Comments about ‘My view: Liberals, conservatives need each other’

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Published: Tuesday, May 8 2012 12:00 a.m. MDT

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Mike Richards
South Jordan, Utah

Strong opinions that are centered on priciples are good. Strong opinions that are centered on self-serving selfishness are bad.

If labor demands high wages, low hours, and limited duties regardless of the fact that high wages, low hours and limited duties would force the business to go offshore, those demands are based on selfishness.

If management demands more productivity at the same pay scale, no overtime, dangerous work conditions, those demands are also based on selfishness.

When labor and management sit down together and formulate ideas that allow the business to be profitable AND allow the workers to be fairly paid for the duties performed, then that business has a chance to survive.

Look at the "garment" industry. It is gone. Look at the "demands" that drove that industry offshore.

Some "principles" are not negotiable. Morality is not negotiable. Honesty is not negotiable. Integrity is not negotiable. Those who would destroy those principles because of selfish behavior should understand that they are destroying the foundation of society. Destroying society is not negotiable.

one vote
Salt Lake City, UT

Yes, this is why Limbaugh threw the elections away. He doe not want to lose his audience.

Mike in Cedar City
Cedar City, Utah

I have always maintained that the country needs liberals to press for change when needed, and conservatives, to prevent liberals from giving away the store.

Noodlekaboodle
Salt Lake City, UT

@Mike Richards
You missed the point. The article was to say that neither side should be able to control an entire situation. Not liberals, and not conservatives. You examples are of times when this didn't happen. Your morality bit is getting old as well, No one (ok almost no one) wants to "destroy society" just because someone disagrees with you solutions doesn't make them an immoral person. Hate to break it to you Mike, your no better than the rest of us.

Gildas
LOGAN, UT

When two "opposites" are actually largely the same then perhaps we don't need either of them or we need a third choice.

On the other hand
Spanish Fork, UT

We have a political system that favors binary choices. It's almost guaranteed that two polarized factions will emerge from such a system, and that the candidates they select will hold non-centrist beliefs. It's a recipe for artificial conflict, built right into our electoral process.

procuradorfiscal
Tooele, UT

Re: "Solutions are only possible, though, if liberals and conservatives shed the tribalism . . . ."

That's liberal tribalism talking. And use of the term "solutuions," as liberal newspeak for "surrender."

We don't need more compromised, liberal solutions. Genuine solutions are already in place and were working quite well for centuries, until liberals started offering their "solutuions."

What we really need are politicians with the moxie and backbone to stand up to liberals, smoke them out of their carefully constructed rhetorical fortresses, and point out that prancing liberal "solutions" are, in fact, unclad -- they solve nothing.

Further, liberal "investments" invest in nothing beyond liberal vote-buying; liberal "conservation" destroys; liberal "compassion" is cynical, mean-spririted, and destructive of the human spirit; liberal "logic" is anything but; liberal "morality" is the worst form of libertine immorality; and liberal notions of "justice" and "fairness" are based on the very injustices sought to be prevented by the wise framers of our Constitution and Nation.

Happily, liberals must be running scared for them to suggest any use whatever for conservatives.

Alex
Salt Lake City, UT

@procuradorfiscal - Thanks for exemplifying the problem, rather than the solution.

Wonder
Provo, UT

@procuradorfiscal -- You really need to get over the "liberals are the source of al evil" type of thinking. I am relatively liberal, and I assure you, I have no interest in buying votes for anybody or being mean spirited or even prancing for that matter. Without liberals we would still have slavery. Without liberals women would not be able to vote or have property rights. Frankly, without liberals we'd be a 3rd world country. I agree with this article, though, that without conservatives pulling back a little, change could come too fast or be too expansive. Both ways of thinking are beneficial to society, but it's hard to see the other point of view sometimes.

Flashback
Kearns, UT

The problem is both ends of the spectrum and the extreme behavior of them. Especially the "my way or the highway" approach. On the left you have Soros and his money pulling the strings. On the right you have the Tea Party pulling the strings. Guys like Hatch, who are conservative but cross the aisle on occasion to make good legislation get vilified by the far right for even dealing with Ted Kennedy or others. Even when the legislation benefits all (the original CHIP as an example). There are not any Left leaning senators that try to work the middle anymore with the possible exception of Lieberman on occasion. They are all scared of Soros.

SG in SLC
Salt Lake City, UT

This is an extremely well-written and insightful article, clearly much more so than some here (*cough*, procuradorfiscal, *cough*) are comfortable with. I also wholeheartedly agree with Mike Richards' post (I hope that Mike, nor anyone else, dies of shock due to my agreement with his post; in all honesty, I have a great deal of respect for Mike's consistency and vigor in articulating and defending his convictions, even though I strongly disagree with some of them).

I have long believed that healthy discussion and debate of public policy alternatives, along with the willingness to "think win-win", to "seek first to understand, then to be understood", and to "synergize" (Stephen R. Covey's 4th, 5th, & 6th "Habits"), will ultimately lead to the best outcomes for our communities and our nation.

George
Bronx, NY

thank you to all the posters that show tribalism is alive and well here at the DN. You want to fix our broken system start by taking a closer look at your own unwillingness to engage in a civil discussion with the end game being a viable solution for everyone not just those you want to win.

procuradorfiscal
Tooele, UT

Re: "@procuradorfiscal - Thanks for exemplifying the problem, rather than the solution."

Any time.

Right back at 'ya for verifying that "seeking solutions" is just liberal newspeak for "being willing to surrender to liberals" and that liberals really believe they can shame conservatives into surrender, if they just doggedly, disingenuously, and unashamedly refer to their deranged, liberal/socialist aberrations as "solutions."

When liberals begin to question some of the most insensate of their sacred canons -- that nothing in America works correctly, that the entire Nation is crying for liberal "solutions," and that conservatives are the Mephistophelian miscreants denying them those "solutions" -- then, we'll talk.

There You Go Again
Saint George, UT

@Mike Richards

2:07 AM?

You old night owl.

Let's see, where were we?

Ah yes...

The garment industry?

Check out "The Triangle Fire" documentary.

It might provide some perspective.

Who knows?

procuradorfiscal
Tooele, UT

Re: "@procuradorfiscal -- You really need to get over the "liberals are the source of al evil" type of thinking."

You bet I will! The very moment they stop being the source of all the political ills that haunt our Nation and have come to threaten its very existence.

You can count on it.

Anti Bush-Obama
Washington, DC

They need each other in order to dupe the american people into doing nothing while they destroy the constiution. That's what they need from each other. They need to keep the sheeple fighint against each other on fake issues while they do their damage.

SG in SLC
Salt Lake City, UT

@procuradorfiscal

"When liberals begin to question some of the most insensate of their sacred canons . . . then, we'll talk."
Do many conservatives question some of the most insensate of *their* sacred canons? What's good for the goose is good for the gander.

"[Liberals] just doggedly, disingenuously, and unashamedly refer to their deranged, liberal/socialist aberrations as 'solutions'." "[Liberals need to] stop being the source of all the political ills that haunt our Nation and have come to threaten its very existence."
Proc, your extremist-biased 'groupthink' is showing . . .
It is closed-minded vitriol like this (and the extreme left is guilty of it, too), more than anything else, that is the reason that Washington DC is a broken, disfunctional mess.

"[Liberals think] that conservatives are the Mephistophelian miscreants"
The far-left extremists might hold this view, but they are the fringe minority among liberals, and I certainly don't feel this way. I think we need *more* open-minded moderate conservatives (but I don't think you want to hear that). I also think we need more open-minded moderate liberals (and I KNOW you don't want to hear *that*).

atl134
Salt Lake City, UT

@procuradorfiscal

"When liberals begin to question some of the most insensate of their sacred canons . . . then, we'll talk."

Obama offered to cut from entitlements, to the chagrin of his party, in exchange for Republicans having to give up some ground on the raising taxes issue. So I'd say we've already made those sorts of overtures and have been turned down. That's why we got a 2 trillion dollar debt deal instead of 4 trillion.

JoeCapitalist2
Orem, UT

atl134:

You keep insisting that Obama made a genuine attempt to cut spending in exchange for some modest tax increases and that the Republicans rejected this "honest attempt" to reach some kind of middle ground.

Hogwash! What Obama and the Democrats really offered was another empty promise to cut spending sometime in the future in exchange for immediate tax increases. The tax increases would impact taxpayers immediately and would be permanent. The spending cuts (which were not real cuts at all, but just reductions in projected increases) would never materialize. The promise would not be kept and government spending would continue to spin out of control.

And of course, the Republicans are the bad guys for rejecting this "I will gladly pay you Tuesday for a hamburger today" offer.

spring street
SALT LAKE CITY, UT

on and on we go with the same worthless partisan snipping that got us into this mess and that the article writer talks about the need to eliminate. You want to know why we are where we are? look in the mirror and take some personal accountability for your partisan bickering.

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