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Sex banned until Warren Jeffs' prison walls crumble, FLDS relatives say

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  • Rifleman Salt Lake City, Utah
    Jan. 6, 2012 6:01 a.m.

    Re: Pagan | 11:33 a.m. Jan. 4, 2012
    "But find NO ISSUE with asking LGBT persons to be 'celibate' (no sex) until marriage"

    No one is asking you to remain celibate. As a matter of fact it is a common practice to live together without the benefits of marriage. The only time it comes up is if you are LDS and want a temple recommend so that makes it a moot point for you.

  • K Mchenry, IL
    Jan. 5, 2012 9:58 p.m.

    There is more to child abuse than relations with underage minors. As if anyone knows there own age there anyway. They are not free to do whatever they want.

    I would like to know, are people leaving?

  • John20000 Cedar Hills, UT
    Jan. 5, 2012 12:26 p.m.

    @pagan: As usual, you slyly twist the thorns. Of course you know, there is no such thing as gay marriage under the legal definition in Utah unless you are referring to a happily married man and woman. Prop 22 passed then overturned, prop 8 passed then overturned, then not overturned, then ???. California still doesn't know what their definition of marriage is. God knows what His definition is and we, as a nation, would be better off, if we followed His definition.

    Homosexual action has been certified by some governments; however, married men in Massachusetts that engage in homosexual action are still breaking God's law of chastity.

  • Lowonoil Clearfield, UT
    Jan. 5, 2012 7:48 a.m.

    For the sake of historical accuracy, it was not Kool Aid, it was the cheaper Flavor Aid. Jim Jones may have been insane, but he was also frugal.

    And I can't see where cutting off the future supply of potential FLDS child abuse victims could be anything but a good thing.

  • Neanderthal Salt Lake, UTah
    Jan. 4, 2012 1:27 p.m.

    @Time4moore:

    Looks to me that if Warren Jeffs can't be having sex, no one else can either.

    Jeffs will experience some interesting situation in jail. There's plenty to do... exercise, read, contemplation, you name it.

  • Anon 808 Waianae, HI
    Jan. 4, 2012 12:56 p.m.

    I hear that the whole Group is moving to Hawaii.

    The Hear, See and Speak No Evil Blue State.

    "reference was not intended when written, but its good and right on and it stays"

  • Pagan Salt Lake City, UT
    Jan. 4, 2012 11:33 a.m.

    Funny.

    People claim the FLDS are 'kooky' for following a leader who makes a decleration of 'no sex' until he is released.

    But find NO ISSUE with asking LGBT persons to be 'celibate' (no sex) until marriage...

    and then WORK to prevent gay marriage.

    *'LDS Church's in-kind donations to Prop. 8 total $190K' - By Lynn Arave - By Dsnews - 02/03/09

    'Proposition 8 was a ballot measure in California last November that changed the state constitution to restrict the definition of marriage to opposite-sex couples and eliminated same-sex couples' right to marry.'

    *Mormon Church agrees to pay small fine for mistake that led to late report of contributions in Prop. 8 campaign' - By Scott Taylor - By DSnews - 06/09/10

    Pot, meet kettle.

    If you don't like how it looks on YOU, why ask it of others?

  • TwinsGuy Savage, MN
    Jan. 4, 2012 9:34 a.m.

    How did that no sex thing work out for the Shakers?

  • Anon 808 Waianae, HI
    Jan. 4, 2012 2:51 a.m.

    I would believe the other fairy tale before I would believe the Wall would crumble. Send him to Denver. The Feds have a joint there thats Underground, 23/7 lock down and double Guards for any movement.Locked down 23/7 No Toys. They have a Super Max called CB Six in Florence Az. that would work just fine.

  • Miss Piggie Salt Lake, UTah
    Jan. 3, 2012 11:37 p.m.

    @Time4moore:

    "Looks to me that if Warren Jeffs can't be having sex, no one else can either."

    Have you thought your comment through carefully? Certainly his adherents can do what they please... as can Jeffs.

  • AZ Blue & Red Gilbert, AZ
    Jan. 3, 2012 10:55 p.m.

    Oh Please

    There for a moment I thougt I was reading a SNL script.

    Better get the rest of my food storage.

  • Rifleman Salt Lake City, Utah
    Jan. 3, 2012 2:26 p.m.

    Re: IMAN | 7:59 a.m. Jan. 1, 2012
    "who am I, you or anyone else to tell them otherwise?"

    The FLDS are free to do whatever they want UNLESS it involves having sex with little girls. Children belong in school and at home nursing one child while pregnant with another.

  • DeltaFoxtrot West Valley, UT
    Jan. 3, 2012 12:37 p.m.

    Can they cut off all of Jeff's communication with the outside world? Seems obvious to me that he is endangering people even from behind bars.

  • TheWalker Saratoga Springs, UT
    Jan. 3, 2012 12:35 p.m.

    I find it difficult to believe that the rank and file membership of the FLDS Church will abandon their husbands and wives just because Warren Jeffs says they should. Nor do I believe that they will abandon their religion. More than likely they will do what is necessary to prevent conception for a short period, but over the long run, Brother Jeffs is likely to be replaced.

  • Alfred Salt Lake, UTah
    Jan. 3, 2012 12:14 a.m.

    @ruthseeker:

    "Will those leaving the cult regroup and start their own FLDS congregations?"

    They can. But what's wrong with the FLDS? Sure, they break state laws such as involving plural marriage. But alotta folks break state laws and nothing happens. Just get on a Utah freeway to see folks breaking state speeding laws. It's not the same as polygamy, you say. Well, thousands of deaths occur from breaking speed limit laws. How many deaths have been noted from polygamy?

  • cjb Bountiful, UT
    Jan. 2, 2012 11:18 p.m.

    When the walls don't come down, I expect there will be a revelation explaining why. I also expect
    The FLDS will buy it hook line and sinker.

  • John Pack Lambert of Michigan Ypsilanti, MI
    Jan. 2, 2012 10:45 p.m.

    Ann Lee, one of the early leaders of the Shakers, died in 1784. It was still going strong at the time of Joseph Smith, and there are still some Shakers alive today. Banning sex does not lead inevitably to a Church vanishing if it recruits new members.

  • Mom of ten SANBORNTON, NH
    Jan. 2, 2012 9:44 p.m.

    I can think of other religions, such as The Shakers, that went "out of the religion business" because it forbade sex and marriage between a man and a woman. For some time, they took in orphan kids to fill their ranks, yet after a while, they recieved few new converts and the orphaned kids chose to join the world. This is what will also happen to the FLDS.

  • rightascension Provo, UT
    Jan. 2, 2012 2:40 p.m.

    Well, Jeffs will winnow out the less faithful . . . or the impotent.

  • UtahBlueDevil Durham, NC
    Jan. 2, 2012 12:15 p.m.

    Sorry for all the typos as usual, my iPad thinks it knows what I mean, and often is wrong... and I only find out too late.

  • UtahBlueDevil Durham, NC
    Jan. 2, 2012 10:26 a.m.

    It is a little frustrating reading these comments from both sides. Both have taken a very biased view of the churches history. It is absolutely true that justifiably so the early church took a very isolationist tact. Unbelievers or those that strayed were asked to leave, and non-believers who passed through were not trusted. There were many events that drove the church to that position then, and is in deep contrast to the policy of the current church. But those are social/political driven decisions, not gospel doctrie driven. It is a little sad that many don't understand this part of the churches history.

    At the same time, anyone who has studied the history can easily identify how Jeffs has bastardized those early teachings for his own advantage, resulting in nothing resembling early church doctrine. To try to draw parallels stretches history to unreconizable representations of what happened.

    Jeff's truly is a sad man desperately trying to maintain control of others lives solely for his on benefit and not out of live for those who follow him..... At least that is my opinion.

  • snowman Provo, UT
    Jan. 2, 2012 9:55 a.m.

    Impartial7: His name is Joseph Smith (not Joe Smith) and polygamy today is not what it was back then.

  • Europe Topeno, Finland
    Jan. 2, 2012 3:15 a.m.

    The difference is, as earlier mentioned, in that "by their fruits ye shall know them".
    We have NEVER declared Joseph to be without sin!, We do declare Christ to be the only one. We also declare that He leads His church. AND that is the real difference in this.
    How do we know?
    By individual, personal revelation - not by counting how many generations of LDS one has in their genealogy.
    How do I know?
    By earnest prayer and by following Christ and His called servants, the Prophets.
    In 1967 I stopped two missionaries on the street in Finland to tell them how wrong they were. I did not want to become "a mormon", but what I heard things I could not deny, because I had known the Truth as a child... Later on my testimony has only strenghtened as I have followed in His footsteps, and followed His Prophets... And as I have seen the fruits of their labor.

  • carman Wasatch Front, UT
    Jan. 1, 2012 7:41 p.m.

    Well said Jack. There are many malcontents who have an ax to grind against the LDS church. They use pejorative terms, ad personam arguments, and try to tear down faith by injecting doubt wherever possible.

    To your point, the original (and current) LDS faith is about personal revelation, living prophets, family, industry and the Living Christ and His doctrines. Not much has changed. Yes, we no longer practice polygamy as these folks love to point out, but the LDS church has always been about building better families and communities. Everywhere they went, they made the places better - Kirtland, Nauvoo, Salt Lake City and many communities all over North America, Central America, South America, and now places all over the world.

    To look at what the FLDS have done in comparison is a study in contrast. Rather than unleash the potential of those who follow Jeffs and his brand of religion, Jeffs has created a dying community, ravaged by mounds of heartache and pain by abusing his self-proclaimed authority as a leader of his community.

  • Jack Aurora, CO
    Jan. 1, 2012 6:54 p.m.

    To Mark;
    What, you think I was born yesterday? Good Heavens! I have many ancestors who practiced polygamy and I think I have a better handle on what the Prophet Joseph (note that I don't use "Joe" Smith, like an anti would)said than Impartial7 would. If you were to pay attention, you would note that my post was more about that, than polygamy. Neither Joseph Smith nor Brigham Young tried to control things like Warren Jeffs is trying to do, nor did they declare marriages, baptisms and memberships null and void until they personally reaffirmed them.. Such is not part of the LDS faith, then or now. Warren Jeffs is about control, the Gospel isn't. Warren Jeffs is trying to cover his sins, the Gospel doesn't do that. So, next time you feel that urge to wade in, stop and think about what is being said and about what.

  • mark Salt Lake City, UT
    Jan. 1, 2012 3:51 p.m.

    Jack, how would he know that the FLDS, is closer to the original Mormon religion then the LDS church is? Good heavens! Study! Learn LDS church history; read what early LDS church presidents said about polygomy and its roll in their religion. The FLDS is far closer to the original religion.

    Of course they won't teach you this in your LDS church meetings today.

  • K Mchenry, IL
    Jan. 1, 2012 3:29 p.m.

    Obviously he expects to be in prison minimum 40 weeks after the edict.

  • Jack Aurora, CO
    Jan. 1, 2012 3:04 p.m.

    To: Impartial7,

    And you know this how? I tend to think that you have a bit of partiality, more than your moniker would imply. "Joe" Smith is used as a pejorative by those wishing harm to the LDS faith, so I gather from your use of it that you feel the same, and are therefore disqualified from any credibility regarding LDS beliefs, past or present.

  • Impartial7 DRAPER, UT
    Jan. 1, 2012 12:06 p.m.

    For all of you bashing Jeff's (& rightly so), you really need to thank Joe Smith & Brigham Young for the FLDS lifestyle. It is more true to the original mormon religion, & the BOM, than current day LDS.

  • Europe Topeno, Finland
    Jan. 1, 2012 10:04 a.m.

    To iman ... Any religion that allows/conducts/recommends activity like Jeff's where underaged children are raped (which is the fact for any child involved intercourse) should have it's rights cancelled.

    Also, I am abhored by some of the comments on these pages like referring to kool-aid. I consider them totally bad taste and not fit for these conversations. We are, afterall, talking about victims (many of them totally innocent) that suffered under sick/satanic leaders who themselves were engaged with adultery and underaged children. When we talk about these events, let's show respect to whoever suffered and address issues correctly.

  • roberto Moses Lake, WA
    Jan. 1, 2012 9:12 a.m.

    Now there is a church I might be interested in. Come on everybody lets go. What? No takers?

  • IMAN Marlborough, MA
    Jan. 1, 2012 7:59 a.m.

    Re:Tyler Ray | 9:17 a.m. Dec. 31, 2011

    Regardless of your biblical quotes IMVHO my question stands. If ANY religions' practices break the law the responsible individual(s) should face the consequences of a secular judiciary. That being said the practices of the Fundamentalest LDS are THEIR BELIEFS, THEIR FAITH. My personal opinion of their practices aside, who am I, you or anyone else to tell them otherwise? Do You really want religious freedom as outlined in the constitution of the U.S. or do you prefer what is popular and commonly acceptable here in the U.S.? Seriously, think about it.

  • across the sea Topeno, Finland
    Jan. 1, 2012 2:40 a.m.

    This all sounds so bizarre, that I wonder if this is really true? Not just banning sex, but cancelling ALL covenants/sealings! That now they all live in a state of NO memberships, NO marriages... Till they are rebaptized and blessings, including marriage, restored...
    This is much more than no bicycles and no sex!

    THEREFORE, I truly hope the Deseret News has researched this fully, and this is not just something DN hears from relatives.

    Allways, even when reported by our own press, remember what the media has spoken about us. The lies and halftruths we have heard from even the most respected media... We should never allow that to stain our own media.

  • zoar63 Mesa, AZ
    Jan. 1, 2012 1:32 a.m.

    If Jeffs has declared all marriages void then the women are free to leave their husbands along with the children. In his own crazy way Jeffs has freed those who have wanted to get out of his oppression, without out retribution. The FLDS will survive though. Sooner or later they will appoint a new Leader and Jeffsrole as their prophet will be past history once the majority of the FLDS realize they cannot live their lives the way he has ordered them to. They will still be polygamists but will leave Jeffs church and start a new one. FLDS do not have a monopoly on polygamy.

  • K Mchenry, IL
    Dec. 31, 2011 5:44 p.m.

    I worry for the pregnancies conceived and children born some months from now. I hope social services is paying attention in some months.

    Can't he be barred from any communication at all?

  • skeptic Phoenix, AZ
    Dec. 31, 2011 3:32 p.m.

    It is easy to follow Iman's view point when religion in general is more than some what strange and cult like and churchs are pretty much the same in kind just differ somewhat in degree of enslavement of mind, soul and body.

  • Hutterite American Fork, UT
    Dec. 31, 2011 3:24 p.m.

    Religion always wants to control sex, doesn't it? Doesn't matter, though, because i haven't been able to get much past the censors today.

  • John Pack Lambert of Michigan Ypsilanti, MI
    Dec. 31, 2011 2:12 p.m.

    Well does not this order show that Jeffs has banned illegal relations between adult males and minor females? Should this willingness to conform to that legal issue not be counted in his favor in considering parol?

  • LDS Liberal Farmington, UT
    Dec. 31, 2011 1:25 p.m.

    IMHO ---
    I believe God is ultimately in control.

    I suppose Warren Jeffs might actually even be bidding his will with this one.
    What, you say? Why is that?

    Let me explain thus --

    BECAUSE....

    Outside influences has never been able to break up the FLDS zealots for over 120 years.

    But, this may be the straw from within, that finally breaks the camel's back.

    Thanks Warren.
    God's children might finally come out from their oppression.

    By bad things happening, good is then allowed to prevail.

  • JohnJacobJingleHeimerSchmidt Beverly Hills, CA
    Dec. 31, 2011 12:44 p.m.

    I am not here to condemn any religion but no organization should be able to facilitate in child rape.

    Jeffs is going to find out really quickly how cutting off sexual relations will destroy his power. In the history of mankind sex and greed have never been defeated.

  • Truthseeker SLO, CA
    Dec. 31, 2011 12:18 p.m.

    Will those leaving the cult regroup and start their own FLDS congregations? Or will they join mainstream society?

  • carver Enterprise, UT
    Dec. 31, 2011 11:55 a.m.

    I own a business in St.George Utah and many of Jeffs followers come into my store. For a long time I thought that these people were very backward in communication skills; until I found out that they were ordered not to speak to anyone outside the FLDS faith unless it was over business.
    These people are controled in more ways than you can imagine. I hope this so called religion fails soon and these good people can recover and become who they want to be. We may all need to help them in some small way.

  • LauraG Concho, AZ
    Dec. 31, 2011 11:38 a.m.

    How is this edict going to be enforced? I thought there were measures in place to keep Jeffs from dictating to his flock and running the church from prison?

  • justamacguy Manti, UT
    Dec. 31, 2011 11:12 a.m.

    I don't think this is going go toward and early release for good behavior?

  • Samwise Salt Lake City, UT
    Dec. 31, 2011 11:00 a.m.

    This will certainly lead to the end of the FLDS church, if not by everyone finally getting fed up and leaving the cult, in time this sex ban will lead to having no next generation left to continue the cult, because the evil Jeffs is not getting out of prison any time soon.

  • CougarBlue Heber City, UT
    Dec. 31, 2011 10:44 a.m.

    This is one bizarre commandment, which flies in the face of the first commandments given to Adam and Eve. This is what comes of a church based on man and not God. This will be an extermination order for this group. If there are no more children to control then there will be no more church.

  • t702 Las Vegas, NV
    Dec. 31, 2011 10:32 a.m.

    I think Jeff had a come to god moment. He knows his followers will jump off a cliff for him. By refraining from sex prevent future offsprings from facing the same deadend all his followers are coming to realize. I bet Jeff is practicing selfdestruction of his type to end the misery he had been preaching for generations...LOL

  • MoJules Florissant, MO
    Dec. 31, 2011 10:31 a.m.

    Warren, may you live to be 100. I hope more of the people in this group will figure out that the person leading them is 100% certified crazy.

  • Cucamonga Coot Rancho Cucamoga, CA
    Dec. 31, 2011 10:22 a.m.

    Jeffs "The Cool Aid is ready"

  • Ernest T. Bass Bountiful, UT
    Dec. 31, 2011 10:05 a.m.

    Sounds great, where can I sign up?

  • Tyler Ray Taylorsville, UT
    Dec. 31, 2011 9:17 a.m.

    Iman,
    "by their fruits ye shall know them." The fruits of the leader of the sect are what make them appalling. Rape, destruction of agency, forbidding of good things. Not ok for any religion!

  • Ranch Here, UT
    Dec. 31, 2011 9:05 a.m.

    Goodbye FLDS.

    We're going to miss you. It might take a generation but if ya ain't gonna play, ya ain't gonna stay.

  • IMAN Marlborough, MA
    Dec. 31, 2011 8:55 a.m.

    What makes the FLDS religion any more or less strange, appalling, cult like, etc; than any other religion? It is puzzling to see this particular religion openely criticized while criticisim of any other religion appears not to be tolerated.

  • UtahBlueDevil Durham, NC
    Dec. 31, 2011 8:52 a.m.

    Time4moore - I was thinking the same thing.

    And he believes this will bring about his early release how? I feel sorry for the young people being raised under the leadership of this group. How very sad their mortality will be wasted in this way because of the ravings of a very selfish man.

  • Uncle Rico Sandy, UT
    Dec. 31, 2011 6:54 a.m.

    This isn't religion, this is the ramblings of an imprisoned madman whose own lust and selfishness drive him.

  • Time4moore La Verkin, UT
    Dec. 31, 2011 6:50 a.m.

    Looks to me that if Warren Jeffs can't be having sex, no one else can either.

  • CJ Murray, UT
    Dec. 31, 2011 6:21 a.m.

    We need to thank Warren for ending his own sect, unfortunately it will probably last about a week.I can't believe anyone actually listens to this guy any longer.
    The scary thing is that there are a lot more where he came from.

  • ER in EUR Belgrade, Serbia
    Dec. 31, 2011 6:13 a.m.

    Well I have to say he will be successful.

    He will winnow his group down to only those who are truly loyal to him as is said in the article. However, that number will be less than the fingers on my hand.

    If someone had purposefully tried to destroy his power over his group, they would have failed miserably as compared to his crazy plan. Good riddance to him and I hope he never sees the light of day. I do not mind someone having a different opinion than I do, but he is obviously hell-bent on impose his will on anyone he can.

    Again, he will be successful on imposing his will on an extremely small number of people, but will ultimately destroy the FLDS church. Good.

  • JNA Layton, UT
    Dec. 31, 2011 6:03 a.m.

    Let me see if I understand......

    1. I get to have sex
    2. I get to bring a beautiful new life into the world
    3. I get kicked out of this church run by an extremely evil man.

    and the down side is.......what exactly?

  • Honor Code Denver, Colorado
    Dec. 31, 2011 5:48 a.m.

    I think Jeffs is confusing himself........what he really meant to say was when that "other place" freezes over!! In the mean time he'll continue to rot in prison!

  • JKR Holladay, UT
    Dec. 31, 2011 5:23 a.m.

    This is hilarious! I predict a long dry spell for the FLDS faithful. May they dwindle in numbers until their purposely remote settlement becomes a ghost town. The rest of us can accept these people back into society where they belong. Mr. Jeffs has a long prison sentence in front of him because he did criminal things which he refuses to acknowledge were wrong. This will not please the Texas parole board.

  • Devin American Fork, UT
    Dec. 31, 2011 3:18 a.m.

    Wow warren jeffs....no bicycles, ATVs, trampolines and children's toys? Now there's no sex? What's next? No medicine, food, water, and oxygen? Would you croak already please?

  • indycrimson Franklin, IN
    Dec. 31, 2011 2:44 a.m.

    What a horrible deal to try and unwind? It is good that families are flocking from this community but their current lifestyle must make it hard to assimilate into a different society when the baseline fundamentals are askew?? When one father/husband leaves Jeff's experiment, and he has multiple wives, where do they go? Leaving Texas seems easy and bless those shelters who take them in...but after that the real problem exists...

    These refugees must feel totally misplaced. My heart breaks for the children. It's always the innocent who pay the price.

  • On the other hand Spanish Fork, UT
    Dec. 31, 2011 1:02 a.m.

    Jeffs might want to study up on his scriptures while he's in prison...

    "...Have ye not read, that he which made them at the beginning made them male and female, And said, For this cause shall a man leave father and mother, and shall cleave to his wife: and they twain shall be one flesh? Wherefore they are no more twain, but one flesh. What therefore God hath joined together, let not man put asunder." -- Matthew 19:4-6

    "Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils; Speaking lies in hypocrisy; having their conscience seared with a hot iron; Forbidding to marry...." -- 1 Timothy 4:1-3

    "And again, verily I say unto you, that whoso forbiddeth to marry is not ordained of God, for marriage is ordained of God unto man." -- Doctrine & Covenants 49:15

  • A1994 Centerville, UT
    Dec. 31, 2011 12:37 a.m.

    I'm going to go out on a limb and guess that the edict is going to be broken long before the prison walls are.

  • John Pack Lambert of Michigan Ypsilanti, MI
    Dec. 30, 2011 11:01 p.m.

    Please stop refering to it as the "Fundamentalist LDS Church". Either use the whole name or FLDS. The other name is far too confusing and misleading.

  • Veracity Morgan, UT
    Dec. 30, 2011 9:58 p.m.

    Where's the Kool aid?

  • Stay the Course Salt Lake City, utah
    Dec. 30, 2011 9:25 p.m.

    This is Warren Jeffs not Alma and Amulek
    The walls ain't falling any time soon in my humble opinion

  • Jim Mesa, Az
    Dec. 30, 2011 9:06 p.m.

    Wasn't one of the first commandments to multiply and replinish the earth.....now how are they going to do that. Jeffs ain't getting out anytime soon.

  • cambodia girl Phnom Penh, Cambodia
    Dec. 30, 2011 8:29 p.m.

    Jeffs sounds like he is a minion to Satan. Satan wants all men to be miserable like himself and so because Jeffs has to be celibate while in prison, everyone else has to be celibate also. He is definitely a control freak and loves the attention that the newspapers are giving him.

    I am so sorry for those who are blinded by his corrupt power. I hope all family members and friends of those people who are still following him will find a way to reach out to them and help them escape.

  • BobP Port Alice, B.C.
    Dec. 30, 2011 6:57 p.m.

    Hilarious. Cutting of sex will kill the religion quicker than anything.

  • DN Subscriber Cottonwood Heights, UT
    Dec. 30, 2011 5:55 p.m.

    Every so often a religious leader will come out and command his followers to do really kooky stuff. Jim Jones and his deadly "cool aid party?" The Heavan's Gate group waiting for the spaceship that was following the Hale-Bopp comet?

    People are free to follow any religion they want to, but disintrested observers must note that some religious leaders have pretty kooky ideas, and followers might want to think long (and prayerfully?) about the wisdom of their religion compared to others.

    Especially when a leader has been convicted of criminal offenses.

    I wish them all well, whatever ensues.