Comments about ‘Pairing Off: Pairing Off: Counsel for Latter-day Saint singles on kissing’

Similar comments could be made for holding hands, dancing and even long private conversations.

In each society, indeed during the evolution of a society, certain symbols develop which are meant to signify love. A century ago it could have been the gift of a rose, or throwing down one's cloak over a puddle. When I was a boy intense discussions arose over when it was appropriate to hold a girl's hand (on the first date? NEVER!) At one point in time a woman dropping her handkerchief in the presence of a man was provocative - even downright risque!

Kissing could be either symbolic or lustful. So can dancing, or long conversations and so forth. So can almost any other action or expression.

I fear that many of the so-called expressions of love of today are so much more dangerous, that I would settle with even passionate kissing as an alternative.

Julia, Thank you for a well written article with many good points in it. I copied it off to share with my daughter.

You might look into "Is Kissing Sinful" by Grant Von Harrison. I think he describes this topic well. Basically, sensual, lustful feelings are meant for your spouse, so when kissing (or anything else) crosses that line, then it's time to stop!

Julia-live a little. The Mormon obsession with depriving oneself of anything that can derive an ounce of enjoyment is bad enough without insisting that completely harmless kisses are sinful. If we handed out kisses like pretzels we'd probably all be happier and skinnier.

Utah is the state with the most porn searches. The middle east Moslem countries are the countries with the most porn searches. This is no accident.

Keep a person hungry through guilt or through police who enforce prevention of vice and promotion of virtue, the hunger grows greater and greater.

I have to agree with 'Another Perspective'. If I keep my lusty and dirty desires wrapped up they will come exploding out of me later in the form of Googling pornographic phrases.

Also, and this is slightly off topic and directed at Another Perspective, I did accidentally search for porn. Totally my bad. So, Another Perspective, wherever you found your statistics for pornographic internet searches by geographical location, could you subtract one from Utah? Thanks.

Of course we want our youth (and adults) to make good choices. But kissing someone you are attracted to will naturally produce feelings of desire and attraction. It doesn't mean you have to act on those desires beyond kissing but for goodness sake kissing during courtship can and should be fun. And occassionally beyond three-second time intervals.

I appreciate the author's perspective. But wonder if she is enjoying her own dating experience or if she is so worried about "laying down", "kissing like it were your parents" or checking her stopwatch to be sure it is within the institute teacher's recommended time frame that dating is more a burden than an enjoyable experience?

You actually write well compared to some of the other "Mormon" blogers on the Deseret News. You also lack the self-centered, I'm so spiritual and perfect attitude of the others. There is substance and value to this article and is definitly not superficial.

Ok, Bottom line is, kissing should be saved for THE ONE. To be frank I think the best idea is to at least wait to kiss someone until you are almost engaged to someone. There should NEVER be a time where you start making out with someone you met the night before!! One of the lessons I have had in Young Womens was if you saw a guy on the street and just gave him your credit card...well that would be stupid...the same when you start making out, your just allowing random people to be all over you...kissing should be kept to a minimum unless your engaged!! Less kissing please!! Save little kids from being subjected to it!

Another Perspective,

Moslem? Are you serious. I have a hard time taking anyone seriously who's intelligence suggests middle school is considered higher education. I'm not suggesting everyone has to get an advanced degree or be a prolific speller, but "Moslem" is a far cry from a simple spelling error. I'm guessing if you had ever read the word Muslim in a book, newspaper, or even cartoon for that matter you would not have written Muslim. Which suggests therefore that....

This article I agree is borderline silly at best, but, come on man! Stop skipping 3rd grade!

What I don't understand is with all these LDS values...why is it that the Mormon divorce rate is simular to everybody else?

Could it be that while the intent is good...the advise has it's own set of issues that ultimately tear down relationships?

seriously? you all have a problem with a guy and girl kissing?

here's how I see your problem with kissing. and it is like your view on marijuana. You think kissing is a "gateway" to sex. I don't think you have a problem with kissing per se. I think you have a problem with what it might lead to and therefore the safe path is to not do it.

but it is a fallacy, just as your belief that marijuana leads to harder drugs. Both are individual actions that don't lead to anything that the person doesn't already want to do. If you want a gateway to sex it would be victoria secret catalogs and for drugs it is definitely alcohol.

I just don't see how you can have a problem with two people kissing. thats a very natural thing, and all it means is I like you. It doesn't mean I want to marry you.

I have no clue where byuh2010 got the idea that kissing should be saved for THE ONE. That's beyond conservative... (but I agree it shouldn't just be a random person).

I'm still not sure how Mormon stuff like this gets put in a public newspaper. Of course, the last time I dared to make a comment like this on deseretnews.com (last week), I was censored and failed to make the cut, so have at it, DN review board.

Dalep2u, I think you're on to something here.

The problem is that many members of the LDS Church don't make a distinction between LDS values and the rules they make for themselves to make sure they are holding on to them. Chastity is an LDS value, for which I feel we LDS people should make no apology. On the other hand, lying next to someone of the opposite sex is not inherently unchaste. I understand how it could lead to unchastity and under certain situations it would be wise to avoid, but in and of itself, it is not, and can actually be quite innocent. If we associate something as innocent as lying down on the grass next to someone of the opposite sex when nothing else is going on as unchastity, we start feeling guilty for sins we haven't even committed, and we develop unhealthy inhibitions that are carried on into marriage. Instead of making up all of these silly rules like no lying down, no being in your girlfriend's bedroom, etc., we should probably just say "be chaste and use good judgment" and leave it at that.

Ted H.
You might do well to look things up before going off on someone and exposing you own ignorance. "Moslem" is actually a correct, acceptable and older spelling of Muslim. Anyway in your attempt to call Another Perspective dumb you forgot to address his/her comment in any meaningful way. I'd love to hear anything on topic if you have it though.

byuh2010, don't you think there is a respectable medium between making out with someone you met the night before and waiting until you're almost engaged to kiss someone?

And why should we be worried about little kids witnessing kissing? I'm not talking about making out in front of anybody. I'm talking about people tastefuly showing affection for those they love. Kids need more exposure to that, not less. If they never see it, they'll just think it's bad. And it's not bad. It's wonderful. If they go into marriage thinking that kissing is bad, they're going to have problems. There is a difference between treating something as sacred and teating it as shameful, and I think LDS people in general need to do a much better job of distinguishing between the two.

Are the vice and virtue police next?

At BYUH2010:

You have got to be kidding. You recommend not kissing until you are almost engaged? LOL.

The real moral guideline is to NOT get carried away. THAT'S it! If you are someone who can't control themselves after one kiss then don't kiss and tell your date why! Otherwise he will be walking away and thinking you are a cold person.

There is nothing morally wrong with kissing, holding hands, or being attracted to another person. Just keep the heavy breathing to a minimum until you are married. After that, go to town!

I know at least one couple who didn't share a kiss until they were married.

Have ya noticed the difference between on-screen kisses of today versus yesteryear?? A child watching today's "kisses" might just think the couple are attempting to devour each other's faces. Today's on-screen kisses do NOT reflect affection nor respect, they scream sex.

This is one good reason to discuss this topic and to teach our youth the appropriateness or not of physical expressions like kissing. If we don't teach them, we let the world teach them.

Dalep2u, LDS temple divorce rates are nowhere near the rates of the general population! The last figure I read was 7 percent, while the national divorce rate is currently at 44 percent.

I think I would prefer for my children to go the temple marriage route; you?