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Utah Jazz notebook: Young bigs stuck on bench
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TIME for CHANGE | 9:36 p.m. Nov. 15, 2009
Thank you Jerry Sloan for 20 years of coaching the Jazz. But it is time to move
on. Time for a change. Please, fire Jerry Sloan. The game has changed and his
coaching hasn't. Hello Coach Jeff Hornacek.
Will Christensen | 9:45 p.m. Nov. 15, 2009
I agree, time for a change. Lose Sloan or lose the fans,,,,real soon.
Chuck Nunn | 3:25 a.m. Nov. 16, 2009
Love Jerry Sloan as a coach. I really do. But the whole "we have a chore to
win games" argument only works when you actually win the games. Fesenko
needs the minutes, and the Jazz need his presence.
Peace out from the Jazz Oracle.
Peace out from the Jazz Oracle.
Comments continue below
Chris | 6:41 a.m. Nov. 16, 2009
It ain't the coach. It's the players. He can't put the ball in
the basket for them. The plays are proven to work, if they play according to
what is layed out to them. It is some of the players who lack heart. It is
also amazing that the 2 young bigs, can't crach the lineup, in which I
think Boozer is coasting. That lets you know that skills aren't there yet.
You can alway blame him for pushing the team to over achieve. If he
didn't, they would of had higher draft picks, and better players.
Matt | 7:23 a.m. Nov. 16, 2009
I disagree with all of you. Jerry is a basketball genius, the Jazz would be
foolish to fire him when they obviously are needing help.
What I don't understand is why the Jazz draft young players that aren't ready to play basketball. What good did Morris Almond playing for the flash do? Did DeShawn Stevenson really pan out? Kris Humphries is finally getting minutes in Dallas, but why did we prepare him for other teams?
The idea of "lets get a young guy who in a couple of years would be a lottery pick" obviously isn't working for the Jazz.
Jazz fans always complain about Sloan not playing rookies. Well are there any rookies that have gone on to earn minutes with other teams? People thought DL all-star Mo Almond was the answer, but he got cut by both the Knicks and the Magic. How about Dee Brown? Roger Powell? Quincy Lewis... which team did he end up playing for? Rookies that don't play for Sloan, don't play.
People think Koufus could start at 5 and move Memo to 4 (this is foolish!)
What I don't understand is why the Jazz draft young players that aren't ready to play basketball. What good did Morris Almond playing for the flash do? Did DeShawn Stevenson really pan out? Kris Humphries is finally getting minutes in Dallas, but why did we prepare him for other teams?
The idea of "lets get a young guy who in a couple of years would be a lottery pick" obviously isn't working for the Jazz.
Jazz fans always complain about Sloan not playing rookies. Well are there any rookies that have gone on to earn minutes with other teams? People thought DL all-star Mo Almond was the answer, but he got cut by both the Knicks and the Magic. How about Dee Brown? Roger Powell? Quincy Lewis... which team did he end up playing for? Rookies that don't play for Sloan, don't play.
People think Koufus could start at 5 and move Memo to 4 (this is foolish!)
Cowboy Joe | 7:31 a.m. Nov. 16, 2009
Whats up with article saying Koufous didn't play in Saturday's win at
Cleveland. Didn't the Cavs win?
Mathews and Maynor will follow suit of Fes and Koufous once Korver Miles and Price return to action.
The chore will win and wield us to the 8th seed in the Playoffs. Good one Jerry. How about let the young guys play get us some ping pong ball two top picks a new coach and a title run the next few years.
Mathews and Maynor will follow suit of Fes and Koufous once Korver Miles and Price return to action.
The chore will win and wield us to the 8th seed in the Playoffs. Good one Jerry. How about let the young guys play get us some ping pong ball two top picks a new coach and a title run the next few years.
After All Jerry | 7:42 a.m. Nov. 16, 2009
True this is not exhibition season now, but what really the regular season is,
is nothing more than extended play for seeding into a tournament at seasons end,
nothing less nothing more! Play the youngsters or dump them, see what they can
do or don't spend any more money on them, but give yourself and them a
chance to see if they can cut it, after all this is not rocket science,
it's just a game!
Fred Breth | 7:49 a.m. Nov. 16, 2009
Chuck Nunn is right! We need to develop a 300 lb. 7 footer so we can win games!
It is very clear to the basketball minds. Most posters do not understand the
importance of shutting down the paint. It is good to know there are still some
Chuck Nunns out there!
Doc Davidson | 7:51 a.m. Nov. 16, 2009
If you had a 7 footer that weighed 300 hundred lbs. and he had any coorination
at all. If he could even lift his arms above his head, you would use him out on
the court!
Ak Fan | 8:06 a.m. Nov. 16, 2009
Good one Doc Davidson.
Someone calling Sloan genius. Maybe maybe not. But it measured not just stats win lost columns how many rings do you have or end result. Jerry doesn't have after 20 = years.
Someone calling Sloan genius. Maybe maybe not. But it measured not just stats win lost columns how many rings do you have or end result. Jerry doesn't have after 20 = years.
Rings count but aren't everythin | 8:18 a.m. Nov. 16, 2009
Stockton didn't get any rings either and he is a basketball genius.
Stockton thought Sloan was a genius. You really want to argue whether or not
Sloan is a basketball genius?
Jazz fans are just naive.
Take for example the comment that "Boozer is coasting" Look at this comment from another article in DesNews "20.5 ppg on 66-percent field-goal shooting, 10 rpg."
20.5ppg and 10rpg and you want Fesenko to take his place? That is ridiculous.
Boozer's defense isn't great, but it has improved this year. I don't think the problems is a lack of effort on his part, its a lack of anticipation. I don't think he's a smart defender. DWill on the other hand lacks defensive quickness. Maybe if DWill didn't get burned by rookie PG's so much, Boozer wouldn't have to be so aware of guarding the middle.
Jazz fans are just naive.
Take for example the comment that "Boozer is coasting" Look at this comment from another article in DesNews "20.5 ppg on 66-percent field-goal shooting, 10 rpg."
20.5ppg and 10rpg and you want Fesenko to take his place? That is ridiculous.
Boozer's defense isn't great, but it has improved this year. I don't think the problems is a lack of effort on his part, its a lack of anticipation. I don't think he's a smart defender. DWill on the other hand lacks defensive quickness. Maybe if DWill didn't get burned by rookie PG's so much, Boozer wouldn't have to be so aware of guarding the middle.
Its NOT Sloans Fault!!!! | 8:59 a.m. Nov. 16, 2009
You guys are CLUELESS!!! The Jazz front office go out and get these offensive
minded players to fit in to Sloan's System....wrong and stupid!!
Sloan's approach is defense, defense, DEFENSE!!! D-will and millsap
(sometimes) are the only one's that play D. It's not Sloan's
number you should be calling out, it's O'Connor and the boneheads that
re-sign people like Okur that can't play D. C'mon people lets use our
heads....
IDjazz12 | 9:02 a.m. Nov. 16, 2009
All arguing in favor of Sloan being a good coach. Let me just say this. Is
Boozer and Memo getting it done defensively the last five years? If you answer
that yes then change to a sport you can understand.
RE: IDjazz12 | 9:21 a.m. Nov. 16, 2009
Uhhhh....and that's Sloan's fault? You can't teach defense, you
can only encourage it. Put Sloan with a group of guys like Portland or Houston,
wouldn't surprise me if they ended up in the finals cause those guys play
D. I garuantee if you bring another coach in the jazz do worse right now...
Geniuses?? | 9:25 a.m. Nov. 16, 2009
EVERY game that the players run our system the way it is supposed to be run they
kill teams. They slice, they dice, they mince, and they win.
When they get selfish, jack up jumpshots, don't play defense, rely on their offense, don't fight through screens, and generally lack effort they lose.
This is player immaturity issue. We have the 5th youngest team in the NBA and it shows. This is not a coach issue.
It is no coincidence that players like Lebron pull Maynor aside after the Cav game and tell him "you have a good coach..listen to him".
Somehow I think Lebron and other NBA notables have ALOT more CREDIBILITY than you Sloan Bashers here.
Your BB IQ's are severely lacking.
LeBron vs. "the oracle"....gee....let me think.
Duh!
Oh ya, when is it you bashers are going to give Jazz management credit for drafting Maynor and scouting/developing Matthews?
I can't hear you???
It must be lousy to be wrong so often!!
When they get selfish, jack up jumpshots, don't play defense, rely on their offense, don't fight through screens, and generally lack effort they lose.
This is player immaturity issue. We have the 5th youngest team in the NBA and it shows. This is not a coach issue.
It is no coincidence that players like Lebron pull Maynor aside after the Cav game and tell him "you have a good coach..listen to him".
Somehow I think Lebron and other NBA notables have ALOT more CREDIBILITY than you Sloan Bashers here.
Your BB IQ's are severely lacking.
LeBron vs. "the oracle"....gee....let me think.
Duh!
Oh ya, when is it you bashers are going to give Jazz management credit for drafting Maynor and scouting/developing Matthews?
I can't hear you???
It must be lousy to be wrong so often!!
Re: It's not Sloan's Fault | 9:27 a.m. Nov. 16, 2009
Who's Fault is then?
If you want to win games, you must defend the paint. Chucks smart enough to know it. Why Jerry can't see it is beyond me. It's turning into a big joke. Play the bigs and get them ready for June. For heavens sake Jerry PLAY THE BIGS!!! It's not just making the playoffs as a 8 seed. YOU HAVE TO BE ABLE TO DEFEND THE PAINT TO WIN PLAYOFF GAMES. GET THE BIGS READY!!!ALREADY!!!
If you want to win games, you must defend the paint. Chucks smart enough to know it. Why Jerry can't see it is beyond me. It's turning into a big joke. Play the bigs and get them ready for June. For heavens sake Jerry PLAY THE BIGS!!! It's not just making the playoffs as a 8 seed. YOU HAVE TO BE ABLE TO DEFEND THE PAINT TO WIN PLAYOFF GAMES. GET THE BIGS READY!!!ALREADY!!!
Sloan | 9:31 a.m. Nov. 16, 2009
Either go big or stay home.(Illinois)
Appreciate it folks | 9:34 a.m. Nov. 16, 2009
Too many armchair coaches and QB's in this town.
Some of you may have heard of LeBron James. He told our rookies that their coach was great. Quite frankly I think Lebron doesn't lnow what he is talking about and I will continue to believe all the intelligent people who say get rid of Sloan.
Those same people say "play Kofous", after one college season putting him into an NBA game where he admittedly doesn't know the plays is like putting a toddler on the freeway. We can hope he scores as we would hope the toddler can make it to the edge of the roadway safely.
Fes and Koufous will get the time to play but not before they are ready. Til then enjoy one of the top 5 pf's in the league and one of the top 5 pg's in the league and the inspiring play of 2 rookies and stop acting like Laker fans.
Geniuses | 9:40 a.m. Nov. 16, 2009
Well who's the genius that keeps Fes and Koufos buried on the bench while
teams make dunks and layups on us down in the paint?
The problem with the Jazz | 9:43 a.m. Nov. 16, 2009
is that they are loyal to their players. They pay players for what they have
done, not what they are going to do.
Okur just got a contract extension and a pay raise but Okur has most likely peaked. He was an $11 million dollar player getting payed $9 million. Next year he will be a $8million player getting payed $11million. (Lets not get started on AK)
Atleast Matt Harpring's contract stayed at $6million without any increases (O'Connor couldn't have known Harpring would get hurt so much)
-----
The Jazz are also paying Korver $6million a year to hit three pointer and shots off the screen. You can find guys in the NBA that will do this for $2-3 million (Matthews is doing it for $450,000) The Jazz didn't design Korver contract though...
Okur just got a contract extension and a pay raise but Okur has most likely peaked. He was an $11 million dollar player getting payed $9 million. Next year he will be a $8million player getting payed $11million. (Lets not get started on AK)
Atleast Matt Harpring's contract stayed at $6million without any increases (O'Connor couldn't have known Harpring would get hurt so much)
-----
The Jazz are also paying Korver $6million a year to hit three pointer and shots off the screen. You can find guys in the NBA that will do this for $2-3 million (Matthews is doing it for $450,000) The Jazz didn't design Korver contract though...
Houdini | 10:10 a.m. Nov. 16, 2009
Wow,lot`s of "wizards" here today,I wish Jerry Sloan could lace up the
sneaks and show you how it`s done,that`s right, the old guy you want to get rid
of,I`m sure most of you never saw him play,too bad,but all he wants is 100%
effort every game...
Bryon | 10:24 a.m. Nov. 16, 2009
Does any one know what the coaching staff is doing to get Fes and Koufos ready
for playing time besides dogging them and glueing their butts to the pine. L.A.
brought in Kareem to work with Bynum. He looks pretty good now. L.A.develops for
a championship. Utah develops for a 8th seed and done.
IDjazz12 | 11:00 a.m. Nov. 16, 2009
RE:IDjazz12
It is one thing to try something for a one year or a year and half. It is plain stupidity to do it for five years and expect a different result.
Excuses such as a young player(KK) only played one year of college ball needs to do such and such and etc and etc and blah blah blah. Falls on deaf ears when just last year when Boozer and Memo were out he came in and played solid all the way around. He blocked shots, he rebounded, and he scored and ran the floor hard. Now all the sudden the kid does not get it. Sorry I don't think Sloan gets it and don't think he is in the boat alone. O'Connor is help rowing that boat.
It is one thing to try something for a one year or a year and half. It is plain stupidity to do it for five years and expect a different result.
Excuses such as a young player(KK) only played one year of college ball needs to do such and such and etc and etc and blah blah blah. Falls on deaf ears when just last year when Boozer and Memo were out he came in and played solid all the way around. He blocked shots, he rebounded, and he scored and ran the floor hard. Now all the sudden the kid does not get it. Sorry I don't think Sloan gets it and don't think he is in the boat alone. O'Connor is help rowing that boat.
FDR | 11:27 a.m. Nov. 16, 2009
Yea Jazz, you are allowing KK to sit on the pine, only then when he is traded or
opts in a few years to go back east and be the player he already is, but with a
team back east, and will be doing close to all-star numbers, then we will be
saying the same thing we did about others who went through our system. The Jazz
are grooming KK to be a great big man for another team. Way to go Jazz. In the
meantime, the Jazz get totally outmanned inside, size wise, length, defense
wise. So Jazz fans, don't get disgusted, we are not going to use our 7
footers. Sloan never liked 7 footers anyway. He truly never like Eaton either.
If we are honest we will see this. KK will be an all-star someday, watch.
todd from santa ana | 11:49 a.m. Nov. 16, 2009
I have attempted so help me to get away from this "sloanaholic stuff and
bashing-scouts honor"
However, Jerry is not a genius. If he knows the right things to do defensively, he has to be the one who gets the message across because you cannot get rid of 12 players. a good sound philosophy is not to let people play that at least can help control the paint. Kous i doubt at this point can help but Fez could but needs opportunities. A good philosophy is not to guard the lines and get over later and let shootersshoot wide open 3s all night. 9 "3s" allowed is a joke like Saturday. We get outscored every game from 3s and that is usually the difference in the point margins of losses.
However, Jerry is not a genius. If he knows the right things to do defensively, he has to be the one who gets the message across because you cannot get rid of 12 players. a good sound philosophy is not to let people play that at least can help control the paint. Kous i doubt at this point can help but Fez could but needs opportunities. A good philosophy is not to guard the lines and get over later and let shootersshoot wide open 3s all night. 9 "3s" allowed is a joke like Saturday. We get outscored every game from 3s and that is usually the difference in the point margins of losses.
Anonymous | 11:52 a.m. Nov. 16, 2009
Sloan's system is good but not enough to win championship. It's been
proved "20+" years. No game time managment. I will say robot coach
very good one.
todd on sloan playingdays | 11:53 a.m. Nov. 16, 2009
Houdini, i like you your cool and loyal, I did watch Jerry play and admired him
He was a beast, but then there was no 3 point line, you could hand check and get in peoples face-when they took away the handcheck that was dumb by the NBA. Still he had players that patrolled the paint even Dennis Awtrey knew how and he stunk if you remember. ALso CLifford Ray and Boelwinkle they had value and played. Tom was 7 feet and would patrol the paint/..
He was a beast, but then there was no 3 point line, you could hand check and get in peoples face-when they took away the handcheck that was dumb by the NBA. Still he had players that patrolled the paint even Dennis Awtrey knew how and he stunk if you remember. ALso CLifford Ray and Boelwinkle they had value and played. Tom was 7 feet and would patrol the paint/..
David Blackwell III | 12:34 p.m. Nov. 16, 2009
My family have been involved in basketball for a number of years. Dad use to to
work with Hot Rod! It is very hard to understand why a coach would not want to
accelerate the development of two big defensive players like K. Fess and Kosta
K. Other teams would die to have big men like these two. Not only do the Jazz
have one, but 2 big promising centers. I hope that Jerry has a plan in mind
that is being implemented to develop these men before their contracts expire.
Who is this..................... | 12:40 p.m. Nov. 16, 2009
...........Chuck Nunn? Why have we not heard more posts from this man????
I too agree, let the big fellows out of their cage and allow them to patrol down into the painted area!
They should be knocking men onto the floor if they try to penetrate into the painted box!
I too agree, let the big fellows out of their cage and allow them to patrol down into the painted area!
They should be knocking men onto the floor if they try to penetrate into the painted box!
You are outnumbered... | 1:19 p.m. Nov. 16, 2009
Sloan defenders..badely. The big guys could help us in a lot of situations we
presently can not control..let the Big Dogs in the fight. We will soon see the
results...not just guess at it. Loyalty to a failing system has brought many a
business down quickly.
todd to blackwell | 1:28 p.m. Nov. 16, 2009
You did not respond to my request your last post couple weeks ago, many of us
remember your dad. He was a legend and a genius in this region. Ilistened him
on talk shows and halftime like Klauke would do later for years. Your dad was
brilliant, similiarities to a man i love and respect Brad Rock. Your dad had a
great sense of humor, I would think though you would have insight and clout to
the point you can deal directly to who it counts-the Jazz organization.
todd on the "holics" | 1:34 p.m. Nov. 16, 2009
It is definitely in the "minority" You can be a
"sloanaholic" but I want to see takes as to reasons you are that make
sense. I personally think it is time for a change. The league has changed and
we need to change with it
Houdini | 2:25 p.m. Nov. 16, 2009
You`re right,the game has changed,but not for everyone,the
Artest`s,Bowen`s,Kobe`s get a different game called on them by the refs,they
have a reputation as tough defenders and the refs let em play,I saw D-Wade block
Kobe at the rim,Kobe slapped him on the tail,(no foul called),respecting his
defensive effort,Sloan played then and could easily play now
Houdini | 2:28 p.m. Nov. 16, 2009
oh,and you`re right about Sloan having help,but then lot`s of guys played tough
defense then,kind of a lost art now
risky | 3:11 p.m. Nov. 16, 2009
I don't know too much but his name was Boerwinkle not bullwinkle.
This Is Sad | 4:11 p.m. Nov. 16, 2009
By the two rooks playing well the past few games, will not impact Sloan one bit.
He just flat out does not believe rookies can play in this league. He is old,
old, old school, and as a matter of fact he is old, and so are his philosophies.
Play the big boys like you had to play the two rooks for a few games Jerry and
maybe the light will come on with you regarding both of them also. At least try
them against the right matchups huh? Get over yourself and try just like you
complain that your other vets don't try at times. What goes on in your head
man?
todd to risky | 4:43 p.m. Nov. 16, 2009
thats funny yeah your right but then the Moose could with Rocky patrol the paint
also, anyway 8 of 9 at home win 7 and we can get back in the hunt, I would like
to see of Miles and Korver can at least our offensive game, if we could put up
108-110 a game consistently we would be in much better shbape
dave | 7:27 p.m. Nov. 16, 2009
I thought Fez did admirable when Sloan was forced to play him due to Okur
injury.
TC | 8:01 a.m. Nov. 17, 2009
Well, when you got loafers like Okur and Boozer, loafing even more because they
are tired, what's the problem with giving Fes and Koufos some minutes to
spell them, especially when the matchups are bad for us, that is when the other
team is a lot bigger up front?
I don't get it, Jerry. You have to balance winning and developing your young guys. You need to give them minutes. From what little I've seen of them I don't see them hurting us, either.
I don't get it, Jerry. You have to balance winning and developing your young guys. You need to give them minutes. From what little I've seen of them I don't see them hurting us, either.
TC | 9:22 a.m. Nov. 17, 2009
This is Sad is right on the money.
You have two bigs like Okur and Boozer who barely play defense so easy that school kids could make layups, and you have two young 7-footers with tons of energy and you don't even give them minutes when it's obvious the loafers are tired and loafing even more than normal. I don't get it, Jerry. Don't you believe that young guys need minutes to develop? You've let CJ play when his playing was warranted less than Fess or Koufos.
You have two bigs like Okur and Boozer who barely play defense so easy that school kids could make layups, and you have two young 7-footers with tons of energy and you don't even give them minutes when it's obvious the loafers are tired and loafing even more than normal. I don't get it, Jerry. Don't you believe that young guys need minutes to develop? You've let CJ play when his playing was warranted less than Fess or Koufos.
Anonymous | 3:38 p.m. Nov. 17, 2009
Its cause koufos and fes cant score. Im all for putting them in but their
offense is just pathetic.
Dick | 12:59 p.m. Nov. 18, 2009
Theres more to basketball then offense. Everyone here knows how awful Boozer and
Okur are on defense. Whats the point of scoring when the other team gets it
right back on the other end. Its just counterproductive.
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