Published: Monday, July 16 2012 12:00 a.m. MDT
And once again those calling for making voting more difficult can't
actually cite evidence of any remotely significant voter fraud.They
want the elderly, the poor and students to have a harder time voting because it
is those voters who are more likely to vote for Democrats.It's
pure and simple voter suppression.
Photo IDs may be inconvenient, but they help prevent voter fraudorPreventing voter fraud by means other than photo id's may
be inconvient but ...Other means should be used so that the
inconvience doesn't fall mainly on the poor.
Bob cites one case, 12 years ago? There is no voter fraud problem. There may be
shenanigans from time to time, but the GOP is actually suppressing the vote and
they know it.
nice one Bob.
A solution looking for a problem. The suppression of Democratic
votes is just a side benefit.Laws like this will, without question,
reduce far more legitimate votes than fraudulent ones.Can anyone
If absentee ballots, or mail in ballots, do not require ID; why do votes in
person? What is inherently different in how I cast my vote that requires ID or
ID laws have nothing to do with "voter fraud" and everything to do with
SUPPRESSING the vote among the marginalized people who have no car! Millions of
voters don't have driver licenses because they can't afford them or
they are too old or disabled to need one. The Republicans know full well that
marginalized people tend to vote Democratic--because the Democrats CARE about
nice antidotal story Robert but it does not change the fact following a massive
investigations across the country into voter fraud in 2008 there where only 7
cases of voter fraud that where prosecutable in the entire country. When there
is fraud it should be aggressively prosecuted but antidotal stories do not
translate to wide spread fraud and the voter ID laws have already caused
100's of legitimate votes to not be counted in the primary elections alone.
Florida received the federal database of illegal aliens so they can remove them
from the rolls. I get a feeling sometimes that posting robots are
fighting this. They get proof and just ignore it, and keep saying the same
thing. Utah in 2005 did a study and found 383 foreign nationals with ITIN
numbers registered to vote here. Only 14 did vote, but Utah refused to prosecute
(Shurtleff?) because they could not determine citizenship. (the ITIN is not for
citizens) more dead carpLike not prosecuting illegal aliens for
perjury when filling out I-9 forms, or felonies for id theft, social security
numbers, etc, yet prosecuting Americans for felonies, we know we are not getting
the entire story. Bob tells the inside story, if they had not caught
them in time, thousands could of voted, and we would never of known. They would
of never found out, and if they did, they would of kept it quiet to "protect
our countries reputation".
@RRBwhat we are getting is more and more conspiracy theories from the far
right as reality increasingly elude them.
@RRBThis “study” you site was conducted by comparing the
name and birthdate of voters to the name and birthdate of individuals with a
taxpayer ID number investigated by immigration authorities, but this method has
been proven to yield errors: the voters in question may not be the noncitizens
identified. Moreover, the source stated that 14 of these individuals had
actually voted; even if the 14 were in fact noncitizens, there is no allegation
in the cited source that any of the individuals voted at the polls or in the
name of another meaning voter ID laws would not have prevented them from voting.
sources Michael McDonald & Justin Levitt, Seeing Double Voting (2007),
Letter from John M. Schaff, Utah Auditor General, to John L. Valentine, Utah
State Senate President (Feb. 8, 2005)
@RRB"if they had not caught them in time, thousands could of voted,
and we would never of known"Oh my heavens 1000''s of
legitimate voters may have gotten to vote that where shut out because of delays
at the polling station caused by poll sitters incompetence that slowed down the
voting process. we would have known because the reason the polls would have been
allowed to stay open would have been because of the court order which is a
@RRB"Utah in 2005 did a study and found 383 foreign nationals with
ITIN numbers registered to vote here."Based on population that
would be about 3,000 Pennsylvanians with 140 actually voting, so why throw off
8% of the states' population from the voter roles? Oh right, to let Romney
win, as their house majority leader said.
@RRB"Florida received the federal database of illegal aliens so
they can remove them from the rolls." =======If that
were the case, I would have no problem at all. They were comparing voting
records to driver license records, and that is the rub. Citizens being removed
from the voting rolls simply because of a potential address mismatch, where is
the due process in that?
Re: "It's pure and simple voter suppression."Sure it is
-- suppression of those who shouldn't be voting anyway.It's simply ageist, racist, elitist blather to suggest that validly
registered and qualified voters who want to vote will somehow be prevented from
doing so because they are old, infirm, or naturalized.The is only
one reason to oppose voter ID -- to enable cheating.And Democratts
have made it crystal clear -- we intend to do so.
Great column, Senator. Photo ID laws are absolutely ESSENTIAL in protecting the
integrity of the vote. Those who disagree either don't understand the
seriousness of voter fraud, or have ulterior motives.When society
makes voting and registering more and more "convenient," we also make it
easier to commit voter fraud, which is a very serious blow against our
constitutional republic.Also, it's very misleading to cite the
small number of cases prosecuted as "proof" that voter fraud is a
non-problem. Even when voter fraud is obvious or rampant, it's often hard
to prosecute and prove in court. It's also politically UNPOPULAR to
prosecute, because of likely (but phony) counter-accusations of "voter
suppression" or "racism" or "disenfranchisement."
@Peanut Gallery"Photo ID laws are absolutely ESSENTIAL in
protecting the integrity of the vote...When society makes voting and registering
more and more "convenient," we also make it easier to commit voter
fraud, which is a very serious blow against our constitutional republic."===============So, do you propose doing away with absentee
ballots? They cannot show ID. If not, why would someone going to the
physical polling place be required to show it?If so, are Servicemembers
not entitled to vote while they are serving their country outside of her
borders?You can't have it both ways.If voter fraud
is really the issue, the precincts would be small enough that the judges could
know everyone, and thus catch a potential fraudster. Why don't we do that?
Is it money? For the big concern that everyone has over voter fraud, cost
shouldn't count.Again, you can't have it both ways.
Voting is an unalienable right in a democracy. If PhotoID is required, the
State must provide me with one, free of charge, otherwise it is a poll tax (my
DL cost $25 for 5 years, or roughly $25 to vote for President.)
If you choose not to have the required ID that is not the government's
fault. If the government were preventing people from getting the ID that would
be one thing, but it is not. I choose not to have a passport, but I don't
blame the government for not allowing me to travel internationally.
We definitely need to prevent voter fraud, but what will we do to stop the
shenanigans by which local GOP's fixed some of their own primaries this
@peanut gallerySo you admit there is nothing to support your
conspiracy theories but we are all the ones that do not understand or have
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