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Dick Harmon: Every team has a claim as best in the state

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  • TruBlueAggie25 Logan, UT
    Oct. 8, 2012 12:45 p.m.

    @toosmartforyou?

    Largest margin of victory actually goes to the Aggies, sorry... They beat Utah by 7. I stand by what I have said before that there are currently 3 #1's in the state... Utah, BYU, USU... We can talk about stats, defense, missed chances... They all happened for the losing team... Utah - offensive pass interference, BYU - botched field goal, USU - botched field goal... The media will decide later, but for now we can talk all we want and the decision still will be made later... Anyone know when they decide? If its at the end of the season could be BYU or USU, Utah's record won't be so great... USU should finish 9-3, BYU 8-4... I agree that going by the bowl game would work... Both play San Jose St., at SJST, which could tell a lot. Frankly BYU's bowl game should be a walk in the park, if they are 6-6 they will play a MWC team... The MWC is horrid this year... The WAC is better. USU still has to play extremely well for a bowl game since the WAC has only 1 automatic bid.

  • toosmartforyou Farmington, UT
    Oct. 7, 2012 7:23 p.m.

    Utes claim they would have won but for an offensive pass interference call. True, but play by the rules for the entire length of the game. If you don't want the penalty, don't commit the foul. Otherwise, its like whinning after you get pulled over by a Cop for doing something stupid when driving. (As Norm Chow would say "No excuses.")

    USU fans still maintain they are better than BYU, but the score and game stats say otherwise. Nice dream job.

    While the three games weren't anything but close, the largest margin of victory at the earliest point in the game belongs to BYU against USU. Admitedly, there isn't mush of an advantage by any team over any other, all winning at home.

  • Stang08 Cedar City, Utah
    Oct. 7, 2012 5:44 p.m.

    Utah State doesn't have a claim. Now before I get any Utah State fan's on my back let me just say this. Let's wait til the bowl season. Whoever gets into a bowl and can actually win the bowl game can then say "We are the best in the state of Utah".

  • FYI Taylorsville, UT
    Oct. 6, 2012 11:20 p.m.

    @Scots
    "The Big Sky Conference is not a D1 Conference people"

    Yes, actually it would be if the D1 classification still existed. The Big Sky was Division 1AA. BYU and Utah were Division 1A. D1 has been reclassified as Football Bowl Subdivision(Division 1A) and Football Championship Subdivision (Division 1AA). Then there is Division II, which Dixie State is a member of, and finally Division III.

  • Scots Ogden, UT
    Oct. 6, 2012 6:54 p.m.

    The Big Sky Conference is not a D1 Conference people! Byu and Utah State only had 1 good qurter when they play Utah, Utah out played both of them they where up 24-7 over byu and out scored utah state 20-7 in the final 3 had whould have won if the fre's could call a play right.

  • Wallbanger Spanish Fork, UT
    Oct. 6, 2012 6:30 p.m.

    I would have to say Utah State is slightly better than the Y overall. With BYU in second of course followed by my Utes. That was one boring game last night, as bad as BYU vs Boise. BYU does have a great defense, but I don't think they have really been tested yet. Utah's offense is pretty bad and they couldn't shut them out. Or give the Y a win. I think USU and the Y finish the season with a better record than the Utes. Only because Utah has a tougher schedule with the much improved PAC 12 teams this year and the Utes struggling as they are.

    Most current SOS has USU at 115, BYU at 85, and Utah at 59. So I don't think Utah State or BYU have really been tested yet. Or proven themselves yet. Boise is horrible this year, so don't count that.
    If BYU and Utah win even 2 out of their next three, I would be surprised. Not to mention, I heard Hill my be out with a knee injury. Best of luck to all Utah schools.

  • camera2head west jordan, utah
    Oct. 6, 2012 4:32 p.m.

    Give respect when its earned,Cougars defense is scary good. Other than that not impressed with Offense,Special teams,Overall Coaching,or Coaching Decisions.By the way huge Utah fan and feel the exact same way about them by the way. But dismising parts of the game to make a case for being undefeated is Laughable.But I should be used to that same babble from cougar fans because its same song and dance ever year. Like me saying other than being small,weak,and not being able to hit a curveball i would have been in the bigs.Im not in the Bigs,and you haven't been undefeated in 28 yrs.

    Utah is 5-1 with cougars schedule.Beat USU at home,Lose at Boise. Argue that point?

    Like to know last time Cougars have lost a game in eyes of cougar fans? Utah has been beaten by 2 better teams the last 2 games. See how easy that was!

  • U 90 Corona, CA
    Oct. 6, 2012 4:23 p.m.

    toosmart,

    It's called satire.... Utah beating BYU twice.

    My point was that me using Utah beating BYU twice was about as iron clad as as your pathetic arguments. There is no "best team" in the state although I'm sure you will continue to spin otherwise.

  • toosmartforyou Farmington, UT
    Oct. 6, 2012 12:53 p.m.

    @ U 90

    Just how does Utah beat BYU twice? Whittingham claimed they won 3 times. Nice spin job. When actually playing the entire game by the rules, Utah sqeaked out a victory by mere inches on a failed field goal. Had it been 4 inches to the right, OT at SLC. But it wasn't and Utah gets the "W". I'm ok with that, but not Utah claiming they won multiple times. Play by the rules for the entire game and then claim victory (once) after everything is said and done.

    Isn't it interesting how Ute partisans joked about BYU fans rushing the field after a victory and they almost cost themselves the game in SLC by doing it? That's too rich......

    It has been an interesting season without any local team being great, although either BYU or USU would be undefeated if their kicking game was up to par. Utah certainly can't say that.

  • Ironmomo Ogden, Utah
    Oct. 6, 2012 12:15 p.m.

    bribri86:

    You need to do a little research on the Beehive boot before you post. Let me help you out. The Beehive boot, signifying football supremacy in the state "is awarded annually to the Utah school with the best record against its instate NCAA Division I foes". Div 1 teams include USU, BYU, Utah, Weber State and now SUU who recently joined the Big Sky Conference this year.
    USU and BYU are both 2-1 against in state opponents as previously stated.

    "In case of a tie, the winner is chosen by vote of the in-state media"...not your made up definition of "head to head" competition.

    Because there is a tie between USU and BYU, I would think the media would would wait to see the outcome of the Weber State/SUU matchup. It only makes sense.

  • U 90 Corona, CA
    Oct. 6, 2012 12:12 p.m.

    Many Y fans here crowning themselves king of the state. Priceless.

    justfax, do you think playing Hawaii, Weber State and Washington State had anything to do with BYU having the best stats? Those numbers would look a bit different had the Y played USC and ASU.

  • 4601 Salt Lake City, UT
    Oct. 6, 2012 10:34 a.m.

    BYU's victory stopped the blather from Aggies fans. Please BYU fans, don't diminish the win with smack talk. This year Best in State exists only in the mind of the fan and no one else cares.

  • braydan32 LOGAN, UT
    Oct. 6, 2012 10:34 a.m.

    Utah state beat Utah by 7 not 3...just saw a few had that confused

  • Just the FAX Olympus Cove, Utah
    Oct. 6, 2012 10:01 a.m.

    SportsFan

    "All three teams are close - great defenses, mediocre offenses..."

    We're getting to the point in the season where we have a large enough sample size that the stats don't lie, and the stats agree, all three teams have great defenses and mediocre offenses, giving BYU the slight edge over Utah State overall, with Utah coming in a distant third, overall.

    Total Offense
    #54 USU 417 ypg
    #71 BYU 398 ypg
    #116 Utah 299 ypg

    Total Defense
    #5 BYU 227 ypg
    #11 USU 211 ypg
    #29 Utah 330 ypg

  • Holden Caulfield Eagle Mountain, UT
    Oct. 6, 2012 9:56 a.m.

    Give it to no one! Just keep it on the shelf and send everyone home with their juice boxes. No team deserves it this year.

  • idablu Idaho Falls, ID
    Oct. 6, 2012 9:54 a.m.

    From the article:

    "Perhaps that is a starting point for offensive coordinator Brandon Doman."

    Holy Cow! We're 6 games into the season! Why can't these coaches have the kinks worked out by the first game?

  • bribri86 Phoenix, AZ
    Oct. 6, 2012 9:53 a.m.

    Ironmomo:

    According to your analysis, USU and BYU would be the only ones considered because of their 2-1 record. Therefore, you would go with their head to head game to determine who is 'better', not the outcome of two other teams playing each other. I think you're just trying to stretch it for USU who is clearly the #2 in the state.

  • SportsFan Orem, UT
    Oct. 6, 2012 9:42 a.m.

    phantomblade

    All three teams are close - great defenses, mediocre offenses, but any objective fan would have to agree with your argument, that best record is the most important factor in determining best team.

    As another blogger suggested

    BYU - 1A
    USU - 1B
    Utah - 1C

  • phantomblade Salt Lake City, Utah
    Oct. 6, 2012 9:22 a.m.

    "Every team has a claim as best in the state..."

    Based on head-to-head results only, but as everyone knows, best team is ALWAYS determined by best record, with head-to-head used only in tie-breakers.

    Look no further than the PAC south last season. Utah beat UCLA, but which team represented the division in the PAC 12 championship? Colorado beat Utah, but not even Colorado fans would be so delusional to think that Colorado was a better team than Utah.

    Bottom line:

    BYU beat Utah State by 3
    Utah State beat Utah by 3
    Utah beat BYU by 3

    BYU and Utah State are tied with 4-2 records; Utah only has a 2-3 record (sorry Utes, you don't get credit for LOSING to better teams; ANYBODY can do that)

    BYU(4-2) > USU(4-2) > Utah(2-3)

  • Itchy Lehi, UT
    Oct. 6, 2012 9:17 a.m.

    The only thing that we know for sure is that BYU, Utah, and Utah State are all the best in state....on their home field. I think that if any of the teams had played the others in their own stadium they would be 2-0 right now. In any case, all of them have looked pretty mediocre most of the time anyway, especially compared to teams from big name programs out of state.

  • YGuy Lehi, UT
    Oct. 6, 2012 9:04 a.m.

    I'm not sure anybody would want bragging rights this year, since none of them is any good. Sadly if the question could be resolved, the difference between the best team and the next best is very slim.

    Oh well, here's hoping we can all finish out strongly. Big picture, I think Utah State is the only team who increased their national credibility--my cougars and the Utes have had lots of fairly boring nationally televised games, and haven't done their brands amy favors, or by extension the State of Utah's brand.

    Go cougars.

  • U 90 Corona, CA
    Oct. 6, 2012 8:59 a.m.

    @ toosmart
    "BYU's defeat of USU was by the largest margin.....look at the stats... So BYU's claim is the strongest"

    Good thing wins and losses aren't determined by offensive stats and that the scoreboard plays a role in the outcome of the game. Defenses that cause turnovers and good special teams can negate offensive stats.

    You will remember that the field goal off the upright would have never happened because Utah had already beat BYU the first time with the block. Since Utah beat BYU twice in that game does that make Utah #1?

    Nobody really knows who the best team is. Lets just sit down watch conference and hope that we hear an address about being honest with ourselves.

  • worf Mcallen, TX
    Oct. 6, 2012 7:50 a.m.

    BYU, Utah State, Weber State, and Dixie can all claim being the best, but in the end, it's the Cougs.

  • Ironmomo Ogden, Utah
    Oct. 6, 2012 7:09 a.m.

    Best in State?

    In State BYU is 2-1 with wins over WAC and Big Sky opponents and a loss to a PAC-12 opponent.
    USU is 2-1 with wins over PAC-12 and Big Sky opponents and a loss to a IND opponent.
    The U is 1-1 with a win over a IND opponent and a loss to a WAC opponent.
    Weber State is 0-1 with a loss to a IND opponent.
    SUU is 0-1 with a loss to a WAC opponent.

    BYU and USU have the best in state records, so deciding best in state between them should come down to the game between opponents SUU and Weber State when they play each other in Cedar City on Oct 20th.

    My money is on SUU for that game.

  • AZCoug Mesa, AZ
    Oct. 6, 2012 6:29 a.m.

    Dick, BYU retains the Wagon Wheel because of the victory over USU. It's the Beehive Boot that is in question because of the three way tie.

  • thebigsamoan Richmond, VA
    Oct. 6, 2012 6:14 a.m.

    This is exactly how I hoped it would end after the Aggies beat the Utes and the Utes beat us. Now we can all be friendly to each other and look to win the rest of our scheduled games. That can only be great for the state of Utah football.

    As for the game, kudos to the two freshmen, Hill and Williams of the offense. They truly were the stars although I wished the offense as whole would stop making stupid mistakes over and over. And that kid that caused a flag from the outside was just lame. There was no excuse for that. On the other hand, the defense as always, was superb! That Van Noy and Ansah led defense is a force to reckon with! They're a joy to watch!

    Go Cougars! And good luck to the Utes and Aggies too!

  • toosmartforyou Farmington, UT
    Oct. 6, 2012 3:01 a.m.

    No, they don't. Here's why:

    Utah needed the luck of a field goal try clanking off the upright to claim victory, on the last play of the game, against BYU.

    USU needed overtime and an offensive pass interference call against the Utes, at the very end of the game, against Utah.

    BYU was ahead after the first half against USU, but played well enough that USU never scored a touchdown, didn't score after the first quarter, and was in control of both the scoreboard and the football at the end of regulation.

    While all 3 games were close, BYU's defeat of USU was by the largest margin.....look at the stats and the number of quarters BYU has gone without letting opponents score a touchdown. USU coughed up the game the last half-minute of the first half; the other games went to the final play or overtime.

    So BYU's claim is the strongest.

    I wish Mendenhall hadn't played Riley hurt and that Nelson had enough courage to decide the best thing for the team was for him to rest, not play at less-than-capacity.

    But it has been an interesting year!!!

  • Kralon HUNTINGTON BEACH, CA
    Oct. 6, 2012 1:40 a.m.

    I thought the Wagon Wheel was only between Utah State and BYU? I think you mean who gets the Beehive Boot!

  • Joe Schmoe Orem, UT
    Oct. 6, 2012 1:03 a.m.

    BYU also beat weber state who I believe is part of the beehive boot. Not that anyone really cares. Kind of like the deseret duel or whatever it is called.

    At any rate, none of the teams are great this year. BYU's Defense is great but the O is really struggling.

    Just glad for the win tonight.

    Utah wanting to kill the rivalries is going in the wrong direction. They are going to be the doormat of the pac 12 and not have any local rivalries. Their fans are going to be jumping ship really fast. Right now they are hyped to have a team like USC come into town but by the third or fourth time of getting beat down, the glitter is going to wear off. They should be doing everything they can to keep some local interest but they aren't.

    I hope they don't regret it 5 years down the road.