Deseret News | We protected democracy in Utah

Reader comments
Pignanelli & Webb: We protected democracy in Utah — you're welcome

Anonymous | 6:38 a.m. Nov. 15, 2009

Unions represent the people and should therefore not face contribution limits. Corporations represent greed and oppression and should therefore not be allowed to contribute at all.

Hah | 9:32 a.m. Nov. 15, 2009

You make me laugh Anonymous 6:38am. As if unions aren't corrupt and bent on making money like any corporation. Funny.

Incumbent protection commission | 9:41 a.m. Nov. 15, 2009

This commission is populated by political insiders whose voting record shows that they want to keep access to power all to themselves.

They've done nothing to strengthen democracy, but weaken the ability of the people -- the "demos" -- to share power.

Campaign contribution limits benefit incumbents and the independently wealthy, and disadvantage challengers.

For proposals supporting more competitive and representative elections, that have higher voter turnout where they been implemented, visit FairVote: The Center for Voting and Democracy online.

Comments continue below

Chuck | 10:48 a.m. Nov. 15, 2009

I don't know why we keep trying to "protect" or promote what Jefferson and Madison said was the WORST form of government, i.e., a democracy. We are NOT a democracy, because the founding fathers knew how dangerous a democracy is and how tyrannical they are. We are a republic! Madison said that democracies are as short in their lives as they are violent in their deaths.

Why do we not educate the youth and the public in this fact? Why do we keep trying to change into something that is both short-lived and violent?

Democracy? | 11:27 a.m. Nov. 15, 2009

Greetings:

According to the Constitution of the United States, each of the states is guaranteed a republican form of government.

"Republic" and "Democracy" are not synonymous.

You will not find the word, "democracy", ever mentioned in the Declaration of Independence, the Constitution of the United States, or the Bill of Rights.

Anyone who thinks a republic and a democracy are the same form of government is poorly educated.

Thank you.

John Robert Mallernee
Armed Forces Retirement Home
Washington, D.C. 20011-8400

Huntsman Jr. | 1:19 p.m. Nov. 15, 2009

Isn't this the same guy that has bought in on the hoax of global warming, who's intent it is to submitt the will of the people to the will of the government. Thus, taking freedom and income away from the slaves that work only to support the govt.

Davis | 1:27 p.m. Nov. 15, 2009

Both Utah and the US are not Democracies, you fools.

Demos | 1:55 p.m. Nov. 15, 2009

Democracy is often when 51 % percent of the population votes itself the wealth of the other 49%.

Democracy is often when 10% of the population appoint the mayor, representative, senator, decide on the outcome of propositions etc because of low voter turnout.

Democracy is often where people who are suckers for a smile, a suit and a handshake sell us all down the river.

Perhaps if new taxes required a two-thirds majority to pass, were sunsetted after three years, and taxes on necessities were outlawed we might have a decent democracy.

@ Demos | 2:17 p.m. Nov. 15, 2009

"Perhaps if new taxes required a two-thirds majority to pass, were sunsetted after three years, and taxes on necessities were outlawed we might have a decent democracy."

Yeah, um - how's that working for California?

Democratic Republic | 2:19 p.m. Nov. 15, 2009

The Commission has produced some important recommendations that, if enacted, would greatly improve the way our leaders are elected and government is operated. The legislature deserves whatever it gets if it misses this opportunity to pass these excellent recommendations.

Thanks but no thanks | 3:15 p.m. Nov. 15, 2009

Webb and Piganelli just represent the stranglehold that the two parties have on the system. If they cared about listening to the people's will, they would let third parties have a chance and get rid of some of the ridiculous laws that protect their two parties and incumbents. Count me as one who has not fallen for their lies. Oh, and by the way, we live in a REPUBLIC, not a democracy. Can't say I really expected two partisan hacks to understand that, though.

@Thanks 3:15pm | 5:18 p.m. Nov. 15, 2009

Who says that third parties don't have a chance. Seems to me that every two years there are mulitple parties represented on the ballot. Yet, those candidates continue to get throttled. So, is it the "system" that denies third-party candidates a shot at elected office, or is it the "voters?"

Ed Meyer | 7:47 a.m. Nov. 16, 2009

I hear this rhetoric about the line between being a republic or a democracy all the time. Let's get past these arguments regarding words and focus on issues. I personally choose to respect the efforts of those who worked so hard on this commission and encourage the legislature to take their recommendations seriously. After all, the Commission spent hour after hour debating this issue while I am simply responding in an admittedly "shoot from the hip" manner. In general I think we overreact to things like campaign contributions because we have become so critical of our elected officials. I choose to believe that contributions may buy time with an elected official, but don't typically buy their vote. As usual, there is too much focus on issues like this and too little on the more important issues our leaders need to face.

@@Thanks 3:15pm | 8:35 a.m. Nov. 16, 2009

>So, is it the "system" that denies third-party candidates a shot at elected office, or is it the "voters?"

Study Duverger's Law. The single-member plurality system encourages voters, over several election cycles, to choose between the lesser of two evils -- the two major incumbent parties -- instead of giving electoral support to third parties.

Most of the world's democracies have eliminated this bias against challengers by adopting proportional representation elections.

Question | 11:57 a.m. Nov. 16, 2009

Would this article be considered patting YOURSELF on the back?

I hope you don't break your arm trying to reach back there.

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