Comments about ‘Washington Post: Cut-off date for revelation?’

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Published: Tuesday, Jan. 24 2012 5:00 a.m. MST

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JoeBlow
Miami Area, Fl

I don't know that there is a specific cut-off date.

However, history has shown us that there are lots of people claiming to know God's will. For those with persuasive personalities and leadership skills it can be a ticket to power and money.

How many really felt that Jim Jones, David Koresh, L Ron Hubbard or Warren Jeffs had any inside information? Probably just their followers.

Maybe we have just gotten more skeptical, and rightfully so.

Swedish reader
Stockholm, Sweden

Good question. Maybe people think that as soon as we developed scientific ways of determining the state of things, God decided we could manage on our own? Personally, no matter how much I can do on my own, I know I can't do EVERYTHING - especially not figure out what God wants to tell me by using scientific techniques. Maybe, as JoeBlow says, people have gotten more sceptical. But completely discounting the possibility of modern reveletion isn't skepticism, it's just closing your mind and heart completely.

BYUalum
South Jordan, UT

If ever in the history of mankind with evil and corruption at every turn, we need revelation from God today. I am so grateful for personal revelation in my own life and hope to live worthily to continue to receive it. And God makes it available to all who will obey and live His commandments and draw near unto Him.

atl134
Salt Lake City, UT

Even the LDS church believes that we went over 1500 years (as far as Europe is concerned since they didn't know of the Nephites, over 1000 for North America) without there being a prophet around.

RanchHand
Huntsville, UT

I will never, ever, EVER again trust anyone who tells me that god speaks to them about what I should do (I was LDS, once upon a time trusted the leaders).

If god wants ME to do something, he can come tell me directly; theres no need for an intermediary.

Baccus0902
Leesburg, VA

I don't know if all Presidents of the LDS church would qualify as prophets. I have my personal doubt about some personal opinion expressed by some of them. On the other hand, I have heard very inspired talks by other leaders of the Church.

I don't understand why evangelicals have this animosity against the LDS church, if we are supposed to judge by our fruits, it seems that a good LDS should be a wonderful Christian.

Even though I have moved away from the Church, it seems I will feel a Mormon until I die.

My dear RanchHand, I agree with you to some extend. However, I still hope and pray for President Monson, the Pope, and other spiritual and secular leaders. Because, I believe that God will not leave us alone in our pursue for equality, social justice and a better world for all his children.

Ross
Madison, AL

People today seem to think that religion must be comfortable, forgetting that it was not too comfortable for those left behind when Noah and the Ark rose to to the top of the water above them. Gods ways are higher than our ways, as in the time of our death, the master knows better than we do, and he is in control. This life is a test, when God speaks we should listen and obey. There is nothing weird about it.

atl134
Salt Lake City, UT

@Ross
"People today seem to think that religion must be comfortable, forgetting that it was not too comfortable for those left behind when Noah and the Ark rose to to the top of the water above them."

Assuming of course that there actually was a global flood which geological research suggests there wasn't. (Plus Noah would die because of the global warming that would occur having that much water vapor in the atmosphere and he'd die because of the pressure of having that much water in the atmosphere since it'd be like pressures experienced when one is at the bottom of an ocean).

Gregg Weber
SEATTLE, WA

atl134 wrote "Even the LDS church believes that we went over 1500 years (as far as Europe is concerned since they didn't know of the Nephites, over 1000 for North America) without there being a prophet around."

Without there being a known prophet around. We don't know everything.

JoeBlow
Miami Area, Fl

"Without there being a known prophet around. We don't know everything."

And I would say that there is no such thing as a "known" prophet.

It is based on faith, belief and conjecture. As is everything to do with religion.

Brahmabull
sandy, ut

Gregg Weber - No, actually if you believe in the great apostasy as taught by the LDS church the gospel was not around between shortly after the time of christ until Joseph Smith restored it. That is a basic LDS teaching. So rather than say "we don't know everything" and speculate, why don't we go off of what we DO know at this point?

On another note, I haven't heard any revelations in the 29 years of my life anyways.... Teachings yes, revelations, no.

skeptic
Phoenix, AZ

Since the begining of man's history he has had a mystical connection with superstitions, healers, sooth-sayers, prophets, etc. and all kinds of imaginations that have evolved over centuries into complex religions and church organizations. All this began tens of thousands of years before Christ's time. Oraganized corporate religion like Mormonism is just the extension of man's exploitation by soothsayers and superstition. There have always been the dooms-dayers with their threat of the end of times. Man has been on earth for over fifty thousand years and he will be here another fifty and by that time thousands of more religions will have come and gone.

Gregg Weber
SEATTLE, WA

John the Beloved, 3 Nephites? Are there others we know not of? We don't know everything.

Gracie
Boise, ID

"On another note, I haven't heard any revelations in the 29 years of my life anyways.... Teachings yes, revelations, no."

Apparently you haven't been paying attention.

m.g. scott
LAYTON, UT

@alt134

There is however evidence of a huge flood in the part of the world,(the only known world then) where Noah was.

Id like to hear the skeptics explain how the revelations from LDS Prophets have been wrong or bad for mankind. Example, the Word of Wisdom was given long before we understood that for instance tobacco, alcohol, could cause so much harm.

Staying or getting out of debt. What better lesson could be taught, especially today.

Having a supply of food and other essentials.

Strongly supporting marriage and family. The backbone of our nation.

Many other things too. Even if you don't think they come from a prophet, you certainly can't disagree with them as good teachings.

Even if you don't think these lessons come from a prophet, you certainly can't rationally disagree with them.

Brahmabull
sandy, ut

Gracie - yes actually I have listened very closely. I have not heard anything that qualifies as a revelation in my lifetime.

M.G. Scott - I agree with you there have been some good teachings i.e. word of wisdom, staying out of debt, etc. However, the word of wisdom as it was revealed to Joseph Smith is far different than the word of wisdom we follow today. And yes, many people of the time knew the benefits of obeying it BEFORE the prophet Joseph Smith revealed it. The journal of health in 1830 taught alcohol and tobacco were bad, and eating fruit was good. That was 3 years before the supposed word of wisdom revelation, so it was already an idea floating around and needed no revealing.

m.g. scott
LAYTON, UT

@Brahmabull

Assuming what you say about the journal of health in 1830 is true, but a prophets words are not just for the time in which they were stated. As recently as the 1950s for instance you could see advertisements for cigarettes being good for ones health. And alcohol has become much more deadly today than it could have ever been back then, due to drunk driving. Many revelations from the past, Bible,BOM,D&C,ect. are even more relevent today than when they were given. That is a fundamental principle of the LDS Church.

Gracie
Boise, ID

"Assuming of course that there actually was a global flood which geological research suggests there wasn't.

As m.g. scott pointed out, there is a significant body of scholarly evidence regarding this. It isn't hidden from those who want to study it.

"(Plus Noah would die because of the global warming that would occur having that much water vapor in the atmosphere and he'd die because of the pressure of having that much water in the atmosphere since it'd be like pressures experienced when one is at the bottom of an ocean)."

Obviously you've never been in a place where the humidity ever reaches 100%. It's intensely difficult to deal with but has none of the silly supposed consequences associated with the idea of global warming, manmade or othwerwise.

Brahmabull
sandy, ut

m.g. scott - I agree with you that we should listen to past prophets revelations. That is one of the problems I have with the word of wisdom. The church doesn't adhere to the word of wisdom as it was revealed by god to Joseph Smith. Meat was supposed to be consumed sparingly, and now it is consumed without restriction. Obviously meat is unhealthy for us, especially in the quantities we eat it. So that whole part of the word of wisdom is ignored. Also the original word of wisdom allowed the consumption of beer but didn't allow for strong drinks. This is evident because not only did many apostles in the 1800's continue to drink beer, but Joseph Smith himself drank beer. Surely if anybody knew what god meant when he revealed the word of wisdom, Joseph would. But now the church has changed that direct revelation. It is still in canonized scrupture, yet parts of it are ignored. It doesn't make sense.

Also, I own a book printed in 1806 called "Means of Preserving Health, and Preventing Diseases." It was written by Dr. Shadrach Ricketson. It is strikingly similar to Josephs word of wisdom.

Brahmabull
sandy, ut

continued.... So IMO the word of wisdom did not have to be revealed by god to Joseph Smith - that same information was in a book written by a doctor 27 years before that and clearly was available at the time. Here are some quotes from that book just to give you an idea of where Joseph may have gotten his ideas, again IMO.

"Concerning distilled spirits their frequent and excessive use is not only unnecessary, but highly injurious; and has destroyed thousands"

"It is rare to see great and constant drinkers of strong tea and coffee, somewhat advanced in life, who have not some symptoms of weakness, tremors, or indigestion: wherefore, it is judged, that the great number and increase of paralytic, nervous, and hypochondriac diseases are, in part, to be attributed to the frequent and excessive use of those articles, drunk in a hot and strong state."

"The oil of tobacco is of so active and virulent a nature, that a few drops of it have proven fatal.This plant is possessed of narcotic properties..."

"animal food may be admissible by the human economy... temperate and sparing use of it is the surest means of preserving health"

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