Comments about ‘Sandstrom's immigration bill clears Utah House committee’

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Published: Friday, Feb. 11 2011 5:00 p.m. MST

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Lectori Salutem
Beautiful Salt Lake Valley, Utah

I listened to the hearing and was especially touched by the statements of Mr. Morales-Llan, a dentist (cannot remember her name), a police officer (maybe former?) and Rep. Herrod. I was also impressed by the testimony of a doctor or psychologist, a self-described black man who has actually suffered civil rights abuses, who supports HB 70 despite claims by the opposition that it will violate civil rights. He was cut off but not before he gave us an elementary psychology lesson: If you reward bad behavior you're going to get more of that behavior. I agree!

Opposing arguments only convinced me that the same people whose bad behavior got us to this point want to continue to profit from that behavior. I don't think we should reward that.

I expect Utah legislators to finally do something that will actually result in deterring illegal immigration and making more jobs available to citizens and legal aliens at fair wages, especially since illegal immigration is again on the upswing.

IMO Sandstrom's, Herrod's and Mayne's bills together would make a significant impact where the Meros-Robles bill would exacerbate and perpetuate the problem.

DN Subscriber
Cottonwood Heights, UT

Sandstrom's bill is nowhere near as tough as it should be, but at least it is a start in the right direction.

Legal immigrants are welcome. Illegal immigrants are not.

We must change every law that provides any incentive, encouragement or support for illegal in our state. It is not the responsibility of the state of Utah, nor its taxpayers or residents to provide welfare, jobs, drives licenses or in state tuition to anyone here illegally, or the children of illegals.

I urge all members of the Legislature to pass this bill immediately! Then get to work on the other issues to get really tough!

Clearfield, UT

I don't think that polls on how citizens view this bill and the cost it entails are very helpful. Until the actual experience of citizens coping with the budget and service cutbacks that come with the implementation of this legislation as cities having to enforce this bill using existing resources that could go elsewhere for law enforcement, polls are only as good as the vague notions and ideas of what $11 millions really might create. Until then reality happens, polls are just imaginary what people hope but don't really know what life will be like.

Proud to be American
West Jordan, UT

This is a great step in the right direction.

Why does the media continue to care what Paul Mero of the Sutherland Institute thinks? It cracks me up!

Kudos to those who passed this on to the next level, we need this in place... yesterday!

Just my opinion
Salt Lake City, UT

This bill might cost some money. It might even cost the $11,000,000.00 I have seen listed.

But if you are able to just deport 2,000 illigals that committed a crime. You will save the $10,000.00 plus it would cost to have each in jail (I don't have the real number it cost, so I went with a very low number). But even at that low number you will save $20,000,000.00.

Then if not having those 2,000 here stops another 1,000 illigals that did not commit a crime to also not be here, from either leaving to be with the ones deported or from having kids here. That probably saves us from having anywhere from 500-2000 students no in our school we are currently paying for and shouldn't be. Another $2,500,000.00 to $10,000,000.00 savings.

Plus welfare money saved of probably $10,000,000.00+.

For a grand total of my low number of $32,000,000.00 up to as much as $100,000,000.00.

So I would say the $11,000,000.00 is worth it.

Orem, UT

What so many of you lack in understanding, ignore & forget, when you so flippantly say,

"They need to come LEGALLY"

Is that for many many years, you all, along with the Federal Government have ignored, not cared, not been bothered by their presence.

Further, you have allowed our elected officials to dangle the proverbial carrot in the faces of people who are POOR, desperate, deprived, scared, and in DIRE need of help.

YOU, we, are accountable for allowing our elected Federal officials to hand out ITIN numbers.

Accountable for hiring and winking at thousands of illegal workers--YOU, your friends and neighbors-- have hired them to do lawn work, labor, construction on your homes...hardly a single home in Utah has been built without some hand of an illegal worker.

THIS is where I see YOU, we, are accountable before God...for all of the sudden things get a little tough...and all jump on the band wagon to pull the rug out from under many families who have put roots down in our communities for many many years.

I'm embarrassed by your brazenness...shocked by your callousness... and no compassion.

For YOU, we, have created this problem.

Murray, Ut

ITIN numbers were designed for non-citizen business owners to pay taxes on property and business interests. It's just been the last while that pro-illegal organizations/people have encouraged people to use them thanks to a loophole in the system.

We are condemned if we do, and condemned if we don't.

We have been fighting lack of illegal immigration enforcement for 25 years.

The only real solution is for enforcement. Rewarding illegal behavior just makes it worse.

Mary E Petty
Sandy, UT

Currently we have bad immigration law in America that has resulted in an intolerable situation in the various states including Utah that must deal with the consequences of this bad law. Rep. Sandstrom's solution of HB70 for those that are caught in the middle of all this, who want to come to America like our ancestors did in the days before the current bad law was passed, and better their lives, is "Off with their heads!

Rather than making it possible for those who seek the Golden Lamp and the Door to Freedom and Opportunity of Life, Liberty and the Pursuit of Happiness for their families through such humanitarian law as SB 60, Utah once again forgets the teachings of "love thy neighbor as thy self and frankly forgive".

All you "eye for an eye" people, good luck when bad law comes back on you. What goes around comes around. If we persist in Utah in denying the lessons from our roots when states rights drove us from Nauvoo, we will reap the whirlwind.

Please, we of all people, should have the compassion/smarts to figure out the higher road for living with our brothers and sisters.

Kearns, UT

CWEB, I feel sorry for you too. We americans did not invite illegals in to this state, we did not give them these jobs, we did not permit government to break our laws, they did that on their own, and that is soon to change with changes in government leadership and reinforcement of the federal laws at the state level.

There is no illegal that is not a felon criminal so none of them are exempt from identification request by law enforcement, business, government workers or citizen of America. If law enforcement has a problem obeying and enforcing the law, then those individuals can look for a new job.

We are proud to be americans and proud to serve our country and proud to help deport all the illegals. There is no need to even arrest an undocumented, just turn them around and point them back to the border.

The so called coalition is an illegal organization of business and community leaders with one agenda, break the laws, therefore are terrorist to the cause of the United States of America.

Red Smith
American Fork, UT

If a legal mother does not put child in a car seat, then she is stopped by the police.

If a legal person does not buckle his seat belts, he is stopped by the police.

If a legal does not fill our government forms (IRS), then he can be arrested.

Why are illegals given a pass? Either enforce or repeal immigration laws.

How is it illegals have more rights than legals?

open minded
Lehi, UT

So we're going to ignore the Utah Compact, now catching on in other states, and the $$ costs of a similar law in Arizona to pass this bill? Sounds like Sandstrom is trying to please his fellow GOP legislators instead of doing what's best for the people of Utah.

Kearns, UT

Hopefully with Sandstrom's bill, Herods'bill and Wimmer's bill, we can go out of this session with some real legislation that stops the middle class from paying taxes to take care of the illegal immigrant, living with a higher crime rates, cars on the roads that you know don't pass inspection and construction workers and our older children getting back to work.
These bills are what we need. We don't need legislation passed because of Corporations and Church's telling the state that we need illegal's here and they can just pass the costs onto the middle class. Enough is Enough. Thank you Sandstrom. You are the sane one in this state.

John C. C.
Payson, UT

Here's my short list of corrections of the common myths quoted above:

The ITN lets the undocumented pay taxes.

Children are assets, not liabilities.

Undocumented residents use government benefits less than natives

Immigrant workers and their families create more jobs than they take, and the jobs they take are usually in sectors that don't compete with natives.

Legal immigrants are not officially welcome. They are restricted and discouraged beyond the point of ridiculousness.

Undocumented presence is a misdemeanor, not a felony.

Kaysville, UT

I think if everyone in the state that wants the immigrants to leave gave five dollars we would have more that enough money to support the bill.

Kearns, UT

This makes me sad. What are we saying to the rest of the world? This will create more problems than actually solve the problems we already have. Here's a thought--let's start treating our neighbors as neighbors. How about we take care of our neighborhoods and be kind to each other? Let's help our neighbors learn English, improve their education, and become productive citizens.

Let's stop acting like the intolerant, judgmental people we appear to be to the rest of the world.

City, Ut

Lectori Salutem--the "bad behavior" I see from the illegals I know include:

*taking English lessons offered at a local church

*both parents working menial, low paying jobs to be able to afford food, a barely adequate vehicle, and overpriced apartments.

*willingly serving others in their church.

*keep themselves and yards clean, orderly

*doing their very best to stay off of everyone's radar screens.

They don't break laws,(except the ONE that INFURIATES you) Don't use public resources except the public school for their children, pay their own way, and don't require anything from anyone.

In return, they are taken advantage of by their landlords, and their employers.

I would WAY rather live next to the illegal aliens I know than many questionable "legal" people I have occasionally lived next to.

I would WAY rather have a neighbor who is breaking the law of being in the US illegally, and who scrupulously obeys every other law (to stay under the notice of anyone) than the ones who ARE LEGAL citizens of this country who are breaking the laws of abusing wife and children, DUI, assault, financial fraud,and any others they don't mind breaking

Santa Clara, UT

Hurrah! We are making progress in stopping this invasion. And the other article in the DMN says "Indiana and other states" are following our lead. Hopefully all 50 states will pass a similar bill and then the Feds will have to sue all 50....or they could just enforce the laws. Amnesty begets more amnesty, or as said earlier if you reward bad behavior you are going to get more of that behavior. Write Sandstrom and others supporting this bill and thank them for their efforts.

Watch Dog
Provo, UT

"...business, government and religious leaders that encourages federal solutions..."

Sure they do! BECAUSE they are well aware that the Feds have no intention of enforcing ANY of these immigration laws.

There is nothing in either AZ's or UT's law that IS NOT ALREADY in the federal law, therefore, all these challenges are going to go away.

I got a kick out of the fiscal cost attached to this bill as well. It DID NOT count the savings should illegals leave our state. I am willing to bet that the $11 million would be made up within weeks just from what we pay to educate the kids of illegal aliens!

Brer Rabbit
Spanish Fork, UT

Watch Dog is exactly right. The Utah taxpayers would save about $453 million if the illegal aliens left Utah this year.

I was at the hearing yesterday. From the Trib, "Rep. David Litvack, D-Salt Lake, said the law wouldn't push illegal immigrants out of Utah." The statement is reported correctly. Even if HB070 doesn't "push" illegal aliens out, it does pull in the welcome mat a little.

If illegal aliens begin to realize that they are not welcome in Utah perhaps fewer of them will come and the costs to UT taxpayers will not continue to rise as it has over the last decade.

It has taken over a generation to dig ourselves into this pit. It could take a decade or more to dig ourselves out, but that is only if we stop digging deeper. HB070 only slows Utah's rate of digging deeper, and more progress is needed.

Life in the United States and the social benefits are not a world-wide entitlement. The toleration of a bad behavior only increases the bad behavior.

Murray, Ut

Good analogy Brer Rabbit, amnesty just makes a bigger problem to dig ourselves out of. Progressive self deportation laws are the best, easiest and most civil way for all concerned.

Amnesty is not being civil to the 100,000 citizens that need those jobs to feed their families.

Right now the rest of the world wants to know why we let people steal their places in line.

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