Comments about ‘Taxpayers Association may sue UTOPIA’

Any time I hear Utah taxpayers association, I am prejudiced to be against whatever they are supporting.

One of the WORST things to ever happen to this state was this "association" and the way it hides behind its funding from big business.

They have truly robbed from the poor to give to the rich.

SAD.

At last, a balanced article on the UTA. Their tactics have been ridiculous, and their depiction of Brigham City residents as total dupes has been frustrating. In my neighborhood, a large number have signed up for the service. Just FYI: Most people in my neighborhood are literally rocket scientists. Surprise: Qwest and Comcast are using underhanded tactics, just like they do when they provide me "customer service." Good riddance to them; welcome UTOPIA.

So let me get this straight. Howard Stephenson, a Utah legislator, who also heads a lobby group called the Utah Taxpayers Association may sue Utopia. What bothers me is that a sitting legislator is running a lobby group that generally spends its time supporting legislation that protects wealthy taxpayers and corporations at the expense of everyone else. The so-called flat tax was nothing more than a tax hike on the middle class and a big tax break for the wealthy (according to my accountant). This group makes it sound like it is protecting the citizens of Brigham City, but given the past dealing of the Utah Taxpayer Association, I suspect there is something else to gain as a result of this court action. I guess time will tell.

Uggh.

When will the yokels stop electing this guy that thinks he is king of the state and serves his own self interest?

He has killed our state from taxes to education. Especially education.

Utopia is a disaster. Anyone who didn't see this coming was blind. Can't wait for the time Utopia falls into insolvency- and comes begging for taxpayers to bail it out.

This complaint would have more credibility if the Taxpayers Association said whether or not they were getting funding from Utopia's competitors.

Everytime I hear of UTOPIA, It reminds me of the Simpsons episode with the monorail ... Governments should never be in the business of competing with free-market enterprises .... even health-care!

AIMHO

UTA is a wolf in sheep's clothing. Good sounding name - lousy works. Everyone and everything associated with it is detrimental. They put up a facade of being good for us while it's just a bunch of back-room deals between businesses, elected officials and a few front men. They're no friend to any citizen of Utah. Don't anyone be dupped by this group anymore. Run away from them.

I have Utopia in my home and consider the service and speed (through xmission) to be much better than the comcast or qwest offerings I've had before.

I am not aware of a 20 year lien or any contract of this nature from my installation. If such a contract was presented her, it must have been a very unusual case and perhaps some sort of subsidy for an unusually expensive install. I don't think we're getting the whole story here.

What people don't understand is that much of the Utopia fibre installation was already paid for by all Federal tax payers in the 90's. Litigious actions like these have postponed the installations, delaying America's advancement as a leader in world communications. Nearly all of Japanese homes are now wired with 2Gbit fibre due to a national program similar to Utopia. As a result, Japanese prices for a 100Mbit connection to the internet are less than $5 average. Having fast connections to so many citizens has propelled the Japanese economy and made possible home commuting, among other social changes which position the country to better compete with countries like ours in the near future.

UTA = Utah Telecom/Cable Company Taxpayers Association

Please someone at the Dnews do a little investigating of the Utah Taxpayers association.

It is time to blow this story wide open.

They are funded by big business and support the causes of big business. They hide behind a name any republican would love but they are doing terrible harm to our state.

I now pay more taxes due to the flat tax, yet the funding for education gets worse and worse. Oh they'll tell you they are increasing funding by so many millions of dollars over the year before but what they don't tell you is the number of students also rose dramatically. Of course you have to spend more when you add more kids to the family.

The teachers are angry, the parents are angry and we keep add more illegals to our rolls.

Expose this group for what they are.

Please.

I'll ask some tough questions:

1. Does UTOPIA "take" property for failure to pay?
2. If UTOPIA takes property, how would they dispose of it?
3. How would a homeowner with a lien for 20 years, sell their home? Would they say, "by the way, we signed up for UTOPIA so you have a lien on the home for 20 years."
4. Does the lien affect your ability to gain access to your equity?
5. Does the lien affect your ability to refinance or get a new mortgage?

Just a few questions for the UTOPIA folks or the Brigham City elected leaders. Go get them Utah Taxpayers Assn.

Just as an FYI, Sen. Stephenson makes about $130,000 a year (at least that was his 2008 earnings reported to the federal government from the Utah Taxpayers Association's financial reports). The association receives the majority of its funding through membership dues. The dues in 2008 were appx. 360,000, with an additional $150,000 in revenue from program services. In addition to the Senator's salary, the association also pays an additional $200,000 in compensation for employees. The association does not report who their members are or what the different membership fees are, at least not on their webpage. This is not what I would call a transparent nonprofit organization. However, if we assume that the choice to join is like any other market transaction, the members must be getting a substantial benefit, in this case that would likely be a lower long-term tax bill.

Anyway, just a thought or two.

UTA suing UTOPIA? It seems like it should be the other way around. The UTA is the side that started up a slander campaign in Brigham City mailing out fliers with false information on them trying to scare and destroy the efforts of UTOPIA there. How does anyone give them any credit? The only thing they have going for them is a name that implies they have interests in the taxpayers of Utah, when in fact, they are just stooges for Qwest, Comcast, and anyone else who will donate to their lobbying efforts. Please, please, DN, investigate their organization. I'm sure you'll find a real story there.

Here's a quick comparison for you to compare UTOPIA and the UTA:

UTA: Formed and funded by big business, non-profit status, non-disclosure

UTOPIA: Formed by 14 municipalities, run by a board consisting of member city representatives, full-disclosure under Utah Grama laws

Which of these groups do you think better represents you, the taxpayer?

So, UTA found a few people who signed up for UTOPIA who didn't quite understand what they were signing. Unfortunately, this happens in all door-to-door campaigns. How many people sign contracts for pest control, satellite tv, carpet cleaning, home security, gym membership, or other door-to-door sales without fully understanding the contracts? There are always going to be cases where this happens. The difference here is that the city actually gave everyone the benefit of sending them all letters that fully explained what they were signing up for in simple terms, without any UTOPIA marketing in it.

Anyone who received that letter who had signed up for services unknowingly, and then didn't cancel in time is a fool, and unfortunately, they are being made out as martyrs for the case of UTA. In general, people up there understand what is going on, and over 350 people paid up front in cash because they wanted it so badly. To say that UTOPIA tricked the people of Brigham City is greatly misleading. DesNews should go do some legwork and interview some people up there. The people up there support what is going on.

@Just some questions

> I'll ask some tough questions:

Actually, your questions aren't tough at all. They're pretty much all FAQs for the Brigham City SAA. The first thing to clear up is that the agreement is between residents and Brigham City, not UTOPIA.

> 1. Does UTOPIA "take" property for failure to pay?

UTOPIA can't, since they are not party to the agreement. Brigham City can, but won't. Most likely, if you don't pay, they'll just wait until you sell the house, and at that time the payment will have to be made or the house can't change owners.

more below...

> 2. If UTOPIA takes property, how would they dispose of it?

If the city were actually to put a home into foreclosure for failure to meet the terms of the contract, it would work like any other foreclosure, where the property would be sold at auction and the proceeds from the sale would go to anyone with a lien, deed of trust, or mortgage, with remaining proceeds (if any) going to the mortgage. Again, the city has said they have no plans to do things in this manner, but they are required by law to put a lien on the property to execute a SAA. Otherwise, they couldn't get the low interest rates on the bond.

> 3. How would a homeowner with a lien for 20 years, sell their home? Would they say, "by the way, we signed up for UTOPIA so you have a lien on the home for 20 years."

The title company researches the title for all outstanding obligations, including liens and mortgages. At settlement, all of the obligations either have to be paid for or transferred over to the new owner. Most can't be transferred, but this SAA bond can. So the buyer & seller can decide whether to pay it off at closing or pass it on to the buyer.

Sorry... in my haste, I made a mistake on answer #2:

...the proceeds from the sale would go to anyone with a lien, deed of trust, or mortgage, with remaining proceeds (if any) going to the mortgage.

That should read

with remaining proceeds (if any) going to the owner.

(And of course, if all of the parties agree to a short sale or other type of non-auction sale, they can get their money that way too.)

Hmmm. Apparently the DesNews comment police thought my previous incarnation of Answers #4 and #5 was to abusive, since it hasn't made it through their system.

> 4. Does the lien affect your ability to gain access to your equity?

No. It's not a deed of trust or a mortgage.

> 5. Does the lien affect your ability to refinance or get a new mortgage?

No. See above.