It strikes me as disingenuous and hypocritical to call all other Christian
religions "an abomination" and accuse them all of falling into
"apostasy" (The Great Apostasy), and then turn around and plagiarize
their traditions and rites.
If you are a true atheist, then you must think all of it is hogwash anyway and
what difference does it make to you.
To Atheist:Your use of th word "plagarize" is questionable
since Brother Huntsman gavereferences to his statements concerning
"The Advent". All Christians, including the LDS, SHARE many many
common areas of Belief. Why not add more common belief/concepts to that rich
tapestry of Common Belief?Sure Joseph Smith said that Jesus said
that there was "abomination"in the churches of the early 1800's,
it doesn't mean that ALL the beliefswere bad or distorted. Joseph Smith
did say numerous times that there WAS MUCHTRUTH in the existing churces of
the early 1800's. He also said there were errors. Basically he said that the
Lord Jesus wanted to bring Fullnessof the Gospel back to the Earth.Atheist, I think you're pushing your thoughts to extreme ends. Not
allatheists see the world the same way and have differing viewpoints.
MyDad was an atheist, but I still loved him. Let's seek for Common
Groundand appreciate our differences too.In addition to being
a Professor at BYU, Brother Eric Huntsman also is a member of the
Tabernacle Choir.Thank You Brother Huntsman for your fine news
article and I'm planning topurchase your new book. Lord
Brother Paul,What "common ground"? Your religion claims to
have a monopoly on authority, virtue and morality. Your religion aspires to
achieve a one-world governmental theocracy requiring atheists like me to bow the
knee and confess with the tongue that Jesus is the Christ (anointed one), or
else be destroyed horribly. Your religion has no tolerance for other views,
calling the beliefs of others "abominations" and the professors of all
other religions "all corrupt", and they all "apostatized"
from the truth.Yet you steal forms of worship and celebration from
these "corrupt" churches. You incorporate hymns from these
"apostate" churches into your own hymnbooks as it is convenient for
you. You call them "all wrong", and accuse 2,000 years of Christianity
of being apostate, corrupt, and "denying the power of god", then spend
millions on public relations campaigns and presidential campaigns to try and
convince everyone that you are really a "Christian" religion.As an atheist, why do I care? Because we non-believers are tired of being
caught up in the messes you religionists create, and then being accused of
having no morality.
Having seen the transformation of the mormon church from when I lived in SLC in
the early 80's until today, I don't really see it as "stealing" a
tradition. The mormon church seems to be moving away from its early teachings
and history and becoming a more mainstream group. I see adopting other
practices as part of this move. In some ways, I think it is necessary for its
survival as so many have found the historical basis implausible, thus it has
become necessary to change and focus instead on the current values the church
espouses. I think its good for the members because moderating the beliefs
creates a more tolerant group dynamic.
To Thinksithink: I think you are really misreading and understanding of the
Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints and the so called movement. From
the beginning there has always been common ground. The problem with so many
especially like the atheist is that we are not saying that every knee shall bow
andevery tongue confess that Jesus is the Christ, but Christ himself. Whether
he believes it or not really is not the point. The LDS Church still holds to
the fact that we are the only true and living Church of Jesus Christ upon the
Earth. This has not changed nor will it change. As President Hinkley stated
and also Joseph Smith, there is much truth in the other Christian sects but as
he so quickly stated, bring your truth and we shall add to it.Also,
as all leaders of the Church have stated, we are a preculiar people and we will
remain so. Our morality is the same as the morality that Jesus Christ has
pledged. Again the time will come when every knee shall bow and every tongue
confess that Jesus is the Christ, the redeemer of the world.
Bill in Nebraska,Respectfully, I don't agree that the LDS Church
holds that it is the only true and Living Church of Jesus Christ. One, as you
point out, the LDS Church acknowledges that there are truths in other churches.
Two, the LDS Church of today has rejected many past teachings - things that at
one time were considered true and now we are told those things were never true
but were just a man's personal opinion. (I'm not talking about polygamy which
is still "true" but not practiced). So, regardless of any claims made
today, the actions show realization that no church has the corner on truth.
To Thinksithink: What teachings at the time were considered true but now are
not. If you are talking about the priesthood. It has always been understood
that they would one day hold the priesthood. That has never changed. If you
are talking about that man shall become an exalted being but may not have
his/her own planet. That never was taught but what is taught is that yes we
shall become exalted just as the Father and the Son. We will become even as
they are. So what is taught that is different from this. You will find very
few of anything that is different from the beginning. Even the Word of Wisdom
has become a living prophesy of the Prophet Joseph Smith. So it stands as it
should. You will find that even Elder McConkie stated that the Church would
never have allowed blacks the priesthood but he later was to say especially as
he was a member of the Seventy when the revelation came. He stated matter of
factually that he and Brigham Young were wrong. Not an opinion at all.
REf: The AtheistAs an atheist, why do I care? Because we
non-believers are tired of being caught up in the messes you religionists
create, and then being accused of having no morality. Everyone makes
their own decisions and what they will be "caught up in" If you don't
want to be "caught up in the messes you religionists create" then
don't. You are free to believe or not believe as you see fit just as we do that
believe in Jesus Christ. Why are you concerned about being "destroyed
horribly" if you are a true non believer.I have never
understood why people that claim to be athiest get in such a twist over other
peoples beliefs. Live and let live and believe what you will.
Bill in Nebraska,My point exactly. We don't know what things are
being taught today that later will be deemed wrong. For example, I expect at
some point the church will abandon the Book of Abraham and likely treat all
scripture as spiritual truth but not an account of historical facts. It
eventually has to happen with advances in science, DNA, archeology, etc.
Again, I think its good and I believe the changes to date have been to
everyone's benefit. It makes it much easier for some to continue as members.
That I totally disagree with because the Book of Abraham is not in whole or in
part of what was translated. This is the problem with the critics. We know
that what has been recovered is not all of the papryi that Joseph Smith had. In
fact, in many instances what we have is only partial. FAIR has done an
excellent job of explaining this and considering the fact the Sunday School
ciriculium stills considers it.Secondly, scripture will remain as
scripture. This is a falicy of those members on the fence. Scripture will remain
as it is. First, of if you read the Book of Mormon you will find that it says
nothing of being a Jew but that the Nephites and Lamanites are of the house of
Israel. This means that the House of Joseph as stated as a tribe of Israel as
Jacob's sons were called are Israelites but not all Israelites are Jews. Only
the House of Judah and one half of the House of Benjamin are those who make up
the Jews. Joseph's lineage no one knows. Thus to be of the house of Ephrain is
not to be of the House of Judah.
Bill in Nebraska,But the drawing that is printed in the Book of
Abraham is in the Papyri that was discovered. The Book of Abraham's description
of the characters in the drawing printed in the Book of Abraham is completely
unrelated to what expert's unanimously say the characters in the drawing are.
Thus, it appears its not so much historical fact as some revealed spiritual
truth. I didn't come up with this on my own. I think some mormon writers have
suggested as much.
Poor, poor athesist or is it happy, happy athesist? You got yourself a lot of
attention this time around. Most of what you blathered on about is complete
nonsense which I wouldn't attempt to correct because you believe what you want.
Suffice it to say that the Lord has told us that all good comes from Him no
matter who has it. And He will never force you to bow the knee and confess
anything. If that happens it will be because you, and only you, desire it.As for the advent: what a lovely tradition. It does give families of
all beliefs an opportunity to gather together and talk about the things that are
Concerning previous comments:There's a line from the Forrest Gump
movie that goes, "I think Lieutenant Dan made his peace with
God". It's towards the end of the movie.I hope that
"Atheist" makes his peace with God someday. I can tell from the
wording and phraseology that there's much dis-comfort (almost anger) now.It's good to know that one is at peace with God. The LDS Church itself
is interpreted differently by many of its own members. Joseph Smith DID say
thatthat there was much truth in the many different branches of Christian
Belief.That's in the historical record.Lord Bless you and Hope
that you have a Good Holiday Season!!
Brother Paul,God knows where to find me. If he wants to "make
peace", he knows where I live.I can't say the same in reverse.
Neither can you. "Where is the pavilion that covereth [God's] hiding
place?"Until God, or Big Foot, or Santa, or any of the others
show up to "make peace", I am at peace with myself, my loved ones, and
my country.What else matters?
Only Christians celebrate Advent, mormons have no concept of this in there new
age religion. This article is funny trying to draw any parallel between
Christianity and the mormondon in slc.
You will find a lot of things said about the Book of Abraham. I suggest going
to FAIR and read what actually is said. Although the following author is not
officially sanctioned by the Church, I'm sure you will find it interesting as to
why FAIR has answered the question pertaining to the Book of Abaham. Michael
Ash, Of Faith and Reason. Read it especially pertaining to the evidences
supporting the Book of Abraham. It is quite enlightening. You once said that
FAIR is a dis-service to the Church but there are many who feel they are doing a
great service for the Church. Though I don't totally agree with some aspects of
what FAIR says it does give room and thought to what is the truth and what the
critics say is their truth. The explanations they give make better sense than
anything the critics can come up with. Also, if you haven't read Richard
Bushman's Rough Stone Rolling you should do that also. It is more for fence
sitters than those with a firm testimony of the truthfulness of the Church of
Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints.
Christians should recall that Holidays comes from Holy Days and that theirs are
not the only observances at this time of year, including the pagan celebrations
they usurped to aid in converting people to Christianity.There is a
lot more to the season than shopping and going mad for all the presents you'll