Utah Romney vote was moot. He needed voters in Ohio, like Karl Rove promised.
The election results moots all of the above. Time to stop rooting for a bad
economy and for the President to fail. He did not.
In response to the question, "Why don't you check the independant fact
checkers to see what they say."Because the fact checkers cited
don't seem to be looking at facts. GM and Chrysler did undergo bankruptcy
under Obama. The difference is that, where Mitt Romney called for an orderly
proceeding guided by the rule of law, their bankruptcy was managed by a
political task force which paid off Obama's union allies first, leaving the
car companies with the same structural weaknesses they had in the first
place.An orderly bankruptcy would have made the car companies much
stronger and more able to compete. Obama saved them temporarily, but
Romney's approach would have saved them long-term.As for
outsourcing, why is expanding overseas evil only when Romney does it? As I said
before, the purpose of the ad was to expose a double standard, which it did
J ThompsonSPRINGVILLE, UTServing Christ is not commensurate with
serving in the military? I wonder what the Prince of Peace would say about that?
The greatest man who ever lived did not serve in the military. He told us to
Dora's he did. Think about it. Who do you follow and why?Thank
goodness we have a military, but thank goodness we also have tens of thousand
who are teaching people to live together in peace. What is absurd is
to think that killing people leads to peace. How many armies have fought in the
Middle East? Where is the peace?================== Some
of us - did BOTH.Myself, Pres. Monson,Captian Moroni, Mormon....What is absurd is to think that killing people leads to
peace. Which is why all of us who HAVE served are bleeding heart Liberals
and are the VERY LAST ones to cry for war.I wonder what the Prince
of Peace would say about that?
Nate Why don't you check the independant fact checkers to see what they
say.Obama pulled GM and Chryser out of Bankruptcy...CheckThe Italians bought Chrysler...CheckBecause of the Success of Jeep
in America, Fiat is considering expanding to China...CheckMitt
Romney will fight for every profit dollar, shipping American jobs overseas if
need be...checkIn his disingenuous ad, Romney insinutes that
American jobs at jeep will be transferred to China...CheckThe
American Auto industry was ultimately saved by Obama over the published
objections of many republicans including Mitt Romney ...Checkmate.
Might as well quote the ad itself:"Obama took GM and Chrysler
into bankruptcy and sold Chrysler to Italians who are going to build Jeeps in
China. Mitt Romney will fight for every American job."Obama
took GM and Chrysler into bankruptcy...check.Obama sold Chrysler to
Italians...check.Fiat is going to build Jeeps in China...check.Mitt
Romney will fight for every American job...check.Now let's
count all the Pinocchio's...hmmm, that comes to zero. They're all
true statements.The purpose of this ad is to show that Obama is
guilty of the same things he's been accusing Romney of.
Wow! Looks like a bunch of MSNBC viewers. I didn't think there were that
many in the whole country. How can anyone be that misinformed?
RedShirt. The Jeep ad may have been technically correct(or not) but the clear
intent of the add was to insinutate that Jeep Jobs in Ohio were going to China.
Deliberately false Insinuations are just as dishonest as out right factual
misrepresentations I don't really understand what Romney
thought he would accomplish with that ad. But he knows that the mainstream
press has mostly ignored his constantly applied political misrepresentations.
But even then they call him "Mendatious Mitt". But that handle is way
too kind, Romney isn't just any polition,and in the public mind he will be
held to a higher standard. Otherwise the almost puritanical ethic of the LDS
Church is nothing more than trivial moral relativism.
Negative TV ads are a persuasive means of convincing audiences candidates are
the ultimate doom for America. Unfortunately, these ads target voters ignorant
to real issues, who fall prey to comments about Big Bird or Muslim terrorists.
Negative ads misrepresent and distort, distracting the unintelligent voter by
scaring them into selecting a candidate. Make choices founded on fact and
research, rather than simplistic ads.If Obama is responsible for
"petty and trivial attacks"(which I do agree), it's not the
vindictive, calculated attacks on women, homosexuals, minorities, and the poor,
of which the GOP and Mitt Romney are currently responsible for.I hope you
don't call yourself a feminist, Mr. Curtis. While you are preoccupied with
Big Bird, you're supporting a platform that takes away fundamental rights
for women and is radically right-winged. Though it's impressive
an Utahan voted for Obama in 2008, your attitude is unsurprising, coming from
Provo. If you provided any solid evidence for choosing Romney, perhaps I could
have been convinced. Mitt's supporters are more preoccupied with
Obama's faults, rather than Romney's credibility. What REALLY changed
your mind about Obama? Is it truly a trivial, giant, yellow bird?
Christian, relax. Maybe you didn't actually read the WaPo fact
check, okay, here's its conclusion: The series of statements in
the ad individually may be technically correct, but the overall message of the
ad is clearly misleading — especially since it appears to have been
designed to piggyback off of Romney’s gross misstatement that Chrysler was
moving Ohio factory jobs to China.It is also especially strange that
the ad touts Romney’s endorsement by the Detroit News, when the editorial
actually backs up Obama’s criticism of Romney’s response to the auto
industry crisis.Four PinocchiosI know, I know, context
is such a hard thing for some people to understand. I have no idea why. See, I
can say a factual statement or two, and if I give no context for them they can
be highly misleading. But anyway, this fact check is not the only
one to claim that the Romney ad is a blatant lie, there are plenty of others.
I wonder if RedShirt ever considers that his pining for the GWB days leaves him
a little...alone. Wars tend to employ lots of people, and if we can do it off
the books, well, so much the better. Warrantless wiretaps, "signing
statements", and a freshly thought up legal framework (the Unitary
Executive) to explain it all. An attack happens under our noses, but it's
just collateral damage....until four more die in Libya. RedShirt has his own
case of amnesia when it comes to the credit rating debacle brought on
exclusively by his party. Salsa Libre might be the smartest person in Provo.
So the Wa Po fact check did say that EVERY STATEMENT in the ad about Jeep was
CORRECT. Then they gave it 4 Pinocchios. So everything Romney said
was true, but he lied? Sounds like deep liberal bias to me.Also
sounds like the crazed Obama worshipping liberal dribble that has filled this
comment forum.Thank goodness there are lots of media outlets so
there is at least some balance.Oh and go vote for Romney! Our
children and grandchildren can't afford another 4 years of Obama debts.
Serving Christ is not commensurate with serving in the military? I wonder what
the Prince of Peace would say about that? The greatest man who ever lived did
not serve in the military. He told us to Dora's he did. Think about it.
Who do you follow and why?Thank goodness we have a military, but
thank goodness we also have tens of thousand who are teaching people to live
together in peace. What is absurd is to think that killing people
leads to peace. How many armies have fought in the Middle East? Where is the
peace?@Mark, So you're claiming that the Deseret
News and the Washington Post made up the emails? You're claiming that the
live video feed that those newspapers reported did not exist? How long are you
going to believe Obama as he covers himself by having Hillary Clinton take the
fall for him? It's beyond credibility to think that all sources and all
reports are wrong just because Obama says so. Hillary took responsibility. It
looks like she knows the real consequences of lying, a lesson that Obama will
Richards, can you provide any evidence to back up your claims about Benghazi?
Be precise, and cite your sources. So far nobody has been able to do
this. So there is you challenge, can you be the first? Remember, be precise, and
cite sources. Redshirt, the WaPo fact check you are referring to
gave Romney's Jeep ads 4 Pinocchios, in other words he really, really lied.
Why do you keep trying to misrepresent what the fact check said?
To "Redshirt" FactCheck dot Org says that Romney distorts the facts on
Jeep and the auto bailout, contrary to your assertion . Re ACA...3.1 million
Americans who would not have been covered without the change were not
covered...are you trying to tell us they are ALL sitting at home doing nothing?
Re: our AAA credit rating, it was Congress and folks like Lee, Ryan and
Chaffetz...Republicans... who undid the deal the Speaker of the House had with
the President on the debt ceiling. S & P downgraded us on lack of political
cooperation not on the amount of debt.
J ThompsonSPRINGVILLE, UTAn LDS Church mission is not, in any
way, commensurate with military service. Talk to a veteran and ask him/her if
converting people to a specific religion is equivalent to fighting for the
safety and security of the American people.Perhaps in Utah and among
LDS members missionary activity is seen as "much the same", but to those
having the responsibility to protect us against our enemies, the thought is
If you want trivial attacks without substance look no further than the repubs
and faux news.
@ Salsa Libre,I hope you feel much better now that you've
gotten that off your chest, but I totally disagree that I, or Rush Limbaugh or
Shawn Hannity or anyone except President Obama needs to bear any responsibility
for the actions or the inaction of our President. Regardless of how Obama has
tried to tell us that Bush "did it" or that the movie maker "did
it". HE did it - all by himself.We hired him to represent the
United States. He works for us. We allowed him to speak in our behalf. He has
chosen to speak for himself. After taking an oath before us that he
would defend the Constitution, presumably knowing that, according to the
Constitution, he is "Commander in Chief" of the military, he decided to
LET four Americans die without doing anything to help them, without lifting a
finger.That is not something trivial. He would be charged with
dereliction of duty were he a private in the military. If his
conduct is acceptable to you, then support him. His CONDUCT is unacceptable to
me. It is not anyone's fault but his own.
To Mike in Cedar City Why do I doubt that this writer ever voted for
Obama. Trivial attacks? Good grief how do they compare with the outright lies
being pushed by the Romney Campaign? You know, the continuing lie about Jeep
jobs being outsourced to China, that he made the economy worse lie, the "you
didn't build that distortion", the lie that Obama "doubled the
deficit". But the author is pained by a few humorous coments about big bird.
Give me a break!------------------------That as the exact
comment I was going to make but you beat me to it. I couldn't have sai it
better myself. All I can say is "I agree" and "good job."
For those claiming that independents who vote for Romney never voted for Obama
in 2008; if that self delusion is comforting you are welcome to it. Even my
wife, a rabid Femocrat and who loves Mr. Obama, hopes (voted early) for a
Fool me once, I voted for Obama in 2008, and it's his fault.Fool me
twice and it's my fault. I won't make the same mistake in 2012.
To "Moderate" unfortunately you are wrong. Prior to the ACA, college
students could be carried on their parents insurance until age 25 or 26. All
that has changed is now, you can sit on your parents couch doing nothing and
still be covered. The letter writer was never in danger of losing healthcare
coverage.To "Mike in Cedar City" read what the Washington
Post fact checkers had to say about the Jeep add. They declared Romney's
jeep add technically correct. They didn't like how he presented the
facts.To "The Real Maverick" hopefully people will remember
how it was under bush. We had AAA credit ratings, unemployment around 5%, and
deficits that are 1/3 of today's
Mike RichardsSouth Jordan, UtahThe hostility in your comments
is self-evident and can be summed up in seven words: "Mike Richards simply
doesn't like the man!" Regardless of what the president says, what he
does, what he accomplishes, you are a true believer and will never give the
president credit. Your comments are unsubstantiated wingnut talking points
spread by conservative media and directed to that Republican goal to make Barack
Obama a one-term president, regardless. This all started with Rush
Limbaugh's edict prior to the president's inauguration in January,
2009, to make him fail. All efforts of true-believing conservatives took this
as their central purpose to re-gain the White House, throw out the usurper, and
re-store the God-given right to a Republican president.The anger
directed toward this president has been allowed to expand and fester to the
point where respectful discussion is considered treasonous to the conservative
mind. Even acknowledging any Obama administration accomplishments is to be
avoided lest the wingnut media turn and punish the offender. Manufactured and
exaggerated lies have become the staple of conservative thinking with a
committed body of individuals to troll the newspace.
Those who try to tell us that Obama had no knowledge that terrorists had
attacked us in Benghazi are portraying him as if he were an idiot. They're
telling us that he had some kind of "do not disturb" sign on his door
and that no one in the White House had permission to wake up the "Commander
in Chief" when we were under attack. They also want us to believe that he,
the Commander in Chief, was kept out of the loop for two weeks while he proved
his total incompetence by blaming the attack on a film maker. Those
who think that Utahns under serve have redefined service. Utah has the highest
participation rate of unpaid service volunteers in the nation. Tens of
thousands of unpaid service volunteers leave their homes in Utah every year to
teach people that they have worth, that they can get off welfare, that they can
be productive, that there is purpose to life. They use their own money to serve
others. Democrats keep telling us that Republicans don't care,
but how many of them spend $10,000 to pay for each volunteer's two-year
OK, the letter writer basis his opinion on "trivial" issues but has
nothing to say about substantive issues. This speaks volumes. Nothing
regarding major policy differences is mentioned which makes one wonder how
seriously the letter writer takes his voting rights.We have just
experienced the latest in a series of devastating storms. However, there is no
reference to Romney's desire to eliminate FEMA. Nothing on how he wants to
give that responsibility back to the states so that a state which is the target
of massive destruction, a state where the infrastructure has been destroyed, has
the responsibility for managing its recovery.There is no discussion
on the matters of war and peace despite Romney's "claim" that he
basically agrees with Obama, ignoring the fact that he is surrounded and advised
by the same neocons who led Bush into Iraq. Romney's bellicose rhetoric
about Iran a month ago apparently has no effect on this young man because
fighting wars are, in the Republican mindset, fought by other people. Utah has the lowest per capita participation enlistment levels in the United
States. Service to the nation, ironically, is of low priority in this
Huh? ". . . his abdication of responsibility while watching live video of
Americans under attack by terrorists in Benghazi."Mr. Richards,
where do you find lies like that?
Many of those professing a change in their voting pattern probably changed (if
they ever voted for Obama in the first place which is seriously doubtful) when
the Republican propaganda machine started their constant barrage of negative
attacks against Obama in January, 2009.When people start out their
comments by referring to the president as "Barack Hussein Obama", you
know they have been hostile to this man since before Day 1. It's that same
old flaming that they have engaged in from the beginning. The visceral dislike
for this president is based more on old prejudices than from any real and honest
difference of opinion. Just read what they write and you know that their
attitudes were sealed in stone before the president took office.Most
of the reasons people give are renditions of conservative talking points pushed
by wingnut media. There is nothing unique or original in the positions
expressed. It's just the Same Ol' Same Ol' partisan talk that
has focused on Obama as "The Other" and "not a real American".
Nothing new. And now we have all the "I voted for Obama and now I'm
not" talk which probably is just more trolling the comments section.
Don't get sidetracked over Obama's fascination with "Big
Bird". What we should be concerned with is his abdication of responsibility
while watching live video of Americans under attack by terrorists in Benghazi.
If you want to cast your vote for a Commander in Chief who stands up
for Big Bird even while denying support for Americans under fire, then vote for
him. May you be lucky enough to never need a leader to save you or someone you
love who is under attack by terrorists.His oath of office means
nothing to him: "I do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will faithfully
execute the Office of President of the United States, and will to the best of my
Ability, preserve, protect and defend the Constitution of the United
States."He lied for two weeks, telling us that a youtube video
led to unplanned demonstrations when he had seen with his own eyes and heard
with his own ears the terrorists who killed Americans.
You can vote for anyone you like, Jacob, but try in your thought process to
separate style from substance. Do we just ignore all the attacks on Obama during
his term in office because they didn't come from Romney personally? Sure,
"Romnesia" was a little silly, but the purpose it had, reminding people
of Romney's constant changes during the campaign, was serious and, I
believe, truthful. Big Bird is about as specific as Romney has been when talking
about future budget cuts. Cut the federal contribution to Public Broadcasting?
It's too tiny to make any difference.
And so after 4 years of vile accusations the like has never been seen in our
nation's history you are bummed out but some petty sarcasim? You need a
refund on your education because you don't know the difference between spin
and out and out lies and that my friend is how to discern history. This campaign
is like a neighor throwing his trash over my fence and calling the cops because
I don't clean it up fast enough.
And apparently Mitt Romney's false Jeep ads and many, many other debunked
claims are NOT trivial.It is going to be a sweet Obama victory!
It is an unfortunate thing when after 4 years of college a person still cannot
think for themselves.
"In 2008, I was a college freshman and able to vote for the first
time."Let's see... that would make you about 22 now... still
eligible to be carried on your parents' health insurance. It is quite
brave of you to vote for the man that pledges to take away that health coverage.
I hope you have been blessed and free of pre-existing conditions.You are changing your vote because of "petty, trivial attacks". The
result of your vote could have a very serious effect on your life.
This is a troll letter There is no way it can be real. The GOP has set the bar
to a new low with their attacks on the President. Both sides are disgraceful but
the GOP is exponentially more guilty.
While Obama may have started his petty campaign in the last few week, Romney
started and is finishing with the same pettiness, not to mention the untruths
and constant flip flopping. Keep the T shirt, you can wear it to an Obama
victory rally and pretend you stuck to your guns!
If 'Romnesia' and big bird changed your vote, you weren't much of
an Obama supporter. There are far bigger issues at play than these silly things
that come out in campaigns.
First and most important, so what? Neither candidate needed your vote in this
state. Romney? He is going to win by a landslide in this state regardless of who
you voted for. He would merely come here to Utah not to campaign but to use it
as as ATM machine. Obama? Ha ha, he doesn't need this state.
Secondly, if you're really going to let Big Bird and Romnesia
ruffle your feathers then A. You weren't really a supporter of
him anyway.B. You're rewarding Mitt's farrrrrr worse
behavior.I am not a parent yet but I know that parents
shouldn't reward their children for bad behavior. It only perpetuates it
further. The GOP's horrific behavior for the past decade but particularly
during the Obama administration should NOT be rewarded. Do you not
remember what they did under Bush? Do you really want to hand them the keys
already?Do you not remember how they have attacked Obama and his
family? If you're being honest and rewarding good behavior then
you'll reward Obama. His campaign hasn't been nearly as negative or
hostile as the GOP's.
Why do I doubt that this writer ever voted for Obama. Trivial attacks? Good
grief how do they compare with the outright lies being pushed by the Romney
Campaign? You know, the continuing lie about Jeep jobs being outsourced to
China, that he made the economy worse lie, the "you didn't build that
distortion", the lie that Obama "doubled the deficit". But the
author is pained by a few humorous coments about big bird. Give me a break!
Welcome home Jared! I agree with you completely!
A gee your vote was the one Obama really needed to win Utah. I am sure he is