Comments about ‘Charter schools’

This is a very welcome letter.

I will point out one error in regards to Charter School funding. We don't get roughly half the funding per pupil compared to a student in a District as was stated. The funding inequity is more likely between 9-12% less.

It seems to me that many charter school seem to offer a "mormon" education which I'm really not happy that my tax dollars pay for.

Clearly, the most significant factor in delivering the best education and thus producing the best results is the quality of the teacher(s) in front of our children. Simple logic says that more teachers like my own daughter, a recent graduate (Cum Laude) with no hope for a job could be aided by districts choosing to implement ERIP. Early retirement incentive programs create openings for bright young, energetic, teachers. Sure, even the best veteran teachers night take the ERIP along with those who are tired, but in the end it works out for the better all things considered.

Noodle is correct. It's more of an indoctrination, more than education, via tax payers. It's not right.

Does your charter school have special needs students? If so, is the number of special needs students, and the accommodations they require, equal to your neighborhood public school?

Does your charter school have to deal with students whose primary language is not English?

Doesn't it seem obvious that a school that only accepts students whose families are highly motivated to assist in their children's' education, and that either actively or passively excludes students that are going to present a challenge to the school, is likely to operate at lower cost?

I understand the frustrations we all feel about the problems in our public schools system. The documentary, "Waiting for Superman" should be mandatory viewing for anyone involved in operating and financing our schools.

That said, the popularity of many charter schools seems to derive from a parental attitude of, "I've got mine, and I don't care a fig about you."

Charter schools are a symptom of a bigger problem, not a solution.

charter schools pick and choose which students to accept. Public schools have to take everyone. That is the difference. Do not use public school money for charter schools. if you want to send your kids to private or Charter schools, thats fine. But you shouldnt take money from the education fund to do it. Pay for it your self. Why you ask. Why should I have to pay for school children? Im 55 and have No kids using the piblic school system. But yet Ive paid for it all these years, in property taxes and such. Lets improve our public school systems, and use the money for them.

If public schools had more funding, we might try this; Place all children who cannot speek proper English into class's that would bring them up to speed before placing them in regular class. We could add a teachers helper in all classrooms to help with large classrooms. We could place children who score highly on tests into two or three special classes daily that were advanced learning. Our schools need more funding to give the children proper education. Period. Starving teachers pay, cramming too many kids into classrooms, not being able to give some one-on-one with children who are slower, and placing them in the same classrooms as fast learners stumps the teachers and students. State leaders are playing games with the future of America. It must stop. Families with more than two children must have no more tax deductions for more children. Come on leaders, why can't you do the right thing?

The charter school idea is fundamentally flawed. It is a complete shamed that horrendous amounts of taxpayer dollars are going to support a flawed system.

The idea of charter schools is this: let's remove the smart, well-behaved kids and place them in their own schools away from the kids who cause trouble and don't care about learning. This is certainly a worthy goal, but the approach is wrong.

Instead of spending large amounts of money to build schools for the good kids so they can get away from the bad, we should leave the good kids where they are and get rid of the bad. Those kids who have demonstrated that they have no willingness or ability to learn and behave should be expelled. Not only would we be spared the expense of building charter schools, we would improve the whole education system for those who have demonstrated that they have the ability and determination to succeed.

This old teacher can't understand why we don't turn all our schools into charter schools.

Why not reduce the red tape and restrictions on teaching that plague public school teachers? Why not require uniforms and good behavior by students. Why not require parental involvement?

Oh, what's that you say? If we did, the charter schools would just be public schools with all their attendant problems? Hmmm. You could be right on that.

And I guess that if we did, there'd be no place for charter schools to send their failures.

JCS. Please tell us what you would do with the "bad" children?

I have nothing against charter schools. I hope you remain happy. The problem I have is that all our children don't have the opportunities. They take money and students from the system. They stretch our dollars and as of yet I have not seen anything that justifies them on the grand scale. It is in all our interests to educate all our children just as it is in everyones interest to have a healthy society. If our schools continue to crumble and the majority of students get a substandard education, what are the odds you will be dealing with the well educated in your daily life? I would like the mechanics, plumbers, carpenters as well as the doctors and nurses to know what they are doing. I think if they have a good education the odds go up dramatically.

My only guess is this all driven by $$$
a "business" model followed like so many other "shady-business deals";

"businesses" that takes public taxes to pay for Private Hunting Clubs
"businesses" that takes public taxes to pay for Private Roads & Services
"businesses" that takes public taxes to pay for Private Insurance
"businesses" that takes public taxes to pay for Private Waste Management
"businesses" that takes public taxes to pay for Private Services
"businesses" that takes public taxes to pay for Private Developments
"businesses" that takes public taxes to pay for Private Banks
and
now we see clearly,
"businesses" trying to take public taxes to pay for Private Schools


You worry so much about "Socialism"?
but can't see "businesses" are doing and end-run around you.

I kindly disagree with the notion that charter schools are teaching our children better than traditional schools. Don't tell me that test scores are consistently higher at charter schools. While that may be true, I don't think the charter schools themselves deserve the credit. I believe that the average charter school child has parents who are more involved at home than the average traditional school child. One-on-one time with parent and child while engaged in educational activities happens more with charter school kids. These children perform well in the classroom in spite of the charter schools.
Yes, the great charter school fallacy.
Hey, did anybody notice how high the score of the NBA Allstar game was? Wow, Allstar teams must produce better players than regular teams. The NBA has it all wrong. Instead of a league of teams with a mixture of ordinary players and a token All-Star, they should instead have a league of Allstar teams. That way, all of the players would be Allstars!! yay.

The quality of the education is most dependent on the quality of the teacher. The best teachers tend to have the best pay. Low wage scales donÂt attract or keep the best teachers. The misappropriation of school funds is a major factor in the demise of public education.

As in other cases of private enterprise providing service to the general public, the profits of building the facility are much greater than the profit from their use. This is true in education just as much as in public transportation and shopping malls. So as business has taken over control of our government, it is logical that the goals of government will change from people to business.

As we exit the information age and enter the age of automation, the need for educated workers is going away and is no longer a goal for business. Thus there is no need for public education. And where needed highly educated people could easily be handled by the private schools at costs higher than ordinary people might pay for education. And as consumers, education sometimes works against business motives.

My overriding wish for education is that the student learn how to learn. As an American I want my government to provide the best education for all and not just an indoctrination about politics or religion.

Some people have figured it out. The Charter schools do attract those students who have parents that care about their children. Unfortunately for many of those schools their kids typically fall into 1 of 2 categories. They are either good kids who would get good grades most anywhere or else they are kids with behavior problems that the parents refuse to acknowledge.

Either way, this shows us the problem permeating society. As a whole, society cares less now about the education of their kids than they did in the past, and the problem is only getting worse each year. Our kids are slowly being segregated into those who's parents care about their education, and those who's parents like the free daycare.

The bigger problem that must be resolved first is how do you get parents to care about the education of their children?

Oh ya - and one other thing....

Mary Poelman writnes:

"Our charter school functions with about half the funds that public schools receive and still produces better results."

=====================

If that be the case,
Then Charter Schools should only be asking/receiving 1/2 the amount in the form of vouchers.

Funny how we NEVER heard Charter School businesses/supporters suggesting that!

@Steven S Jarvis: "We don't get roughly half the funding per pupil compared to a student in a District as was stated. The funding inequity is more likely between 9-12% less."

You also get to pick and choose the best students, shunning all others. In which case you should get even less than half the funding of public schools.

In fact, student selection for charters should be on a random drawing basis... Or close them down.

Re: "It's more of an indoctrination, more than education, via tax payers. It's not right."

As if regular public education weren't secular, liberal indoctrination!

What bothers liberals and "educators" is not the indoctrination -- they believe that's a proper role of schools. They're bothered, rather, by the fact that conservative-minded charter schools deprive them of control over that indoctrination.

They don't get to foist discredited liberal ideas and ideals on trusting, unsuspecting minds. They don't get to enforce ignorance of real history, real civics, and real math and science. They don't get to innoculate kids with their libertine values through sex education.

And, worst of all -- they don't get to teach kids to sing, "Obama, mmmm, mmmm, mmmm."

The letter writer states another common mistake about the benefit of charter schools. Charter schools to don't reduce class size at the traditional public schools. They may lower the number of students at a local school, but that means the number of teachers lowers too. Teacher/ student ratio is a fixed number. No amount of private schools or charter school will lower class size.

I reject the premise that Utah schools are falling apart like the author states. I think there are plenty of great teachers in public schools and there are plenty of great public schools. I've even had my own children in private, public and charter schools. I think Utah public schools are in trouble but that trouble comes from lack of resources coming from the legislature and decreasing respect for teachers in the society at large. These two things are hurting the schools deeply. However, this can be reversed. Prospective great teachers can still be attracted to the profession, great teachers in the classroom will stay in the profession and schools can improve. There is some understandable angst about the status of public education but much of this can be corrected with some investment and not treating teachers like dirt, but rather as respected and caring professionals like the vast, vast, vast majority of them are.