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Red roundup: Whittingham chimes in on Utes' identity, model

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  • hedgelog Idaho Falls, ID
    May 5, 2011 2:45 p.m.

    Before voting for hill, the should check out his hires in basketball. If little k fails, hill may be next!

  • Dutchman Murray, UT
    May 5, 2011 2:46 p.m.

    Larry Scott is a genius. He and the PAC 10 presidents passed on BYU when they expanded the conference. We have heard and read ad nausea from BYU fans how this was a mistake and the PAC 12 would regret it because BYU has a bigger fan base and would earn everybody more money ect. ect. Now along comes Larry Scott with his TV deal in hand (FOX and ESPN) where he holds the exclusive rights to any premier TV games so he can put them on the PAC 12 network and without adding BYU to the conference he will probably encourage every team in the PAC 12 to schedule BYU because as an independent BYU will need to fill their schedule. By so doing Larry will place every one of those BYU vs PAC 12 games (including Utah) exclusively on his PAC 12 network and all those BYU fans who watch them on TV will have to buy the network subscription. The PAC 12 reaps the benefit of BYU and its fan money without having them as a member of the conference and all the political correctness and Sunday play issues that come with it. Brilliant!!!

  • JDL Magna, UT
    May 5, 2011 3:30 p.m.

    Dutchman:

    You forget that BYU has it's own deal with ESPN. Even if BYU schedules PAC 12 games they will most likely be home & home so you may be half right, but then again, I think ESPN would make sure the games were on ESPN not PAC12 network.

    Nice try though.

  • CG Orem, UT
    May 5, 2011 3:44 p.m.

    Dutchman

    Larry Scott has no choice whatsoever in deciding which games are shown on the PAC 12 network.

    That decision will rest entirely within the control of the ESPN and FOX, who will decide which games they're going to broadcast. ESPN, as a partner with BYU, will certainly opt to televise every game involving BYU that isn't televised by FOX.

    The PAC 12 network will never see a dime from BYU fans.

    Bigotry is not something to be proud of and the PAC 12 will still have to deal with the Sunday no play issue with Utah. If the PAC 12 is dumb enough to schedule a Sunday home game for Utah, they won't be doing the Utes any favors because a Sunday home game will guarantee at least half of Utah's fans won't be at the game.

  • Dutchman Murray, UT
    May 5, 2011 3:59 p.m.

    CG,

    You need to get up to speed with the latest contract updates from Jon Wilner. He is reporting that Scott has exclusive rights over every PAC 12 game so that the conference can put it on the subsription only PAC 12 network. FOX and ESPN agreed to this. As an independent BYU needs games to fill a schedule and they would prefer to have a lot of those games in the PAC 12 foot print where they recruit. Scott knows how to make money and for every one of those BYU games at a PAC 12 school it will end up on the PAC 12 network. ESPN and FOX have no say in the matter. They have already agreed to allow the conference to have those exclusive selection rights as to where a game(s) is broadcast.

  • In My Humble Opinion South Jordan, UT
    May 5, 2011 4:13 p.m.

    "Whittingham chimes in," as in "ca-ching!" Meanwhile, athletes are grossly underpaid under these new revenue figures.

  • flynn is the coolest Salt Lake City, UT
    May 5, 2011 4:26 p.m.

    Even if BYU were to agree to appear in games broadcast by the PAC 12 network, they'd still want the right to re-broadcast it on BYUtv- and thus circumvent lining Larry's pockets. Of course some BYU fans including myself would be willing to pay for the PAC12 network to watch Utah games as well. And yes I will cheer for the TUN- though it will be nice to see the TUN fans learn a lesson in humility.

  • Duckhunter Highland, UT
    May 5, 2011 4:36 p.m.

    @dutchman

    So I went and read all of Wilners columns from this week that have to do with the pac10 deal. Nest time you may not want to tell us your sources so that no one can actually check them and discover (no surprise) that you are fibbing.

    As Wilner reported yesterday the pac10 will not have first choice of all games despite your assertion that they will. The pac10 network will have the 1st choice of games only twice all year. There are how many weeks in a college football season? Let's see everyone plays 12 games and most everyone has at least one bye week, sometimes two, plus some start a week earlier than others, so there are between 12 and 15 weeks in a college football regular season. Of those 12-15 weeks the pac10 network gets 1st choice of games twice.

    Also your assertion that the pac10 has exclusive rights to say where a game is broadcast? False! LOL They have no such thing. The only thing they have is the right to stage their post season basketball tournament wherever they want it.

    Nice try but we all learned to use the google at BYU.

  • gonefishn Salt Lake City, UT
    May 5, 2011 6:17 p.m.

    I cannot believe Y fans are still trying to nit pick what is obviously a great deal in every way, shape and form. Come up for air and read any national or local article on the subject. This deal absolutely crushes any deal that has come before it. Are you sure you still want to continue showing your ignorance?

  • hedgehog Ann Arbor, MI
    May 5, 2011 6:20 p.m.

    "Nice try but we all learned to use the google at BYU"

    Ducky,

    But you didn't go to BYU....

  • JDL Magna, UT
    May 5, 2011 7:13 p.m.

    Fishn, No one on this thread nit picked any one except Hedge, Dutch and you. I ignored Hedge even when he disparaged Dr. Hill and then Dutch opened the door and made some assumptions and disparaged BYU, a few of us walked in the door

    This story is about the University of Utah not BYU and before any BYU fans typed a letter BYU was blasted by Dutch.

    Oh the hypocrisy,

  • Bluto Sandy, UT
    May 5, 2011 7:18 p.m.

    The question is...

    Of the Pac 10.2 National Games on Fox and ESPN, how many times will they choose a Utah game?

    I say none.

    Therefore....Hellooo Fox Regional.......in two years.

    Four years for equal $$$$....maybe!

    As for next year, Looks like Utah's only National Game will be the BYU away game, oops, riding big brothers coat-tails again , eh Utes?

    Ahh, it's good to be a Coug.

  • Bluto Sandy, UT
    May 5, 2011 7:21 p.m.

    @JDL

    It's called intellectual debate. Seems to me BYU fans are very articulate and come ready with facts in hand.

    No free reign for Ute spinsters here.

  • hedgehog Ann Arbor, MI
    May 5, 2011 7:24 p.m.

    JDL,

    Look closer it's a byu troll called Hedge - log

  • hedgehog Ann Arbor, MI
    May 5, 2011 7:28 p.m.

    "Four years for equal $$$$....maybe!"

    Deep breaths bluto, deep breaths.

    There is no "maybe" in the truck loads of cash the Utes will be hauling in. It's a legal contract agreement.... no crazy holmoe/WAC loop holes.

  • Dutchman Murray, UT
    May 5, 2011 8:56 p.m.

    The following statements are directly from Wilner's reporting:

    "Having quality content on the network is enormously important for leverage in potential carriage fights with distributors."

    "The remaining regular-season football games, an average of approximately three games per week, will be featured exclusively on the Pac-12 Network."

    "High-quality football and basketball content on Pac-12 Network will minimize distribution fights. We have structured things in a very distributor-friendly manner."

    3 games per week over a 12 week season is 36 games that will be featured exclusively on the PAC 12 network. Larry wants high quality content on the network to attract subscribers. PAC 12 games with BYU will be on this tier. That is my analysis and I stand by it. Obviously, games between conference members will be the games featured on ESPN, FOX and ABC.

  • Duckhunter Highland, UT
    May 5, 2011 9:24 p.m.

    @dutchman

    No dutchman, you claimed the pac10 network got 1st choice of games, they don't, the only way the pac10 network gets to broadcast a BYU/utah game is if it is played at the quaint little stadium on the hill and then only if ESPN or FOX doesn't choose it 1st. Since the pac10 network only gets 1st choice twice all season my guess is they may want to choose that game since it would definately draw a whole lot more viewers than any other game utah plays all year so you may be right about that. They are going to need at least one game every two years on that network that would actually have decent ratings.

    They won't choose to put games like USC/UCLA or Stanford/Cal on the pac10 network because they actually want those games to be seen instead of hidden away on their low distribution network. So every other year they may actually get to broadcast that game and since they know BYU is a huge draw they will probably jump all over it. They know they can't get any real rating depending on utahs miniscule fanbase.

  • Seattleview Federal Way, WA
    May 5, 2011 9:54 p.m.

    The debate about TV contracts is stupid. Pac 12 is a much better situation.

    Lets just wait two years and see how BYU and Utah have changed. It is going to be hard for BYU to keep up.

    I am curious to see if BYU Salt Lake will make overtures to get more BYU Provo fans to watch them. If they dont increase their fan following, they wont be very impressive in the TV ratings comparrison. They dont want to be considered another Oregon State of WSU.

    Congrtulations Utah. This move will be good for the university and good for the state of Utah. Anthletically, we will see how it turns out.

  • Rock Of The Marne Phoenix, AZ
    May 5, 2011 10:01 p.m.

    Welcome to Ducky's fantasy world where whatever he says actually is. Facts to back it up? Who needs facts when you can just make stuff up that you want to be true in order to put down the team that got the prize and left your team behind to do the cute little independent/not invited thing (an actual fact). Do any other Ute fans find it strange that so many Y fans seem so obsessed with the PAC 12 TV deal and the terms thereof? I could really care less about BYU's ESPN deal; yawn.

  • utesovertide Salt Lake City, UT
    May 5, 2011 10:48 p.m.

    Duckpunter,

    Rock of the marne is right. You've got about as much credibility on this subject as North Korea. You and your band of followers were all saying weeks ago that $20 M per school wasn't possible and all of your many reasons in post after post. Well, wake up to reality that you were way wrong. Instead, you call out dutchman who has been way more accurate than you.

    The info on it is pretty plain: the Pac 12's new wholly owned media company is going to call the shots on where the media is going to end up. They have every distribution tier accounted for. The Pac 12 network will be nationally available, and will feature premier content, which they will hand pick. The network details will be announced a few months from now, so please do us all a favor and hold your breath till then.

  • BYU Deek Spanish Fork, UT
    May 5, 2011 10:55 p.m.

    @ Rock of the Marne,
    If you were actually paying attention to the thread you would have seen that it was not Duckhunter that brought up the tv contract facts. (Or lack thereof). It was dutchman. Dutch doesn't know that the 12 teams in the PAC12 all play 12 games next year, meaning that 144 total games will be played. The PAC12 network will air 36 games, or 1/4 of the total games played by the PAC12. Yet, he's saying that BYU will be playing on the PAC12 network, because Larry Scott knows that Utah can't pull ratings in its own state, so the PAC12 will need to schedule games with BYU to help jump ratings on its own network. So, in reality Dutchman was admitting that Utah plays second fiddle to BYU, and quite frankly he's right. BYU going independent is still a much bigger deal than Utah's joining the PAC12. Utah may have left first, but BYU made a much bigger splash. Even Ute fans are stating that the PAC12 Network won't work without PAC12 teams scheduling BYU to help boost ratings. Dutch's words, not mine.

  • Wiley Old School RIC, VA
    May 6, 2011 7:24 a.m.

    Deek,

    How quickly you forget what it means to be in a conference. Each PAC12 team will play nine conference games for a total of 54 games. Add 36 non-conference games (three for each team) and you get a total of 90, so the PAC12 network will air 40% of the games. (Championship game not factored in.)

    Your sloppy math, however, has much more credibility than your statement that "BYU going independent is still a much bigger deal than Utah's joining the PAC12." That statement is laughable, even coming out of Spanish Fork.

    Enjoy your 12-game "big splash" exhibition season, especially that home schedule. Thank goodness Utah visits LES this year. It's the only thing that makes BYU's home schedule more attractive than SUU's.

  • Dutchman Murray, UT
    May 6, 2011 8:32 a.m.

    Here is an interesting statement made by Larry Scott when he was being interviewed regarding the astounding PAC 12 TV deal with FOX and ESPN and creating a wholly owned PAC 12 media company with a PAC 12 network:

    "Both ESPN and Fox know my views," Scott said. "They both know that if we were to expand, there would be appropriate adjustments to our fees and we certainly have the ability to expand under these contracts. I don't foresee it happening in the near future but it's my view that there will be further expansion down the road."

    Further expansion down the road. Scott certainly is relentless in achieving his goals for the PAC 12 conference. It seems like the PAC 12 network and possible more expansion are his next pet projects. It will be interesting to see where BYU lands in the next round. Will BYU land in one of the super conferences or not? You make the call.

  • hedgehog Ann Arbor, MI
    May 6, 2011 8:38 a.m.

    "Thank goodness Utah visits LES this year. It's the only thing that makes BYU's home schedule more attractive than SUU's"

    Wiley Old School,

    Totally agree. I've yet to hear BYU fans thank the Utes for doing them a huge favor. Without Utah on thier home schedule it's possibly the worst schedule in BYU history.

  • aggieblue Saint George, UT
    May 6, 2011 8:47 a.m.

    Wanted to read article about the u and the comments. Seems as tho this is a Y article, nearly every post compares the u to the Y. Why are so many obsessed with being better than the Y or any other teams.

    my aggies are not the top, we have our good games, win some we should loose and loose some we should win. It is fun to watch, both teams, whoever they might be. Kids work hard, coaches get the most out of them and together they give us a good time and entertainment.

    The entertainment continues here. Hasve fun you Y and u posters.

  • Duckhunter Highland, UT
    May 6, 2011 8:56 a.m.

    @pebbles and utesovertide

    Is the truth really that hard for you two to handle? ductmans claims were false and I proved it. My post was 100% correct and if you know how to use the google and find Wilners columns, the ones dutcman claimed to have gotten his info from, you can read it yourself. I'm sure you have no interest in doing that because reality is obviously not something either of you want to embrace.

    Once again dutcman claimed the pac10 network got 1st choice of all games. False. They get 1st choice twice each season. That's 2 out of 15.

    dutchman claimed espn and fox gave the pac10 exclusive rights to decide where the games are broadcast. False again. ESPN and FOX can broadcast, or not broadcast, the games they carry wherever they want to do so. That means if they only want to show it regionally then that's what they will do if they want to broadcast it nationally that is what they will do. I'm sure usc will spend alot of time on national tv and utah will spend most of theirs on regional. But at least ute fans can watch them.

  • utesovertide Salt Lake City, UT
    May 6, 2011 9:58 a.m.

    @Ducky,

    I'm sorry, but in my understanding of it, you are the one that is wrong. The Pac 12 is forming their own media company. This has never been done before to such a degree in college sports. They will control all of the media licensing, from TV, to radio, to internet. If you don't think they will wield control and leverage over where the content ends up going, I don't know what to tell you. Everything I have read on it points to that fact.

    Also, I am a software developer, so unlike a lot of people in the world I still know more about computers than they know about me. I have been to foreign countries to set up web servers, and have been using Google since 1998 when I first read about it in technology guides.

    Again, stop acting as if you know everything.

  • Ibleedcrimson Cottonwood Heights, UT
    May 6, 2011 10:00 a.m.

    Quack,

    I love how you're the paragon of facts then end it all up with this:

    " I'm sure usc will spend alot of time on national tv and utah will spend most of theirs on regional. But at least ute fans can watch them."

    Is this another one of your "facts"?

    Is this all you have left BYU fans, disecting the minutiae of the contract looking for little nuggets you can interperet as a negative, then applying your spin?

    If the deal your team has is so inherently better then why bother to comment at all? What's the point?

  • Rock Of The Marne Phoenix, AZ
    May 6, 2011 10:05 a.m.

    Ducky and other Y trolls, the point is this is a U of U article and you are all over it like white on rice which in my book makes you desperate little Mid Major brothers looking to makes yourselves feel better about the major slight of last June. Really, showing that level of obsession about the U of U is very telling. I wish the Y no ill will, though I am tired of the comparison game from Y fans. Utah and its fans are very happy with how things turned out; not one of them would rather be independent. Bottom line, the PAC 10 wanted Utah they didn't want BYU. BYU did what it had to do by getting out of the Mt. Worst which I totally understand; they chose the best option available. But in no way is that option equal to being in the PAC 12 or Big 12. You'll find that out if you have undefeated season beating ranked teams along the way and they don't even consider you for NC game because you're not part of the club (I didn't say it was fair).

  • Duckhunter Highland, UT
    May 6, 2011 10:22 a.m.

    @utesovertide

    Obviously that vast knowledge of computers doesn't help any with reading comprehension. You are wrong and if you just bother reading the actual articles ductman claimed he got his info from you may be able to comprehend it.

    But really this is just about you having a kneejerk reaction to the debate. You want to agree with ductman and you want to disagree with me so rather than actually finding the truth of the matter you just go off half cocked so you can disagree with me.

    As I said before you obviously have no desire to know the truth of the matter.

    But if it helps you feel better about yourself I do think the tv deal the pac10 got is a great one. You see reality is where I dwell. It is an excellent deal so there is no reason to pretend it is something it isn't. It isn't what ductman claimed but it is still the best deal any conference has.

    Enjoy the reality of it rather than some ficticious claims.

  • utesovertide Salt Lake City, UT
    May 6, 2011 11:01 a.m.

    @Duckhunter,

    Oh, so now that I point out that I am very skilled in computers it is my reading comprehension that is lacking. Hmmm, keep digging for a reason for me to be wrong. Again, I have read every one of Wilner's articles. What am I supposed to comprehend from the following:

    "Both ESPN and Fox know my views..." "Pac-12 will form the Pac-12 Media Enterprises, which will include TV and digital network and commercial arm." "approximately three games per week, will be featured exclusively on the Pac-12 Network." "High-quality football and basketball content on Pac-12 Network will minimize distribution fights"."Pooling digital and mobile rights allows league to approach distributors with assets that make (the Network) more appealing. "The Pac-12 Network will have first pick in the selection of football games twice during the season."

    From that, we know Larry is King, The best 2 games each year will be on the Pac Network. Network content each week will feature 3 "high-quality" games. How does any of that say that when BYU plays a Pac team, it won't be on the Pac 12 Network?

  • Dutchman Murray, UT
    May 6, 2011 11:19 a.m.

    Everyone,

    My original comment in my original post was this and I still stand by it. Thanks though for all your input. It has been an interesting discussion.

    "Now along comes Larry Scott with his TV deal in hand (FOX and ESPN) where he holds the exclusive rights to any premier TV games so he can put them on the PAC 12 network and without adding BYU to the conference he will probably encourage every team in the PAC 12 to schedule BYU because as an independent BYU will need to fill their schedule. By so doing Larry will place every one of those BYU vs PAC 12 games (including Utah) exclusively on his PAC 12 network and all those BYU fans who watch them on TV will have to buy the network subscription. The PAC 12 reaps the benefit of BYU and its fan money without having them as a member of the conference......"

  • Duckhunter Highland, UT
    May 6, 2011 3:51 p.m.

    @utesovertide

    "the pac10 network will have the first pick in the selection of football games TWICE during the season"

    Hmmm.....that doesn't sound like the pac10 network has 1st choice of all games to me. Also "approximately three games per week will be featured exclusively on the pac10 network....High quality football and basketball content on pac10 network". Well that is pretty subjective. I'm sure larry scott thinks the utah/colorado game is "high quality" but I highly doubt the rest of America thinks so.

    Also where did I ever say when BYU plays pac10 schools it won't be on the pac10 network? To the contrary I said that sounds like a game they would want to have on there as it would generate alot more viewers than utah/wsu. I'd almost guaranty it would be on there so long as it was a pac10 home game. BYU home games are the exclusive right of ESPN and larry scott doesn't have any say in it.

    I'm sure if the pac10 wants to televise a BYU/pac10 team at BYU that BYU will sell them the rights so long as ESPN doesn't want it.

  • utesovertide Salt Lake City, UT
    May 6, 2011 4:23 p.m.

    @Duckhunter

    It remains to be seen, but I'll bet the Utah/Colorado game is actually one they try to get Fox/ESPN to pick up to try and generate and hype a national interest in that game.

    By saying Dutchman was wrong is where you said BYU won't be on the Pac 12 network, because that was the point he was trying to propose: that the Pac 12 can use BYU's "national" fan base to sell subscriptions to the Pac 12 network by putting the pac 12/BYU games on it, regardless of the "first pick" issue you have been plodding. But I'm sure you'll spin that one way or another.

    Anyway, this argument is getting tiring, because you know everything. I'm sure you'll continue to try to have the last word on it too, because that's your MO.

  • Duckhunter Highland, UT
    May 6, 2011 5:44 p.m.

    @bleeder

    Just like you tried to have the last word? Seriously if you are having a discussion what is wrong with keeping it going?

    But once again you are ignoring what I really said. ductman made some claims that were false. Period. They were false. I proved they were false. He did it because he wanted to get a rise out of BYU fans. Unfortunately he was proven wrong and it didn't work.

    I never made any comments about BYU not being on the pac10 network as I think it is highly likely they will play there on occasion when they play pac10 teams. I highly doubt larry scott gave much up front thought to that however or that it was a motivation to him. It is just a happy benefit of the deal he made.

    But of course having pac10 teams play at BYU is a benefit in the opposite direction. If espn doesn't want those games BYUtv will broadcast them or sell them to pac10 tv if they want them.

    I won't subscribe to pac10 network just to watch one game but I may do it for the entire batch of games. I like football.

  • Dutchman Murray, UT
    May 7, 2011 4:31 p.m.

    BYU will be scheduled on the PAC 12 network. Larry Scott will have all the details in 60 days. There, did I get in the last word? Thank you.

  • Duckhunter Highland, UT
    May 7, 2011 7:53 p.m.

    Once again ductwork that wasn't your claim, that is just your fallback and attempt to save face. But of course I never disagreed on that point I'm sure BYU will be on that network. They want ratings afterall. I can't think of a network out there that wouldn't want to have BYU playing on it. Guaranteed ratings are something very few schools can supply.

  • forreal people Cottonwood Heights, UT
    May 17, 2011 5:49 p.m.

    and FYI everyone, after the new tv deal starts (2012 season) the ute's won't get "stuck on regonal." Read the details again, as the explicitly list the channels that Fox and ESPN/ABS can brodcast football games on, all national.

    The Ute's might be hating the TV coverage in 2011, but after that it is 100% national TV.

    BYU fans, please knock it off. The only thing utah has to wait for full membership with is the money, not anything else. Like a few have pointed out, the TV deal, Pac-12 membership, and all else crushes BYU's espn deal and independence. Duh.

    And BYU fans, you know your season tickets just got way worse as utah's got way better. You play wac teams at home, we play pac 12 teams. It's not rocket science.