You can stay on the CJ bandwagon for as long as you want,just realize it`s not
going anywhere because as you stated yourself he is lazy,out of shape,winded all
the time,and worst of all he`s a ballhog,who is not all that good a shooter and
not a team player,notice on the replays when Gaines hit the game-winner and was
mobbed,CJ was no where to be found
Game winning shots...1, miles game winning shots...0,that`s gotta be eatin at
seems to do well against the best of breed. The tougher the competition the
better he plays. He is probably a born competitor that loves his game. this
makes the game extrtemely interesting for me. He is no slacker. He will give the
Jazz fans something interesting to watch.
You guys can rip me apart and it is easy too after "you win" most of the Sloan
ites....Most of the OConnor SUpporters-only go on here to say "i told you so" or
"sloan is great we told you so because we win a couple of suprising results"
What is the "body of the work over a season" remember last year?
The first half of this season?I will say it again: You could give
Jerry "the greatest roster" and he still would not win an NBA title...He has "to
prove" it to me.I am on here good and bad. I even have the
class to praise Sloan and O Connor when deserved as I have proven for the last
year.Further, we will see about Gaines. If anyone tell me O Connor
sent off Maynor because "not including salary dump, he already knew Gaines could
be nba player"?That is a reach....Can we not be happy
about Gaines and hope he contributes to us when called upon?I do
support our team. Still this team is 1 major deal away from being #2 in the
West. That is where I have problems withg GM
Sign Gaines for the rest of the year. He has earned it.
What Gains has that Maynor never will? An NBA body! Maynor is a short AK -
will never be able to hold any muscle or weight on his frame and this is a
liability in today's NBA.
I would suggest that for a 10 day contract the Jazz are getting a lot for their
money.Gaines is not Rondo or Nash. He certainly isn't Magic Johnson.
He is a combo guard who does not know the Jazz offense. He can shoot
and that is not based on one shot. We have seen enough to know he can shoot in
the NBA. He plays decent D and should get better as he gains experience. Give the kid a break. No talent? He has only played 5 games. Give him
the rest of the season to learn the offense and adjust to the NBA. At the end of
the season the Jazz can decide if they need more talent. Sloan gave
Price 4 years (with contract extensions) to learn to be a PG. Gaines is not a
pure PG. Right now he looks like he is as good as Price and a whole lot cheaper.
Playing both Price and Gaines together seems to be an interesting
approach. It takes pressure off of both. Would you rather have
Gaines, Knight or Hart? Knight played for 10 years. I think Gaines has enough
talent to be in the NBA.
Re Sandy Jazz Fan: Your pretty much right on most things and that is why I have
been having a hard time staying on the CJ bandwagon. Mathews deserves to start
and most of the time he has outplayed CJ.Potential is a different thing,
Potential is a combination of athletism, and skills. CJ is taller, longer,
better hops (?), CJ's shot is better long range and pull up jumper. Fress throws
CJ last yr shot 87%, this yr he hasn't hardly got to the line (problem in
itself), CJ's quickness and speed are questionable because of his nonshalont
approach. There are time he shows as good or better quickness and speed and
anyone on the team and other times he looks terrible.Mathews hustles all
the time and his quickness to stay in front of his man is great. CJ shows he can
play D against anyone at times and then other times he looks terrible. I think
it's not that he can't it's because he's lazy and not tough enough.If CJ
and Mathews play up to their potential I'll take CJ but Mathews plays closer to
his potential than CJ.
@Miles, CL. BTW, I just don't get this "potential" thing with CJ. I don't think
he has improved all that much this year, and I don't think he's any better this
year than last. So just what is his "potential"? Pretty much all he is is a
shooter. So he raises his shooting percentage 5 or 10 points? That won't make
him that much more valuable.Matthews is a much more well-rounded
player. He may not be a superstar, but he is solid and he will keep getting
better. He is a better passer than CJ, better driver, has better court sense,
more energy, and is just as good of a shooter . He will improve in many more
dimensions over time.As for stats, CJ is NOT better in all
categories:Shooting: Matthews, .480, CJ. 3973-point :
Matthews, .359, CJ .319FT: Matthews, .773 (second on team), CJ .667FT/game: Matthews: 2.0, CJ, 0.6TO: Matthews, 1.0, CJ 1.15PF:
Matthews, 1.5, CJ 3.0CJ scores more (8.9 v. 8.3), but only because
he shoots so much more.
@Miles, CL. Yes, I live in Utah (that's Sandy, Utah, not Sandy, elsewhere), and
yes, I know that Matthews is older than CJ. But college ball is no comparison to
the NBA. It's not just court time. It's practice, watching the games in person,
learning from your teammates, etc. As Sloan says, Fesenko and Koufus have
continued to improve this year, and they've hardly gotten any court time. Age
notwithstanding, CJ is in his fourth year of NBA experience and Matthews is in
his fourth MONTH. That's a huge difference.I have to say that in
previous years, I loved CJ and always liked to watch him play. But that was when
the Jazz were more of a shooting team, with Korver and Okur's 3s dominating like
they did most of last year. Having seen how could we were running the offense
and executing D during the 19 games Matthews started, it made it clear to me how
much of a deficit CJ really is and how much Matthews adds to the team. It isn't
that CJ is bad, but our team is worse when he plays...
But gaines defense has been light years ahead of maynor. big upgrade as far as
that end of the floor is concerned.
If you really want to compare gaines to maynor, you'd have to say, gaines is the
better scorer, and maynor is the better runner of an offense. I don't want
to get nostolgic about maynor, but he had a way of finding the open guy and
getting them a chance for a good score, he did it surprisingly well, but maynor
will never be the scorer that gaines is, however, gaines can become better at
facilitating the offense, hence he will fit the job description of jazz backup
pg. This is what I'm waiting to see, he's a pg, will he work at #1 priority,
run the offense, i do think that he can run it better than price, but price is
such a tough competitor he makes up for it with his hustle. It's not as
important that the backup pg get everyone involved. Comeon, price boxing at
lebron, thats got to warm the heart a little.obviously, gaines will get a
contract, i think he's going to make a fine backup pg and be better for this
team than maynor. He makes it easy to forget about the maynor trade.
I don't think CJ thinks much about his teammates when he gets the rock in his
hands. He isn't the pure shooter that he thinks he is. I cringe every time
Sloan puts him in and every too quick shot he puts up gives me a little heart
attack. I feel much more comfortable with Brewer or Matthews starting in his
place. Gaines blows my mind. So calm and cool. Fast and great D. Okur needs
to put his hands in anybody's face that is shooting near him. That's the other
thing that makes my heart flutter. He will stand next to a great shooter and
watch them take a great shot with his hands at his side. The past two games
have been a little better with Okur's defence but I'd like to see CJ get traded
to some team that could use somebody like him more than we could. I think he
should be the last resort on the floor!
Will DWill miss any games?
Truth be known CL,Matthews is better than Miles.Period.Matthews plays within the
team concept,Miles is all about Miles and making sure he shoots(not makes) every
ball he touches,yes he`s lazy,winded,out of shape,that`s because he doesn`t care
about helping the team,just wants his shooting % to look good in the paper every
morning,you`re a smart guy and should really be able to see the truth
EXPECTATIONS CJ vs Mathews : Miles makes a good point,that CJ's stats are
better than Mathews but people (myself included) have higher expectations for CJ
than for Mathews and therefore we are disappointed with CJ and his performance.
Mathews does play tougher Defense, drives better to the hole and has
scored pretty good. CJ looks soft, out of shape, winded and he doesn't
hustle like Mathews. The game comes easy for CJ and therefore he plays
soft, lazy and nonshalont alot of the time. That being said he can be very
productive at times. It's those times that make me frustrated and say why can't
you play like that all the time. At least put in the effort to play better all
the time. CJ has alot of potential and even his good games are not near
reaching his potential. I say that because I don't see him putting forth the
effort, playing with top energy,guts,determination etc. If he will learn to play
harder etc he may be able to reach his potential.The cosches must see CJ's
potential in practice & realize what they have to play him ahead of Mathews.
wow lets sign him to a 5 yr 50 mil contract.
I was never that hign on Maynor anyway, he performed better than I thought he
would but he wasn't anything great. Maynor isn't that good of a
shooter(especially 3's), not a great athlete. He ran the team pretty good,
calm,controlled but he wasn't worth 10 mil.Gaines looks to be a better
athlete, quick, fast, strong,good defender, and a better shooter. Time will tell
but he looks like a keeper.Re Sandy fan: I agree with some of what you
say, Mathews is playing very solid, better D, but he doesn't have more potential
and he has more b-ball experience than CJ. He is older than CJ and CJ sat the
bench most of his first two years. Even the last two years CJ has gotten less
than half a game minutes wise. I have been pretty hard on CJ as of late because
he is so inconsistant but I still hope he will improve and reach his
potential(which is higher than Mathews).
@Sandy Jazz Fan: Do you live in the State of Utah? Did you realize that
Matthews is OLDER than CJ? Matthews actually played in college while Jerry
froze out CJ on the bench after drafting him. Now that CJ is starting to receive
consistent playing time and have a greater role on the team he is improving at a
much fast rate. CJ's stats are better than Matthews in every catagory.
The two most exciting players on the Jazz now are two people who weren't even on
the radar last summer when all of the talk was about Boozer, Milsap, et. al.:
Gaines and Matthews. They're exciting because they play hard, don't give up, and
bring incredible energy to the team, just like Ronnie Price does.Is
Gaines as good as Maynor? Hard to say. But does it really matter? Even aside
from his spectacular shot last night, he has played solidly and has been a great
team player, mostly without the benefit of any practices. Does anyone really
realize how hard that is? Maybe he'll be great and maybe he won't, but the
chances of finding someone else even at this level is very small, and he
deserves a chance to prove himself the rest of the year.As for CJ
vs. Matthews, remember: this is CJ's fourth year in the NBA, and he was a
starter all last year. Matthews is a rookie. CJ should be far better than
Matthews, but he isn't. Matthews is more solid, better court sense, better team
player, far better D, and much greater potential.
"and the fact that it was done simply to save money made it even worse." It saved them like 10 million dollars. Would you give up that money if you
were in that situation. I wouldn't. I was fine with trade regardless of Gaines'
I'm happy for Gaines and glad for the win, but to say that he is as good or
better than Eric Maynor is just plain nonsense. Anyone making that claim simply
knows nothing about basketball. Gaines is a marginal NBA player right now.
Hopefully he will improve his game enough to stick in the league. Maynor is
going to be a solid player for years to come, and maybe even a star. Letting him
go was a mistake (remember Mo Williams?), and the fact that it was done simply
to save money made it even worse.
NOT separate issues. people were all over these boards when Maynor was traded
saying O'Connor made one of his biggest mistakes and that it was one of the
worst moves in Jazz history (not exaggerating, read the boards). well that
"worst move ever" turned into O'Connor picking Gaines up. We got another point
guard who is just as good as Maynor (and possibly better, the future will tell)
for pennies, meanwhile saving the team over 10mil. So yea, everyone who was
ready to hang O'Connor a couple of weeks ago, put that foot of yours in your
It wasn't just one big shot. He was 3/3 with 9 points. He played solid D, and
did everything that was expected of him. And he has played well each time he
has beeni n the game. If the Jazz don't give him a contract for the rest of the
year, they are crazy. They would only have to pay him the rookie minimum, and
that would be a bargain considering the exposure he gave the Jazz and those
green uniforms last night.
I expected this kind of response from Jazz fans. You guys have been conditioned
well by your ownership.I recognize talent just fine, thanks, and
Gaines doesn't have it. Actually, let me clarify - he has talent compared to
the other stiffs that make up the piddling, middle-of-the-road Jazz, but not
compared to the rest of the NBA.I hope you're right - I really do -
but I think you're looking at Ostertag part 2 here.
Gaines should have earned a contract for the rest of the season with that shot.
But it's his solid play since he's been here that is showing his worth. The
kid's got talent.And hold your horses, if you can't recognize talent
when it's playing in front of you, you need to take your words some place else.
This guy can play, and the Jazz's scouting department saw it too.
Funny how two "nobodies" are key (and underpaid) Jazz players this year
(Matthews and Gaines). By year's end, the Jazz should be in pretty good shape
for a deep playoff run, sans key injuries then.Recent wins over
really good teams shows that the Jazz can compete at a high level. They just now
need to do it consistently, and on the road.Being the ONLY NBA team
with wins over the Orlando Magic, Dallas Mavericks, Los Angeles Lakers, and San
Antonio Spurs is very interesting. Shows potential.
Why don't you just go back and stay a cheerleader for your Alta Hawks.
He has been a consistent player who takes care of the ball and consistently
makes the mid range jumper. He has done everything expected with his
yata made a bigger shot last night than any of our starter have made all
season.Against a team with the most wins in the league?National TV?A rookie?His first made NBA 3pt shot?He did great and as far as I'm concerned he deserved the scorers table
with as big as shot as this franchise has seen in several years.re:
attentionYou have to be sentimental with Todd. His ego is smarting
about now since he undoubtedly was criticizing O'Conner about the Maynor trade
and every other fantasy trade that O'Conner can't make (neither can any GM but
that seems beside the point).Now Sundiata hits Todd between the eyes
and makes O'Conners signing look brilliant.It must really stink to
be Todd.He complains about everything and everyone and then day
after day the RESULTS and FACTS discredit everything he says.
One clutch shot does not make Gaines a good player. Unfortunately, that's
historically been the attitude of Jazz ownership and fans. That's the reasoning
that got us 12 years of Greg Ostertag.There's a reason Gaines was in
the d-league....he's not good enough to play in the NBA. And that didn't change
just because he hit a timely three.
On National TV? Too bad nobody saw it in most markets due to the late start
Sunday-aught-a-Gain you some extra blessings if you do the right things to keep
Now O'conner doesn't seem like quite the idiot you all said he was. I've said
all along that KOC knew what he was doing.. happy that Gaines proved it during
the game!GO JAZZ!!!
Hey "plyxply", we need a little more of that emotion from our players. I want to
see some heart and desire. Yata was just overcome with the emotion that he
finally made it in the NBA.
separate issues, what a silly statement
stay off the table, now we can say please act like you've done it before. Nice
shot by the way, gnite.
To everyone who cried bloody murder when the Jazz traded Mayor: You may now
proceed to insert your foot into your mouth. Thank you.
what a game tonight. best one i have seen in a lot of years. i was a nervous
wreck when gains made that killer shot. I could not believe my eyes when it
dropped in. it was great!
Wont it for the Jazz. Kyle with an unbelievable shot behind the board to
bring the Jazz within 2 and Sundy's winning 3! Glad to see Sundy
beat LeBronThis kid is a keeper for the rest of the season.
Gaines was the savior tonight!!!!! I was unsure of this guy when Kevin brought
him in but he just secured his place in Jazz lore and he needs to stay until the
end of the season. SWEET GAME
What a way to end the game! Played pretty decent throughout - but to make the
game winning 3 pointer while on a 10 day contract?! Incredible!
An unlikely hero in Jazz victory against Cleveland Lebrons er, cavaliers.What a rollercoaster it was !
Gaines unbelievable heart, you are the kind of young man that will being pride
back to these colorsBless you son