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Can't help but feel bad for Cain losing his job
44 comments | Read story
Plan B... | 8:23 p.m. Nov. 1, 2009
Plan B worked well for a win.
Utes should keep plan B.
And the good thing is plan A --which was good for 6-1 record-- is still available.
This can only help Utah offense.
Re: So... | 8:27 p.m. Nov. 1, 2009
actually, it's a "wynn-cain" situation for Utah team.
Comments continue below
Maybe | 9:27 p.m. Nov. 1, 2009
He should transfer to Nevada.
TheHailstorm | 11:27 p.m. Nov. 1, 2009
I hope that Terrance reads my note of admiration and thanks for a job well
done and to please hang in there. I think Cain is a very good quarterback and
that we are lucky to have him. Please Mr. Cain , take this in stride and be
ready whenever your number is called-- this short slice of advise will last you
in all of life's challenges. Take things in stride and remember, you are to
be admired. I, for one, am a big fan of your game and a red blooded Ute.
I'm sure that Coach Kyle and his staff have lost some sleep over this decision. Study up and stay sharp you will be needed down the road. ( or even next weekend) Just take one for the team and don't Louks out on us.
I'm sure that Coach Kyle and his staff have lost some sleep over this decision. Study up and stay sharp you will be needed down the road. ( or even next weekend) Just take one for the team and don't Louks out on us.
Fanboy | 11:54 p.m. Nov. 1, 2009
It is a rough deal for Cain. It is not his fault that when the team gets in the
red zone the coaches start making incredibly conservative calls and abandon the
pass until it is 3rd and 11 or so. His stats are solid--as are Wynn's--but
someone has to pay for the anemic playcalling from the offensive staff.
bigutefan | 11:57 p.m. Nov. 1, 2009
Do you really think the Utes won't continue to utilize the talent that Cain
has? I mean serious...your writing as if he is dead. I see him running the Louks
package, and many more plays. The Utes just made their offense even more
difficult to scout. Did you watch the game Sorenson? Because in the first half,
the ball was hiked to Cain and he didn't bother to catch it and we lost 20
yards on the play. Not really a fumble.....but a costly play. Cain is still one
of the best players we have and will get his time.......
JD | 12:00 a.m. Nov. 2, 2009
Cain can't throw the ball. This offense needs balance and Cain is only
successful in short yardage situations. Teams continue to creep up on us.
Defending just ten yards rather than the whole field. Utes have some amazing
receivers that are just waiting in the wings for the ball to get to them, I bet
Brooks almost dropped the ball since he hasn't seen one thrown his way in
weeks.
We haven't seen the last of Cain | 1:03 a.m. Nov. 2, 2009
Not by a long-shot. There are pleanty of games left this year and next and
seasons never go as planned. You are writing as if this is an obituary for
Terrence. He will be back. We put the best players available on the field, and I
fully trust Kyle.
Great coaching decision at halftime to spark the team although I agree that the blame for the poor offense in the first half does not lie completely on Cain. Give Wyoming's 3-4 defense (same as Air Force- who we struggled against as well) and scheming some credit as well.
Great coaching decision at halftime to spark the team although I agree that the blame for the poor offense in the first half does not lie completely on Cain. Give Wyoming's 3-4 defense (same as Air Force- who we struggled against as well) and scheming some credit as well.
gdog3 | 1:40 a.m. Nov. 2, 2009
there is a lot that goes into this Wynn vs. Cain thing. For one, regardless of
who is at QB, there are offensive coaching issues that are really nothing new
for the Utes in recent years. Yes, Cain's numbers are similar to those of
Brian Johnson last year. Truth is that although the Utes had a magical season,
the offense stunk in all but 4 out of 13 games. Johnson was great in the clutch
and the defense was supreme. Well, this years Utes are winning the close games
again. Props to them, but they are barely beating teams (minus Oregon) that have
sub par talent. Again, Oregon being the only exception there as well. Now, Andy
Ludwig is gone and Schramm is doing the same thing. What you might ask? Major
conservative play calling that is geared on protecting the ball and relying on
the defense. Here's the problem. The offense still turns the ball over
(they have throughout Whit's reign) and can't score points. Regardless
of who is offensive coordinator, and it's my opinion, Whit won't let
that guy open up the offense.
gdog3 | 1:54 a.m. Nov. 2, 2009
Moving on with problems with the Ute offense. Although they are winning, the
Utes have an anemic offense. Is it Cain's fault? Some, I am not sure how
much. I know he can't throw a good deep ball, takes to many questionable
sacks, and has looked to be a fumbler based on his numbers thus far. However,
the play calling isn't allowing Cain or the offense to succeed. Sure, the
dink and dunk stuff was understandable while getting Cain's feet wet to
start the season. But hey, we are 8 games into the season. If the coaches have
that little faith in Cain, why not start Wynn from day 1. I know they are high
on him. My question here is that there were bound to be growing pains (division
1 football) with a true freshman or JC guy. I was a proponent of starting Wynn
and I said that going back to spring ball (off season). However, at this point,
second half win against Wyoming or not, what the Sam Hill is going on? There are
no non-conference tune ups for Wynn (USU & SJS) and he just lost a season of
eligibility.
Good Move by Whit | 6:49 a.m. Nov. 2, 2009
Cain did a decent job through 7 weeks but he fumbles too much, can't
stretch the field with the deep ball and doesn't consistently deliver the
goods in the red zone. Ute coaches should have actually made the change aganist
AF.
Sorenson, did you watch the reply? The reciever was being held on the ball that was almost intercepted.
Sorenson, did you watch the reply? The reciever was being held on the ball that was almost intercepted.
We're in the homestretch... | 7:00 a.m. Nov. 2, 2009
There is still a lot of football to be played this year. Utah has been very
successfull after replacing numerous key players from last year's
exceptional team. I would love to be 8-0, but I can't complain with where
we are all things considered. However, except for Oregon, the toughest games
are yet to be played. Utah is still in the hunt for a conference
championship.
It shouldn't surprise anyone that the coaching staff decided to take a look at Wynn. He and Cain were in a neck and neck battle for the starting job until late in the preseason. Plus, while the Utes have been successful, they will not be able to compete with TCU, and maybe BYU, unless they change their trajectory on offense. The defense is great, but more productivity on offense is needed for those critical games.
It shouldn't surprise anyone that the coaching staff decided to take a look at Wynn. He and Cain were in a neck and neck battle for the starting job until late in the preseason. Plus, while the Utes have been successful, they will not be able to compete with TCU, and maybe BYU, unless they change their trajectory on offense. The defense is great, but more productivity on offense is needed for those critical games.
Thats It Media | 7:33 a.m. Nov. 2, 2009
Start a controversy, thats what you people do best. Why don't you people
shut your mouths and report and leave the decision making to those that know
what they are doing? Thats too hard? Take a hike nutso.
Oh Well | 7:50 a.m. Nov. 2, 2009
Oh well Cain, you had a good run. Since coach sidelined you, you might as well
go play for Nevada or somewhere else like that.
Hang On | 7:58 a.m. Nov. 2, 2009
Cain will be back this year so he needs to stay ready. Whit saw that he had no
chance against TCU and maybe BYU as well if he didn't shake things up with
the offense. The schedule sets up well for Wynn this week with the winless lobos
coming to town. If Wynn falters he can fall back to a more motivated Cain this
week or next. But it won't matter that much because it will take a miracle
to get the win in Ft. Worth regardless of QB. Defense is coming on strong
though, Zoobies need to beware, speed kills
Utah Man | 8:02 a.m. Nov. 2, 2009
UTES WIN!!! No need to worry about the "feelings" of the players,
that's there job. Just figure out how to win. Louks was worried about Louks
and not the team. Where would he be sitting today with Asiata out. Team
first...UTES WIN!!!
re: Fanboy | 8:21 a.m. Nov. 2, 2009
Sorry, but is was nobody's fault but Cain's that he took 2 horrible
sacks to blow at least a FG attempt before halftime.
Both times he showed his inability to read defenses. His first option wasn't available, so instead of going through his progessions, he just sort of hangs out not doing anything. Instead of throwing the ball away and salvaging a FG, he tip-toes around the pocket until he gets sacked.
Cain is an average QB, nothing more. His lack of arm strength was killing the offense. We were completely depending on WR screens to gain yards.
This was a good move. Much more potential with Wynn than Cain.
Both times he showed his inability to read defenses. His first option wasn't available, so instead of going through his progessions, he just sort of hangs out not doing anything. Instead of throwing the ball away and salvaging a FG, he tip-toes around the pocket until he gets sacked.
Cain is an average QB, nothing more. His lack of arm strength was killing the offense. We were completely depending on WR screens to gain yards.
This was a good move. Much more potential with Wynn than Cain.
NJ UTE | 8:27 a.m. Nov. 2, 2009
We're in the homestretch - you are dead on. If this team is to compete
with TCU and/or BYU they have to be able to get more out of the offence. Whit
sees that and made the switch to see what he may have. I feel bad for Cain as
well, but at the same time he has not shown that he can throw anything beyond
the quick hitch. A team as fast as TCU will eat that play up, especially if
that is all we can do.
If you remember back to the USU game, 1st half nothing but underneath stuff for Cain and he looked awesome. Then the UTE coaches opened up the passing game in the 2nd half and Cain looked pretty bad. Almost everything was over-thrown or under-thrown.
Play calling is an issue, but at the same time it may also be that the coaches are only calling the plays that they know Cain can make? Most games this year have been close, so they don't have the ability to just let Cain throw alot more of the more risky (per Cain's ability) throws to try to work them out.
If you remember back to the USU game, 1st half nothing but underneath stuff for Cain and he looked awesome. Then the UTE coaches opened up the passing game in the 2nd half and Cain looked pretty bad. Almost everything was over-thrown or under-thrown.
Play calling is an issue, but at the same time it may also be that the coaches are only calling the plays that they know Cain can make? Most games this year have been close, so they don't have the ability to just let Cain throw alot more of the more risky (per Cain's ability) throws to try to work them out.
LaVar the Utah Cat | 8:35 a.m. Nov. 2, 2009
Cain's problem is that his "thinker" doesn't work very fast
or well. Example: on the missed ball hike Cain was attempting to pick up the
ball which likely would have been a disaster, but Wide jumped on it and covered
up, as you should in that situation.
I am afraid Cain isn't the personality the Utes need to lead the team. Too indecisive and tentative in key situations. Good talent (certainly not great), but not a leader of men.
I am afraid Cain isn't the personality the Utes need to lead the team. Too indecisive and tentative in key situations. Good talent (certainly not great), but not a leader of men.
It is interesting... | 8:52 a.m. Nov. 2, 2009
...to see how quickly some Ute fans are willing to dump Cain.
Back when the season started, Cain was the next Brian Johnson (before that, Corbin Louks was the next Brian Johnson).
Now that Whittingham has pulled him the consensus is that he's too slow, doesn't read defenses, fumbles too much, etc. Jordan Wynn is now the next Brian Johnson.
I think this move -- a desperate attempt to blame someone for Utah's offensive ineptitude -- is going to backfire on the Utes, big time. While Wynn might be more explosive and talented, he's also inexperienced and will be prone to making big mistakes in key situations (much as Wyoming's freshman QB did on Saturday).
That probably won't be an issue against a putrid New Mexico team coming into RES this week. But against TCU in Fort Worth it's a recipe for disaster.
The Utes should stick with Cain, he at least has big-game experience. The Frogs' defense will eat Wynn alive.
Back when the season started, Cain was the next Brian Johnson (before that, Corbin Louks was the next Brian Johnson).
Now that Whittingham has pulled him the consensus is that he's too slow, doesn't read defenses, fumbles too much, etc. Jordan Wynn is now the next Brian Johnson.
I think this move -- a desperate attempt to blame someone for Utah's offensive ineptitude -- is going to backfire on the Utes, big time. While Wynn might be more explosive and talented, he's also inexperienced and will be prone to making big mistakes in key situations (much as Wyoming's freshman QB did on Saturday).
That probably won't be an issue against a putrid New Mexico team coming into RES this week. But against TCU in Fort Worth it's a recipe for disaster.
The Utes should stick with Cain, he at least has big-game experience. The Frogs' defense will eat Wynn alive.
Actually | 8:57 a.m. Nov. 2, 2009
given your schedule coming up, I'd call it a lose-lose situation. Get it?
You will!
No surprise | 9:32 a.m. Nov. 2, 2009
Cain has been a mediocre, turnover prone QB leading a mediocre offense all
season. The only reason Utah is 7-1 instead of 5-3 or 4-4 is because Utah's
defense has saved the Ute's bacon several times by scoring almost as many
points as the offense in several games (see RoJo).
Kyle pretty much announced at his news conference last week that Wynn would be replacing Cain against the Cowboys. Cain conveniently provided Kyle the perfect scenario to replace him by only producing 3 points against an average Wyoming defense in the first half.
Kyle pretty much announced at his news conference last week that Wynn would be replacing Cain against the Cowboys. Cain conveniently provided Kyle the perfect scenario to replace him by only producing 3 points against an average Wyoming defense in the first half.
re: Actually | 9:38 a.m. Nov. 2, 2009
One thing we know for sure....Utah won't lose by 31 points to TCU, even on
the road.
You see, Utah plays defense, something the kittens can only pretend to do.
Lose @ TCU, yeah that will probably be Utah's fate. But our defense will keep us in the game, and maybe Wynn can put up enough points to get the victory. Heck, all he has to do is score 7 points and he'll have accomplished what mighty Max Hall has against TCU the last 2 years!
You see, Utah plays defense, something the kittens can only pretend to do.
Lose @ TCU, yeah that will probably be Utah's fate. But our defense will keep us in the game, and maybe Wynn can put up enough points to get the victory. Heck, all he has to do is score 7 points and he'll have accomplished what mighty Max Hall has against TCU the last 2 years!
Shut Out | 10:18 a.m. Nov. 2, 2009
Utah's defense will be exposed against the Frogs.
Utah's offense will cough up the ball at least 2 or 3 times against the Frogs.
Utah's kicking game won't be able to save the Utes this season.
And, a TCU shut out of Utah is a real possibility.
Utah's offense will cough up the ball at least 2 or 3 times against the Frogs.
Utah's kicking game won't be able to save the Utes this season.
And, a TCU shut out of Utah is a real possibility.
the writing | 10:22 a.m. Nov. 2, 2009
was on the wall. I guarntee this decision has been based not only on game
performance but performance in practice. What happens, happens but I trust Kyle
and his staff to do the best thing for the team
Utah back to BCS | 11:15 a.m. Nov. 2, 2009
Utah will finish 11-1, after beating TCU and BYU.
All 10,214 TCU fans will be in attendance on November 14 to watch the Ute defense shut down the frogs.
BSU will lose to Nevada.
Utah will go back to the BCS for the 3rd time in 5 years.
All 10,214 TCU fans will be in attendance on November 14 to watch the Ute defense shut down the frogs.
BSU will lose to Nevada.
Utah will go back to the BCS for the 3rd time in 5 years.
Can't feel too bad | 11:26 a.m. Nov. 2, 2009
Cain had his chance and didn't produce.
Utah needs to give Wynn all the practice he can get to prepare for next season.
Utah needs to give Wynn all the practice he can get to prepare for next season.
Re: Shut Out | 10:18 a.m. | 11:30 a.m. Nov. 2, 2009
I will remind you of one fact:
BYU 7 TCU 38
BYU 7 TCU 38
You feel for Cain..... | 11:41 a.m. Nov. 2, 2009
But have to realize this was the right decision. The Ute offense has become
stagnant and predictable. Case in point- Third doen efficiency. Terrance
Cain's bread and butter on long third downs was a short out to one of the
receivers. This is a good FIRST down play, not a good play on 3rd and +5 or so.
Kyle Gunther, former Utah center and captain, noted that the offense had become
very predictable, and that the majority of plays were counters to Eddie Wide or
quick outs (or some variation on the WR screen). I was at the game and the only
shot downfield Cain took was the crap pass he threw at the end of the first half
(awful play call, by the way). Once Wynn came in, he started hitting guys over
the middle, threw a couple new wrinkles in the offense, and the game was on! 1
scoring drive in the first half (and many potentials blown up by poor plays,
lost third down opportunities, and aggravating penalties) vs. 4 in the second
half. I'll take Wynn over Cain any day, but would like to see Cain come in
and run some Wildcat!
David H | 12:49 p.m. Nov. 2, 2009
Its called leadership. Johnson had it. Cain does not.
On Track | 12:49 p.m. Nov. 2, 2009
Lets all be honest here, Utah is not a serious contender this year. Unless their
offence gets back on track, they have no chance against serious teams. My
prediction is that it will take a few years for a quarterback to develope. And
then Utah will have another shot at the BCS. Lets just calm down and root on the
Utes through this rebuilding time. Unfortunately we cannot produce consistantly
every year. Oh well one good year every now and then is good, right?!?
Coug in SLC | 12:55 p.m. Nov. 2, 2009
I love it that even when Ute fans analyze the TCU-Utah game a comparison of BYU
comes into play. I can't wait for the BYU-Utah game. Sorry Utes I think
your offense has slipped a little so unless your defense comes up big you are
going to have a tough time in Provo.
Re Coug in Salt lake city. | 1:16 p.m. Nov. 2, 2009
A problem with what? Your defense? PLEASE. Your offense? HAHAHAHA you make me
laugh.
CainVonte | 1:21 p.m. Nov. 2, 2009
Ok Terrance.....trust in Whit. Maybe he will move you to reciever next?? He has
your best interest in mind.
Remember DaVonte trusted him and was touted as a real contributor at WR....look how that's working out.
Only smart one in this bunch is Louks who jumped out of this crazy QB cluster...what a mess.
Remember DaVonte trusted him and was touted as a real contributor at WR....look how that's working out.
Only smart one in this bunch is Louks who jumped out of this crazy QB cluster...what a mess.
Coguarf@n | 2:01 p.m. Nov. 2, 2009
I was hoping that the coaching staff remained with Cain through the BYU game.
His complete inability to make a decent down-field pass matched up perfectly
with BYU's inability to defend a downfield pass (for BYU anyway). BYU does
fine against the short stuff that Cain seems capable of and it's not hard
to defend the read "option" when the open QB always pitches it to the
covered RB, so it's a shame that Utah will be in a much better position to
beat BYU with Wynn as the starting QB. I still think BYU wins it, but
we'll see if Wynn does anything to change my mind in the next few weeks.
TCU will be a tough game for Utah, but Utah's defense will keep it closer than the TCU-BYU game. I guess the question will then be, if a win is a win in yewtville (regardless of how ugly it is), how are ewe going to put lipstick on a pig after losing by 20 to TCU? I can't wait to hear how much better Utah's 20 point loss is than BYU's 30 point loss.
TCU will be a tough game for Utah, but Utah's defense will keep it closer than the TCU-BYU game. I guess the question will then be, if a win is a win in yewtville (regardless of how ugly it is), how are ewe going to put lipstick on a pig after losing by 20 to TCU? I can't wait to hear how much better Utah's 20 point loss is than BYU's 30 point loss.
Lately... | 2:02 p.m. Nov. 2, 2009
Let's play What Have You Done For Me Lately! (TCU is added in for a useful
tool to see what we can expect from the Utah-TCU game)
BYU: has scord 28 pts or less in 3 games
Utah: has scored 28 pts or less in 4 games
TCU: has scored 28 pts or less in 2 games
BYU: averages 34.625 pts/game
Utah: averages 27.125 pts/game
TCU: averages 35.25 pts/game
BYU: has given up an average of 24.625 pts/game
Utah: has given up an average of 16.75 pts/game
TCU: has given up an average of 11.125 pts/game
Let's face it folks. The difference between BYU and Utah right now is slim, with Utah holding a slight edge that is negated by SOS. TCU...well, they're the cream of the conference. Best in scoring, most consistent offense, most stifling defense. I love my Utes, and would love to see them beat TCU for the 3rd straight year, but the numbers are what they are. TCU even has the hardest SOS up to this point, with no L's. GO UTES!
BYU: has scord 28 pts or less in 3 games
Utah: has scored 28 pts or less in 4 games
TCU: has scored 28 pts or less in 2 games
BYU: averages 34.625 pts/game
Utah: averages 27.125 pts/game
TCU: averages 35.25 pts/game
BYU: has given up an average of 24.625 pts/game
Utah: has given up an average of 16.75 pts/game
TCU: has given up an average of 11.125 pts/game
Let's face it folks. The difference between BYU and Utah right now is slim, with Utah holding a slight edge that is negated by SOS. TCU...well, they're the cream of the conference. Best in scoring, most consistent offense, most stifling defense. I love my Utes, and would love to see them beat TCU for the 3rd straight year, but the numbers are what they are. TCU even has the hardest SOS up to this point, with no L's. GO UTES!
re: CainVonte | 2:09 p.m. Nov. 2, 2009
Yep, maybe Cain can transfer with Louks to Nevada. They can both play safety
next year.
FYI - Louks isn't good enough to play QB for a WAC school not named Boise.
FYI - Christopher was terrible throwing the ball when giving his chance in spring last year.
FYI - Cain is an average DI QB. And if Utah didn't have a gem in the waiting in Wynn, he'd still be the starter for a top 15 team. Just the way things break sometimes.
FYI - Louks isn't good enough to play QB for a WAC school not named Boise.
FYI - Christopher was terrible throwing the ball when giving his chance in spring last year.
FYI - Cain is an average DI QB. And if Utah didn't have a gem in the waiting in Wynn, he'd still be the starter for a top 15 team. Just the way things break sometimes.
plyxply | 2:20 p.m. Nov. 2, 2009
college football is about giving your team a chance to win regardless of hurting
someone's feelings. Immediately Wynn was able to open things up and the
run game and pass game both looked better than they have all season. Cain will
be fine, he'll find a niche in the offense and will not be lost on the
sideline. I do think Wynn could be a top tier qb and I love this move and glad
they finally did it. As big as this move is, Aaron Roderick calling plays is
even better. He could be their best offensive mind on the staff and will help
their play calling immensely.
akk | 2:44 p.m. Nov. 2, 2009
Everybody relax... we have 2 QB's with very different skill sets. Now that
you can't redshirt Wynn start him use Cain in the Asiata packages... could
be awesome since defenses would still have to honor the pass. If Wynn struggles
go to Cain Simple. Wynn worries me against TCU because the game will be so
fast... if he struggles put Cain in either way they have to work at stopping
both. Wynn probabily is a better match up with BYU because he can stretch the
field and punish there suspect DB's.
re: Coguarf@n | 5:21 p.m. Nov. 2, 2009
Utah fans don't need to put spin on a close lose @ TCU.
Because no matter what Utah does in that game, they will not be downright embarrassed like BYU was, on their own field, with a senior QB.
But if Utah losing on the road at TCU will make Cougar fans, I mean Utah haters, like you feel better about a 31 point drubbing on your home field, that's a really sad statement of BYU football.
Here's what BYU's season has boiled down too:
1)Hoping Utah losses as bad @ TCU as BYU did at home to TCU.
2)Beating Utah.
Wow, I believe that was the way Utah fans used to think back in the 80's/90's! Enjoy your new role Cougs!
Because no matter what Utah does in that game, they will not be downright embarrassed like BYU was, on their own field, with a senior QB.
But if Utah losing on the road at TCU will make Cougar fans, I mean Utah haters, like you feel better about a 31 point drubbing on your home field, that's a really sad statement of BYU football.
Here's what BYU's season has boiled down too:
1)Hoping Utah losses as bad @ TCU as BYU did at home to TCU.
2)Beating Utah.
Wow, I believe that was the way Utah fans used to think back in the 80's/90's! Enjoy your new role Cougs!
Anonymous | 5:46 p.m. Nov. 2, 2009
The game is about points on the board, not individual QB statistics!
I will feel bad for Cain... | 10:45 p.m. Nov. 2, 2009
if he is not starting QB, but may the best man win. I think both QB's
deserve a shot to prove themselves. Cain had 8 games... let's give Wynn a
shot. If Wynn does not play well, then put Cain in. I don't care, as long
as we win.
Whit | 1:02 a.m. Nov. 3, 2009
Hello Urban, I've got myself a problem, can you help?
Whit, how do you keep getting my number? You're on your own now, should have got a guy with more offensive experience when Gary left. Why did you think I kept you, your defensive experience. Top teams, have top coaches, there is no time for on the job training when you want to be number one.
Whit, how do you keep getting my number? You're on your own now, should have got a guy with more offensive experience when Gary left. Why did you think I kept you, your defensive experience. Top teams, have top coaches, there is no time for on the job training when you want to be number one.
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Geno's and Pat's are good.. but, they are mostly for tourists, the real...
(You even got a middle initial... how's that for 'ya Max) It's nice to see...
Even today, I still cannot get enough of this movie or Charles Gitonga Maina....
...disappointed with Max Hall's comments that he hates everything about UofU....
Over the last few days I read comments of people complaining about tasteless...
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it's a win-win situation for Utah team.
Starting Wynn and if he is not doing well, bring in Cain.