Deseret News | Vanishing languages a 'tragedy'

Reader comments
Vanishing languages a 'tragedy'

geedub | 10:01 p.m. Nov. 14, 2009

What's the big deal? With all the bad things going on in the world today how can the extinction of an obsolete language be termed a tragedy? It only a tragedy to handful of pHDs who have nothing else to worry about.

Waste of time | 10:29 p.m. Nov. 14, 2009

They teach some of these dead languages to kids in school -- what a waste of time. They should be studying English and working hard on their math skills. It's a complete waste of time to teach them Goshute or any other dead language. It doesn't help them to get jobs in the future and it doesn't help them retain their culture. These kids are Americans and it's a waste of precious school time to teach them this useless junk.

Anonymous | 12:32 a.m. Nov. 15, 2009

Take one linguistics class and you will understand this tragedy. Language circumscribes how we think. The loss of a language is the loss of ideas, of human capacity.

Comments continue below

My name is Alan Day. | 12:53 a.m. Nov. 15, 2009

Are you serious? Get out of your bubble; come out from under your rock. Language IS culture, and preserving diversity in language and culture is just as important to humanity as preserving various "obsolete" species is to the environment. You have no idea how much history as you know it has been pieced together with mainly linguistic evidence. This has nothing to do with your fear that somehow America is going to stop using English.

deedee | 1:05 a.m. Nov. 15, 2009

Geez, let's be stupid and celebrate it. I love Utah sometimes..

Anonymous | 4:14 a.m. Nov. 15, 2009

Perhaps part of the reason for the two negative comments is this article itself. I don't know whether the problem was caused by the reporter or by the interviewee (in which case, the reporter should have picked up on the problem).

The article states: "'Another example of the importance of languages around the world . . . [identifies grain] . . .'Without it, our chances of survival could be less,' he said. 'It could be important to humanity.'"

Unfortunately, there is a glaring lack of transitions. There is no explanation as to WHY loss of language means that society would lose the knowledge of this important grain. After all, if one language is lost, the people using that grain will obviouslyu be using another language.

I always tell my freshman compoposition students that it is up to the author to draw the connections. They should never assume that the reader know what they are thinking or mean.

Anonymous | 7:18 a.m. Nov. 15, 2009

Prediction: The only loanguages that MOST of the World will speak in the next 500 years:

1) Chinese
2) Spanish
3) English
4) French
5) Russian/Slavic

Survival of the fittest | 7:26 a.m. Nov. 15, 2009

The natural phenomenon, "survival of the fittest" found another casualty. Languages become extinct because of the constant changing world we live in, people want technology over preserving language. How is that a tragedy?

1 is best | 7:28 a.m. Nov. 15, 2009

The fewer languages, the better, so we can all communicate with each other.

RE: Waste of time | 8:15 a.m. Nov. 15, 2009

While I agree that teaching and learning the core subjects needs to be focused on in school, I also agree that losing these languages is also a bad thing. The knee jerk reaction to this story might be to say, "Who cares." But if we stop and think about it, these PhD's might have a point. With that said, I don't plan on handing over any of my time or money to support the PhD'd cause either.

utwingnut

Tragedy? | 8:40 a.m. Nov. 15, 2009

I am a retired Ph.D. professor of linguistics. Yes, to academics it is a tragedy. But I neither celebrate or lament the loss. There are far greater concerns for me and for this world.

Idaho Boy | 8:48 a.m. Nov. 15, 2009

We don't need no dang old langudges. We got english and thas good enuf.

Another catastrophe | 9:29 a.m. Nov. 15, 2009

Global warming, beaches disappearing, and now the loss of language? The real question is where will we put our tax dollars. Perhaps we could create a whole new "language preservation culture" with thousands of jobs. People could learn from the one Australian aborigone who speaks it and start a community of PHDs speaking a dead language. The tragedy is it may take some funds from our fight against global warming. How can anyone even think about other problems in the world when global warming will annihilate the entire human population in the next 100 years - then ALL languages will be extinct because no one will be left.

MetricWrench | 10:26 a.m. Nov. 15, 2009

Language is important and anyone who speaks more than one language knows how learning the second language teaches you to think differently about verbal communication. However, to say that loosing obscure languages of the indigenous people of various continents is some how tragic is a bit of a stretch. The article offered no reason why this is a bad thing.

Scottish Gaelic | 11:09 a.m. Nov. 15, 2009

Hallo:

Ciamar a tha sibh?

Several years ago, while serving my Church mission guarding a ranch in Utah, I learned that biologically (I was adopted), I had Scottish ancestry.

Having recently seen the movie, "BRAVEHEART", the knowledge that I belonged to an ancient Highland clan thrilled me beyond words.

In my attempts to learn a few words and phrases of the disappearing Gaidhlig tongue, I learned from an LDS high school teacher in Scotland that the students in her Gaelic class prefer to speak English, regarding speaking Gaelic as "not cool".

I have a copy of the Bible in Gaelic, but even the LDS Church does not have Gaelic speaking missionaries or publish a Gaelic edition of the Book of Mormon, considering it a waste of resources, since the few Scots who still speak Gaelic also speak English.

Gaelic spoken in Ireland and Scotland are two separate languages.

Tapadh leibh.

Slainte mhath!

Is Mise Le Meas,

John Robert Mallernee
Official Bard of Clan Henderson
Armed Forces Retirement Home
Washington, D.C. 20011-8400

Anonymous | 12:17 p.m. Nov. 15, 2009

Some peoples are able to sustain dual languages and some are not. Hebrew went from nearly dead language to one spoken regularly by millions in the course of a single century, whil most of its speakers still manage to speak a second language, frequently English.

Meanwhile, even Native Americans who speak English are struggling economically. Teaching them their historical tongue - one in which almost no literature exists and which no more than a few thousand speak - is doing them a disservice.

The purpose of language is to communicate. A language which allows you to communicate with hundreds of millions of people is superior to one which only allows you to communicate with a few thousand.

We should do our best to preserve records of these languages for posterity's sake, but it may not be realistic to expect people to actually speak them.

Matt Connelly | 12:32 p.m. Nov. 15, 2009

I'm not that concerned with languages being lost. In fact, I'd love it if everyone spoke the same language because it would dramatically simplify living in today's global community. However, I AM deeply concerned about losing knowledge that is not yet written and translated into a widely-used language, such as English. Here's a solution: for all those languages in danger of extinction, round up tons of university students worldwide and send them on study abroad programs to these communities with endangered languages (linguistic scholars at the world's universities would coordinate this project). Then have them ensure that all the critical language-specific knowledge is written down. Next, have scholars or lay persons who speak these languages translate the written content into English. Finally, digitize all that content and publish it on the Internet. Problem solved.

The skinny: | 12:37 p.m. Nov. 15, 2009

While it is somewhat sad to see an old language with its ties to a different time and a different culture slowly disappear, you have to keep grounded in reality and realize that most people's lives are dependent and forged on practicality instead of sentimentality, and the languages and "old ways" usually disappear because they have been replaced with a more convenient or advantageous method or idea. Why, even the English language continues to evolve; new words to convey things are introduced all of the time. If languages are mixing and melding that just oges to show that we are continuing to destroy old cultural barriers and divides and the world is continuing to become a smaller and smaller place. Is that good or bad? Depends on how we all end up treating each other. That is the real concern.

Anonymous | 1:53 p.m. Nov. 15, 2009

Prediction... I think you’re forgetting Arabic and Hebrew... don't underestimate the power of religion.

Artificial Languages | 2:00 p.m. Nov. 15, 2009

Greetings:

Another very interesting aspect to this question of obscure languages are the artificial languages created either as a practical global experiment, i.e., Esperanto, or as part of a fantasy, i.e., the languages invented by author J.R.R. Tolkien, actually indulged in by contemporary aficianados.

Due to the powerful influence of the United States of America (Hooray for US!!!), English has become so dominate that all airlines, regardless of nationality, are required to use it, as a safety factor.

Thanks to the British Empire, English remains the official language of India, as it is the only way to unify the numerous different ethnicities.

I'm fascinated by the similarities in various languages, along with symbols and ancient legends which are common to several countries, some of which are geographically far apart.

To me, it's indicative of the migration and interaction of all mankind, as civilizations evolved.

If our research can successfully trace it all back to its origins, we'll find - - - ?

Thank you.

John Robert Mallernee
Armed Forces Retirement Home
Washington, D.C. 20011-8400

bob marley | 3:45 p.m. Nov. 15, 2009

and so we see why , they be running in da future!

anonymous | 3:47 p.m. Nov. 15, 2009

Language is an important aspect of culture and I understand the sadness associated with its loss, however, language's primary purpose is to communicate. If only one person is fluent in a language, it is impossible to use it to communicate with others and it does not serve its purpose.

Let's be honest | 4:17 p.m. Nov. 15, 2009

Most of us aren't concerned as long as it's not our heritage language that's dying. Somebody made a comment about spending tax dollars to preserve native languages. The fact of the matter is that over the course of the nation's history, we've spent a lot of tax dollars on efforts to eradicate indigenous languages. White people with no respect for indigenous peoples and cultures deserve a large share of the blame for the decline of these languages. The grandchildren and great-grandchildren of those who supported efforts to take Indians away from their homes and cultures and beat them for speaking their languages are the ones now clamoring for these languages to keel over so everyone can speak OUR heritage language. How short-sighted and ethnocentric.

Imagine if Arabs took over the historic British Empire and used corporal punishment to force everyone to speak Arabic. You folks saying, "We should all speak one language for ease of communication" would be up in arms about the fate of the English language. Say what you mean: "I want everyone to speak MY language so that I can communicate with them on my terms."

Simply amazing... | 4:37 p.m. Nov. 15, 2009

I am not from Utah, nor do I intend on staying around more than a few more years. I must ask, is the ignorance displayed on these forums reflective of the overall intelligence of Utah's citizens? As I read some of these posts, I really wonder. There are comments on taxes for example. This has nothing to do with taxes. I didn't read them all, and am supposing that I missed at least one Obama comment. Anyway, language defines our existance, and the meaning of our world. There are entire concepts that will vanish when a language dies because nobody else has words for them. Parts of the world will vanish. With the tools that we have today, we should be archiving these languages with vigor. Nevertheless, it's up to cultures to teach these languages to their children. This isn't some United States government issue whereby we should require reservations (for example) to teach languages in schools. Nor, should we prohibit it. These are socio-cultural concerns, and not government concerns.

Quichua Warmi | 4:41 p.m. Nov. 15, 2009

I am a Bilingual (Spanish/English) North American who speaks Quichua/Quechua (the language of the Incas) as my third language. I am a bilingual teacher here in Utah where I teach students in both Spanish and English. My students excel in all academic areas as learning two languages simultaneously creates high expectations for students and closes the achievement gap we are currently experiencing in our educational system. It also creates an advantage for individuals competing in the global market. In the summer of 2008, I received a scholarship to study Language Revitalization in the Ecuadorian Amazon. During my time there, I was involved in a project viewing this very issue of "dying languages" as a direct result of the cultural shift we are experiencing. It is sad to think that as projected, in approximately 20 years, the entire Quechua language family could disappear as a result of this shift in values. Language is the highest spiritual value a community or group of people possesses. It explains where we come from, why we are here, and where we are going. It is passed on from generation to generation except when this occurs. Something needs to change for language preservation.

Loss of culture, not language | 6:56 p.m. Nov. 15, 2009

The tragedy in these cultures is that they are losing their rich traditions and pride. The loss of a language is only a symptom of the problem. Linguists are just looking at a tiny aspect of the bigger issue. When new generations set aside the wisdom of their elders they lose their roots in the process.

I would recommend that everyone should be fluent in one of the "big 5" languages to survive in the modern economy. But learning and retaining distinct elements of our ancestors' culture should be a priority for all of us.

ALSO VANISHING - - - ? | 9:18 p.m. Nov. 15, 2009

Greetings:

Among the World's vanishing languages, I would include English.

"MY FAIR LADY" is one of my favorite movies because of the great truth being taught.

More than any other factor, the way a person speaks will determine their opportunities in life.

Likewise, I've often heard Rush Limbaugh emphasize the necessity of mastering the English language, due to the massive influence such mastery has on an individual's status throughout all of their life.

Many parents now realize how important it is for their child's literacy skills to be developed long BEFORE they begin receiving formal education at a public school.

If a child enjoys reading, then it will be easier to learn all of the other required subjects.

But, if reading is a burden, then the child will resent the rigors of academia, and will not excel.

Enforcement(?) of "political correctness" in our speech has done great damage to English language, by perpetuating ignorance.

So very MANY adults are severely handicapped by not being able to spell, properly enunciate, constuct sentences, or by being limited in their vocabulary.

Thank you.

John Robert Mallernee
Armed Forces Retirement Home
Washington, D.C. 20011-8400

A TEACHER, HUH? | 6:43 a.m. Nov. 16, 2009

"I am a Bilingual (Spanish/English) North American who speaks Quichua/Quechua (the language of the Incas) as my third language."

Re A TEACHER, HUH? | 12:12 p.m. Nov. 16, 2009

The last comment is somewhat confusing, what do you mean by "a teacher, huh?" Is there something wrong with being bilingual and becoming trilingual in languages other than English?

@Simply amazing... | 12:30 p.m. Nov. 16, 2009

Is the fact that you make conclusions about a very large population of people based on a small sampling of those who bother to comment in a newspaper forum reflective of your overall intelligence or lack there of?

Why the rush to leave Utah? There are people of all sorts here, just like everywhere else in the world. Life is what you make of it, as is your community. Find the good and try to fix the bad, don't just sit back and criticize.

20/20 | 12:53 p.m. Nov. 16, 2009

Keep in mind that the article was written to support an agenda; if everyone in Utah spoke English, there would be no reason to fund the university department behind the article.
Does the author contend that diversity in languages is so vital that airline pilots should be allowed to speak their native tongues? That would go over well, right?
The fact is that the entire world would benefit from standardizing on one language. So, linguists, how about working to unite us, instead of working to divide us?

re: Simply Amazing | 6:06 p.m. Nov. 17, 2009

I did read all the posts and no one else mentioned your favorite president - sorry to disappoint. It sounds like you consider yourself to be part of his elite-thinking entourage. Perhaps you can deep-think your way to a quicker exit than just a few years.

If we do have unique knowledge tied up in obscure languages then I agree it would be preferable to capture that knowledge and share it with the world whether or not the language dies.

Language is critical to learning, critical and creative thinking and the advancement of ideas. Multiplicity of languages is not critical to those outcomes. Those disappearing languages belong generally to stagnant cultures who would still be lagging centuries behind in development if left alone and isolated. They end up migrating to more common languages in order to survive in today's more complex world.

As this world moves toward globalization, efficiencies will be required to overcome the problems facing mankind: climate change, population growth, diminishing resources, etc. I enjoy language and am capable at varying levels in Spanish, Italian and French. There is some romanticism in the existence of multiple cultures but shrinking of languages will not be our undoing.

Add your comment

Comments are monitored. Any comments found to be abusive, offensive, off-topic, misrepresentative, more than 200 words or containing URLs will not be posted.

Words Remaining

E-mail address: For internal use only. We may want to contact you to publish your comment (not your e-mail address) in the newspaper or for a separate story idea.