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Baptism — born of water and the spirit
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David Wakefield | 6:42 p.m. Nov. 13, 2009
What was also left out was that we also believe that baptism by immersion and by
one holding proper authority is a covenant that we make to keep the commandments
of God, and to follow the Lord Jesus Christ. It also left out that we too,
believe it has significant symbolic teachings as well such as the symbolism of
death and resurrection, and being reborn spiritually.
We believe baptism is so essential that we also perform vicarious baptisms for our dead ancestors in the temples around the world. This was revealed and restored back to the earth in these last days by the Prophet Joseph Smith Jr.
This was a great article, but more depth or more consideration could have been made to really teach others what is believed by the various Christian faiths. I am sure that others beliefs were vaguely or not really fully explained.
We believe baptism is so essential that we also perform vicarious baptisms for our dead ancestors in the temples around the world. This was revealed and restored back to the earth in these last days by the Prophet Joseph Smith Jr.
This was a great article, but more depth or more consideration could have been made to really teach others what is believed by the various Christian faiths. I am sure that others beliefs were vaguely or not really fully explained.
Rituals are manmade | 6:57 p.m. Nov. 13, 2009
Certainly religious leaders want "authority" and control over their
religious ceremonies. It is a form of vainglory for the leaders to pronounce
over their followers.
But I doubt that God cares whether we have been through any kind of ceremony or not. Ceremonies are of man.
But I doubt that God cares whether we have been through any kind of ceremony or not. Ceremonies are of man.
Comments continue below
RE: anonymous | 6:59 p.m. Nov. 13, 2009
Where does one get the Authority? "Yet to all who received him, to those
who beleived in his name,he gave the right(exousia or authority) to become
children of God" (John 1:12 NIV)
In Greek Holy Ghost(pneuma)and Holy Spirit pnuema) have the same meaning. Joseph Smith relied on the KJV.
In Greek Holy Ghost(pneuma)and Holy Spirit pnuema) have the same meaning. Joseph Smith relied on the KJV.
RE: David Wakefield | 7:35 p.m. Nov. 13, 2009
"Vicarious baptism for the dead" In the great resurrection chapter
Paul in (1Cor 15:29)Paul questions this practice,He does not join in.
Eventually the ritual of baptizing a living person for a dead person was condemned by the Council of Hippo in 393 A.D. The sects which practiced this work for the dead,gradually died out.
Eventually the ritual of baptizing a living person for a dead person was condemned by the Council of Hippo in 393 A.D. The sects which practiced this work for the dead,gradually died out.
anonymous | 7:50 p.m. Nov. 13, 2009
This is not an article to debate, prove or argue "where" authority
comes from. It is simply an article to present how different faiths practice
and understand baptism...
Paul the Apostle | 8:11 p.m. Nov. 13, 2009
1 Cor 15:29
Else what shall they do which are abaptized baptized for the dead, if the dead rise not at all? why are they then baptized for the dead?
Paul's Rhetorical question authenticated the need to baptism for the dead . Paul knew that the dead will rise, i.e. Jesus.
Else what shall they do which are abaptized baptized for the dead, if the dead rise not at all? why are they then baptized for the dead?
Paul's Rhetorical question authenticated the need to baptism for the dead . Paul knew that the dead will rise, i.e. Jesus.
@rituals | 8:51 p.m. Nov. 13, 2009
Rituals are man made? Yes, some of them. This particular ritual of baptism is
God made. Christ himself ordained that one needed baptism to enter into the
kingdom of heaven. He even was baptized by imersion by one having the authority
to show us the proper manner and that even he needed baptism.
Your beef is not with man, its with God. Ask God if he's there and he will answer your sincere petition.
Your beef is not with man, its with God. Ask God if he's there and he will answer your sincere petition.
Divine Revelation... | 11:44 p.m. Nov. 13, 2009
As I read this article, it became clear to me the need for divine revelation. I
can't help but think, from reading the Bible that baptism is an absolute
commandment, that He would not leave us so in the dark concerning how it's
to be performed. As well from reading the Bible, all the prophets had direction
from God on how to proceed with His gospel on earth, according to the gospel of
Jesus Christ.
This is not an item to be debated. Rather it is very clear from the example of Jesus Christ that all should be immersed! Also one with the proper authority needs to be the one doing the baptising as demonstrated by Christ seeking out John the Baptist.
Is there a church that proclaims modern day revelation? Are we to rely on man's interpretation of scripture? It even states in the Bible that, "God reveals his secrets to his servants, the prophets". Baptism is truly a saving ordinance that must be done under the strict command from God and this direction needs to be given to someone with the authority from God. There is no other way...
This is not an item to be debated. Rather it is very clear from the example of Jesus Christ that all should be immersed! Also one with the proper authority needs to be the one doing the baptising as demonstrated by Christ seeking out John the Baptist.
Is there a church that proclaims modern day revelation? Are we to rely on man's interpretation of scripture? It even states in the Bible that, "God reveals his secrets to his servants, the prophets". Baptism is truly a saving ordinance that must be done under the strict command from God and this direction needs to be given to someone with the authority from God. There is no other way...
Sam | 12:57 a.m. Nov. 14, 2009
It seems to me that many people believe their traditions over the Scriptures.
Objectively reading the Scriptures with lead us to seeking spiritual growth
through revelation and through the Holy Ghost. This will lead us to God's
will.
God knew the confusion that would persist in these the last days and provided additional witnesses of Christ and His Gospel. The Book of Mormon contains the fullness of the Gospel and supports the truths that are contained in the Bible. If any one will read the Book of Mormon and ponder in their hearts it's message, comparing it's truths with the truths in the Bible, and then sincerely ask God to know of it's truthfullness, with real intent, they will recieve a knowledge by the power of the Holy Ghost. Real and undeniable!
God knew the confusion that would persist in these the last days and provided additional witnesses of Christ and His Gospel. The Book of Mormon contains the fullness of the Gospel and supports the truths that are contained in the Bible. If any one will read the Book of Mormon and ponder in their hearts it's message, comparing it's truths with the truths in the Bible, and then sincerely ask God to know of it's truthfullness, with real intent, they will recieve a knowledge by the power of the Holy Ghost. Real and undeniable!
Subtleties | 1:43 a.m. Nov. 14, 2009
Baptism is a mere ritual, symbolizing the real phenomenon of individual
spiritual enlightenment. The real phenomenon is the goal. Water baptism is
teaching for those newly entered on the path.
Remember that the Bible has meanings on more than one level. The literal view is only the start.
Remember that the Bible has meanings on more than one level. The literal view is only the start.
Historical Error | 5:16 a.m. Nov. 14, 2009
English Baptist didn't split off because they believed in Baptism by
Immersion. They didn't accept baptism done in other churches or child
baptism.
They believed in Believer's Baptism. In order to join their group, one had to believe in their teachings and was then baptized. In fact, originally they baptized by pouring.
It wasn't until their self exile to Holland that they started baptizing by immersion after learning how the Anabaptist did baptisms.
Ben Abrams
They believed in Believer's Baptism. In order to join their group, one had to believe in their teachings and was then baptized. In fact, originally they baptized by pouring.
It wasn't until their self exile to Holland that they started baptizing by immersion after learning how the Anabaptist did baptisms.
Ben Abrams
Randall | 5:44 a.m. Nov. 14, 2009
I like baptism, especially in the Mormon tradition of immersion. I also
appreciate the fact that in families it is frequently performed by a father or
other important family member. It is one of the ties that bind.
However, other than Jesus' own baptism, there is scant proof that Jesus intended it to be a universal commandment. Like this article, we Mormons quote John 3:5 as proof, but this passage is not about baptism. It is about spiritual conversion.
In this section Jesus says that a person needs to be born of the water and the spirit. Nicodemus clarifies this statement by asking if a man could enter the womb and be re-born (i.e. being born of water). Jesus further clarifies "that which is born of flesh (water) is flesh, that which born of spirit (conversion) is spirit.
Yes, baptism is a beautiful symbol of conversion, but this passage does not refer to it, nor does it make the case that it is a commandment.
However, other than Jesus' own baptism, there is scant proof that Jesus intended it to be a universal commandment. Like this article, we Mormons quote John 3:5 as proof, but this passage is not about baptism. It is about spiritual conversion.
In this section Jesus says that a person needs to be born of the water and the spirit. Nicodemus clarifies this statement by asking if a man could enter the womb and be re-born (i.e. being born of water). Jesus further clarifies "that which is born of flesh (water) is flesh, that which born of spirit (conversion) is spirit.
Yes, baptism is a beautiful symbol of conversion, but this passage does not refer to it, nor does it make the case that it is a commandment.
Eduard A. Erdtsieck | 6:53 a.m. Nov. 14, 2009
Baptism is not a public relations effort by men or women who feel a need to meet God's laws. Joseph Smith taught that there is a veil between us and God, our Father. This reality points ALL men to Jesus of Nazareth, who as the Only Begotten in the flesh, himself submitted to that requirement.
The interpretation, that by baptizing we are put under water and come out of it, meaning symbolically our death and ressurection is false. Not that it is wrong, because we are free to accept whatever interpretation we want to believe in.
Baptism means that I am becoming part of the heavenly family our prophets and Jesus of Nazareth taught. Joseph Smith was a temple builder. Temple are places where we are sealed as one family, glorifying the name of the Son of God, because we must make that pure offering to the Lord Jesus.
Temples by design are predictive, revealing our common future. Ancient temples were butcher shops, not by the will of the Father, but to instruct us about the nature of the natural man. Modern temples are family gathering places for the children of God, our Father in heaven. Dead or alive.
Indiana | 7:49 a.m. Nov. 14, 2009
RE: RE: @ 7:35
The Counsel of Hippo was a group of men that interrupted something sacred (many things in truth). One more reason God performed the truly beautiful and needed gift of the restoration; to bring back so many things that man in his ignorance removed.
The Counsel of Hippo was a group of men that interrupted something sacred (many things in truth). One more reason God performed the truly beautiful and needed gift of the restoration; to bring back so many things that man in his ignorance removed.
RE anonymous 6:27 | 7:58 a.m. Nov. 14, 2009
The exact quote referred to in the first comment does not mention authority:
“You might as well baptize a bag of sand as a man, if not done in view of the remission of sins and getting of the Holy Ghost. Baptism by water is but half a baptism, and is good for nothing without the other half-that is, the baptism of the Holy Ghost” (History of the Church, 5:499)
I was just reading this morning what
David Bercot, a scholar of the teachings of early Christianity writes: Baptism carried the utmost significance to early Christians. They associated three very important things with water baptism:
1. Remmissin of Sins...
2. The new birth...
3. Spiritual illumination The early Christians believed that the newly baptized person, after receiving the holy spirit, had a clearer vision of spiritual matters, receiving illumination as a child of God and citizen of His kingdom (Will the Real Heretics Please stand up pp 78-79)
“You might as well baptize a bag of sand as a man, if not done in view of the remission of sins and getting of the Holy Ghost. Baptism by water is but half a baptism, and is good for nothing without the other half-that is, the baptism of the Holy Ghost” (History of the Church, 5:499)
I was just reading this morning what
David Bercot, a scholar of the teachings of early Christianity writes: Baptism carried the utmost significance to early Christians. They associated three very important things with water baptism:
1. Remmissin of Sins...
2. The new birth...
3. Spiritual illumination The early Christians believed that the newly baptized person, after receiving the holy spirit, had a clearer vision of spiritual matters, receiving illumination as a child of God and citizen of His kingdom (Will the Real Heretics Please stand up pp 78-79)
Great Plains Saint | 8:57 a.m. Nov. 14, 2009
We use Jn 3:5 different than most Christians. They teach that a man is born of
water at birth and needs to receive the new birth of the spirit later in life.
They do not believe this verse relates to baptism. Perhaps a better verse is
found in Matthew where the apostles are sent out baptizing all nations in the
name of the Father, Son and Holy Ghost. Yet, for me as a Latter-day Saint the
interpretation we use Jn 3:5 is acceptable as revealed through the teachings of
the prophets.
Darkbull | 9:35 a.m. Nov. 14, 2009
The wonderful part of each of these ordinances in the different faiths is that
they represent an individual's outward expression of their desire to be
devoted to God, and recognize the saving grace of Christ's atonement.
That, I believe, each of the aforementioned faiths can agree upon.
As a Mormon, I am grateful for the symbolism of my baptism, and I recognize that the symbolism of baptism of others might be somewhat different, but the feeling of devotion that results is the same.
As a Mormon, I am grateful for the symbolism of my baptism, and I recognize that the symbolism of baptism of others might be somewhat different, but the feeling of devotion that results is the same.
True Gospel | 9:40 a.m. Nov. 14, 2009
"For Christ did not send me to baptize but to preach the gospel, and not
with words of eloquent wisdom, lest the cross of Christ be emptied of its
power." (1 Cor 1:17)
Baptism should never be said to be a part of the Gospel--that which saves us (1 Cor 15:2). There is a clear distinction here. Furthermore, any discussion of 1 Cor 15:29 (baptism on account of the dead) must be done in light of this verse (notice that all three verses occur in the same letter). If Paul didn't think baptism for living people saved them, it is unclear why he would argue that baptism could save dead people.
One of the chief problems with LDS theology is its lack of biblical theology (i.e., reading verses in the context of the rest of the book and Bible). Joseph Smith is notorious for making up doctrines because of reading out of context.
Baptism should never be said to be a part of the Gospel--that which saves us (1 Cor 15:2). There is a clear distinction here. Furthermore, any discussion of 1 Cor 15:29 (baptism on account of the dead) must be done in light of this verse (notice that all three verses occur in the same letter). If Paul didn't think baptism for living people saved them, it is unclear why he would argue that baptism could save dead people.
One of the chief problems with LDS theology is its lack of biblical theology (i.e., reading verses in the context of the rest of the book and Bible). Joseph Smith is notorious for making up doctrines because of reading out of context.
RE: Randall | 10:21 a.m. Nov. 14, 2009
Try Matthew 28:19
It's interesting to me how so many people will make such stark statements similar to how you have done, and seem that they've never read their scriptures.
It's interesting to me how so many people will make such stark statements similar to how you have done, and seem that they've never read their scriptures.
RE: Baptism Authority | 10:50 a.m. Nov. 14, 2009
IN (Luke 3:22 NIV)"And the Holy Spirit descended on him[Jesus]in BODILY
form like a dove,And a voice came from heaven: "You are my Son ,whom I
love; with you I am well pleased." Here is a picture of the three persons
of the trinity,Like Joseph Smith taught,"Which Father,Son, and Holy Ghost
are one God,infinite and eternal,without end Amen."(D&C
20:28)or"...baptizing them in (eis,into)'the name' of the
Father,and of Son and of the Holy Spirit."(Mt 28:19 NIV) the name(to
onoma)not names of, good Greek Grammar.
anonymous | 11:58 a.m. Nov. 14, 2009
Thanks for posting the specific quote I was referring to. It has been years
since I actually read it. However, "authority" (keys) was certainly
the point!
Baptism is an earthly ordinance, and *anyone* can perform a baptism to initiate a member into their congregation here upon the earth. But, the authority to bestow the gift of the Holy Ghost is absolutely necessary to make this ordinance legal on the other side of the veil. I stand by my first comment and its intended interpretation.
It is ultimately following the Holy Ghost, that brings a person back into the presence of God the Father.
Baptism is an earthly ordinance, and *anyone* can perform a baptism to initiate a member into their congregation here upon the earth. But, the authority to bestow the gift of the Holy Ghost is absolutely necessary to make this ordinance legal on the other side of the veil. I stand by my first comment and its intended interpretation.
It is ultimately following the Holy Ghost, that brings a person back into the presence of God the Father.
Necessity for baptism | 12:31 p.m. Nov. 14, 2009
Don't take Joseph Smith's word for it. Read the bible.
"When therefore the Lord knew how the Pharisees had heard that Jesus made and baptized more disciples than John, (Though Jesus himself abaptized not, but his disciples,)..." (John 4:1-2).
So Jesus had his disciples out baptizing? Must be something important about that.
"And Ananias went his way, and entered into the house; and putting his hands on him said, Brother Saul, the Lord, even Jesus, that appeared unto thee in the way as thou camest, hath sent me, that thou mightest receive thy sight, and be filled with the Holy Ghost. And immediately there fell from his eyes as it had been scales: and he received sight forthwith, and arose, and was baptized." (Acts 9:17-18)
So Paul has an open vision of the Lord, receivies the Holy Ghost, and is still baptized? Hmmmm, must be important then.
"When therefore the Lord knew how the Pharisees had heard that Jesus made and baptized more disciples than John, (Though Jesus himself abaptized not, but his disciples,)..." (John 4:1-2).
So Jesus had his disciples out baptizing? Must be something important about that.
"And Ananias went his way, and entered into the house; and putting his hands on him said, Brother Saul, the Lord, even Jesus, that appeared unto thee in the way as thou camest, hath sent me, that thou mightest receive thy sight, and be filled with the Holy Ghost. And immediately there fell from his eyes as it had been scales: and he received sight forthwith, and arose, and was baptized." (Acts 9:17-18)
So Paul has an open vision of the Lord, receivies the Holy Ghost, and is still baptized? Hmmmm, must be important then.
True Gospel | 1:51 p.m. Nov. 14, 2009
I would also like to point out that my original argument based off of 1 Cor
1:17; 15:2 was never addressed directly.
Furthermore, John 3:5 is almost certainly not referring to baptism. First, you will find baptism mentioned nowhere in the context (the burden of proof is on the Mormon to show why "born of the water" means "baptism." However, second, the Old Testament IS referred to in the context: "these things" (John 3:10). Jesus is likely speaking of Ezekiel 36:25-27, in which God tells of how He will make His people clean: 1) by sprinkling them with water, and 2) by putting His Spirit within their hearts. Jesus was softly chiding Nicodemus for not remembering this passage from the Old Testament. Nicodemus likely had the Old Testament memorized, yet as THE (the Greek monadic or par excellence article) teacher of Israel (John 3:10), he still could not understand it. Thus, the water in John 3:5 is simply symbolic for God's action of saving washing. Note also that God sprinkles; He does not immerse, another reason for not viewing this as baptism.
Furthermore, John 3:5 is almost certainly not referring to baptism. First, you will find baptism mentioned nowhere in the context (the burden of proof is on the Mormon to show why "born of the water" means "baptism." However, second, the Old Testament IS referred to in the context: "these things" (John 3:10). Jesus is likely speaking of Ezekiel 36:25-27, in which God tells of how He will make His people clean: 1) by sprinkling them with water, and 2) by putting His Spirit within their hearts. Jesus was softly chiding Nicodemus for not remembering this passage from the Old Testament. Nicodemus likely had the Old Testament memorized, yet as THE (the Greek monadic or par excellence article) teacher of Israel (John 3:10), he still could not understand it. Thus, the water in John 3:5 is simply symbolic for God's action of saving washing. Note also that God sprinkles; He does not immerse, another reason for not viewing this as baptism.
RE ; Anonymous 11:58 | 1:54 p.m. Nov. 14, 2009
If one receives Christ as their personal Savior,you have been given the
Authority (exousia) or right to be a son of God! Your faith in Jesus Christ
gives you this authority. See( Romans 8:14-17)
Mormons claim their authority comes from the priesthood,what they fail to realize is that they do not have any right to hold them. The priesthood ended with the death of Christ. The entire function,and term priest(Cohen)means "one who stands up for another,and mediates his cause." Before the great sacrifice,the priest had to stand in the gap for the people and offer animal sacrifices to atone for their sin. Do Mormons carry out this function today,NO! Therefore the office is insignificant.
'
Mormons claim their authority comes from the priesthood,what they fail to realize is that they do not have any right to hold them. The priesthood ended with the death of Christ. The entire function,and term priest(Cohen)means "one who stands up for another,and mediates his cause." Before the great sacrifice,the priest had to stand in the gap for the people and offer animal sacrifices to atone for their sin. Do Mormons carry out this function today,NO! Therefore the office is insignificant.
'
Leo | 2:41 p.m. Nov. 14, 2009
Who is this Joe Smith guy ??? I never seen his name in the Holy Bible...The
Bible is the only True Word and Testament
cb | 2:56 p.m. Nov. 14, 2009
Re Leo, you make a big assumption about the Bible. It never claims to be the
only word of God.
@true gospel | 3:02 p.m. Nov. 14, 2009
A lot of words with little substance. Why was the Lord himself babptised by
immersion? Why should we, as followers of Christ, be baptised in like manner?
Joseph Smith asked and recieved direct revelation regarding baptism and many
other important truths we read about in the bible. Continuing revelation is
key. Both by a prophet and personally. They are necessary for our
understanding of the plan of salvation and for Gods acceptance of our offering.
True Gospel | 3:07 p.m. Nov. 14, 2009
That's good stuff, responder to Anonymous 11:58. All of your arguments are
valid. The book of Hebrews makes it clear that the Aaronic priesthood no longer
exists (7:11-12). It has been replaced, just like the Mosaic Law has. Further,
the only man who qualifies for the Melchizedek priesthood is Jesus Christ
Himself (Hebrews 7:15-16, 23-25). No Mormon meets the qualifications for the
Melchizedek priesthood laid out in Hebrews 7. A Mormon might try to make an
argument off of the JST's in this chapter, but they should do so knowing
that none of the Joseph Smith Translations has a shred of manuscript evidence
backing it up.
Grandma | 3:30 p.m. Nov. 14, 2009
The word "baptism" comes from the Greek word, "baptizo"
which means "immersion." The Savior, who had no need of baptism, gave
us the proper example of how one should be baptized -- by immersion. He came to
fulfill all righteousness.
RE: Grandma | 4:30 p.m. Nov. 14, 2009
The word "baptism"(baptizo #507),To dip, primarily among the Greeks to
signify the dyeing of a garment,or drawing of water by dipping a vessel into
another. "...eight souls were saved by water. The like figure whereunto
even baptism does save us (not the putting away of filth of the flesh,but a good
conscience toward God)...(1 peter 3:20,21)
They were saved by faith(good conscience toward God)afterall no one got dunked,they were in the Ark.
Israel was figuratively baptised when made to pass through the Red Sea(1Cor 10:2) Christians tend to honor one anothers baptism for church membership because it is in the name of the Tri-une God. But few honor LDS Baptism,Mormons must be Re-Baptised, to join a Christian church.
They were saved by faith(good conscience toward God)afterall no one got dunked,they were in the Ark.
Israel was figuratively baptised when made to pass through the Red Sea(1Cor 10:2) Christians tend to honor one anothers baptism for church membership because it is in the name of the Tri-une God. But few honor LDS Baptism,Mormons must be Re-Baptised, to join a Christian church.
james2 | 9:59 p.m. Nov. 14, 2009
So Mormons are suddenly Protestants, Baptists and Christians????
Amazing...we've gone from 'we're not Christians' to
'we're Christians just lke you' in less then 30 yrs. WOW!!!
RE: True Gospel | 11:29 p.m. Nov. 14, 2009
"Further, the only man who qualifies for the Melchizedek priesthood is
Jesus Christ Himself (Hebrews 7:15-16, 23-25)."
If that was the case why was Christ made a high priest "for ever after the order of Melchisedec" (Hebrews 6:20)?
Thus, Jesus isn't the ONLY person who qualifies for that priesthood as we see Melchisedec obviously qualified for it too, otherwise it wouldn't be "after the order of Melchisedec".
PS - I find it funny that some try to use "science" to disprove the Book of Mormon, just like some non-Christians try to use "science" to disprove the Bible.
If that was the case why was Christ made a high priest "for ever after the order of Melchisedec" (Hebrews 6:20)?
Thus, Jesus isn't the ONLY person who qualifies for that priesthood as we see Melchisedec obviously qualified for it too, otherwise it wouldn't be "after the order of Melchisedec".
PS - I find it funny that some try to use "science" to disprove the Book of Mormon, just like some non-Christians try to use "science" to disprove the Bible.
True Gospel | 9:27 a.m. Nov. 15, 2009
@3:02pm, and necessity for baptism:
As a Baptist, I do not deny that there are important and legitimate reasons for being baptized. It seems hard for Mormons to understand me on this point. My group is named for baptism; we suffered intense persecution and martyrdom for baptism--I do not need to be chided about baptism!
What I am denying is that the New Testament teaches that baptism is salvific (and remember that baptists still died, even for a non-saving baptism). Faith is the only sacrament known in the New Testament (Eph 2:8-9). Those who depend on their good works for justification, sanctification (Gal 3:3), and glorification will never attain life.
@james2
well said
As a Baptist, I do not deny that there are important and legitimate reasons for being baptized. It seems hard for Mormons to understand me on this point. My group is named for baptism; we suffered intense persecution and martyrdom for baptism--I do not need to be chided about baptism!
What I am denying is that the New Testament teaches that baptism is salvific (and remember that baptists still died, even for a non-saving baptism). Faith is the only sacrament known in the New Testament (Eph 2:8-9). Those who depend on their good works for justification, sanctification (Gal 3:3), and glorification will never attain life.
@james2
well said
Storm | 12:09 p.m. Nov. 15, 2009
I was uncertain what to feel when the Unitarians were left out of the big
Baptism piece from Sat. We are baptised or christened when we are babys. As we
don't believe in the most common thought of Jesus we are often thouhgt not
to be religious but we are and we feel EVERYONE should celebrate their feelings
as they see fit. Too bad not everyone feels the same way.
Batism by immersion | 3:00 p.m. Nov. 15, 2009
You could have a fleet of bombers drop tons of water on Iraq and Iran,until they
were all immersed,but without faith in the Tri-une God it would not matter, You
are saved by grace(a gift)thru faith.
Saving faith is only as good as the object of that faith.
Saving faith is only as good as the object of that faith.
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I thought the Aggies were in the game until the end of the 2nd quarter. A...
Sorry to break the news to you, but Boise State really is not that good....
UH guard Hiram Thompson is LDS and an RM and the older brother of freshman...
as bland as wonder bread.
I agree totally with you. I've had some time in the strips and when i was at...
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As Joseph Smith taught, baptism without authority and the bestowal of the Holy Ghost, is as effective as baptizing a bag of sand. (paraphrasing major) Baptism is more than a ritual, it is a necessary saving ordinance that must be performed by one authorized by God. At least that is what Mormons believe:)