Cougar corner: BYU to start at same BCS tier as Army, Navy


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  • Howard S. Taylorsville, UT
    April 25, 2011 7:23 p.m.


    Bluto my friend, you spend a lot of time talking about what you think will happen, what you hope will happen, and what your wish to happen.

    You seem to completely ignore what has happened... Utah was in fact invited to join the big boys of college football... and BYU is in fact slated to make regular appearances as ESPN's Friday night special.

    You know Friday night... when good high school players actually play football instead of watching ESPN's second tier programming.

  • Bluto Sandy, UT
    April 25, 2011 7:20 a.m.


    Nobody holds up bottomfeeders of the so called "power conferences" as anything but that, bottomfeeders. The Washington Genereals, fillers, fodder, so to speak.

    The U is not elevated to any esteemed status just by joining the Pac 10.02
    In fact, the only decent decade in the history of Utah football will never again be matched.

    Boise State will still outshine the U. As will San Diego St. and Utah and 5-6 and 6-6 seasons will again be the norm. It's Tom Lovat time uties.

    The U will soon take their rightful place among the "perpetual losers" programs of Conferences.

    Nobody shudders when Vanderbilt, Rutgers, Wake Forest, Duke, Iowa State, Baylor, Washington State, etc. and now Utah, is mentioned.

    BYU will be "Seen", win or lose, on National TV every week. Not on TierTtwo, but Tier-One. I don't think you even know the definitions between the two. Every major program plays games on week nights.

    So, when BYU is still finishing in the Top 25, having every kid in America knowing where Provo is, thank you ESPN, then u just cuddle up with your PAC 10.02 membership.

    Nobody else will notice.

  • Howard S. Taylorsville, UT
    April 24, 2011 9:44 p.m.


    This is great. While politely seeking not to offend Utah fans he/she calls them hypocritical.

    He/she thinks the BCS is illegal, doomed to fail, a joke, and based on greed.

    Yet, he/she also thinks BYU fans "would have loved an invite by the PAC..."

    The funny thing is watching Cougar fans twist around the fact that they desperately seek the acceptance of the BCS, whose values they despise.

    And Utah fans are the hypocritical ones???

    So, Cougars1, If the PAC rejected BYU because of their private religious status, why did the BIG 12 reject the Cougars?

  • Cougars1 Bluffdale, UT
    April 24, 2011 6:01 p.m.

    Howard, no offense, but you are putting way too much into an illegal system that will be gone within 10 years. I find it interesting how hypocritical Utah fans can be over this whole BCS nonsense. Just a over 2 years ago they were complaining about how unfair the system was that they were not even given a chance to prove their worth as a NC. It's a joke of a system that evolves around greed; and yet here you are touting it as the end all be all to college football.

    And then when you bring it up in terms of basketball, you all look even more foolish; since the BCS has nothing to do with basketball.

    BYU and it's fans would have loved an invite by the PAC; it didn't happen, and so we are more than happy to have gotten out of the MWC to be where we are now. Congratulations on the PAC invite. News flash, BYU was left out of the PAC because it is a private religious institution; not because their accomplishments are irrelevant. You have proven BYU's relevance by simply being obsessed with BYU.

  • Hank Pym SLC, UT
    April 24, 2011 5:49 p.m.

    @ Howard S.

    I agree w/ most everything you've posted. Equating Army & Navy with BYU is an insult to the Service Academies.

    There is no sense of entitlement, no yearning for legitmacy, no need to suck up to a major network, no chasing the almighty dollar @ Annapolis or West Point.

    This college football fan lives each season for the Army/Navy game, The Iron Bowl (all SEC football really), & PAC games (nothing caps off a saturday like the USC, Az St, UAz, UCLA, or Oregon cheerleaders)

  • Howard S. Taylorsville, UT
    April 24, 2011 3:38 p.m.


    If that "cache" had any relevance at all in the BCS era of college football, BYU would be a member of a power conference instead of second tier programming on the ESPN Friday night special.

    But as you are painfully aware no power conference wanted BYU.

    Oh, and in 8 months Utah will still be in the PAC 12 power conference and BYU will still be the BCS equivalent of Army and Navy.

  • Bluto Sandy, UT
    April 24, 2011 1:07 p.m.

    When BYU is on National TV for every game, and with ESPN at it's back as well as Utah being nowhere to be seen, the mighty Utes-aka the Washington Generals of the Pac 10.02, may then realize that U are all blather and no substance.

    What a wonderful thing it will be when the Self-Inflated Utes have it all come back around. 2004 and '08 were your salad days, enjoy the memories, it's all you'll have.

    Since your self inflated invite to the Pac-10, your worth has risen so far that
    1-You took the 5th choice for a b-ball coach,
    2- Players are leaving the B-ball team in droves.
    3-Even the President of your University went to a real Pac 10 school, Washington, and your Football team can't exist without former BYU guys.

    Oh please.... Howard S., Chris B, and Hedgie, join us all back here in about 8 months.

    It's all downhill from here for U.

  • Bluto Sandy, UT
    April 24, 2011 12:51 p.m.

    @Howard S.

    BYU finishes in the Top 10 or 12, believe Me and ESPN, they will play in a BCS Bowl.

    Their History, Legacy, Brand and Cache are worth Millions on their own merit, Utah has No Legacy, nor Elite Status.

    Your new definition of Modern Era is laughable. As is your thinking 2 BCS bowls makes U elite. Three Conference Championships in 50 years makes you Washington State or Vanderbilt.

    The U played in a BCS bowl in 2004 and '08. So did 9 other Teams those years.
    So do 10 every year.

    But only One Team Per Year, is granted the "National Championship".
    BYU was a Unanimus #1 selection by the UPI-coaches and AP writers, and 4 other organizations.

    There are 6 '84National Championship trophies in BYU's Legacy Hall, including the Waterford Chrystal Trophy. You can also see a Heisman, Outlands, Davey Obrien's, Sammy Baugh's and Doak Walker trophies. There is a Jim Thorpe Super Bowl MVP and NFL MVP Trophies. There have been 16 Consensus All-Americans in Football at CougarTowne,


    58 All-Americans all told at BYU.

    Elite schools develop over Generations, not 2 good years in a Decade.

  • Hank Pym SLC, UT
    April 24, 2011 12:39 p.m.

    re: Cosmo's Cousin | 11:55 a.m. April 22, 2011

    "Attorney General Shurtleff should demand special status for BYU as part of the plea deal against the illegal BCS."

    BYU isn't a state owned school. Think about it.

  • Howard S. Taylorsville, UT
    April 24, 2011 8:57 a.m.


    25 years ago is NOT the modern era of college football. The BCS is the modern era, and the BCS has rejected BYU and their 25 year old NC.

    You are correct though that the BCS was created because of BYU's 1984 NC. It was created to make sure no mid-major school would ever win it again.

    You keep dreaming though. It will help you through the tough times as Utah joins the big leagues and BYU continues to lose ground as an independent, non-AQ, mid-major... just like Army and Navy

  • Cougars1 Bluffdale, UT
    April 24, 2011 1:23 a.m.

    Howard, "Your last NC was so long ago as to be irrelevant in the BCS era of college football." BYU's NC was the REASON the BCS was established. The only mid-major in the modern era of football to win a NC. Too bad you are either too young to remember, or you had your head in the sand like most Utah fans until 2004.

    "No independent, non-AQ, mid-major team that has had one undefeated season in its history is ever going to win an NC." That's pretty close to what Bryant Gumbel said in 1984 just months before BYU proved him wrong. See, that's what's wrong with Utah fans; they don't know how to dream.

    "Oklahoma, Ohio State, Florida, Oregon, Auburn, TCU... all BCS teams.

    Notice any difference with BYU?"

    How about something similar....they have all won a NC. FYI, TCU was a member of a major conference when they won theirs(SWC).
    I think you are the one making yourself look silly Howard.

  • Howard S. Taylorsville, UT
    April 23, 2011 10:03 p.m.

    @ Cougars1

    Keep dreaming about that NC my friend.

    Oklahoma, Ohio State, Florida, Oregon, Auburn, TCU... all BCS teams.

    Notice any difference with BYU?

    Your last NC was so long ago as to be irrelevant in the BCS era of college football.

    No independent, non-AQ, mid-major team that has had one undefeated season in its history is ever going to win an NC.

    Keep talking NC though... it just makes you look silly.

    But, I'm okay with that.

  • DSB Cedar Hills, UT
    April 23, 2011 8:28 p.m.

    Anyone who thinks a season is as "good as over" just because they lose a game here or there is a crummy fan, an extremely poor sport, and really needs a worthwhile hobby other than living vicariously through athletes on TV.

    You don't have to go undefeated or win the national championship to have an enjoyable season and provide competitive entertainment to your fans.

  • Cougars1 Bluffdale, UT
    April 23, 2011 8:10 p.m.

    utahcountyute, you are right but it does not hurt to think about. I am very happy with being Indy, even if they lose a game and a chance at a BCS game. Finish in the top 25 and it will be a successful season. At least I don't have to tune in to the mtn. to watch BYU or Utah. Happy days.

  • Cougars1 Bluffdale, UT
    April 23, 2011 8:06 p.m.

    Not true Howard. The Oklahomas, Ohio States, Floridas, Oregons, Auburns, etc. make no bones about the fact that their goal is to win the NC every year. Then they go out a game at a time and play football. TCU, on an ESPN special even showed the camera man their chart with their goals for the year, and a NC was at the top of the pyramid. When Utah wins a NC, you'll understand and your expectations will be such. Until then, go ahead and continue being content with second place. Having a stated goal of winning a NC is not arrogant, it is what some teams do every year, but it does not translate into arrogance or stupidity as some Utah fans would like you to believe. Likewise, there is nothing wrong with keeping the team goals within the team and just getting it done like Whitt. Good luck in the PAC12.

  • utahcountyute Cedar Hills, UT
    April 23, 2011 7:40 p.m.

    Exactly as it should be given they have done nothing in the BCS. byU will need to beat Texas on the road, Utah at home and every WAC team by 40 to even be considered for a BCS game. OUCH

    Utah on the other hand is set up really well to get to the PAC 12 Champ game and possibly even to the Rose Bowl in their first year. Even if they lost to byU in Provo, they could still get to the Rose Bowl. This cannot be said for the Indy team in Provo, if they lost to Utah, their season is as good as over.

    It has to really hurt to think about it that way. Oh well!

  • Howard S. Taylorsville, UT
    April 23, 2011 7:10 p.m.


    "I have yet to hear any mention of a Conference Championship being talked about by anyone."

    Good teams usually limit their public comments to "winning the next game".

    Other teams spend their off seasons spouting off about quests, national championships, and Heismans.

    Sound familiar?

  • Howard S. Taylorsville, UT
    April 23, 2011 6:59 p.m.


    "...no longer fettered by the MTN and Craig Thompson."

    It must have been tough when the MTN and Craig Thompson caused BYU to lose to Utah State and Utah last year.

    Oh and btw, fettering by the MTN and Craig Thompson didn't stop Utah from climbing the ladder to elite status.

  • Cougars1 Bluffdale, UT
    April 23, 2011 6:34 p.m.

    Hey GoGetter, remember the crap Utah fans gave Jake Heaps for talking about a goal of a NC. Seems the Utes aren't the only ones with that goal. Though I have yet to hear a Ute football player talk about it. In fact, I have yet to hear any mention of a Conference Championship being talked about by anyone.

  • TrueBlue Orem, UT
    April 23, 2011 4:12 p.m.

    Howard S.

    "I have no problem at all with BYU being the college football equivalent of Army and Navy."

    But you'll be green with envy when you watch BYU slowly climbling the ladder to elite status, no longer fettered by the MTN and Craig Thompson.

  • Jose Ortiz american fork, utah
    April 23, 2011 3:37 p.m.

    Do we really need to fight over such a silly thing?

  • GoGetter Sandy, UT
    April 23, 2011 3:08 p.m.


    Umm.. College Game Day visited Utah with Urban Meyer, check it.

    2nd, scoreboards of last season... Who was it that barely made it above a .5 record?

    Utah is in a better position for a BCS game because they have a national champion as their goal, not exposure.

  • Howard S. Taylorsville, UT
    April 23, 2011 11:29 a.m.

    I have no problem at all with BYU being the college football equivalent of Army and Navy.

    That's exactly where they belong... independent, non-AQ, mid majors.

  • aggieblue Saint George, UT
    April 23, 2011 8:57 a.m.

    All of you talking about the NIT, 1944, etc. Utah did win an NCAA in 1944 and the NIT in 1947, BYU won in 1951 and 1966. Oh, by the way for all of you putting any credence on that tournament, remember one thing, Wyoming won it in 1943. You had better put them on the par with u and the Y.

    To the pac people and u. This sounds a lot like the presidental politics we are currently dealing with. Utah wants the pac to spread the wealth around, and also, don't keep score, let everyone feel good and give each a trophy and every forth year let them get to be the champ.

    With all of the ballihooing for u in the pac there doesn't seem like many are talking about the u winning, but rather all the money they get. Go tell your alumn that, we didn't win anything but we got some money. See how far that goes.

  • Duckhunter Highland, UT
    April 23, 2011 8:31 a.m.


    Of course no one denies utah won the ncaa tournament in 1944 but claiming it was the national championship is simply untrue. It was a startup, and secondary, tournament. People have listed alot of other factors here about it being a deleted talent pool because of the war, utahs season schedule, etc. To me those don't matter and you simply play who you can play and beat who you can beat and let the rest take care of itself. But there is no denying the ncaa tournament was not the premier tournament then and the winner was not the national champion.

    The other game was an exibition. Nothing more.

    That is just the way it is.

  • TrueBlue Orem, UT
    April 23, 2011 8:19 a.m.


    "Go read what the US Naval Dept created at Dartmouth college with the all americans from all over the country that they brought there."

    All-Americans from all over the country?

    You grossly exaggerate:

    In 1943-44, Freshman Dick McGwire of St. Johns University, along with Freshman center Bob Gale of Cornell, Freshman forward Harry Leggat of New York University, and Freshman guard Walter Mercer of Fordham finished the season playing for Dartmouth, where they were sent to undergo military service as Navy Trainees stationed at Dartmouth in Hanover, NH.

    Dartmouth's leading scorer, team captain, Junior Audley Brindley, went on to a "stellar" career with the New York Knicks in 1946, playing in 12 games and scoring a total of 34 points in his NBA career.

    Dartmouth was a cobbled-together group of players from other teams who had only played a few games together and were coached by an interim coach.

    Hardly the juggernaut of All-American all-stars you make them out to be.

  • duck Saint George, UT
    April 23, 2011 8:15 a.m.

    Notre Dame's record was built when it was an independant and played only weak teams in its schedule. Once it went into a real conference, it's record crumbled. So, why should BYU consider itself any less than Notre Dame?

  • sammyg Springville, UT
    April 23, 2011 8:14 a.m.

    Troll meter is really clicking on this story.

    Since last year Cougar Nation has had to put up with all of the BCS horse pucky and now these Ute trolls are livid that BYU has an in equal to Army and Navy. That's almost equivalent to their precious BCS / PAC-10.1.1beta invitation.

    Another "soul crushing" and "deliciously ironic" reality bite for the little UTE trolls.

  • JustGordon Cottonwood Heights, UT
    April 23, 2011 7:17 a.m.

    No worries for the folks down in Provo. Given the current and future scheduling options for the Y, the blue faithful will not have to worry about being in BCS contention. Even if you play four or five national programs, and perhaps win all of these games, the balance of schedule played against a depleted WAC will guarantee that your computer rating will not be high enough, or the coaches won't vote for you.

    This is the price of being an independent. Surely this road was chosen not for National Championships but for exposure. Don't worry, be happy...stop Ying!

  • Striker Omaha, NE
    April 23, 2011 6:22 a.m.

    Notre Dame is considered "America's Team," like 'em or hate 'em. I'd much rather try to get where they are than to the poor status the PAC has of needing to discipline their teams, coaches, and players year after year. The PAC is just a joke. I love this independence thing and BYU's future is very bright. Just needing to win 8-9 games is not too tough, but BYU's schedule will be tougher. Let's just get USU off our schedule and we'll have a real schedule for the future.

  • Silent Lurker Cottonwood Heights, UT
    April 23, 2011 6:06 a.m.

    Oh please, since we cannot get in with as a conference champion, then maybe we can do it by scheduling Idaho, Idaho St, New Mexico St, and the other step sisters of the poor. Let's schedule seven gimmies at home three real teams on the road and one legitimate team at home and try to get in that way.

  • Duckhunter Highland, UT
    April 22, 2011 10:22 p.m.

    @slim shady 801

    Huh? You're going to have to repost that in a manner that makes sense. Other than "Duckhunter" I really don't have a clue what you were talking about.

  • Unbelievable West Jordan, Utah
    April 22, 2011 8:59 p.m.

    Careful Ute faitful, everytime you take your digs at the Y's playing in the Vegas bowl, just remember that it wasn't that long ago that UNLV itself ran roughshod over you, 27-0.

    Just sayin.

  • Who am I sir? Cottonwood Heights, UT
    April 22, 2011 8:47 p.m.

    BYU needs to prove worthy of the respect given to them. To be given the same BCS opportunities as Navy and Army. After all Army has TWO national championships and you know what a power they are!!!

  • BlameItOnTheOfficials Cottonwood Heights, UT
    April 22, 2011 8:29 p.m.

    I'd love to see BYU get a better opportunity for a BCS bowl.. just so Utah can have a hand in keeping them from achieving it when we beat them every year.

  • hedgehog Ann Arbor, MI
    April 22, 2011 7:55 p.m.

    "This is great news. Win 9 games and have a shot at a BCS game is not too shabby for little insignificant independent program, eh hedgie?"


    I'm sure you haven't really got you arms around the situation yet... don't worry it will sink in.

    Never has an a at large team gone to a BCS game with 9 wins. bYU will need to go undefeated and get very very lucky.

    Because bYU will again start the season unranked even a perfect season will probably not be enough....based on the 6 bottom feeder games

  • SUNNY ALL DAY Saint George, UT
    April 22, 2011 7:51 p.m.


    It is surprising more comments have not been made about your thesis.

    BYU goes undefeated and is chosen to play in the National Championship.

    It just so happens that the game "is"/"has been" or is "re-scheduled" for a Sunday.

    It probably will not happen (the schedule/reschedule etc.; not the BYU undefeated season). However, don't put it past the BCS types to pull out all stops to keep BYU out of the BCS Championship picture.

  • rickski13 salt lake city, utah
    April 22, 2011 7:28 p.m.

    byu has never been to a bcs game playing in the mountain west. This year they leave the mountain west and are playing a number of teams from the wac. utah and tcu have been twice each to bcs games. now byu is requesting a notre dame deal. sorry until you prove you are worthy on the field you should play under thr army & navy guidelines.

  • Dutchman Murray, UT
    April 22, 2011 7:22 p.m.

    OK, thanks. I apologize. I apologize for ever sticking up for BYU's national championship in 1984. I have defended it against family members and friends. Well no more. I will from here on out denigrate it to the teeth. The 1984 title you call a championship was a joke. What goes around comes around. Thanks. You all made my day.

  • Bluto Sandy, UT
    April 22, 2011 7:19 p.m.

    Imagine that, ESPN rolls into town, and visits BYU, one of only 15 schools visited, drives right by Utah and ignores them.

    How's that Hopey-Changy Pac 10.2 working out for U?

    I guess Lee Corso was right, Utah is "Almost" as nice as BYU.

    That's how You spell "Brand" and "Cache".

    The Y has it, the U never will.

    Still the Little-Brother-Utah. Always will be.

    You're Tommy Smothers, and Avis wrapped into one.

    Go Wazzu-Utes!

    5-6...6-5 Those will be your good years.

  • Slim Shady 801 Bluffdale, UT
    April 22, 2011 7:13 p.m.

    So many people in the 801 think they know about the Pac 10....Duckhunter for example. LOL. Stanford and Oregon this year. MWC? That would be one. Yeah, the MWC is a better conference than the Pac 10. Check the draft results and yes, Utah went to the Pac 10 (12) and BYU goes indy because the MWC is so strong.....you guys that just state options based on the heart are funny.

  • Bluto Sandy, UT
    April 22, 2011 7:05 p.m.

    It does not need to be stated, if BYU is in the top ten, let alone top 8, they will recieve an bcs bid. Have no doubt. Just watch.

  • sammyg Springville, UT
    April 22, 2011 6:54 p.m.

    This is great news. Win 9 games and have a shot at a BCS game is not too shabby for little insignificant independent program, eh hedgie?

    Geewiz, what are Ute trolls going to say when all of their talking points about the BCS at BYU's expense are taken away?

    Ute troll world just got a little smaller today.

  • Riddles in the Dark Olympus Cove, Utah
    April 22, 2011 6:07 p.m.


    That's quite a daunting schedule Utah played in 1944.

    Just wondering, how many of those teams actually had players who played high school basketball?

    Did Utah really play the Kearns 2nd ward?

    Compared to that schedule, BYU played an NFL schedule in 1984.

  • Flame of the West The OC, CA
    April 22, 2011 6:06 p.m.

    All BYU has to do now is win games...can't wait!

  • redfeather Palo Alto, CA
    April 22, 2011 5:53 p.m.

    I see the blog has been overrun by insecure, whiny Utah trolls.

    They're obviously scared to death that BYU is going to steal Utah's PAC 12 thunder.

    And, they should be.

    ESPN's hype machine is already kicking into gear, as evidenced by ESPN's DirecTV satellite bus visiting BYU today,

    as well as making stops at TCU, Oklahoma, LSU, Florida, Florida State, Alabama, Arkansas, Missouri, Nebraska and Boise State, UCLA, USC, Stanford and Oregon,

    but skipping Utah.

    Just a sign of things to come.

  • Dutchman Murray, UT
    April 22, 2011 5:39 p.m.


    I won't stoop to your level and start denigrating and dismissing BYU's national championship in 1984 but as Rock of Marne has pointed out there are many reasons to do so. You can discount it all you want but the national media saw the game in Madison Sq Garden between Utah (NCAA champs) and the NIT champs as the national title game for 1944. You see it differently but of course you know more than all the sports writers and those that keep the record books back in 1944. And you wonder why people think BYU fans are arrogant?

  • royalblue Alpine, UT
    April 22, 2011 5:33 p.m.


    Homework done

    Utah's 1944 Regular Season

    18th Replacement Wing
    A.S.T.P. Company D
    A.S.T.P. Company B
    A.S.T.P. ERC
    Hill Field Fliers
    Weber Navy
    Kearns 2nd
    Fort Douglas
    Wendover Bomber Quinn
    Idaho State
    Ecker Studio
    Colorado College
    Fort Logan
    Fort Warren
    Salt Lake Air Base
    Bushnel Hospital
    Idaho State
    Dow Chemical
    Salt Lake Air Base

    Invited to NIT and NCAA; turned down NCAA to play in more prestigious NIT.
    Lost opening round game to Kentucky 38-46

    Utah's season should have been over, but Arkansas team bus crashed and the NCAA needed a last second fill in (that's how few teams were playing basketball in 1944).

    Utah beats Missouri, Iowa State and Dartmouth in 2nd rate tournament of the day

    Then an exhibition fund-raiser was arranged and the media hypes it as "the national championship game" to attract more fans.

    Utah's whole season was nothing but hastily arranged pickup games.

    NCAA championship - yes
    National championhip - not even close

    BYU's 1951 and 1966 NIT championships, are every bit as much national championships as Utah's 1944 NCAA and 1947 NIT championships.

  • Ernest T. Bass Bountiful, UT
    April 22, 2011 5:32 p.m.

    It doesn't matter byu will get in the BCS several times now that we have Heaps and Q. It will be domination on everyone else.

  • Waylon77 Logan, UT
    April 22, 2011 5:24 p.m.

    What they should say is that Notre Dame brings in more money, therefore they get better odds at playing for a national championship. How does a team's past performance have anything to do with what they will accomplish in the future? I am no BYU or Utah fan, but anybody could tell you that Notre Dame is no better than BYU, Utah,or Boise st. and haven't been for quite some time. This system is corrupt and unfair on all accounts I for one cannot wait for the day when it finally crashes down on itself.

  • Duckhunter Highland, UT
    April 22, 2011 5:08 p.m.


    Once again utah did not win the national championship in 1944 no matter how hard you try to convince yourself they did. The ncaa championship WAS NOT the national championship in 1944.


    All I could decipher in your post was the following:

    "whine, whine, whiny, whine, wimper, whine, whine."

  • Veritas Aequitas Fruit Heights, UT
    April 22, 2011 4:50 p.m.

    Cosmo's Cousin | 1:58 p.m. April 22, 2011
    Holladay, UT
    @Ted H

    That was an April Fool's post. You would know that if you read my other messages in the string. I get sick of you being on my back. I think your a big Utah Utes fan.

    Ted, How about you send me your favorite charity, and I send them $5 everytime you post a real post.

    Lame on your part...

  • Dixie Dan Saint George, UT
    April 22, 2011 4:41 p.m.

    With a little bit of luck, BYU will get a major BCS bowl game on Sunday.

  • Rock Of The Marne Phoenix, AZ
    April 22, 2011 4:21 p.m.

    Wrong Dukcy, there is an NCAA Championship Banner up at the U; sorry to burst your blue eyed goggles. They were the NCAA Champions that year no matter how hard you try to discount it; its in the books. Speaking of discounting something let's look at 1984 when BYU did not play in a championship game of any sort, didn't play in a January bowl game, and beat a 6-5 team in a second rate bowl. Add to this not beating any team that wound up in the AP top 25; and they were the best team in the country, sure; that's why we now have the BCS so that type of thing will never happen again.

  • Dutchman Murray, UT
    April 22, 2011 4:10 p.m.

    TheSportsAuthority and Duckhunter,

    For someone claiming sports authority you fall way short. Neither of you has done any research on the 1944 championship. Go read what the US Naval Dept created at Dartmouth college with the all americans from all over the country that they brought there. How do you explain the victory Utah got over the NIT champs at Madison Sq Garden before 17,000? How do you explain how the national media hyped it as the national tilte game? Please, please do your homework. I have never once denigrated BYU's 1984 national championship. I saw it on TV and I cheered. Please don't denegrate Utah's 1944 title especially when you know so little about it. Check the NCAA record books, it goes down as a national title. Also, those boys went to war and came back in 1947 and won the NIT, the very championship you so admire. Are you going to denigrate that too?

    You two sound like some of those frustrated BYU fans Tom Holmoe referred to in a quotation in another article today.

  • panamadesnews Lindon, UT
    April 22, 2011 4:00 p.m.

    AZguy: That was so funny. I laughed when I read that - laughed real loud. Thanks for the insight. You are so right on. But that is the way we LDS people are raised.

  • worf Mcallen, TX
    April 22, 2011 3:57 p.m.

    Mormon Ute:

    You, I, and anyone else who saw the game, know the utes got lucky and were outplayed. A freak bounce of the ball and a missed refs call. It's not an excuse but fact. The Cougs are better suited for the Pac-10, but I'd rather they be independent. Utes will not go bowling for at least three years or maybe longer.

  • panamadesnews Lindon, UT
    April 22, 2011 3:56 p.m.

    Re Hedgehog at 12:08 pm:

    You might "no" but I "know".

  • Duckhunter Highland, UT
    April 22, 2011 3:48 p.m.


    You realize I posted a question?

    "I don't think the pac10 has ever gotten two teams into a bcs bowl have they?"

    You see by asking a question it means I don't claim to know the answer. Obviously the university of utah doesn't teach its students what this (?) symbol means. LOL

    But I see now that they have gotten 2 teams in. One time. Last year. And all they had to do was have one go undefeated and the other have only one loss to do it. Compare that to the records of some of the 2nd teams that have gotten in from the big 12 and sec and you'll see a 2nd rate bcs conference.

    Also utah did not win the basketball national championship in 1944. The ncaa tourney was a second rate start up tourney and in no way was the winner of it considered the national champion. You see here I am now laughing at you. LOL

  • USUfootballWasIndependent2001&am Provo, UT
    April 22, 2011 3:38 p.m.

    I agree with Y Dad. BYU needs to prove it on the field first. It may take a few years though, because BYU is mostly playing teams in our conference for the next couple of years.

  • TheSportsAuthority Arlington, VA
    April 22, 2011 3:32 p.m.


    Utah won the most watered-down NCAA tournament in history back when the NCAA tournament was still the little brother to the NIT, which Utah first lost in to Kentucky.

    Utah's ENTIRE regular season consisted of three games:

    Idaho State (twice) and Colorado College

    because nobody else in the whole intermountain area was still playing basketball, as was the case for most of the country.

    The few teams still playing basketball were composed mostly of Freshmen and Sophomores because all of the upperclassmen were off fighting a world war.

  • nottyou Riverton, UT
    April 22, 2011 2:18 p.m.

    Uteman, Utah's BCS Bowl appearances are tainted in that the undefeated seasons were padded with mid-major season-long opponents like BYU, TCU, etc. The victories mean little as the Utes spent the entire season resting while playing inferior competition; then they were lucky in the end. In the PAC12, the poundings will be endless and often. Might as well book tickets for the Las Vegas Bowl or the new Magna Bowl each year. And then, there is basketball season...oh my heart!

  • Ted H. Midvale, UT
    April 22, 2011 2:12 p.m.


    April fool's on April 4th?

    Did you forget to take "Holidays 101" at the U? Isn't that the final class all graduates to be must take?

    I'm sorry you get upset I continue to point out your high character and obsession with BYU.

    It's ok your a ute. I remember when it used to be fun to pretend to be from the other side to make those people look foolish. But then I grew up. Perhaps U will someday too, but I wont be holding my breath.

  • Y Grad / Y Dad Richland, WA
    April 22, 2011 2:11 p.m.

    I have to agree with the premise - first, get to a BCS bowl game. And preferably win. Maybe twice. Then we can push for an ND type of agreement.

    The exciting thing is, I think the cougs have increasingly good chances. No need to put Utah down, other than in September. The work is there to do, and I think the pieces are in place to get it done.

    And happiness will be watching it all in big, beautiful, high def, surround sound color.

  • Cosmo's Cousin Holladay, UT
    April 22, 2011 1:58 p.m.

    @Ted H

    That was an April Fool's post. You would know that if you read my other messages in the string. I get sick of you being on my back. I think your a big Utah Utes fan.

  • RepresentBlue West Jordan, UT
    April 22, 2011 1:56 p.m.

    BCS. Fair. How anyone can use these two words in the same sentence is beyond me. Ute fans, of all people, should know this better than anyone but I guess their inclusion in the BCS cartel has changed their principles. It is an ABSOLUTE DISGRACE that our nation's service academies have to be in the top 2 of the BCS rankings in order to earn an automatic BCS bowl berth. It also makes no sense because if they were in the top 2 of the BCS rankings shouldn't that mean they would be playing in the NC game?! The whole thing is the biggest Ponzi scheme ever perpetrated on the American public.

  • Mormon Ute Kaysville, UT
    April 22, 2011 1:54 p.m.


    Uh, who beat BYU right after losing to Notre Dame? That's right, those underachieving Utes.

  • 1984 for life Salt Lake City, UT
    April 22, 2011 1:52 p.m.

    Let's try getting to the BCS like all other non BCS confernece teams have done - WIN ALL OUR GAMES. Hawaii has done that, Boise has done it twice, TCU did it twice and Utah has done it twice. If we are so good and "loaded with talent" every year, let's win all our games and we'll be in.

  • Dutchman Murray, UT
    April 22, 2011 1:36 p.m.


    "I don't think the pac10 has ever put a 2nd team into a bcs game have they?"

    Last season my friend. Oregon and Stanford.

    Utah did win a legitimate b-ball title in 1944. Go do some research on how Navy built an all american team at Dartmouth and lost to the Utes in the NCAA. Then Utah played the NIT champs in Madison Sq Garden before 17,000 fans which was heralded by the media as the national title game and won. Please do some homework before making uninformed comments.

  • eagle Provo, UT
    April 22, 2011 1:28 p.m.

    Sorry Lou HoltZ not Lou Holt, don't want to be picked on for that typo...

  • Tommy2Shoes Lehi, UT
    April 22, 2011 1:27 p.m.

    BYU wins on the field speak for a BCS game. Losses take us out of the equation like a rock hitting lake water. So, just win baby. During the Heaps era I expect to see a BYU team in a BCS bowl game.

  • eagle Provo, UT
    April 22, 2011 1:27 p.m.

    Coach Holmoe:

    Don't sell BYU short vs. Notre Dame. I bet since 1980 BYU has had more wins, has had one national championship to ND's one national championship and since the inception of the BCS probably won a lot more games. I would dare say it's overall athletic dept is also much superior. Notre Dame, much like Europe, biggest selling point is how great it used to be. Those days are long over for the most part but ND fans can point to the days of Lou Holt, Joe Montana etc but brag about much lately.. I think Navy, which has beaten ND the last couple of meetings, is more deserving than ND for this "elitist" designation. And if the argument is that ND has more followers, then I guess the BCS has lost all credibility, if it had any, because it certainly isn't about gauging BYU or Navy vs. Notre Dame on what has actually happened on the field, most recently and even back further.

  • B Logan, UT
    April 22, 2011 1:27 p.m.

    To the naysayers: Just when you say 'never' it will happen. Why do people insist on following conventional wisdom. I distinctly remember the AD down at USC saying that he didn't think USC would ever go independent but that it's not out of the question either. Here's the thing: if BYU can be even reasonably successful as an independent, more teams are going to look to break away from a conference and create their own brand. Texas is already kind of doing that as well. It's only a matter of time.

  • Ted H. Midvale, UT
    April 22, 2011 1:21 p.m.

    Mormon Ute:

    Cosmo's Cousin is one of your own. She pretends to be a byu fan and says crazy things to make byu fans look bad.

    Immature I know, but it's how she is.

    Want proof?

    Cosmo's Cousin | 7:52 p.m. April 4, 2011
    Holladay, UT
    I expect something like this....

    2012 - PAC-12 runner up & Sweet 16 visit
    2013 - PAC-12 Champ & Final 4 visit
    2014 - PAC-12 Champ & National Championship

    2012 - WCC 4th place & no post season
    2013 - WCC 3rd place & no post season
    2013 - WCC runner up & NIT berth

    Sorry Mormon Ute - you are arguing with one of your own. Classy of her huh?

  • atl134 Salt Lake City, UT
    April 22, 2011 1:19 p.m.

    "The Cougs would never get blown out like the utes did."

    Those games against Utah State and Florida State (either of the two years) were pretty awful... don't say never. Pretty much every team takes some disgusting loss.

  • hedgehog Ann Arbor, MI
    April 22, 2011 1:08 p.m.

    "$100 bill and the 10 commandments and don't break either one"


    Ok, that was funny.

  • Max Syracuse, NY
    April 22, 2011 1:06 p.m.

    It sounds fair to me. After all, BYU never made it to a BCS Bowl when they were in the MWC. Getting too hyped up over the requirements of getting to a BCS bowl seems VERY premature. BYU has a steep climb over the next few years.

  • TJ Eagle Mountain, UT
    April 22, 2011 1:03 p.m.

    crisb, hedge and those of the same stripe; Your Jealousy and Obsession are fully exposed today. I can hear your whining voices clearly in my mind.
    and hedge; Your spell check is still not working properly.

    Nothing has changed for BYU as far as getting to a BCS game. They can still follow the Ute, Boise, TCU and Hawaii recipe and go undefeated by playing 8 or 9 easy games and winning against a few good ones. They also have ESPN on their side and your not too bright if you don't think that isn't a major plus. Who do you think will go to a BCS game between a 10th ranked BYU and a 9th ranked Utah at the end of the season. The answer will make U Blue with envy. National respect, national fan base and a decades long record of excellence.
    They actually have an easier path than the Utes do now. Being in an BCS conference does not mean you will ever be in a BCS game. You still have to be very successful. Time will tell.

  • Koke Spanish Fork, UT
    April 22, 2011 12:59 p.m.

    Holmoe is taking a reasonable position. BYU is a good and rising team. It has had some consistency problems over the past few years along with difficulty recruiting sufficient bench depth. So, it DOES have something to prove. ND hasn't been good for a while, but has a much longer football tradition and historical contribution to the sport--earning it special treatment.

    The promise of high exposure on ESPN along with BYU's probable performance over the next few seasons is likely to yield increasingly impressive recruiting classes.

    BYU is a pretty consistent top 15-20 team. We are the best second tier team that everyone love's to hate. Current changes should elevate BYU to a consistent top 10-15 team with occasional forays into the top 10. Once we establish this new range, we will be on the doorstep of ND's treatment.

    We MIGHT get into a BCS game in two years because the planets align, but I don't see us being strong contenders for another 10 years. I'm not negative on the team. I think making the top 10-15 would be wonderful and lead to better things. Be patient. Go Cougars!

  • Go Big Blue!!! Bountiful, UT
    April 22, 2011 12:56 p.m.

    The y hasn't been close to having a BCS bowl worthy season since the BCS was created. I guess it is like me telling my boy that he can grow up to be president. He is a smart goodlooking young man but just because he has the right to be president doesn't mean that he is likely to live on Pennsylvania Avenue some day.

  • Mormon Ute Kaysville, UT
    April 22, 2011 12:56 p.m.

    Cosmo's Cousin,

    Where did you come from? AG Shurtleff cannot advocate for BYU, because they are a private school and a religious private school to boot.

  • Mormon Ute Kaysville, UT
    April 22, 2011 12:54 p.m.


    You're usually pretty accurate in your statements, but you missed it on this one.

    In 2004 Boise State was undefeated and did not get invited to a BCS bowl.

    Also, just last season two PAC-10 teams played in BCS bowl games. Oregon and Stanford.

  • GoGetter Sandy, UT
    April 22, 2011 12:46 p.m.

    Good thing BYU is only interested in exposure and not a national championship.

  • hedgehog Ann Arbor, MI
    April 22, 2011 12:35 p.m.

    Sporting News -"Holmoe said he would not attend the BCS meetings, set for Tuesday through Thursday in New Orleans."

    Who could blame him. I'm sure he's not intrested in being on the receiving end on "eye rolls" and "hand cupped wishpers".

    I just read that Jack Swarbrick ( ND VP of athletics) will be attending.... rumors are swirling again that the BIG10 is pushing hard for ND.

  • AZguy Phoenix, AZ
    April 22, 2011 12:19 p.m.

    I have said all along that this is fair and fine. BYU does not need an ND exemption.

    If in the future, BYU is in the top 10, undefeated, and does not get in the BCS, it would be another huge blow to the credibility of BCS and would hopefully help quicken its' downfall.

    BYU may travel well in the West and fill stadiums, but cities still do not want us because we come to games with a $100 bill and the 10 commandments and don't break either one. All BYU can do is just line up and beat the person across from you. Then let the chips fall where they may.

    Go Cougs!

  • worf Mcallen, TX
    April 22, 2011 12:18 p.m.

    BYU is much closer to Notre Dame caliber than the utes. Yes, you can mark it down. Face it! The Irish haven't done much to past few years, but did crush the Utes. The Cougs would never get blown out like the utes did. Period! Notre Dame has a richer tradition, but hasn't been Cougar caliber the past few years either.

  • hedgehog Ann Arbor, MI
    April 22, 2011 12:08 p.m.

    "I don't think the pac10 has ever put a 2nd team into a bcs game have they?"


    You just confirm what everyone already knows. You don't no much about the PAC12.

    You need to look just to last year when both Oregon and Stanford went to a BCS game....

  • Lone Star Cougar Plano, TX
    April 22, 2011 12:08 p.m.

    I suppose this deal is good for right now but I hope the BCS implodes on itself and a true playoff is instituted with other supporting bowl games.

  • MiP Iowa City, IA
    April 22, 2011 12:05 p.m.

    Tom Holmoe is simply making a case for fair treatment. If you want to look in the "here-and-now" it's hard to argue that BYU doesn't have enough 'going on.' They have a solid fan-base, a well-run program, a large undergraduate student population, their own cable channel, and vast resources. It'd be hard to argue that teams like UConn and Rutgers (or most other Big East teams) deserve an autobid and leave other good schools out like BYU. With 5 BCS bowls, why shouldn't a BYU that finishes in the top-8, not be guarenteed a spot?

    Winning enough to be ranked #8 is another question. Something that non-elite programs reach only with a combo of great talent, staying healthy, senior experience and a pinch of luck.

    In the BCS, jus like other 'systems', if you win your games, you will be rewarded.

    The BCS system has it's pluses for the non-BCS conference teams---and it has it's minuses. It's far better than the old bowl system, so Mr. Holmoe is just trying to make it better----for one team at least. Can't fault him there.

  • jdub Ephraim, UT
    April 22, 2011 11:59 a.m.

    re: I Still Can't Say It

    If Las Vegas Bowl wins don't count, then what do LV Bowl losses represent?

    Many of you forget that it was because of BYU that at-large bids were extended to non BCS teams.

  • Cosmo's Cousin Holladay, UT
    April 22, 2011 11:55 a.m.

    The Blue is the Notre Dame of the west. We have a national championship too. We beat Notre Dame a bunch of times.

    We deserve the same deal as Notre Dame! Attorney General Shurtleff should demand special status for BYU as part of the plea deal against the illegal BCS.

    Who's in town -- Cougars in Town!!!

  • Duckhunter Highland, UT
    April 22, 2011 11:54 a.m.


    Well considering utah didn't win a national championship in basketball in 1944 you really have no point.

    As far as the bcs access is concerned this is good enough. If BYU is a top 14 team they will probably get a look and if they are top 10 it will mean they are undefeated and will probably get in. One thing about the bcs is that they have been smart enough not to exclude any undefeated non bcs teams since they excluded BYU a decade ago. It puts to much of a bad light on them and the last thing they need is any more bad publicity.

    The truth is utah won't be getting in either if they don't fullfill pretty much the same requirements. I don't think the pac10 has ever put a 2nd team into a bcs game have they? You have to be the pac10 champ to get in, only the SEC and Big12 can put a 2nd place team into the bcs.

    The only thing utah has gained is they are automatic if they are the pac10 champ and I really don't see that happening any time soon.

  • The Disillusionist Alexandria, VA
    April 22, 2011 11:52 a.m.


    I was citing BYU's 1984 national championship vis-a-vis Tom Holmoe's statement that Notre Dame deserved their BCS status due to their "established record." None of ND's recent accomplishments in football can be cited in support of said "established record." Tom Holmoe could have made a much better case for BYU receiving the same standing as ND.

    And yes, Ute fans should by all means proclaim their basketball team's "awesomeness" by referring to their 1944 "championship" (if "championship" you want to call it).

  • Mormon Ute Kaysville, UT
    April 22, 2011 11:51 a.m.

    I'm glad to finally see some concrete information on this. I have been wondering what kind of deal BYU would be able to work out and I think this is fair.

  • I Still Can't Say It Holladay, UT
    April 22, 2011 11:47 a.m.

    Notre Dame got a special deal with the BCS because it brings tens of millions of dollars to college football and has an enormous fan base. Also, it has tradition that goes back decades and decades.

    The team in Provo has neither of those things because Vegas Bowl wins don't count. There will be no sweetheart deal -- especially for a team that's basically a member of the WAC in football. Sorry.

  • Skippy West Jordan, UT
    April 22, 2011 11:35 a.m.

    I wasn't even going to respond to this one, but come on Chris B and Hedgehog... knock it off. You are both an embarasement to Ute fans or any other sports fans.

  • eswiny sandy, ut
    April 22, 2011 11:31 a.m.

    @ The Disillusionist. You smugly refer to BYU's championship in '84 as validation of their current legitimacy. Should we Ute fans proclaim our basketball team's awesomeness by referring to our 1944 national championship?

    Live in the now. It's a sad existence to be forced to draw upon such antiquated success.

  • The Disillusionist Alexandria, VA
    April 22, 2011 11:28 a.m.

    Re: byu_num_1

    "Can we stop living in the '80s uncle rico."

    Easy there, num_1. Tom Holmoe was arguing that Notre Dame had an "established record." That argument certainly isn't based on ND's recent accomplishments. So 1984 is relevant to the discussion.

    "Let's be pround of the here and now."

    Agreed. BYU's record three out of the last four years speaks for itself. Too bad Holmoe didn't use it to make his argument.

  • Bugoff Houston, TX
    April 22, 2011 11:27 a.m.

    Chris you are making yourself look ridiculous. Sometimes you have valid points or at least potential fears. However, the logic that somehow the honor code prevents you from having talent is rather bizarre.

    I expect some minor modification to the BCS mainly in the form of lawsuits.

  • byu_num_1 Provo, UT
    April 22, 2011 11:19 a.m.

    re: The Disillusionist

    Can we stop living in the '80s uncle rico.
    Cornell has 5 national championships and Army has 3, so they have better football programs than Auburn, BYU, Florida State, right?

    1984 wasn't even our best year. Let's be proud of the here and now.
    We don't necessarily deserve to have the same rules as ND yet, we need to prove it with our record. Our schedule isn't that difficult this year, so we will get a good start on proving we deserve better.

  • ute4ever West Jordan, UT
    April 22, 2011 11:13 a.m.

    When was the last time BYU ended the season ranked in the top 8 in the BCS standings? Getting the Notre Dame exemption or not, BYU isn't going to a BCS game anytime soon. They didn't do it while in the MWC with a weaker schedule, so why expect them to do it now with a tougher schedule? Why would the BCS grant an exemption to BYU ever? They will never be on the same caliber as Notre Dame and should never be treated like it. Get to the BCS first (as the rules are now) before trying to write the rules on how you should get in....prove it first.

    Fair or unfair, the BCS looks for any reason to keep the money out of the hands of the non-BCS conferences and independents, other than Notre Dame. It's been unfair since the beginning, but that is just how it is. I, for one, am just happy I don't have to worry about what the BCS will do to non-BCS teams, since the PAC12 inclusion eliminates those worries. I feel for you Cougars.

  • MenaceToSociety Draper, UT
    April 22, 2011 11:03 a.m.

    We're not saying we're the same as Notre Dame. But we want to get an automatic BSC bid if we're in the top 8.

  • The Disillusionist Alexandria, VA
    April 22, 2011 10:58 a.m.

    Re: Chris B.

    "sunday school boys"

    Why the bigotry against the LDS players on your own team?

    Re: hedgehog

    "established record": Notre Dame and BYU each have more national championships than Utah.

    Just sayin'.

  • hedgehog Ann Arbor, MI
    April 22, 2011 10:42 a.m.

    holmoe :They came in with an established record. Were trying to make small steps.

    If the definition is "established record" means winning a lot of mid level conference games and getting exposed by legit BCS teams... then yes, "established record".

    Notre Dame is an anomaly that transends religion - truly the face of college football. BCS powers knoe if they give BYu the same status, Notre Dame will ask for more.

    byu= army, navy