wall St who hatch plans that make 3 card monte look like
well... 3 card monte? p.s. isn't interesting that Utah... is
notorious for people who get conned by can't miss schemes? And, the number
of people who work in *financial services*?
@SLarsDon't forget Medicare as well. That is also a subsidy to the
insurance industry. The majority of healthcare spending is done in the last
years of a persons life, and even more specifically the last 6 months to a year
of a persons life. When they are on Medicare.
Re:RedshirtIn nearly every recession, when unemployment is above
7.2%, unemployment benefits have been extended. For example, they were extended
early In Bush's term in office. The most recent extension of unemployment
benefits was part of the "Middle Class Tax Relief and Job Creation Act of
2012," passed by Congress (yes, Republican-controlled and Republican
sponsored).People don't qualify for unemployment without recent
work experience. Who are the long term unemployed?Pew did some research
and found:" In the current recession, older workers (45+) are
less likely than younger workers to become unemployed in the first place. But,
once an older worker loses his job, he’s far, far more likely to enter the
ranks of the long-term unemployed than the younger worker is."
LDS Liberal,The President is not the chief executive officer of the
United States. The Constitution never refers to the President by that term. In
Article II, Section I, Clause 1 it states "The executive power shall be
vested in a President of the United States of America" and the Constitution
refers to them as President and their office as the "office of President of
the United States." "This is what wrong with conservative
"Business Good / Government Bad" mind-set."No one
believes business is good and government is bad. A conservative understands that
while business may make bad decisions it will impact very few and mostly be to
the detriment of their owners but when government makes bad decisions it is to
the detriment of the whole of society. I don't care if the CEO of Walmart
messes up and Walmart goes out of business anymore than I care Hostess went out
of business."We might whole-heartedly disagree, but for
Pete's sake, at least try to be consistant!"Try to
understand consistency. Hostess isn't the U.S. I never bought from them but
I pay taxes and you waste my money on your stupid agenda.
How can conservatives - with any sort of straight face - villify the Chief
Executive - America's CEO is you will - the buck stops here, ect.,ect. for
the sole cause and ultimately responsible for 100% of America's whoa's
....Pamper, Cottle, Excuse and even defense a Hostee Business
CEOs.?This is what wrong with conservative "Business Good /
Government Bad" mind-set.It's inconsistant, hypocritical,
biased, one-sided and completely unrealistic.We might
whole-heartedly disagree, but for Pete's sake, at least try to be
Hostess underfunded the pension plan by 75%. They took 75% that belonged to the
employees and put it in the business to cover up their mistakes. America's
biggest problem is lack of ethics in business, and poorly educated businessmen.
Medicaid exists because of insurance companies and their ability to refuse
per-existing conditions. Insurance skims off the healthy cream, and forces the
government to take care of those with illnesses. It's a form of subsidy for
our insurance industry.
Can we just rename the Republican Party the Heartless Party or the Let Them
Starve Party and be done with it? They really seem to have no interest in
preserving the Republic, except for those who can pay their own way (a smaller
and smaller percentage, as time goes by). Let's get "Republic" out
of their name once and for all. Or maybe we could just call them the Economic
To "airnaut" actually we have a lot of unemployment benefits being paid
from sources outside the FUI and SUI. The Democrats have authorized numerous
spending bills that funnel federal tax dollars into unemployment benefits. That
is money that was used to bail out the unemployment insurance. One example of
this can be seen in "25K Nevadans Will Lose Unemployment Benefits Without
Budget Deal" at Breitbart. The federal budget is in fact used to extend
benefits beyond what the system could otherwise support.
To "LDS Liberal" actually we are not quite to a 1:1 ratio for makes vs.
takers. See "‘Welfare Nation’: The Sad Truth" at The Blaze.
We currently are at 1.25 workers in private industry for every government
worker/welfare recipient. That is not a good ratio.If the Unions
didn't run a dying company into the ground, then explain who did? We have
already done the math, and even if the executives were spending $2 million per
year on bonuses, that is equal to 5 cents per hour of wages. However, if the
union was requesting a $2/hr raise for just 25% of the employees, that would
have cost Hostess $18.6 million. Tell us, which would cause more financial harm
to a business?You say "these same Folks blame the executive in
government Office for every ill in the entire Country" yet aren't you
the same person who has repeatly blamed Bush for Iraq, Afghanistan, $5 trillion
in new debt, and all sorts of things for the past 12 years? So, unless you are
laughing at yourself, you are showing your "hypocriasy and dis-connect."
As I understand it - FUI and SUI [Federal State Unemployment Insurance] is paid
for by the working Employee.It is shown as earnings on the W-2.It is a benefit the worker PAYS for in the mis-forunate event he'she
becomes unemployed.and like any other Insurance, he'she is then
eligbile to file a claim and draws from it.It's not different
than Health Insurance or Auto Insurance.You've paid into it, and IF
you need it - you are covered.I get sick and tired those who
don't know, and don't care to find out the facts and mindlessly
regurgitate the garbage they hear on the radio from college-drop-out,
drug-addicts, who marry and divocre 3 times, NO children, and claim the moral
high ground of via the Rush Limbaugh Institute of Conservative Studies.
Let's just say for the sake of argument that some people are scamming the
system. And the reality is that some are I suppose. But even most of these
"scammers" would probably prefer to be middle or upper class. I
don't think any lives well if on food stamps or unemployment or disability.
They might have the "lifestyle" of getting by but I don't think
any of these people are living the dream. As for the ones that need these
services, well they need these services and more compassion is in good order.
It is true that the federal government can only spend the money it takes from
taxpayers. Part of the reason that this truism is also a lie is the unsaid
facts that the same is true for every state and local government and all the
successful business operations in the USA. Governments exist do the
things that the people who own the government want it to do. The only universal
rules are that the task must be possible and that the people are willing to pay
for it. The problem with our Constitution is that unscrupulous
people have devised too many hurdles for the people to change it. Technology,
knowledge and the need for workers have changed and we need to update the rules
of government. When the takers outnumber the workers where will we
be? Right where we are. All of us in America are takers of our
Well why don't any conservatives ever just do it themselves? I've
never heard ANY testimony of someone testing their theory that the welfare
system is so good you can just kick back and enjoy the easly life on it.Why not? Where are the conservatives with proof that they tried it and
it was SOOOOOO easy to take advantage of the system? Lots of conservatives have
been out of work in the last 10 years. Where are they? I should be hearing from
hundreds and thousands of conservatives about how easy it was for them on
some of you right wing talkers are just a veritable dictionary of Fox News
taking points. Giving governments money is just feeding an addiction? Reading
some of these inane comments makes me wonder who really has the addiction.
Like Hostess -- The BAKERS were the Makers, The CEOs and
Executives in Office making bad business decisions were the "Takers".But keep blaming the Unions for running a 100 year old Company into the
ground.[Funny, these same Folks blame the executive in government
Office [Pres. Obama] for every ill in the entire Country, but can't seem to
be able to make the same sort of connection and accountablity with Business
Executives. the hypocriasy and dis-connect is truely Amazing!]
Many of you are missing the point! More taxes will not help, unless we cut
government spending! Giving the government more money is like giving an
alcoholic more booze to cure his addiction, it won't help! We will never
tax our way out of this mess! The government is like a 500 pound gorilla that
demands and consumes ever more of the efforts of those who are called upon to
feed it, it cannot go on much longer.
"When the takers outnumber the workers, where we will be?"Patricia Sorensen============== We're aleady
there.1% are takers who produce nothing, yet own 80% of the wealth,99% are the makers who actully do the production, and fight over the remaining
scraps off the table.Other "Takers" would be like WalMart,
or WallStreet, Bankers, Money Changers.while the true "The Makers"
- are dying in factory fires in Pakistan and Bangladesh or jumping out of
factory buildings in China.But keep symbolically washing your hands
of their blood, or blaming Obama if it makes you feel better and helps you sleep
Which jobs would those be, Patricia? Are your going to require "job
creators" to hire unqualified people and then train them? Or do the
potential workers (who currently have no job and no money) need to be retrained
I agree with only one statement made by Patricia: "Nothing in life is free
for anyone who works for a living, only those who choose to live on others'
hard work get things for free." Like, for instance, Mitt Romney and other
wealthy investors who do not produce a product but reap huge windfalls from the
work of productive people. Mitt made what, $20 million, in 2011? While doing
what? Running for president. He's obviously a taker, since he didn't
really produce anything.
I always wonder what would have happened if we had taken the money spent on the
war on Iraq and instead invested it in created job and education programs across
the united states. To the tune of BILLIONS AND BILLIONS of dollars.I
wonder what would have happened.
Those who earn seven or even eight figures per year for doing nothing but
sitting on a board or heading up a company are the real takers. They
haven't "earned" anything, they are merely taking from the people
in the companies who are the actual producers. It's completely
backwards to think otherwise.
Don't be surprised, It's people who think like this that will
one day fully support "Death Panels".There only 2 ways to
end hunger, pain or suffering - 1. Feed, Clothe, and healor2. Put them quickly out of their misery.The letter reminds me of
story great story told and re-told this time of year -- A Christmas
Carolby Charles Dickens[Are there no prisons? are there
no workhouses? If they'd rather die, then they had better do it and
decrease the surplus population!]Merry Christmas Ms. Scrooge.FYI - Beware - The Nazis chose the latter for their "final
solution" to the same problem.
Chris, I sure get a kick out of people who believe in the Obamaphone myth.Actually, it's a program that was started by Ronald Reagan, but is
not paid for with government funds.Here's a clip from
Politifact: Q: Has the Obama administration started a program to use
"taxpayer money" to give free cell phones to welfare recipients?A: No. Low-income households have been eligible for discounted telephone
service for more than a decade. But the program is funded by telecom companies,
not by taxes, and the president has nothing to do with it. Why
can't people on the right seem to make an effort to learn the truth before
posting comments? Perhaps it's because it's true that Truth Has A
The writer points out that there are those who truly need and should be helped,
and there are also those who are clueless leaches, and a whole lot of welfare
people somewhere in between. So is it wrong to try to root out the ones who
should and could be working and are not?By the way, my
hypersensitive democrat friends, a free phone is one of the programs welfare
people get, but it was not the writer who instantly jumped to Obamaphones, it
was one of you.Obamaphones, Obamaphones, Obamaphones! I know
it's embarrassing, even if no one actually says it, but until you stop
supporting the Obamaphone lady mentality, you will continue to be so sensitive,
that soon you won't even be able to see someone in business clothes talking
on a cell phone without thinking, "That nasty successful person said
Obamaphone to me!"
I have an idea for Patricia... How about instead of complaining she actually
does something about her (imaginary) problem? How about she starts
up her own business, employs (legal) American workers, and pays them 50k+ per
year plus benefits? That way, folks wouldn't have to rely on
"government handouts" to pay for food or receive basic health care. That
way, her employees could contribute something to society instead of being
"takers." That way, Patricia would be contributing to society something
other than hateful and bitter letters which make excuses for why Mitt Romney
Medicaid is a band-aid that became necessary because this nation would not
provide universal health care as other advanced nations have long done. There
are some that need it on a temporary basis, there are some that have abused
it,(but very few) and there are some that have chronic medical conditions and
disabilities that preclude them from working and obtaining private health
insurance. Since it is largely administered by the state government,
medicaid's competence to meet medical needs is affected by the political
orientation of each state.In Utah, no matter what your health needs
are, it is almost impossible to obtain Medicaid if you happen to be male, and
not easy if you are female. It will be interesting to see if this right wing
republican dominated state will opt for the expansion of Medicaid under the ACA.
As hard as right wing Utah government is to the plight of the poor
and disadvantaged, and suspicious of their motives, I bet they opt out.
Two-thirds of Medicaid funds are spent on seniors in nursing homes. They would
surely get out of their beds and get a job if our socialistic president
hadn't forced them to become dependent on government handouts.
Excellent response Emajor. I would add that what Mrs. Sorensen doesn't
understand, is that the vast majority of those who get food stamps, and medicade
do have jobs. They are workers. They simply work for the likes of those on
this blog who brag about being job creators but don't pay a living wage and
don't give any benefits.By the way Mrs. Sorensen when you work
but don't earn a living wage, you can scrape together $150 for a microwave
on a one time basis, but you can't put together $500 each month for health
insurance. That's the difference. PS. The second you mentioned
Obama phones you lost all credability with the knowing.
People who write letters like this are usually quite ignorant of the facts.
Patricia's class warfare was used by the repubs in the last election, it
has been debunked countless times by experts, and this hate agenda was clearly
rejected a few weeks ago.More sour grapes from the right. Nothing
new here.People like Patricia don't use facts to back up their
opinions. No matter what we tell her she'll still believe what she wants to
Gaming the system is the newest and fastest growing occupation in America. The
facts tell the truth; the number of people receiving disability payments from
S.S. has doubled in the last 10 years. Either the gamers have figured out how to
scam the system or the work places of America have suddenly and mysteriously
become very dangerous. More people are receiving some kind of aid from the
government today than at any time in our history. Its difficult to argue with
facts but it sure wins elections! We taxpayers better shut up and get to work
and sign on to more tax increases because the gamers (victims) are depending on
you! That, in a nut shell, is the message from Obama. More gamers=more Democrat
It is the difference between a hand out and a hand up. This is so obvious that
it needs little discussion.
This is a common refrain but I am guessing that Mrs. Sorensen has no idea how
many people are using these programs as a temporary help vs. how many are
abusing them. I don't want to pay for people's abuse of the system
either, but I am not going to judge anyone without knowing their individual
circumstances. Mrs. Sorensen doesn't sound like she knows anyone's
individual circumstances except her own. Her argument that the poor
live better than the global average leaves me a bit cold. I suppose that since
you have a microwave rather than squatting in the dirt around a fire, you
couldn't possibly have other needs. Sorry, Mrs. Sorenson, owning a
microwave and TV doesn't mean you are abusing the food stamp system. Or
that you can afford medical expenses. This is the same diseased thinking that
leads to First World corporations who employ Third World people in sweatshops to
claim "hey, the working conditions are bad and the pay is worse &
I'd never put up with it, but it's better than they are used to".
Patricia, your letter is hyper-simplistic conservative whining based on right
wing sour grapes about why Republicans lost as much as they did last month.Until you see Americans as more than "takers" vs.
"makers," you won't be able make a meaningful contribution to the
debate about federal budget priorities.