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Comments about ‘At BYU forum, Evangelical Mark DeMoss says Christians must be civil’

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Published: Tuesday, Jan. 24 2012 8:55 p.m. MST

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Pagan
Salt Lake City, UT

**'Fox News host: Romney not Christian' - By Hal Boyd, Deseret News - 07/17/11

**'Trump on Obama's Birth Certificate: 'Maybe It Says He's a Muslim' - Fox Nation - 03/30/11

Yes.

We DO need to be more civil to each other.

Still Blue after all these years
Kaysville, UT

We saw in South Carolina how "civil" the evangelicals are. and it takes about 10 seconds on the internet to see as well. I rarely, if ever, hear a Mormon talking badly about other religions. DeMoss needs to go give his lecture in the deep south.

JKayDS
EULESS, TX

Pegan

Yes I agree with you
We ALL need to be more civil
And I am not just talking about the Christians.
The "gays" are some of the most uncivil commenter that I read.

Pagan
Salt Lake City, UT

'The "gays" are some of the most uncivil commenter that I read.' - JKayDS | 10:46 a.m. Jan. 25, 2012

Would you please provide some examples?

Or is it only 'acceptable' when Mormons do it?

**'Gays greatest threat to America, Buttars says' - By Aaron Falk - DSnews - 02/19/09

**'Buttars used 'black baby' remark again, officials say' - By Rodger L. Hardy - DSNews - 07/05/08

'At an earlier legislative session Buttars said in referring to a bill, "this baby is black ... it's a dark and ugly thing." - article

**'Sen. Orrin Hatch utters profanity about President Obama's health care reform' - By Jamshid Ghazi Askar - DSNews - 03/01/11

**'Silent LGBT protest sparks crude comment' - By Mohammad Allam - The Daily Utah Chronicle - 02/16/10

I use these exmaples...

because Chris Buttars was elected in Utah...x3 times.

Hatch, I believe x7 times.

I cannot even REPEAT what Rick Votaw.

But you, have no examples.

Midvaliean
MIDVALE, UT

@Still Blue after all these years
Try hanging out with some of the Mormons I know. Other religions are garbage to them. Of course that is a flaw of the individual. But I see it all the time. More so in the past, and more so against Catholics.

Pagan
Salt Lake City, UT

Look.

I am not here to play the 'he said/she said' game.

If we will concede that we ALL need to be more civil.

Then we must acknowledge that we have ALL been UNcivil, at one point in time.

I have given examples on:
Race
Religion
Orientation
Profanity

Of what NOT, to do.

I can only say I have done my best...

to be the example, I would want my daughters to be.

It's that, or raise your children to call ANYONE they disagree with...

'sinners.'

Lets work, to be a BETTER, example.

Good day.

RanchHand
Huntsville, UT

Ok Mods, let's try this again - there's nothing against the rules here:

I'm tired of all these "pledges" being passed around for our representatives to follow.

Every single one of them is about a particular point of view and if the candidates sign the "pledge" then they obviously intend to disenfranchise a certain segment of their constituency who don't agree with the "pledge" as a result.

(relating to the article!) As for the "left" being against the religionist position on marriage; If you don't agree with same-sex marriage, for heaven's sake DON'T HAVE ONE. You don't have the right to determine who another of your fellow Americans can or can not marry and whether or not they will be treated equally by the law and government.

How could any religious person, who honestly follows Christ's teachings, think that it is "civil" to discriminate against another person?

Mimi
Venice, CA

Ultra Bob,

Our light cannot shine, as Christ said it should, if it's kept hidden inside our mind, behind closed doors, or under a bushel.

lds4gaymarriage
Salt Lake City, UT

sharrona
(Christians) should earnestly CONTEND for the faith which was once delivered unto the saints.(Jude 1:3).

LDS4
Agreed, we should always be ready to give an answer to every man that asks about the reason for our hope and faith (1 Pet. 3:15). We can contend without being contentious. We can be steadfast in our position and give reason for our positions and respond to the assertions of others, but we still must be gentle as lambs and avoid offending others as Paul clearly discusses in 1 Cor. 10.

Picketing temples, which we hold sacred, intentionally causes offense.

Making inflammatory claims about magic underwear intentionally causes offense.

Professional anti-LDS who knowingly mislead others about our REAL beliefs intentionally cause offense.

To such will Jesus say, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

A voice of Reason
Salt Lake City, UT

WOW! I thought the headline read "Evangelical Mark DeMoss says Christians must be *evil*"

I'm glad to see I misread it!

Any genuine attempt to make peace and promote friendship between different faiths is more than pretty decent in my book.

Tzadikim
Bakersfield, CA

Mark DeMoss has a Biblical point. Civility is always the better road for public discourse. Are dissenting opinions allowed to be shared, with civility, at BYU? This article did not define any terms or conditions, however, or cite God's Word when it comes time to obey our Lord and contend earnestly "for the faith, once delivered to the saints". For those who follow the Bible as the final Word, this was another lovely day in the market place of ideas, like Paul defining the Unknown God to pagans at the Aeropagus.

Can you reference some substance of his speech? Is he speaking for himself, a denomination, parsing a text? This article doesn't give DeMoss' opinion for exposing false teachers, as the apostle Paul did "with boldness". Jesus' brother Jude said to "contend earnestly for the faith". Paul instructed to send "pervertors of Christ's gospel out of the church" (NLT) and let them be "anathema" (Greek- accursed, excommunicated). Obviously you can civilly excommunicate a brother for not adhering to your rules and doctrines.

I follow Peter's instructions, to "sanctify Christ as Lord in your hearts", always ready to give a defense, with gentleness and reverence. (1Pet.3:13-17)

Cats
Somewhere in Time, UT

The reference that is made to "liberal" in the Book of Mormon is a term that has now become archaic. "Liberal" used to mean generous. It had no reference to politcs. It has now become a political term that refers to those to the left of center. The Book of Mormon is making NO reference to the word "liberal" as it is used today in the politcal sense. Sorry Senator.

Capella
Bakersfield, CA

I am really saddened by the LDS here who keep calling another person's opinion "hate", when it doesn't agree with theirs. My Mormon family are honest, proud of their Mormon heritage, and keep sending out missionaries 7 generations later. They do not consider someone "a hater" just because they call you a cultist, a non-traditional Christian, or even a false religion. If it is done "civilly", while in discussion or debate, it is not Hate Speech to express an opposing opinion.

If that is your definition of Hate Speech, then Mormons drew first blood. Joseph condemned all denominations. You are aware of your own missionary lessons, aren't you?

Are there any Saints here who will own their history, who know what Joseph Smith's First Vision claimed, who can cite what founding Mormonism claimed about all the previous 1,830 years of Christianity? What was claimed- uncivilly by DeMoss' standards- about "all other Christian denominations"? About the veracity of the Bible, or the authority of any other church's baptisms, confirmations, marriages?

My grandparents struggled, their ancestors died with the Willey Handcart Co., to reach a place where they could live in their truth.
Atleast honor your own message.

ute alumni
Tengoku, UT

capella:
Joseph Smith didn't draw first blood, God told him not to join any church as there were none that had the fullness of the Gospel, only parts.

DonO
Draper, UT

Are evangelicals really Christians? If they believe in a Trinity and that their three-in-one God is a spirit, are they not denying the existence of the resurrected Jesus? By their definition of God it seems that they are not truly Christian. I don't necessarily have a dog in this fight but have watched the labels being thrown around with impugnity. It seems that Mormons, with their belief in Jesus, are far more Christian...and far less cultists...than the Trinity crowd.

Jonathan Eddy
Payson, UT

Scott Howell commented how much he enjoys speaking at BYU because he is able to openly express his faith, asserting that he is a Democrat because of his beliefs. âI believe in education, good health and in the principles of Mosiah Chapter 4,â he said, referring to a passage in the Book of Mormon that urges care for the poor.

Former State Sen. Karen Hale echoed Howell, noting that her favorite use of the term âliberalâ is a Book of Mormon verse that says the people fed the hungry and clothed the naked and âwere liberal to all.â

Very interesting viewpoints. Satan also believes in care for the poor, food for the hungry and clothing for the naked.

atl134
Salt Lake City, UT

@DonO
"If they believe in a Trinity and that their three-in-one God is a spirit, are they not denying the existence of the resurrected Jesus?"

No, they're not. Don't be ridiculous.

@Jonathan Eddy
"Former State Sen. Karen Hale echoed Howell, noting that her favorite use of the term âliberalâ is a Book of Mormon verse that says the people fed the hungry and clothed the naked and âwere liberal to all.â

Very interesting viewpoints. Satan also believes in care for the poor, food for the hungry and clothing for the naked. "

People wonder why liberals might have problems with Mormon candidates... here's a hint, stop making defaming liberals look like a Mormon belief.

lineup2
SALT LAKE CITY, UT

Loved the artical! It brings up great views that all Christ followers need to be civil.

MoJules
Florissant, MO

Awesome, I appreciate this article and am using his three points to share with others. That can be applied to all aspects of our lives. Good to read about Scott Howell, I went to school with him and met him when he was in office, he invited my daughter to come spend part of a day there with him. I thought that was really nice of him.

Jonathan Eddy
Payson, UT

@ Capella

"I am really saddened by the LDS here who keep calling another person's opinion "hate", when it doesn't agree with theirs. My Mormon family are honest, proud of their Mormon heritage, and keep sending out missionaries 7 generations later. They do not consider someone "a hater" just because they call you a cultist, a non-traditional Christian, or even a false religion. If it is done "civilly", while in discussion or debate, it is not Hate Speech to express an opposing opinion.

If that is your definition of Hate Speech, then Mormons drew first blood. Joseph condemned all denominations. You are aware of your own missionary lessons, aren't you?"

I say this in all "civility", you appear to be easily saddened.

Secondly, if Joseph was a prophet of God, he condemned no denominations; God did. I would have to wonder if you yourself understand your own Mormon heritage and history and ask why you would be so quick to challenge others regarding their understanding of the same.

Thirdly, even a child knows the difference between hate and "opinion" when it smacks them on the cheek.

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